Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Hi, I have recently been given an explanation as to why these wide "flags" were laid next to ordinary cobbles, in front of the Hargreaves Arms pub on Manchester Road, Accrington.

(by the way - I believe the pub is due to re-open Mon 6th April, 2009).

I am not sure if what I have been told is true, but wondered if anyone would like to have a guess about their "purpose in life".

Atarah

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Is it braile for "your crossing a cobbled street" :D

Seriously now, I'd have a guess at something to do with horses and carts

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

They look like they are spaced to fit wagon wheels

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Ladders?

Edit - can't be, thee on the back alley too

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Ken, its brail for 'dont drink and drive, the cop shops over the road'

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

It's to make it easier when wearing heels :rolleyes:

I would go for the horse and cart thing. The flags seem more worn towards the middle than the edge like they have had something running up and down them, but guess that could be many things

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

A path to the swan when you blind drunk

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I were thinking where the tram lines were , but a bit too close to the buildings for that , or something going back to the days when the first water and gas lines were layed down :D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Is it so that horses knew where the end of the road was?

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

[quote=Atarah;700855]Hi, I have recently been given an explanation as to why these wide "flags" were laid next to ordinary cobbles, in front of the Hargreaves Arms pub on Manchester Road, Accrington.

(by the way - I believe the pub is due to re-open Mon 6th April, 2009).

I am not sure if what I have been told is true, but wondered if anyone would like to have a guess about their "purpose in life".

Its just an extension of the pavement from Bank Terrace.

Retlaw.

ps
did you get my email on Wm. Hindle.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Flippin' heck, I had my wedding reception there back in 1970 and it seemed really posh to me!

Well, 'im indoors reckons that the flags were there to stop the cobbles breaking up when the carts delivered to the hotel.

Nice to see the pic Atarah, brought back nice memories x

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

i was thinking fer the owd hoss drawn dray.:confused:

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Perhaps to roll the barrels along ? .. :D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

at a wild guess as they go along the road for some distance iw oudl say it was for horses to get a better grip while ppulling somthing that wa sin teh road

like when a tram broke down the horse would walk along side the road pulling it along or a carridge of some sort

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

or they just laid em that way to confuse us anoraks 100 yrs on.:D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Were there buildings built on the current road line originally and that is the width of the cobbled road between them?
If you look at the line of Manchester Road as it passes The Park Inn it seems to follow straight on down Grange Lane thus making the bit between there and the Hargreaves a later re-alignment. There may well have been buildings there originally.

De-bunk at will!! :D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

these large stones become very slippery in the wet so were place there for when criminals ran out of court seeking refuge in the pub

they would slip on the stones and be dragged back into court

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I'm just with the theory that they were just extensions of the originals, but would love to hear Atarah's hearsay.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I have contributed to other threads on the subject of Grange lane, in the area of the Fire Station, plus photographs. Grange lane as you see it now, was impassable until the Fire Station was built in 1934, opened in May 1935. The Lane had to be raise twelve feet, to meet the bottom of Timber St & Manchester Rd.

Retlaw.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Well and truly de-bunked :D

Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Hi, well you have all guessed what I would probably have guessed (and it is probably the correct explanation) - but here is what I was told:-

For the old fashioned pram!! (perambulator) - for the mums talking their new off spring for a Sunday afternoon stroll, on their way up Manchester Road, to Oak Hill Park - must have been an extrememly bumpy ride anyway for the poor child, but slightly less bumpy on the section near the Hargreaves Arms Pub.

what do you think about that explanation? :)
Atarah

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

With those coach built prams you needed all the help you could get.
The thought of pushing one up Manchester Rd reminded me of the effort I used to make pushing one up Dill Hall Lane (I lived at the top)

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I'd say codswallop!!

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Your gonna get debunked again.
Its what I said, an extension of the pavement from Adelaide St to Bank Terrace.

Retlaw.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

LOL!! I meant the pram explanation!!!

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I pushed the twins in their double pram up manchester road a few times and nearly killed myself each time I did it!!

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Well if it is right they had better people on the council them days than they have now, can you imagine them being as thoughtful nowadays? I can't, but I'm sure they would think of a way of charging/taxing you to push a pram up there :rolleyes:

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Are they ancient ley lines, proving that Accrington was the centre of the old world, and Camelot was on Warner Street?

:D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Thers a similar track near Cowm Reservoir at Whitworth, we were told by the local historian that the cobbles were for the horses hooves to grip, the slabs for the cartwheels.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Hi everyone....nice to see the Hargreaves getting some tongues wagging:) I have just bought the place in an effort to stop a succession of breweries running it even further into the ground. It s a stunning property and i want to try and do it some justice in renovationg it and opening it up as good bar again.... with the hope of opening upstairs as a restaurant at some point. Im looking for info though, as much as possible into the history of the place... any links or infor would be welcomed in my hunt for its past...the place is brimming with charachter from celler to tp floor, i feel privalidged to have it to be honest, a true part of accringtons history. Im not some rich city developer, im an accrington lad born and bred, so would love you guys to help in getting some nfo together.......please please please.
Cheers
Justin

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

was a good boozer early 60s white coffee, had a landlord called "Jack" who used to play the piano drunk as a skunk, whilst his dog used to sit beside n howl, he would be that drunk he would fall off his stool, n a regular would pick him up n he would continue the piece without missing a note. think he also worked in Bulloughs offices, all the road workers used to stand outside around 6-45 at morning n jack would let em in fer a pint before the vans picked em up fer work. happy days, thats all the history i know soz.:D;)

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I had my wedding reception upstairs there on 2nd September 1961

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Justin, what can I say, but .. good for you and I wish you every success. I will help you all I can with its history. I love it when an Accrington lad tries to do his best for his own town!

Atarah

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

We use to have a good folk night at the Hargreaves in the 70's. Remember the landlord Jack well,and the dog.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I remember Jack too cashy especially when he used to fall of the stool playing the piano. used to practice there in the seventies with a group, that was after Jack ad died. Worked on the refurbishment in 76 whilst the pub was close, when it reopened a mate took it over Denis and Ruth Smalley, was my local for a few years but ain't been in or years now

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Is that the Denis Smalley who used to live on Hornby St in the 1950s?
I recall that his real surname was Manifold.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

i always knew jack as a very clever fellow..
he could view an old financial ledger book,
look down the column of pounds,shillings ,and pence
and calculate them all up in his head..AND..it would be correct :):)

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

That's the one Margaret, unfortunately Denis died a couple of years ago, he was a painter and decorator by trade, served his time with Fred Hindle, always had a huge 750cc Motor Bike. His wife Ruth was Stewardess at the Brooks Club of a time

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I heard that too beechy, in fact I think his wife told us about it one night when we'd been practising

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

thats correct beechy, i mentioned he was n office worker, but omitted to say how clever he was.;) i was hoping fer someone to slag my description of him n then i could bounce em.:D:D:D:D:D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Thats not like you cashy:rolleyes::rolleyes::D

Bit of a local history puzzle
 

this one is for Whitecoffee - Justin.

Atarah

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Atarah.
Do you know why the left hand pillar is no longer there.

Retlaw

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

no..but I reckon it was a shoulder to lean on after 10 pints of bitter!:D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

All the pillars and the balcony have gone now.
You would have crapped in your kecks if youd been stood there when the left hand pillar went.

Retlaw.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

just what had you and jacks wife been practicing :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Come on beechy, when I'd been pracising with the group, not the old dear:D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Good Luck in your new venture, spent many a happy and "late hour" in the Hargreaves in the 80s, many good memories particularly as that was were I first met my wife.

If somebody could spend a decent amount of time as landlord without having time to build up a clientel then it could be a great pub

Is it true there's a fully sprung dance floor above the pub?

when will it reopen?

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Hi, maybe when the Hargreaves re-opens, we could support the new owner and have one of the Accy Web meetings there?

Atarah

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Good idea....he needs to get back on here and tell us what real ales he will be putting on and when it will reopen.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

There certainly wasa sprung dance floor upstairs, seen it with my own eyes! In the 80's as a poor student I used to spend a lot of time in the Hargreaves, landlord then was called Barry and his wife was called Mavis, used to do some cracking food, with prices aimed at the college population, the side room used to be completely separated from the main pub, think the windows used to have " the Vault" etched in them, we had a couple of student do's in there. Was a great pub, I have many fond memories and hope it gets a new lease of life!

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

I remember Barry...he held a good pub in the 80's..sound as the pound..they did have a pool room at the side room but then moved the table into a larger area..used to have a few in there then back to the Tramway.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

When did the Tramway shut Mancie, it seems a long time ago now, used to go in there and the Park when Scouse Dave had it after Denbo left. There was a nice little run there Swan, Hargreaves, Tramway and Park, no need to shlep into town:D

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Can remember when i was working for BSU (Business Support Unit).. as it was north lancs training bought the tramway for their offices and that was in 1984 early 1985. BSU ran the YTS for the office and retail and catering, north lancs training did the building and mechanics ..

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

wow!!! what can i say atarah! i'm truly gobsmacked! please come in for a pint .....i owe you one. we're well on with the refurb now and are hoping to be opening 2nd week in december. i hope i can blow this picture up and use it in the pub. your a star....thats pic has just made my day:))))))

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

once saw n old photo of the junction outside, when the old church was still standing, blowed if i remember who had it. was a great pic.:confused:

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

That is a picture of a postcard of which I have the original. I lent it to Bob Dobson and he used on the cover of his last book.

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

it may be the only picture of any historic value of the pub:( i'm certainly not having much luck. i cant believe that a place thats been stood in accrington for nearly 200 yrs hasn't got more documentation behind it. surley ther must be some somewhere.... i know its a long shot jeff but is there any chance at all i could borrw your picture some time in order to get a big copy done for the pub...i'll be sure to put your name on it....ther might even be a pint in it for you:) i'll have to stop giving pints away, i'll go bust before i open if im not careful...!! So, gentlemen......which real ales would you recommend. i'm going to start with 3 and see how it goes..... what are your top 3????

Re: Bit of a local history puzzle
 

Hi, I too have a postcard. Its not Jeff's postcard, nor is it MY postcard. Its just a photo of old Accrington, so anyone can use it!