Potential Labour Candidate for Hyndburn - Page 20

SPUGGIE J · 03-12-2009, 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewb

I don't think you can fulfil the role of district councillor and county councillor alongside being an MP in London most of the week no.

On what basis have you reached that conclusion? He is suposed to be superman.

Eric · 03-12-2009, 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPUGGIE J

On what basis have you reached that conclusion? He is suposed to be superman.

Maybe he will build a moat around his phone booth so that no one bugs him when he's changing

Of course, the moat will be built and maintained at taxpayers' expense.

jaysay · 04-12-2009, 09:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by g jones

I agree Jaysay. AndrewB has argued that it wastes money holding by elections speaking about my position. I am sure Peter would serve both full term resigning as Council Leader and all other Council positions.

Think that goes without say Graham, for one think that there should be a bar on sitting on both local and county councils at the same time, don't know whether you agree, but at present there is nothing there to stop it, so is quite acceptable, but to me it doesn't make it right

g jones · 04-12-2009, 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

Think that goes without say Graham, for one think that there should be a bar on sitting on both local and county councils at the same time, don't know whether you agree, but at present there is nothing there to stop it, so is quite acceptable, but to me it doesn't make it right

I have seen both sides to this one. Joined up thinking or disjointed thinking. The answer is unitary authorities.

From a distance they are two separate jobs. However as a District Councillor you do 90% of the work, and often LCC work. The passing it over system was awkward. Then there's left hand, right hand, Council and County.

On balance I think you should do both. Incidentally Labour rules forbid you holding an important position on both at the same time. I think the Tories do allow you hold to senior office on both. Pat Case is Dep Leader at Chorley and was in the cabinet at LCC until last month.

Gayle · 04-12-2009, 15:08

I think the two tier system is a waste of resources - two sets of people doing similar jobs and people needed on both sides to liaise with each other.

There are arguments for and against sitting on both LCC and HBC.

For - being able to follow a job through, deal with a job rather than just fobbing it off to the other , speak to the right people, understand what is going on from both sides etc

Against - conflict of interest i.e. LCC want one thing, HBC want another - the Pennine Reach scheme is one of those subjects

Another positive - it's not financially viable for a person to be a HBC Councillor and do nothing else, the meagre salary/expenses would not be sufficient to live on, however, by being on LCC and HBC, and getting the two salaries/expenses, it is a proper income and means that you can concentrate on public service.

jaysay · 04-12-2009, 15:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by g jones

I have seen both sides to this one. Joined up thinking or disjointed thinking. The answer is unitary authorities.

From a distance they are two separate jobs. However as a District Councillor you do 90% of the work, and often LCC work. The passing it over system was awkward. Then there's left hand, right hand, Council and County.

On balance I think you should do both. Incidentally Labour rules forbid you holding an important position on both at the same time. I think the Tories do allow you hold to senior office on both. Pat Case is Dep Leader at Chorley and was in the cabinet at LCC until last month.

Your spot on with the Unitary Authority Graham, for more than one reason, for a start every penny from Council Tax gets spent here, it would also cut out red tape and bureaucracy, I argued on the point when it came up for consideration some years ago when B with D went solo, but Labour at county hall campaigned for the Status Quo and that's what we got, to the detriment in my mind of places like Hyndburn

Neil · 04-12-2009, 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by g jones

Incidentally Labour rules forbid you holding an important position on both at the same time. I think the Tories do allow you hold to senior office on both. Pat Case is Dep Leader at Chorley and was in the cabinet at LCC until last month.

Not sure what I think about that. So non of the leaders of Labour Councils could be in the County Cabinet. Doe that not mean you would have less experienced people at County or Local Council because they can't do both?

turkishdelight · 06-12-2009, 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewb

I don't think you can fulfil the role of district councillor and county councillor alongside being an MP in London most of the week no.

What is the total salary for one who would combine all of these roles, if it was possible it appears like three separate jobs to me. The question is asked out of interest.

g jones · 06-12-2009, 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil

Not sure what I think about that. So non of the leaders of Labour Councils could be in the County Cabinet. Doe that not mean you would have less experienced people at County or Local Council because they can't do both?

Yes your right. Opposition positions do not count. I think it is more a conflict of interest as much as too many fingers.

Jaysay - Unitaries. Labour at LCC did oppose and also said a County wide unitary was the best unitary.

Peter and the Cons saw us merge with Ribble Valley. It failed because everyone saw it exclusively from their own perspective.

My view then and now is more devolution. 85% of services come from Preston. It would mean mergers and Hyndburn giving up 15% to a bigger authority in order that Police, Fire, Education and Social Services were big enough to cope. An East Lancs or Pennine Lancs with Town Councils would be an ideal balance in my view.

Dividing Hyndburn up into the various towns. Under this model town councils would be more meaningful and people would have more power locally.

Gayle · 06-12-2009, 20:49

And if Hyndburn didn't exist - what would you call the area? Accrington and Districts???

Neil · 06-12-2009, 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by g jones

Dividing Hyndburn up into the various towns. Under this model town councils would be more meaningful and people would have more power locally.

I thought that was the idea behind the Accrington and Districts with the start in Great Harwood.

andrewb · 06-12-2009, 23:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by turkishdelight

What is the total salary for one who would combine all of these roles, if it was possible it appears like three separate jobs to me. The question is asked out of interest.

If all three allowances were claimed it would be an £80,000 base rate. If additional responsibilities were held on county or district council such as being leader of a grouping, or sitting on committees, that figure would be higher.

Eric · 07-12-2009, 07:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

And if Hyndburn didn't exist - what would you call the area? Accrington and Districts???

No, no, no: Clayton and districts

turkishdelight · 07-12-2009, 07:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewb

If all three allowances were claimed it would be an £80,000 base rate. If additional responsibilities were held on county or district council such as being leader of a grouping, or sitting on committees, that figure would be higher.

Huge salary. Expenses on top? Do you believe that one could run all three positions effectively? Correct me if i am wrong it appears to me that it is taking two vacancies that other individuals could sit on. In this economic crisis meaning employment for others, whichever political party they stand for.I consider an individual should not hold all three positions.

Gayle · 07-12-2009, 08:38

Sir Tom McKillop - Chair of RBS took home £471,000 in 2009
Sir Peter Middleton - Chair of Barclays was paid a whopping £1.76m

I'm not saying it's right and I'm certainly not going to argue that £80k isn't a lot of money, but let's put it in perspective. We're paying some of these Chairmen a huge amount of money for running banks - isn't it right that we should make it attractive to be an MP and for running the country?

So, my quibble isn't with the amount that MPs, County Councillors or Councillors take home, I think they earn and deserve every penny - my only concern would be that - long term- they would be spreading themselves a bit thinly by trying to do all three. However, I think that - short term - it's probably a good idea to keep hold of the positions that they already have so that it keeps them 'in the loop' when it comes to making decisions at all levels.