Alleytroyds
 

During my research for another recent thread Ibnoticed that on old maps the area around the bottom of Market Street, Church, is marked as Alleytroyds.

Today there is a modern housing estate in this location and I am pleased to see that the old name has been retained.

Does anyone know the derivation of the name or how far it dates back? Googling the name just brings up lists of houses for sale.

Would the royds part of the name have the same meanig as the Royds in the Woodnook area of Accy?

Re: Alleytroyds
 

I am unable to help you with the derivation of the name Sue, but I don't really like the name.......it is ugly. And I know that life cannot be sanitised to remove the ugly things in it........but I wish they had chosen a name with local connections that didn't sound grimy.
Just my opinion...as usual.

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Royds Street is named after a family so don't think it's connected to Alleytroyds. Will have a look at my 1848 map when I get home but I'm pretty sure it was called that back then.

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Yes, Steve, that area is named on this map.
Shows 'Alleytroyds T.P. and weighing machine' What does T.P. stand for ?

Agree with Margaret, it is an ugly name, but would be interesting to find out why it was called that.

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Not 100% certain but T.P. might stand for Turnpike

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...which would make sense as there was a weighing machine there as well.

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Sounds feasable to me.

Actually,the map I am looking at is earlier than 1848 .. no railways.

It is the oldest one on Mario .. wish they would date it.

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Why is it an ugly name? Cos it reminds you of something you get on your bottom? :rolleyes:

Steve thought that might be the case for the Accy Royds.

Kate please can you post a link to your early map - I find Mario and Lancs Lantern impossible to find anything on. :(

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Royds street is named after Edward Albert Nuttall Royd who built it and the streets of the other streets that bear his name , he also built / rebuilt Newhouse Farm and leafield farm on sandy lane .

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I don't like the name.

Sounds a bit too Yorkshire for me.

Murgatroyd, and the like.

Royd isn't in the dictionary, though I read that in place names, it's a Yorkshire derivative of 'road'. Which makes some sense.

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Kate please can you post a link to your early map - I find Mario and Lancs Lantern impossible to find anything on. :([/quote]

This is a screenshot of part of the map (probably 1840's)

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Alley t' royds---Pathway to the roads---Just a thought

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No, nothing like that...to be honest it hadn't crossed my mind........and I can't put my finger on why I think it is an ugly name.......I just don't like it. It sounds grimy and unpleasant. Not a nice place to live......like dung heap, or muckmidden.

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Well thought out...and could be right too.

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'Something you get on your bottom !?!' .. oh .. s'okay .... just got it..:D

See Steve has posted the bit I was talking about, could be correct with around 1840. Although shows Spring Mill which wasn't built until 1844.
Steve .. is this the map you referred to as 1848 ?

Agree, Mario is really difficult to navigate (since they 'improved' it)..:)

P.S. Some one has just told me T.P. stood for Toll Point.

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Steve .. is this the map you referred to as 1848 ?

P.S. Some one has just told me T.P. stood for Toll Point.[/quote]

Nope, my map is almost identical but it has the railway on it and is dated 1848.

I think Toll Point sounds a good bet...wonder if there was ever a Toll House there...?

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Maybe it meant something like Alley t'road then ? (Translation .. Alley to the road..:D).

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You can access Steve's 1848 map on the ordinary LCC website but can't see yours Kate.

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Very interesting article here, sorry if you've seen it before

"Up until the early 1960s, when carrying on the canal ceased, Accrington had to rely upon the wharves at Enfield and Church for its canal service. The former, opened in 1801, was built near to the junction of two turnpike roads which enabled goods to be carried to and from Bury and Clitheroe besides serving Accrington. The warehouses still stand partly derelict. Several factories were served by the canal at Enfield; of particular note are Royal Mill, the last to be built in Clayton, which opened in 1912, and Enfield Corn Mill, used for many years by Joseph Appleby, who had his own fleet of boats carrying grain on the canal. This mill was subsequently occupied by the East Lancashire Soap Company who used the canal for shipping their famous floating soap. Presumably, it must have been carried by boat!

The history of the canal at Church is, perhaps, more interesting. The turnpike from Blackburn to Accrington was opened after the canal and the canal embankment across Tinker Brook was enlarged to carry the road as well. The first canalside warehouse was opened in 1836, a few years afterwards. This was built by the Hargreaves brothers of Broad Oak. A proper wharf was erected seven years later, the canal company draining the canal for just twenty four hours to allow the foundations to be built. The canal company later took over the warehouse, enlarging and improving the facilities in 1890. It probably ceased to be used by the canal company around 1921, and today is in a derelict condition, despite being listed."

Accrington

Re: Alleytroyds
 

Thanks Wadey, was just about to wade through the whole article on the www when I saw your post!

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Ignore that, senior moment. neither of them are there. Sorry! :(

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On my shelves somewhere I have a booklet/essay written about Alleytroyds by a Miss Doris Pickup. There will be one in the library. It gives an explanation for the name. Retlaw will be able to tell us when the name is first recorded. I will ask the people at the Lancashire Place-Name Survey. Definitely nowt to do with the Royds family, who came to Accrington from Rochdale in the first place just to buy land.

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Alleytroyds sounds like a more acurate description of Hemoroyds or some other sort of rear alley illness.
.
i know someone who lives on Alleytroyds and thinking about it he does walk a bit funny

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The people at the Lancashire Place-Name Survey cannot help with a derivation

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See my post 8, accyman.

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Sorry Kate, as you may imagine, that part of my anatomy is a bit on my mind at the moment... ;)

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Road in this sense is not a highway but a cleared piece of land: see below for various thoughts on this gleaned from sources on google. This makes more sense to me. Alleytroyds could be the land belonging to All... something. Might be Allah if they built a mosque on it! :rolleyes::eek:

In this are we also have Huntroyde near Simonstone which describes the activity on the cleared land. And Ormerod is a local surname and street name.

From google:

In Norwegian, the name Royd means- dwells in the clearing in the forest. The name Royd orginated as an Norwegian name.

rodu - Old English-a clearing- royd and worth are frequent elements within
the Bradford Metro area but much less common further North.
Waddington-Feather suggests this pattern reflects the relative influence of
the old Saxon kingdoms of Mercia and Northumbria. However, others have
argued that the word royd indicates clearings made later than those with the
element ley. In medieval Calderdale "royd land" was the term commonly used
to describe land cleared or "assarted" for farming. It's tempting to suggest
a historical chronology of word elements to describe land brought into
cultivation : ley - worth - royd - intake; but alas it's never that simple.
The common Yorkshire surnames Ackroyd, Boothroyd, Holroyd, Murgatroyd and
Illingworth derive from these local place name elementsIn Norwegian, the name Royd means- dwells in the clearing in the forest. The name Royd orginated as a Norwegian name.


rodu - Old English-a clearing- royd and worth are frequent elements within
the Bradford Metro area but much less common further North.
Waddington-Feather suggests this pattern reflects the relative influence of
the old Saxon kingdoms of Mercia and Northumbria. However, others have
argued that the word royd indicates clearings made later than those with the
element ley. In medieval Calderdale "royd land" was the term commonly used
to describe land cleared or "assarted" for farming. It's tempting to suggest
a historical chronology of word elements to describe land brought into
cultivation : ley - worth - royd - intake; but alas it's never that simple.
The common Yorkshire surnames Ackroyd, Boothroyd, Holroyd, Murgatroyd and Illingworth derive from these local place name elements.


ROYD, ROYDS. A local name meaning "at the rode" (so always spelt in early records), an old term implying a ridding, or clearing. Compounded with the Christian name of the proprietor or settler we get Murgatroyd (Mergret = Margaret) or Ormerod (Orme). Whitaker, in his Hist. and Ant. of Craven, has such spots as Tomrode and Wilimotrode (Wilmot = William): p. 199. Sometimes 'royd' is compounded with the names of the hills cleared, as in Holroyd or Acroyd; sometimes with the profession of the resident, as Monkroyd or Smithroyd (Whitaker, p. 199); sometimes with a word descriptive of the locality, as in Huntroyd. The glossary to Hulton's Coucher Book of Whalley Abbey says: 'Roda, an assart or clearing. Rode land is used in this sense in modern German, in which the verb roden means to clear. The combination of the syllable rod, rode, or royd with some other term, or with the name of an original settler, has, no doubt, given to particular localities such designations as Huntroyd, Ormerod, &c.' See Notes and Queries, 1st Ser., vol. v. p. 571, for further authorities. Dr. Whitaker styles it 'a participial substantive of the provisional verb rid, to clear or grub up': see Hist. Whalley, 3rd edit., p. 364.


Royd is a Yorkshire dialect word for Road i.e. a clearing, and generates surnames such as (in descending frequency) :

Holroyd, Ackroyd, Murgatroyd, Boothroyd, Oldroyd, Learoyd, Ormondroyd, Howroyd...

The element Royd: reached its highest use in the Halifax Registration District

Re: Alleytroyds
 

Dave do you think the man would have been Royds rather than Royd otherwise the street would have been so named.

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This is a more likely explanation, considering the age of the place, & its first mention in the Church Kirk registers. In those days Vicars were not usualy local to the area, & wrote what they thought they'd heard, and Alley tu Royds is feasable considering local dialects. Especially as there were very few paved roads in those days, mostly cart tracks.
Retlaw.

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I get what you are saying Walter but surely a place name important enough to be on an 1840s map would have been around longer than a clergyman's mishearing in 1783.

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Digging around for more about Alleytroyds I found the following very informative document about Church and its history

http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...st_2007_3_.pdf

I especially liked the following:

Church can probably trace its origins back to the Conquest. It has a recorded
history and survivals that are 800 years old. The site was selected initially for
its favoured topography. It was also blessed with water power and reserves
of coal which sparked the industrial growth that has forged the special
character of the Conservation Area. Church forms a distinct enclave within the larger Accrington conurbation. It is recognised from viewpoints in the
surrounding landscape. It retains considerable heritage interest, possibly
unique of its type including discernible topographic setting, medieval vestiges
and plan-form, node of transport infrastructure, and locus of industrial
revolution sites and buildings.

These elements combine to form character areas of great power that are unlikely to be experienced elsewhere in modern Britain.
It offers a distinct and valuable character setting for sympathetic development, and merits better understanding and treatment.

Assessing Special Interest

The Conservation Area is part of a landscape characterised as “Industrial
Foothills and Valleys”, but has a pre-industrial history dating from the
conquest. By the 13th century its plan form had been established by routes
focussed on the church. The earliest survival is medieval (the church tower).
However the character of the conservation area was defined by Georgian
industrialisation - the canal (1807-87), Bradshaw Street housing 18228 and the turnpike of 1827.

The document mentions Alleytroyds on page 21 but only as an area name, with no historical information.

Further trawling on Google found mention of Alleytroyds in the censuses for 1841, 51 and 61, as an address with people living there.

I also found the following record on Lancs Lantern:

Title: Alleytroyds Theatre, Church and Oswaldtwistle
Newspaper:Accrington Free Press
Issue Date:Mar 13, 1858
Page:4
Column:d
Illustrated:No
Description:Alleytroyds Theatre, Church and Oswaldtwistle
Obituary:No
Library Location:Accrington
Cuttings:No
Classmark:T71
Format:Microfilm

And on the following website:

Place:Blackburn Registration District, 1861 Census Street Index S-T - Your Archives

This is a list of streets and places in the Blackburn Registration District in the 1861 census and includes

Toll Bar Alleytroyds, Church Kirk reference RG 9/3106 folio 13

Re: Alleytroyds
 

That 'glory' of Church is long gone.
I know- I lived in Church from 1985 - 2002, and sold my house dirt cheap just to get out fast.

Don't put yourself down, I'm sure things didn't improve even after they got rid of you.

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I think the name was Royd rather than Royds, it may be that it was known as royds street as in it belongs to him:confused:

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From Victoria County History of Church, 1911

Townships - Church | A History of the County of Lancaster: Volume 6 (pp. 399-404)

The principal road is that from Blackburn to Accrington, crossing the southern end of the township. The road from Blackburn through Oswaldtwistle enters the south end at Alleytroyds, apparently the Ollertrodes of 1618

There were various minor families in the township, but little can be recorded of their estates. The names of Radcliffe, Church, Cattlow, Rodes, Aspden, Wallbank and Collinson occur among the earlier deeds, and the inquisitions show that the Nowells of Read and other neighbouring landowners had small estates.

Thomas Greenwood of Oswaldtwistle died in 1618 holding lands called Ollertrodes, Fleets and Churchfield in Church of the heirs of Ralph Rishton by 3d. rent; Lancs. Inq. p.m. (Rec. Soc.), ii, 244. The Greenwood tenement may be traced to the John Greenwood (1506) mentioned above in the account of Cattlow. Richard Greenwood and Thomas his son had land, &c., in Church and Oswaldtwistle in 1577; Pal. of Lanc. Feet of F. bdle. 39, m. 116.

Re: Alleytroyds
 

I may be going out on a limb here but the Scandinavian name Olle is a diminutive of Olaf, the name of several kings of Norway. We were speculating not long ago about a possible Viking origin for Accy...

http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/f...tml#post967263

Re: Alleytroyds
 

Alternatively...
This very unusual surname is 13th century Medieval English, and is recorded in an equally unusual number of spellings. These include such forms as Holliar, Hollyar, Hawler, Hawler, Holyard, Hollyard, Hollors, Hulliard, Olle, Ollar, Oller, Olliers, and Oyler! They all derive in whole or part from original residence by either a place of worship, probably a pagan temple or a holy-yard, with "yard" being an enclosed area, or from living or working in a "holly wood". Holly, being a very hard wood, had many uses in the olden times, and the specialist growing of holly was a major industry. The fact that there are so many varied forms of the surname is testament to both the vigorous local dialects and the inablility of local clerics to spell anything but the most obvious names. There has been a suggestion that the name is Norman-French and in the form as Ollier or Oller, this in some cases, may be so. If this is the case, then it is a short or nickname form of the personal name Olivier or Oliver.

Re: Alleytroyds
 

Nice bit of research, Sue.
You've unearthed a lot to be going on with.....!

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Wow! appreciation at last... :rolleyes:

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Well you are researching your own question!! haha!

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Silly me!:o

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Ged off thats 53 years lots of things can be put on maps if they are refered to by that name.
I have quite a few old maps, and if you look at the small print at the bottom, you will see the surveying was done by army engineers. Names were supplied by local knowledge. When they were surveying the engineers would'nt know the names of the places they were setting up their theodolites on.
Those army men did not draw the maps, all their findings were sent to the cartographers, who then drew the maps, and added place names. The 1848 Ordnance survey of Accrington contains 27 mistakes.
Retlaw

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Hence Ancliff and Stannel for Antley and Stanhill on some of the old maps.

It does look though from what I have uncovered that Alleytroyds was in existence under whatever name a couple of hundred years at least before
the late 1700s.