Hello I’m new.
 

Hi I found your forum on Google. I’m from Norfolk and unfortunately never been to Accrington.

The reason I am interested in Acrington is I recently found a box of old photos and postcards. I had 2 Great Uncles who like many were both killed in France WW1 in 1917. As it was the 100th Anniversary of Uncle George Brown on December 13th. I decided to look in the box and found photos of both brothers that I had never seen before.

I then decided to pull out the 200 odd postcards to see if anything was written on the back. I found about 10 from George. 2 from Frank. Plus a letter from George. I don’t want to bore anyone here. Cutting long story short, there was also sweetheart postcards about 5 from a Bertha. That’s all I have apart from two addresses that she had written on a couple.

30 Canal Street, Church

73 or 75 Catlow Hall Street, Oswaldtwhistle

I have looked at both addresses on the 1911 census and there is no Bertha there then. I realise it’s a while back now and that Bertha is probably no longer with us. I have no idea of her last name as no one had ever mentioned her. She has sent postcards with pictures from, drinking fountain, miller park, Preston. Ye towne pump Croston and another from Leyland. She talks about all the places. They are very moving and as we now know the fate of George, sad.

I would love of course to know who she was and does she have any living relatives?

I have heard of the Accrington Observer, that is it so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. If anyone is interested int the postcards I have scanned them.

I’m not sure what tags are so not added any sorry.

Merry Christmas to all and Thank you

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hi Kozie welcome to the forum, hope you get some success in yer search. Retlaw may possibly be able to give yeh some info if he sees this hes got a weath of knowledge on ww1 accy soldiers, may be worth sending him a message,

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

I also welcome you to the forum

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

ow do and welcome

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Kozie - As you know the date of George Brown's death - what was his military number ? This may help Retlaw. I advise holding fire on the Observer until you've given Retlaw more inflammation.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hello and welcome

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hi thanks for looking but I know about George Brown he was from Great Yarmouth, he was in the Royal Irish Fusiliers and he was killed at Arras on April 11th. Sorry it was a typo Frank his brother died on 13th December. I get them muddled up sometimes.

It is Bertha I am looking for. Not much to go on I realise. Thanks for checking the two addresses maybe she was the daughter of either occupant?

Sorry for the confusion, I didn’t want to put too much info I was trying to keep it simple, sorry again for wasting your time.

Thank you

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hi Bob

Thanks for the info. I have found George Francis Bray age 39 on the 1911 cwnsus at 27 Henry Street, Church, Kirk, Accrington. Along with his wife Ellen Tilet Bray 37 yrs and daughters Kate Elaine, Doris Ellen, Francis Suie and Bertha Annis age 9.

Bertha Annis married James P Morton in 1920. She died Bertha Morton 1975.

George Francis war records in 1915 show his address as 34 Canal St, Church, Kirk, Accrington.

Looks like this could be Bertha!

It would be great to know the date and source where you found the name at the address.

Thanks Very much

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Not me you should be thanking.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hi all just a quick update I do know the details of George Brown from Great Yarmouth thank you he died April 11th at Arras. His brother Frank died December 13th and is buried at Villers Faucon. Sorry I muddled the dates with the names. It was Bertha who was from Accrington who I am looking for. Apologies if that was not clear. I tried to keep it as simple as I could so as not to confuse. Did not seem to have worked sorry again for any wasted time.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Ok thanks no idea who posted the two names looked like you, obviously not.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Thanks for the info. I have found George Francis Bray age 39 on the 1911 cwnsus at 27 Henry Street, Church, Kirk, Accrington. Along with his wife Ellen Tilet Bray 37 yrs and daughters Kate Elaine, Doris Ellen, Francis Suie and Bertha Annis age 9.

Bertha Annis married James P Morton in 1920. She died Bertha Morton 1975.

George Francis war records in 1915 show his address as 34 Canal St, Church, Kirk, Accrington.

Looks like this could be Bertha!

It would be great to know the date and source where you found the name at the address.

Thanks Very much

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hi Retlaw

Thank you very much for all your help. I don’t want to confuse matters any more. Basically I was looking for a Bertha at the two addresses I gave. You have helped very much as it seems it was a Bertha Bray.

George Brown was from Great Yarmouth he served in the Royal Irish Fusiliers and was killed 11th April at Arras and is on the wall there as he had no grave.

The postcards I found are from 1917 between him and Bertha who I had never heard of before of the two addresses I gave but no surname. Now with your help it seems you have helped me find out who she was. Thank you very much for your help it is very kind of you. I can send you the postcards if you want to see them.

Kind regards Kozie

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hey Retlaw

The first picture is George the rest is just a few of Berthas postcards front and back. I can post the rest if you want to see them.

Thanks again
Kozie

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hey Retlaw

A few more of the postcards from Bertha. Plus photos and details of George 17821 Royal Irish Fusiliers.

Now looks like a Bertha is Bertha Annis Bray born 1901 daughter of George Francis Bray.
Kind regards Kozie

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

First uploads I’ve attempted hopefully I have done them correctly and you can see them. The Birthday cake Bertha is talking about must have been George’s 21st Birthday in July 1916? He was killed April 11th at Arras 1917 aged 21 years. From the postcard he sent home looks like he thought he would be coming home on 18th April. Like many others he didn’t.

Bertha looks as if she married a James P Morton in 1920 and died Bertha Morton in 1975 ..... Blackburn I think?

Thanks again Retlaw very kind of you.

I’m not sure what AVL 1918 means but I found the same address 34 Church Street. On George Francis Brays war records.

I have not heard of Burgess roll before but will look it up now so thank you as it is obviously the right Bertha.

Thank you again Kozie mystery solved 👍😁

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

I just remembered something else I wanted to tell you, My Great Grandmother only had a small house in Great Yarmouth and like many she used to take in visitors. Probably for summer holidays by the beach. Berthas father came from Lincolnshire originally which is not too far from Norfolk. Maybe Bertha had been a visitor and that is how she met George? No one ever mentioned her I had not heard of her until I found the photos and postcards in the loft 100 years later. I suppose we will never know for sure but you never know Bertha may have had her own family who are still about in Lancashire. They could recognise her lovely writing? Stranger things have happened?

Happy New Year to you all in ACCRINGTON ������

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Thanks for the info, must have been a mammoth task indexing the absent voters list for Greater Accy. Resurrections made me laugh. Do you think someone was drawing their pensions ��

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Don't overdo praising Retlaw - he's nowt else to do.

A family called Bray in nearby Oswaldtwistle had an England footballer init. I've forgotten his name - maybe there were two of them.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Tek no notice of yon Dobbo, and his wise cracks, as for mammoth task, aye eck Kozie, thad were nowt compared to finding all the details of the 12500 and odd men and women of Greater Accrington (Hyndburn) who took the kings shilling in WW1, ave bin at it longer than Dobbo spent plonking his big feet up and down, pretending to be a Copper.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Hi Bob

Thanks for info. I found the two brothers you were talking about.

One called Jackie Bray, played for and Manchester City with Matt Busby when they won the FA Cup. Plus he was an England player. Then a coach for Watford. Then he had a sports shop.

His brother George Bray played for Burnley. I think he played an FA cup too can’t remember what I just read exactly either against Stoke or Charlton Athletic. Not sure if they won. Anyway he played, trained and was a kit man till 1992!

They were both born in Oswaldtwistle.

Not sure if they were related but very interesting all the same.

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

Accrington Library or Blackburn Library may have a report on the death of these lads, and a list of those attending the funerals - there may be names that you recognise. Accrington will check the Accrington Observer for you, Blackburn will check the Lancashire Evening Telegraph

[email protected] Google the Blackburn library's address

There may be Brays still in Ossie. I'll check the phone book and let you know. I suggest asking the Hyndburn Chat Facebook page.There's an Ossie one too

Re: Hello I’m new.
 

There are two in Church, next door to Ossie - check the BT phone book for Bray in BB5 and give hem a ring.