The joys of cycling

[accyman]

Originally Posted by Studio25

Really sorry, Accyman - I thought it was your thread. I should have referred to Guinness (the OP), not you. My sincere apologies.

lol no problem it happens

[Morecambe Ex Pat]

How times and attitudes have changed.

I was a keen cyclist towards the end of the last century and when approaching a red traffic light, it never occurred to me to jump on the footpath and bypass the lights.

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Studio25

Rule 64
https://www.gov.uk/rules-for-cyclist...rview-59-to-71
It's the only problem I have with cyclists. As a driver you have a responsibility to drive defensively, so you should plan for as many hazards as you can think of, including a cyclist weaving around potholes, undercutting in traffic etc.

These days, defensive driving is seen as "weakness" and anyone who is doing so is "dawdling".

The highway code says that undercutting is permissible of traffic to the right is held up and moving more slowly. Accyman, why do you think that does that not apply to cyclists?

Originally Posted by Studio25

Really sorry, Accyman - I thought it was your thread. I should have referred to Guinness (the OP), not you. My sincere apologies.

Didn't respond because I thought Gremlin had already busted your argument by distinguishing between inside lanes and gutters regarding undertaking……did you read rule 68 in your link about riding in a dangerous, careless or inconsiderate manner?

Had another run in with a Bradley this morning…

Hear a siren, clock that it’s an ambulance coming up behind me. Me and all the other car drivers pull over, most of us with a couple of wheels on the pavement..

Cars on the opposite side do the same….all except Bradley who nonchalantly overtakes them causing the ambulance to slow down to negotiate the gap between him and the cars my side of the road….

No doubt you will now quote me some part of the highway code about how overtaking is legal even for cyclists, whilst ignoring the dangerous, careless and inconsiderate bits.

Oh… and I’d appreciate it if you could point me to the part of my original post that indicated I wasn’t driving defensively.

Far too many cyclists bemoan that a minority of car drivers are inconsiderate whilst ignoring the fact that the majority of cyclists are absolute muppets!

[Barrie Yates]

After the young child was hit by a cyclist and dragged along the pavement - on her face, the police confirmed that it was illegal to ride a cycle on the pavement - OK, Police too busy, well how about a fixed penalty for anyone who does so on a bike that cannot be classed as a child's bike.

[Morecambe Ex Pat]

All PCSO's should be issued with a broom handle and should lie in wait for offending, pavement hogging cyclists. As the offender passes, the broom handle should be inserted into the front wheel spokes of the errant cycle, bringing it to an instant and unceremonious halt. The offender should then be issued with a fixed penalty ticket. The fixed penalty should be increased if the offender requires an ambulance and hospital treatment.

[Gremlin]

Cyclist, cyclist, don't mention blooming cyclist to me after what I saw yesterday.Well I will mention it anyway.
I'm driving up towards the traffic lights where the Hyndburn road crossed Dill Hall.
There was a queue of traffic in the nearside lane waiting to turn left. Another shorter queue in lane two to go straight ahead.
Three cyclist dressed in proper sports attire were weaving their way up between the two lanes and just as they approached the junction the green light came on.
Two cyclist went straight up Dill Hall but one decided to go left round the cars turning left and tried to filter into the now moving traffic. He went a hundred yards or more with cars either side of him on the dual carriageway before he cut in front of a car which decided not to kill him. There were , by now, other cars on his right hand side who had pulled out to overtake the slower cars.
It was one of the few days my car cam was switched off.
Think bike, think bo*****. When they think about others I might decide to think bike.

Rant over, time for another coffee.
Good day folks. Have a nice bank holiday on our over crowded roads.

[Studio25]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Didn't respond because I thought Gremlin had already busted your argument by distinguishing between inside lanes and gutters regarding undertaking……did you read rule 68 in your link about riding in a dangerous, careless or inconsiderate manner?

Yep - did you follow up and read the statute that is behind that entry in the highway code? It's so subjective there's no point having it as law. In the example we're discussing, what one driver says is "dangerous riding" a cyclist will see as "making progress". It's borne out by the number of convictions you (don't) see for dangerous cycling or careless/inconsiderate cycling.

Originally Posted by Guinness

...No doubt you will now quote me some part of the highway code about how overtaking is legal even for cyclists, whilst ignoring the dangerous, careless and inconsiderate bits...

You seem to have taken this quite personally. I'm not an apologist for cyclists - they irritate me as well.

Yesterday, I was driving up Accrington Road out of Whalley and met a pair of cyclists alongside each other well out from the kerb. It prevented me from passing (it's a left-hand bend) and by the time I did pass the lights had changed. so their inconsiderate riding cost me time and money (fuel cost having to wait at lights and get moving again when green). I've not mentioned it to anyone, not put the dashcam footage on youtube and didn't get upset with them at the time. I only mention it now to illustrate my point that they get to everyone.

I haven't ridden a bike on the road for 29 years. If the drivers scared me back then, you can imagine how worried I'd be now.

Originally Posted by Guinness

Oh… and I’d appreciate it if you could point me to the part of my original post that indicated I wasn’t driving defensively.

I didn't, it was a general "you" meaning everyone, not specifically at Guinness. I think you're right that proportionally, there are more idiots among cyclists than there are among drivers. One has to remember (did you see what I did there?) that an idiot on a bike is far less likely to kill than an idiot in a car.

I used to think I'm an average driver. Not particularly good, but safe. My wife definitely thinks I'm safe. However, I went on a driving assessment about ten days ago for a job, and was told all the things I'm doing wrong. Turns out I'm an awful driver. I passed the assessment, but only because I adapted what I was doing whenever the examiner said "you need to do this" or "you should consider what that car might do". If I'd carried on with my so called "safe" driving, I would have failed. No driver likes to have their driving criticised, even when they have technically asked for that criticism.


One more thing - I refer you to your point about getting out of the way of the ambulance. Blue light services ask that you do not break the law in order to let them get past. Driving on the pavement is breaking the law.

from Gem Motoring Assist

I've always done it (when safe), in the belief that the "extenuating circumstances" will protect the driver from prosecution, but they don't. After reading up on it, even the emergency services driving under blue lights don't get immunity from breaking the law, without a ton of paperwork.

[Neil]

Good video that, just shows some stupid moves by cars on the opposite side of the road but people do stupid things when they see blue lights

"Turn any music off in your car so you can hear the music better" - Errrm I've heard it why do I want to turn my music off when I've already heard it?

I like at 4 min 8 seconds the organ donor cutting through traffic following the police cars, when a car kills him everyone will blame the poor biker

[Less]

I do ride a bike but rarely these days when I do I have all the items required by law and stick to the highway not the pavement, I don't move off unless the lights are green, I try my best to keep out of the way of other road users even by pulling over to allow faster traffic to pass, do I deserve thanks? No absolutely not I am using a road provided at the expense of those that pay road tax, insurance and for their petrol. I should shift my arse out of their way I'll always be slow when on a bike therefore I should consider the poor sod behind me as I grunt and groan zig-zagging up a hill when I'm blocking his/her way.

[Gordon Booth]

Driving into town last week, cyclist ahead, parked car in front of him, roundabout a couple of hundred yards ahead.
Guessing what he might do I held back. Sure enough without looking behind or signalling he swerved out to the crown of the road, passed the car then swerved back towards the kerb.
Stayed wide to pass him before the roundabout and surprise, surprise, having swerved in after the car he swerved straight back out to the crown of the road just a few feet in front of me. No hand signal, no checking behind.
I almost had him so I gave him a quick beep to point out he'd almost become a car mascot- big V sign, no looking round to see how close death was, just carried on on the crown of the road.
If he'd swerved out a couple of seconds later he'd have gone into the side of me(or under me).
Guess who's fault that would have been!

[Morecambe Ex Pat]

It is not just cyclists who are dangerous though, there are many car drivers who simply do not have a clue what is going on around them and carry on regardless.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by Morecambe Ex Pat

It is not just cyclists who are dangerous though, there are many car drivers who simply do not have a clue what is going on around them and carry on regardless.

No-one would disagree wi that at all, But the threads about cyclists.

[accyman]

i see bikers , cyclists and cars swerve in front of articulated wagons so its not the mode of transport thats the issue its the pillock in control of it

the thing with cyclists is that they are the most vulnerable on the road yet do equally stupid things

im quite happy knowing that if i hit one while one is acting like a baffoon im walking away from the accident although not too happy that regardless of said baffoons actions i will be the one getting the blame

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Studio25

Yep - did you follow up and read the statute that is behind that entry in the highway code? It's so subjective there's no point having it as law

Erm..thats the reason we have judges and lawyers who are supposed to argue common sense over pedantic views

Originally Posted by Studio25

It's borne out by the number of convictions you (don't) see for dangerous cycling or careless/inconsiderate cycling.

Just a couple from todays papers

And precious few convictions for texting, using the rear view mirror for checking lipstick, changing the CD or drinking a coffee…..lack of conviction doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen

Originally Posted by Studio25

You seem to have taken this quite personally

Not at all, it’s the pedantry that I have an issue with as in…

Originally Posted by Studio25

One more thing - I refer you to your point about getting out of the way of the ambulance. Blue light services ask that you do not break the law in order to let them get past. Driving on the pavement is breaking the law.

Narrow road, rush hour, traffic on both sides, (unlike your nice clinical, sun shining video)….I’ll do my best to safely let emergency services by..and if that means I have to put a couple of tyres on a pavement..sue me!

[Studio25]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Just a couple from todays papers

I saw those - there's a Facebook page called "Idiot UK drivers exposed" which has dashcam/helmet cam videos added at a rate of about two or three per day. There are the occasional videos where a cyclist is at fault, but usually it's a driver.

Something else you will pick up from the comments to posted videos is that there is always disagreement about who was in the wrong. It just goes to show you'll never see absolute agreement on what constitutes good driving.

Just a point for anyone reading this far - I've not put a link to the FB page, if you want it, you'll have to search for it. There's almost always some unnecessarily obscene language in the comments to each video. (As well as some who think it's hilarious to add a "I blame the cyclist" even if there's none in the vid.)

Originally Posted by Guinness

Narrow road, rush hour, traffic on both sides, (unlike your nice clinical, sun shining video)….I’ll do my best to safely let emergency services by..and if that means I have to put a couple of tyres on a pavement..sue me!

As I said, I've been doing it as well, and will continue to do so if there's no alternative, despite this. It's likely the video is obliged to say you're still culpable in case someone tries to countersue. If it's the police trying to get past, they can direct you onto the pavement.