Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

This has always been something that bothered me. A while ago, women had no rights, and had to start all this bra-burning, protesting to get rights, and slowly but surely, the rights came to women one-by-one. The high numbers of female unemployment decreased adn work rights were given, enabling them to apply and get any job that a man does. Just because women were women doesn't mean they shouldn't get a job. The number of housewives reporting crimes against her at the home has decreased, and general manners towards women has majorly increased (opening doors, sitting them first at a table, etc).

But now, it seems, that men seem to be the minority. All a woman has to do is say that "this guy at work" has been eyeing her for the last month/week/year, and was making rude gestures towards her involving sexually explicit movements. Guaranteed that the woman will be believed before the man, even if the man is innocent. It is very hard for a man to prove the innocence as women take looking at their rear as sexual harrassment nowadays (it's a compliment!).

The number of male house"wives" has increased with the number of "independant" women around who would rather work than look after the kids (this is their choice, and i'm not saying they shouldn't have that choice). But, with this increased number of male house"wives", the number of male beatings from their spouse/significant other at home has also increased. Men are being bullied more than women now, and the perpetrators are women, and men still stuck in the macho "men work, women mind the children" egos.

A man will rarely, if even at all, win a case of sexual harrassment from a woman. It seems that women have an upper hand over men. They seems to have more rights, maybe not specifically speaking more legal rights, but more power anyway.

If a couple are married and have kids, and they split up, the mother has instant custody over the child. The father has to fight for custody. If the mother gets the child, the father has to pay the mother, but not vica-versa. People say that a child needs it's mother more: bull! The child needs both parents, but either will do should push come to shove (also depending on how the mother/father treated the child).

So, in your opinion, do women seem to have more rights than men?

(Oh, and before anyone thinks it, i'm not been chauvenistic, i just thought it would make a good discussion.)

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

lol wemon do tend to have more rights but as for kids if they split up the mother doesnt have custerdy strait away it just depends on the motherand father there better makin arangments with each eg if there was 4 kids then father has 2 and mother has 2 but if there was only 1 child then they have to make arangments best for them like for instance if any of them work then theone that works shouldhave the child the days they dontwork but they are better gettin intouch with a solicitor so that if there isany complications then thev allready todthe solicitor and maby the solicitor can come to an arangment and it depends on thecercamstansers cuz iv lost my son through his dad an socia sevises telling lies i now cant even visit him

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

I would say that women are making up for lost time! I am lucky in the fact that I have been brought up to believe that the sexes are equal, but I remember my mother telling me about the massive pay rises she got in the 70's - to bring her inline with the male pay rate on LET! Its not that long ago that women were seen as inferior, as less capable.
I do think things have gone a bit too PC though, as far as work - people should be given the job on their ability, not because of their sex, or because the PC brigade have said they need another woman on board.
As far as custody of children in a divorce goes...hmmm. I am about to go all maternal now (which is a rarity for me!). Yes, technically, in an ideal world the child should go to the 'best' parent. But then you have to define what makes one parent better than another. Plus (and this is where I willprobably get shot down in sentimentality!), men don't 'do' pregnancy. They don't carry a baby round for 9 (horrible) months and develop that bond before a baby is even born. I don't mean that this makes them less of a parent. If my partner and myself split up, I would expect to get custody of our little boy, even though he is an excellent father. This would be for no other reason that I am the mother. Its difficult to explain, but he wasn't the one who had to put up with looking like a beached whale for 9 months. He wasn't the one who had a 3 day labour (during which I might add he popped home to go on his PC!). I am not one of these silly women who worship their offspring, but if push came to shove, I feel like I have 'earned' that baby.
However as the child gets older, I think they should have more of a say in whom they would like to live with and when they would like to see the absent parent.
I think the daft bints who have 4 kids by different fathers then play about with access, and use children as a weapon have given the situation a bad name. I fully agree with a child being able to see both parents whenever they choose - any parents who need a court to tell them this need their heads banging together.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

well ive got 2 kids by differant fathers and i sertanatly do not use them as a target i just simply was lookin for the right guy and used protection andstill gotpreg but when the fathers found out they ran like a mouse so u cant say that about every one cuz sometimes its diferant surcamstances

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

I am sorry pixie, but no one 'earns' children. Just because you carried them for 9 months and went through labour to have them, then to say you 'earned' them as a result makes them sound like commodities.

If 2 people were to split up, I would expect the father to fight tooth and nail for custody of his children - I don't think the mother should have the absolute right to automatic custody of the children. In our situation though, we would probably work out an amicable solution; neither of us would want to put our kids through any more pain than is absolutely necessary (but I can't see us splitting up anyway!!!)

I think it is appalling though that unmarried fathers have no legal rights over their kids.


In the workplace women seem to get treated more favourably than men. In many offices, the men have to wear shirts, trousers, ties, etc. In the heat of summer, trousers and ties can be very uncomfortable. I am not saying that they should start wearing dresses, but women aren't required to be as formal. If they were, it would be the female equivalent of suits for them as well as us.

In one company where I worked, we were allowed to wear knee-length tailored shorts when the weather got very warm, and the rules on ties were also relaxed, but I don't know of any other company that did this (and I have worked for a few!).

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Some interesting points brought up Xiango, where to start?

- Like Pixie said, the time before equal pay for equal work regardless of sex seems a totally crazy idea now but it is within the last 25 years that was put right.

-The fact that even when custody of a child is given to the Mother who then denies the Father access, and the law is unable to enforce it, is still wrong and needs addressing. l'm with Fathers for Justice on that one.

-As for women reporting flirting as more serious sexual harrasment, watch out 'cause l flirt with anyone, if you don't believe me make sure you are at the next meet at The Stag! ;)

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

It didn't come out how I wanted it to Vorlon. Of course I don't think of kids as some sort of 'commodity' that can be bought and sold. However I DO think that a mother has a very different bond to her children, than what a father has, as a result of pregnancy. I can't quite find a way to put it into words that convey it properly.

I was also under the impression that as of Dec 2003 the law had changed. If a couple is unmarried with kids, the fathers name has to be on the birth certificate for him to have parental rights. Before that I think they had to apply for parental rights.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

if the fathers name isnt on the birth catificate then thayjust have to aply for a dna test then if it shows up as there child then thay autamaticly getparantal responsability and get more rights

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Agree with Vorlon on the unfairness of dress codes.

What passes as suitable work attire for women in the work place, when men have to be suited and booted is very unfair.

17 years trussed up like a turkey running between Jermyn Street and Knightsbridge and now off to the acupuncturists in my sarong. Revenge is sweet and so are my legs. ;)

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

You should see our daughter. She is very much 'Daddy's' girl, but I didn't have to go through pregnancy to bond with her. Yes, she goes to her mother for comfort, but the majority of the time she will come straight to me, and if I appear while she is getting comforted by her mother, she will put her arms out for me.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

I'm not saying that a father has no bond with his children. I'm just saying that its different. :)

I think I'm arguing a moot point anyway. I'm not planning on splitting up with my partner, and even if we did I would like to think that we would reach an amicable agreement, rather than have the courts dictate to us.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

You may not be planning to split up Honey, but me and Chav are planning to run away together and fully intend to get custody using all our newly given rights.

Sorry to break the news to you like this,

Rindy, your children's new Mummy xxxxxxxxxx

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Now theres one for Trisha!:eek:

I think I'll threaten the Brat with this when he misbehaves!:D

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

if we split up this is the plan of action ..


you die

baby comes with me

baby grows up

we dance on your grave

you have been warned

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Parental responsibility depends on when the child was born. It applies to decisions which can be made for a child regarding medical treatment, education etc. If your child was born before December 2003 an unmarried father has to either,
a) Marry the mother or
b) register a parental responsibility agreement with the court or apply to the court for parental responsibility.

If your child was born after December 2003 an unmarried father has to
a) Register the birth of the child jointly with the mother
b) Marry the mother or
c) apply to court for parental responsibility.

Therefore if your child was born in May 2002 for example and needs medical treatment, even if the name of the father is on the birth certificate, if you are unmarried the mother must give consent technically. This could cause some problems within families when the father doesn't agree to treatment ie, Vaccinations, operations, blood transfusions as his wishes could be vetoed by the mother.

Hope this helps..:D

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

don't know about women having more rights than men! what i do know is women are always RIGHT. pmsl

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

There is actually no such thing as custody any more. It was abolished by the Children Act some time ago. The current thinking is that both parents should have equal responsibility for their child(ren), although it is normally the case that the children live with mother. In many cases, mother does not/has not worked, and the children have spent more time with her. That said, fathers should and can get reasonable access - and it can be enforced more strongly than before. There is a move in the Courts to send mothers to prison if they consistently refuse access, and not before time. A parent can get a Residence Order, whereby the Court states that the child should live with that parent, but a father usually has to prove that the mother is unfit before he is granted one.

And yes, the children are consulted as to which parent they want to live with, once they are old enough to make a reasoned decision.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Forgot to add this bit - I am concerned about sexual harassment in the workplace. It does happen, but far too many women over-react these days. However, lads, there is a world of difference between an appreciative look and feeling up the goods! I would treat any allegation made by a member of staff with a degree of scepticism and would want some corroboration/proof.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

all it took was a tiny sacrifice from one stupid "suffering get" who decided to throw herself in front of the kings horse, in protest that she was as equal to any man and wanted equal status so now what are you women doing to do eh? mollify every male around? ... you actually think you can outsmart a real man? har har har ... well two x,s never make a y (chromesome) meaning that even if there are a thousand "mummies" around a child, it would never come close to five minutes with his or her real FATHER, for a start, who is most likely to tell the child the truth about the real world instead of filling its head with sick fantasies of a world of equality where decent people can live in peace with the demented...its sssooooooo unholy! im sorry to have to bursts your bubbles ladies but there is only one way you can ever be equal to a man and that is you have to be lucky enough to have been born one... brussells can make as many rules and pass as many laws as they like, but i have it from the highest authority, that in every known universe that contains a life force there is a perfectly natural pecking order whether it be an "evolutionary order" or an "intelligent order" ....this order to the chaos on this island earth has been totally buggered up by your strife for equality which can never be, allow me to be the first to say that war is inevitable, world war... for which no-one in this country is prepared for should it suddenly loom before the appropiate time...too busy embracing sodom and building giant monuments to adulterers while paying for the privelidge of getting your own money from the banks! ...... still lets see what womenkind can do first, ...like the first eve who tempted adam ...or the slut salome who had john the baptists head cut off, to the modern day 6 kid 7 father unmarried trollops who use the children as weapons in order to extract money from all concerned, this planet is one big asylum like a home without a father in it...constant bickering...a blatant disregard for laws and the delusion that we are all equal... well god made man in his image, not woman, so get over it and go and make a brew or summat.......
p.s.margaret thatcher couldnt even be equal after fighting with some argy schoolies and having that operation you can have done at private hospital....whatsit called... oh yeah...a strappadictomy! blessed are the ignorant, for they shall inherit large bills.....

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Oh my...michael - funniest post ever!:D

I have to assume you are joking, because surely nobody could be that daft and still breathe...:rolleyes:

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Oh dear, another male who hasn't read Margaret Mead. Also, all you are stuck with are stupid X chromosomes - we have a Y as well. And who are all these women who achieve parthenogenesis? It takes two to make a baby - even if one is a sperm donor, so where are all these men taking responsibility for their illegitimate offspring? No, blame the woman, it's easier.

As for slagging off the women who fought for the right to vote, words (almost) fail me. Fortunately I am a woman, so they rarely do.

You gave me a laugh, though, Michael - no-one with half a brain could seriously believe that the possession of wedding tackle makes them a higher species!

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Women have got all the rights and services that they have because they fought for them. If blokes were seriously unhappy with their lot then all they have to do is change it. In the first post it was mentioned that male domestic violence victims are on the increase. I'm not saying that this is acceptable but women have DV services because women publicised the need for those services, got off their backsides and started running those services. If blokes want those sort of rights and services then go and get them. Just stop expecting the women to do it all for you.......:D

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Quite agree with Lettie, women's sufferage and rights were hard won, and brought about by women themselves.

The so called p*ssy whipped male whingers haven't the balls or the gumption to attempt to change something they don't like, unlike Mrs Pankhurst and her home girls. ;)

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Nobody will ever win the Battle of the Sexes. There's just too much fraternizing with the enemy. ~Henry Kissinger


I asked a Burmese why women, after centuries of following their men, now walk ahead. He said there were many unexploded land mines since the war. ~Robert Mueller

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

mans best weapon against women is the toilet seat

if you seriously think we arnt peeing on it on purpous then you are gravely mistaken :D

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

I just want to check.......the real michael have you taken your medication?

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

BAS****S :mad: !!

If you don't think we keep you for hours from the pub while we get ready you are sadly mistaken lol!

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

thats something to ponder on the open road today.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

All this talk of equality is all very well but men and women are different and always will be. We are physically different and we should accept that and think of it as an assett. Having equal opportunities is good and getting paid the same wage for the same work wasn't before time though. It seems unbelievable now that women would work alongside men doing exactly the same but get paid less for it. In some cases women are better at some things than men too. lol I remember a weedy little specimen of manhood who couldn't open the strongroom door at the bank because it was too heavy for him!


I know what you are trying to say pixie but it's almost impossible to put into words isn't it? A father's relationship with a child begins at birth. A mother's relationship starts long before then, there's a physical bond. For 9 months that baby is a part of you. It doesn't mean that the father loves his child any less, it's just this something about having carried something which developed from a tiny imperceptible speck into an individual human being, having felt all the little flutterings which develop into wrigglings and kickings. Even before birth my children had personalities, the kicker, the wriggler, the quiet peaceful sqiggly one. The relationship is already developing as the baby develops.

I do think some women have gone a bit OTT though and the balance has swung too far. A lot of male chivalry and gallantry has been lost as a consequence. I don't think we'll ever get that back and it's a shame. I'm probably very old-fashioned but I'd prefer a world where the hubby goes out to work the wife stays home and looks after the house and children. He opens doors for her and holds the chair in a restaurant, takes her coat etc etc. Life was gentler and sweeter then.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Can't agree about women staying at home, Willow. I would hate to have to ask any man for everything I needed/wanted. I do like to have my independence and also to be able to contribute to our joint needs/wants. I wouldn't feel comfortable buying my round in the pub if I'd had to ask David for the money to do it!

There was the downside, too. When there was little employment for married women, families suffered dreadfully from being on the poverty line. There was little enough money for anything, let alone entertainment, thus families had six or more children (it was the only fun they could get). Two wages would have made a lot of difference - even though the wife's would probably have been half the husband's.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

I remember women going out to work to "make ends meet" and then coming home and trying to do all the housework and cooking too. If a woman is expected to look after the home she shouldn't be expected to do a full days work like the man. That way she's doing twice as much and still for only half the money. Nobody gets paid for housework. Maybe if both share the household chores as well then it's not so bad but men just didn't in those days did they?

As for asking the husband for money, my parents and grandparents always had it the other way round. The husband worked and then handed over the whole wage packet, from which they were given a weekly sum for "expenses" (i.e. - going down the club) and the wife paid all the bills etc and took a little something for herself if there was any left. If she was very good at budgeting she also mannaged to save some for special occasions. I think it was usually the men asking the women for extra "subs";)

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

not in most homes in our area willow,when i was growing up,my dad and most others,were always at the pub/club/bookies etc,the mums were always hard up even though they worked,cos the men put the PUB first,i always hated that but it was life,i think you were very fortunate to have it the other way round.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

You see, we did need economic independence. Sadly, all too many men didn't face up to their responsibilities. How did women cope when a man came home having drunk his wage? I do think that having economic independence and paying a fair share of the household bills does make for more equal relationships, just as taking a fair share of the jobs involved in running a home does.

Okay, so what man out there thinks he can cope with my ironing better than I can? - I see from Willow's thread that it is now a sport, so come on, lads - if you want some extreme ironing, I can supply the raw materials. I will be more than happy to pass my clothing up to The Real Michael as he stands on top of the Town Hall porch dashing away with his smoothing iron!

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

My hubby lets me deal with all the major decisions in life........I once asked him 'why'......he told me it is so that he can't be blamed.

If I snuff it before him.......then God help him, because he doesn't know his way round the financial world.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

And I would like to ask the Real Michael........ who told you that God was a man......?

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

cant iron to save my life pendy, but agree entirely about women needing econonic independence,and thankfully they got it, do think its swung a bit much the other way now,but you can't have everything.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

I can iron, but I choose not to, and my wife is quite happy to do it, as long as she has some tv to watch while she's doing it!

As soon as we can afford it, we'll pay someone else to do it for us!

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?
 

Many years ago an old fellow I met recommended marriage to me. He said " Get thiself wed lad. You don't have to think any more, it's all done for you". He described his wife as his 'Walking, talking book of instructions'.

Re: Serious Topic - Do Women Have More Rights Than Men?