Is Jack Wilshere right

jaysay · 09-10-2013, 17:45

It seems Jack Wilshere has caused a bit of a storm saying only people born and bred in this country should be allowed to wear the shire, not just live here for 5 years and then they're eligible to play for England. To me only people born a bred here should represent England, although people who have bother parents from England but are born out of the country should also be allowed

cashman · 09-10-2013, 21:29

Difficult un to call, Me own view is born n bred here only, but other sports (Cricket) for one, dont seem to give a toss.

So its probably daft if all sports aint the same?

jaysay · 10-10-2013, 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman

Difficult un to call, Me own view is born n bred here only, but other sports (Cricket) for one, dont seem to give a toss.

So its probably daft if all sports aint the same?

England probably wouldn't have a cricket team if the rule applied cashy, Peterson is an example

Guinness · 10-10-2013, 20:24

Mo Farah, Bradley Wiggins, John Barnes, Greg Rusedtski, Nasser Hussein, Andy Caddick....the list goes on

Mind you I wouldn't put it past the muppets at FIFA to bring in national transfers before too long, probably with some codicil allowing them to get their moneygrubbing bloodstained mitts filled with lucre.

Barrie Yates · 11-10-2013, 08:49

It does apply in most sports - Football, Rugby (both codes), cricket, athletics, tennis and no doubt many more.
If there is to be a level playing field then let it apply across all sports and all nations. Look at Ireland, Belgium, Germany, Italy, Russia and former Russian States in football.
To my mind, if anyone becomes a British (English) citizen with a British Passport then they are eligible to represent the country of which they are a citizen.

jaysay · 11-10-2013, 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

It does apply in most sports - Football, Rugby (both codes), cricket, athletics, tennis and no doubt many more.
If there is to be a level playing field then let it apply across all sports and all nations. Look at Ireland, Belgium, Germany, Italy, Russia and former Russian States in football.
To my mind, if anyone becomes a British (English) citizen with a British Passport then they are eligible to represent the country of which they are a citizen.

I've never been a fan of a piece of paper taking the place of blood lines Barrie, never mind how long they live here, if they are born here to foreign parents that's fine, but being born in say South Africa then qualifying to play for England after a 5 year residency doesn't work for me

DaveinGermany · 11-10-2013, 19:12

Personally I think they need to be English born (in England) regardless of parental lineage or of English parents overseas who've retained their English nationality. Just my opinion mind.

Guinness · 11-10-2013, 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Personally I think they need to be English born (in England) regardless of parental lineage or of English parents overseas who've retained their English nationality. Just my opinion mind.

What about someone like our own Eric....born here, is now Canadian, by choice not by birth,...lets suppose his son considers himself a Brit by heritage, he's a cracking footballer and has no chance of showing or improving his talents in an Ice Hockey based country...do we deny him the chance of representing England because his dad got fed up of Clayton?

DaveinGermany · 12-10-2013, 07:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guinness

.do we deny him the chance of representing England because his dad got fed up of Clayton?

Simple answer, yes! If you start tinkering with definitions & happenstances the whole ethic of a "National" player or sports person has no meaning or worth. Instead "Our team" would be a cobbled together hodgepodge of mercenary's playing for the highest bidder with no pride or passion to win for "their" Country. This is self evident every Saturday with a quick glance through the team sheets of most EPL teams.

I'd sooner have us being crap on our own merits than win through default due to paying the gold price for success.

accybeme · 12-10-2013, 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

It seems Jack Wilshere has caused a bit of a storm saying only people born and bred in this country should be allowed to wear the shire, not just live here for 5 years and then they're eligible to play for England. To me only people born a bred here should represent England, although people who have bother parents from England but are born out of the country should also be allowed

Agree with you Jaysay, that is if all the other countries are singing off the same hymn sheet but there needs to be a level playing field on the regulations

Barrie Yates · 12-10-2013, 11:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Simple answer, yes! If you start tinkering with definitions & happenstances the whole ethic of a "National" player or sports person has no meaning or worth. Instead "Our team" would be a cobbled together hodgepodge of mercenary's playing for the highest bidder with no pride or passion to win for "their" Country. This is self evident every Saturday with a quick glance through the team sheets of most EPL teams.

I'd sooner have us being crap on our own merits than win through default due to paying the gold price for success.

Do you apply this across all sports then DinG. You can also take it further - what constitutes a British Serviceman, should only Brit born personnel be allowed to take the Queen's Shilling? (P.S. I got 4 bob)

jaysay · 12-10-2013, 13:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guinness

What about someone like our own Eric....born here, is now Canadian, by choice not by birth,...lets suppose his son considers himself a Brit by heritage, he's a cracking footballer and has no chance of showing or improving his talents in an Ice Hockey based country...do we deny him the chance of representing England because his dad got fed up of Clayton?

Sod of Guinness I'd deny him just because his dad is Eric

jaysay · 12-10-2013, 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

Do you apply this across all sports then DinG. You can also take it further - what constitutes a British Serviceman, should only Brit born personnel be allowed to take the Queen's Shilling? (P.S. I got 4 bob)

You were a greedy sod

DaveinGermany · 12-10-2013, 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

Do you apply this across all sports then DinG. You can also take it further - what constitutes a British Serviceman, should only Brit born personnel be allowed to take the Queen's Shilling? (P.S. I got 4 bob)

Aye Barrie, all sports. As to joining HM forces, in an ideal world yes, our servicemen & women would be British as it's a British Army, Navy, Air Force. That said though, they've been scrabbling round for several years now to fill the ranks with cannon fodder, end result, they opened up recruiting to our commonwealth brethren.

Difference is though, these folk won't be on obscene pay packets, getting idolised or living the life of Riley, they'll be getting stuck in in dangerous & life threatening situations, risking life & limb so a whole different World.

Guinness · 12-10-2013, 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Simple answer, yes! If you start tinkering with definitions & happenstances the whole ethic of a "National" player or sports person has no meaning or worth. Instead "Our team" would be a cobbled together hodgepodge of mercenary's playing for the highest bidder with no pride or passion to win for "their" Country. This is self evident every Saturday with a quick glance through the team sheets of most EPL teams.

I'd sooner have us being crap on our own merits than win through default due to paying the gold price for success.

So..by your definition, if Eric had kept his English nationality, despite the fact that he's lived in Canada for 40-50 years, and his son would have been born there, and never seen Clayton except on Google Earth, he'd be able to play for England...

Devil's advocating here btw