It's not a problem or is it?
 

Yes,fair enough for those doing 'some jobs' ie nobody wants to be patched up on a Monday by that paramedic that's half cooked due to the bender on Sunday... but retail work?
Who cares if the fella on the till at Tesco/Asda had a couple joints over the weekend?.....I suppose they may over charge someone leaving the world in turmoil.

Penalising folk for what they do in their private time just seems a little wrong IMO.
If people want to have a drink or have a smoke and as long as it doesn't affect their work then "it's not a problem or is it"?


Workplace drug testing 'on the rise', say providers - BBC News

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Smoking pot. Its class B, no its class C, Its legal here, its not legal there, Its OK for medical, no its not, Phew, I am so confused. I saw people get aggressive after drinking alcohol, very aggressive, never saw this when someone smoked pot. Do not operate machinery, Hee Hee.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I suppose it's a good tool for those bosses looking to cut costs on redundancy payouts (hmm) and as always I presume it will only apply to the lower earners not CEO's etc.
Perhaps a good starting point would be to drug test all them MP's in parliament ,I'm sure their off their heads on something :D

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

If the taking of drugs or alcohol impacts on your work, then of course it is a problem for an employer......because the employee is unable to fulfil their contractual obligations.
In short you cannot do the job you are being paid to do.
Your private life is your own business until it impacts on your area of work.......and if you were an employer you would see that......but you aren't and so you see it as an infringement of your Liberty.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I suppose it is a little selfish M,Drugs tend to stay in the system long after the effects wear off.
It's Monday morning and Jason on the fork lift had a few joints over the weekend. Jason turns a bit sharp and some of his load falls off the forks and on to Peter who is walking past killing Peter.

The insurance company demand a drug test and find drugs in Jason's system. Insurance refuses to pay out and a charge of corporate manslaughter is brought against the company. The company cannot afford the immense fine and closes for business putting Jason,his work colleagues out of work.

But as long as Jason can get stoned at the weekend, sod everybody else....I get it now :o

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Most companies already have policies about alcohol, drugs is just the next step.
If I make a mistake at work because my tiny brain is under the influence of something I could cause an accident and kill someone.
It doesn't really need a second thought about testing someone you suspect has been drinking or taking drugs and may not be safe to themselves or others around them

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

It isn't just selfish it is irresponsible.
I once had the unenviable task of sending home a member of staff who turned up for work still suffering the effects of an alcohol fuelled weekend.
The person was unfit to cope with the work responsibilities which were expected of them.....and as such they were unsafe to practice.
The person received a disciplinary warning and the time off was deducted from their holiday entitlement.

Now are you saying that I should have let this nurse stay on duty and put the patients at risk?
How would you have felt if one of your relatives was being looked after by someone who was the worse for drink?
Had I not acted, then I would have been just as culpable for any adverse events which had arisen from my lack of action.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

No,Like I've said, if your job effects the life's of others (especially nurses etc) drug test seem reasonable enough to me.

What about those folk on certain prescription drugs? I'm sure your aware that Anti-depressants for example can affect folks performance. More so than having a couple of pints or a few joints at the weekend.

Sorry for sounding like Mr conspiracy but companies aren't treating folk like humans anymore they are treating them like machines where every ounce of efficiency is attempted to be squeezed out of them. They don't want them running on 80%, they want them running on 100% all the time.

As you know,we live in a society where money is worshipped over everything else (it's making for a sick society). It's obvious that jobs like nurses, surgeons or paramedics shouldn't be working under the influence but testing people who sell clothes or who are on the till at Asda is taking things a bit far imo.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

So it's an infringement of your freedom if applied to you but is O.K. when applied to others?

We should all turn up for work in a condition fit to do that work responsibly.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Your ok Less,I don't think they do drug tests in mordor ;)

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

What was it about my sensible reply that provoked yet another of your moronic digs?
:confused:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

No, I don't think it is. If you enter into a contract with an employer(to work for them) then shouldn't you make sure that you are fit to do that job?
Isn't your employer entitled to expect value for money......a responsible attitude, and of course safety of the people you work with.
If for any reason you cannot keep to your part of the contract, then the employer is within their rights to find someone else who is capable of doing a good job.
Even on the Till at Asda, you need to have your wits about you.

Those people who take drugs for medical reasons are under the surveillance of a medical team and if their performance was reduced due to the medical treatment, then the doctor would have to sign them off as unfit to work, but even those on antidepressants become attuned to the drugs in their system...if you like, their tolerance of them makes work possible...in effect they get used to the way they work for them personally.

Jason your argument for recreational drugs and alcohol doesn't hold water.

If you know yourself to be compromised by your recreational activities, you have two choices......give up the activities or give up the job.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

This is all bs, probably just brought up in order to agitate the fecal matter ... nothing to do with drugs and booze ... come to think of it, if booze isn't a drug, then what is it? Bottom line is that it's about common sense and responsibility. If you are aware that you have to show up for work at eight ack emma on monday, just don't be quaffing the booze, or toking, or snorting, or hitting at three. Nobody gives ... or should give ... a flying you-know-what about what you do on your time off. Just don't show up for work, or drive, or operate chainsaws:eek: when you are still trashed. If you do, you have a problem ... probably one you would have had even if you spent a sober, straight weekend. People who do this are ignorant, irresponsible assholes, drunk or sober.

A sense of responsibility, a large dose of common sense, and an IQ large enough to figure out how to pour water out of a boot without having to read the instructions written on the heel is all you need to manage, or to balance your recreational habits with your work.

I'm having a quiet toke right now ... but all I have to do today is housework, and walk the hound. If I go out to the bar later, I will take a cab there and back. I've already taken my window shaker out ... yes, Summer is gone:mad:. So, nothing else I have to do today requires sober concentration.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

It wouldn't be much fun on an airliner if the pilot was hungover or stoned or on a bus or train either!

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I'm beginning to wonder if accyx is related to Kes?:rolleyes:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Just wanted to put a word in for those who according to AccyExplorer 'just work on a till at Asda' - don't know if you've ever tried it but it's not as easy a job as he/she seems to think.Don't get me wrong, of course I'm not comparing it to someone whose work directly affects the health of others but believe me dealing with some members of the public on a daily basis can be quite stressful & would be even worse for both the employee & the customers if anyone tried to do it with a hangover from any substance whether it be alcohol or recreational drugs

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Isn't there is the morale problem though E? I mean, a work place where folk are randomly tested is one that will be short on trust and good feeling won't it?

Mr conspiracy says:-

There's also the problem of, if folk are tested for drugs today, it isn't such a big move to start to check folk for other undesirable activities tomorrow. Why stop at drugs,why not test folk for STD's,tax evasion or marital infidelity? What is so particularly problematic about these 'drugs'?

Obviously, being off your box at work at work is one thing but I believe a employee should be appraised on their performance and companies are businesses not law enforcement agencies. its funny that on the one hand folk don't want a nanny state, but on the other seem perfectly happy to condone nanny capitalism.Companies should not be allowed to deal with employees (private) illegal behaviour unless it's effecting their proformance.

A employer is allowed to sack you for testing positive for a bit of weed yet the US airforce is allowed to give its pilots amphetamine to improve their concentration over long periods.
U.S. Combat Pilots on Speed - ABC News

Gives a whole new meaning to fighting the war on drugs ;)

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

It would not be in the interests of an employer to test for sexually transmitted diseases unless that employer ran a brothel.....which is illegal in this country.

You ask what is problematic about these drugs, but this has been answered in previous posts...even you have put forward very good reasons why being under the influence of drugs or alcohol is unsafe.

You are just trying to fudge the issue.
What happens in America has little relevance to this issue......and tax evasion, marital infidelity....if they meant that you were not doing your job properly then an employer might be concerned.......and any issue that meant you were compromised in your job should and would be brought up at yearly appraisals, along with some actions to remedy any performance deficits.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Evading tax or having it off with someone else's wife probably won't affect your ability at work(although the second can be tiring).

To quote your attachment 'Their judgement is impaired and they do very bad things. They are among the sickest of all drug addicts'.
We can't have the checkout staff at Asda killing 4 customers and injuring 8 more, can we?:eek:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Perhaps if the infidelity was being committed in front of customers on the check-out of the above mentioned supermarkets then the employer would have every right to show concern?

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I'd certainly want the conveyor belt wiping down before I put my stuff on it!

It's not a problem or is it?
 

Is that a euphemism Gordon. :D

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

It could be.
Or a Freudian slip!

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Sorry if I offended you Accymad,Asda till clerk was just used as a example.
I'll put it another way,If the till/stockroom clerk of a well known supermarket store has had a cheeky joint or two over the weekend I don't think it represents any grave danger to public safety and as such it should not be any business of their employer.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Why do supermarkets only open 5 days now?:rolleyes:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

CDT was introduced into the Army in 1998 & is running still, it's part & parcel of the job the lads & lasses are aware of it & accept it, if not, well they can leave (or get dishonourably discharged) it really is that simple.

You ask why a smoke or a bender at the weekend should be of any concern to the employer, because there's a good chance that the employee that enjoys these liberties in their own time are quite probably going to enjoy the same pleasures through the week. This then impinges on their working ability & daily commitments to their employer (sick days/ inability to function as required) so I don't see any problem with employers using a system that enables their firm & those working there peace of mind concerning their staff & colleagues.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

You just do not get it do you?

If someone is unable to do their job properly due to their recreational habits, then it is the business of the employer......working in a stockroom away from the general public still has safety issues. The general public are not the only ones who can be affected by someones inability to spot risks.
An employer has to make sure that all his workers are safe....and if the person who s still hungover from Alcohol/spliffs causes an accident because they are incapacitated from their habit.....then it is of concern to the employer.

If you like to partake of recreational drugs, then you have a responsibility to make sure that they are out of your system before you are due back at work.

Or is this just another thread where you stir the pot?
Pose a question, but if you do not like the answers you fudge the issues.

If I were still of working age(which thankfully, I am not)......I would have absolutely no qualms about my employer testing me for alcohol or drugs.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

and you call it a 'Cheeky joint' to make it lighthearted...to minimise the seriousness of such issues.
It smacks of irresponsibility....of hedonism...doing what you want, when you want and damn the consequences....because you do not accept that the consequences are very important.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I get it M, and the answer to your other question is probably and I do like all the replies (even Less's) ;)

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

:p

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

With great respect, I don't think you do get it at all.
You just like to prod the snake with a sharp stick.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I do get it M, I thought I gave a very good example getting it in post # 5.

An employer can do without someone that uses illegal drugs in the working environment as this may cause said environment to become unsafe. If the employees are allowed to come into the work environment under the influence of drugs, there are endless possibilities for accidents, injuries to not just themselves but others plus there's the possibility that productivity may decrease.

It's very important that our work places stay in order and have the least room for error as possible and as such It is imperative that we drug test employees to ensure not just their safety but others around them ie consumers work colleagues.....



.....That being said, what kind of world are we living in where we encourage employers to police folks life's [prod prod] ;)

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

You say you get it, and you provide a very valid argument as to why it is unsafe for people to be in a work environment under the influence, but then in the next breath you ask if it should be employers 'policing' their staff.

They are not policing their staff, they are just ensuring that the work environment is safe from preventable hazards......and they have a legal,responsibility to do this. They have to have public liability insurance, and this has to be displayed so that all and sundry can see that is current and up to date.
Employers have lots of legal responsibilities. By ensuring their staff come to work in a fit state they are ensuring they do not get stung for damages if something does go wrong.
To answer your last question.....what kind of world are we living in?
Well, you have eyes and ears.....you see the same things that I see.....we are living in an increasingly dangerous and litiginous world, where lawyers tell,people 'no win, no fee'.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Here endeth my input to this thread.
I have said all that I can say and I am not into chewing my cabbage twice....or three times.
What I have said clearly states my own opinion on this issue.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I may be wrong but,The hypocrisy with this testing is that it doesn't test for prescription drugs (painkillers etc).
It's certainly possible for someone to cause a serious accident because their mind gets a little fogged up due to strong say strong pain killers.
I guess drugs effect people in different ways. I know Mrs explorer gets mind fog on her painkillers.
I wonder if it would be possible to fail the alcohol tests by drinking certain cough medicines? Hmm

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Perhaps Margaret is right and "I just don't get it" :confused:

I wonder what the stats say about folk who have drugs (including alcohol) in their system in the work environment my guess is 1in50 give or take :confused:. That amounts to thousands of "irresponsible" workers across the country :eek:
Giving employers this kind of power is a little scary (imo) as it has a habit of migrating into other areas in the future (testing for other undesirables). Surely employers have sufficient powers at the moment for dealing with folk they suspect are on drugs or that may be under the influence of alcohol at work.Rather than random test why not just test those suspected of being intoxicated?.....


......And before the 'if you're not a drug user you have nothing to worry about' crowd start, can I just point out to them that this is a perfect example of 'guilty until you prove yourself innocent' :rolleyes:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Disagree its stupid until yeh prove sensible.:rolleyes:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

More like stupid until yeh agree with the family :rolleyes: :D

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Now yeh have just proved what i said.:rolleyes:

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

I know, I've got my stupid head on now its relaxing and herbal ciggie time for me...don't expect any sense till....well just don't expect any sense (proven again,I know) :D

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

That comment rather scuppers your whole argument, doesn't it?

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

That was a cheap blow......



.....Accyexplorer watches the ears of the drug users as they twitch at the thought of cheap blow ;)

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Nope it was an accurate observation, you do cheap blows, whenever you start these threads.:rolleyes:

No doubt you will attempt another one because I dare to criticise you...

P.S. We all read/watch the news, we don't really need your updates on the Saville pervert threads unless they are of use.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

It was a observation, "accurate" hmmm.....maybe my next thread will be about toy trains and you can have a opinion worth replying too......



.....as for my updates,I've told you before, as much as you like to think you do, you don't speak for everyone....some folk may not read/watch the news or they may miss it and my updates help keep them informed :p

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Accurate to all but you.



Oooh! look, another 'cheap blow', yes I have a model railway, it is in my profile as well as in threads on site, you may call it a toy train if you wish, however I and many, many more find it far more relaxing than wandering through derelict buildings whilst on a suicide mission.

Yes, you have told me before and I have replied in a similar vain to this:-

If folk can make their way onto AccyWeb, I think they may just, be able to turn on a television or read a newspaper, they don't need you to act as a broadcaster.

How can you keep anyone informed, all your posts and threads prove is that you are the most ill-informed poster on here.

How many times just in this thread have you done a complete U turn?

U turns? You're a complete, six lane roundabout!
:(

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Cheap blow? I don't think so.

After all, you're the one who told us that at 14.48 on a Tuesday afternoon you were getting so high we shouldn't expect any sense from you until-- you didn't seem too sure when.

Your later posts suggest you were right.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

If they could accurately pinpoint at what time the joints where smoked then yeah I am all for the tests- Cannabis as we know there is no hangover like you get with alcohol. But it stays detectable in your system(though its having zero effect on anything you do at work, the effects simply do not last that long) and It isn't fair to penalise staff because they had a few joints Sunday night. That has absolutely nothing to do with anyone. But it is fair to do so if they are smoking on the way to work, on breaks and eating space-cakes for lunch, and if this is detected then they should be facing disciplinary action for drinking/taking drugs at work.

The problem with this BS is there is a too much of a fine line between under the influence and "in the system" and nobody really cares for drugs subjects on here. But hey. You know this. Right?

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Still waiting fer n answer to this.!!

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Some geneticists believe we're all at least 50th cousins to everyone else on this planet (like one big family)....some stats if your interested (or not) The Straight Dope: 2, 4, 8, 16 ... how can you always have MORE ancestors as you go back in time?

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Are you suggesting you could be my 50th cousin?

You've depressed me for the rest of the day!

Re: Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Count your fingers and toes if you have more than the normal amount, then yes, inbreeding could mean you are very closely related.
(He must have more fingers than most to get his crap out there so quickly).

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Oh how clever, avoiding a straight answer, wish i were that bright.:rolleyes:it only required a yes or no.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Is he an M.P?

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

You may of gathered I'm quite partial to a herbal ciggie now and again, yes I know, It's high time i recognised folk other than myself in my thought process and stopped for a moment to consider the ramifications my drug use may have on other folk....but... 'work is the curse of the smoking classes'.
No doubt there have been times when I'd of probably failed a drug test due to some THC in my system but I'm pretty responsible with my 'habit' and I don't turn up for work of my box.
Say I did go into work with red eyes, smelling of stale ale,and all hungover and 'it was effecting my work performance', I'd expect disciplinary action to be taken 'after' a test.

I can see these tests sending folk back into unemployment leaving them basically unemployable due to their new 'drug user' title. What constitutes a unacceptable level of drugs, Is the rate the same for drink driving as it is for say a office job?

I want a job testing all those directors/managers 5minutes after they come back from their (liquid) lunches or maybe testing employees for stress I've lost count of the weekends I have lost due to the crippling effects of working.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

And you confessed to the above for what reason?
It doesn't make you big or clever, whatever artificial stimulant you are using, please keep such information to yourself and not on site, it only shows you up.

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Don't need to gather- you tell us on a regular basis

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

Bit numb starting and or contributing to this thread if you haven't already done that AccyX

Re: It's not a problem or is it?
 

So it is a problem? You've answered your own question.