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This morning along with my post I received a magazine from Hyndburn and Ribble Valley NHS, called Living Health. Keep your selves under control, I'm sure you'll get yours soon.

Nice pictures, and probably a nice price we have had to pay for it's production, and delivery.

There was really very little information in it, except for the Facts and Figures pages.

The figure for 'general dental services' was cut from £59,000 in 03/04 to £18,000 in 04/05. Managenment costs on the other hand rose from £2,113,000 to £2,148,000 for the same period.

Perhaps the money saved on dental services was due to getting all of us without a dentist onto the promised list, thus saving the authority money?

[The Chief Executive by the way is on a salary quoted in a bracket between £96-100,000.]

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It never seases to amaze me the NHS has gone tot he dogs, i got a mate who has suspected breast cancer has found another lump & still she is to wait 2mnths despite being aware & catching it early tho when she gets the damn appointment they will no doubt say why didnt you come sooner - dohhhhh - they should prioritise better.

Hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm dentist what dentist????:(

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Don't talk to me about hospitals..............

I know that they do a good job usually............. BUT!! today I had a training course about prevention of pressure sores.

Touch wood, our patients very, very rarely break down with pressure sores as we have good knowledge and understanding about how they occur, how to prevent them and how to deal with them if they occur.

The one question I asked the trainer at the end is, If we are taught this then why do so many of our patients go into hospital pressure sore free, and almost always return back to us riddled with them.

Well the response to this is, that apparently in hospitals the staff are under the impression that, if they are on a Air mattress, then these people don't need to be re-positioned through out their stay in hospital.

My response was " um mm well obviously, if their skin is breaking down then, duh yes they do".

Apparently nursing staff in hospitals are not trained on pressure sore care and preventatives. Now in my opinion, someone breaks down with a pressure sore, someone somewhere isn't doing their job properly..................does this not equal NEGLECT??..........mmmmm yes. So simple. Train the staff in pressure sore management, and keep patient comfortable.

Rindy maybe they could use the money they spent on sending trash through the door to you, on training!!!!!!!!!!

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You would think they would be knowledgeable of pressure sores specially as mobility is restricted - quite shocking really!!

So if i sit on me bum for too long i'll get pressure sores:confused: LOL

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You wouldn't be able to bare the pain of it Mel....................But think of the poor folk that, although they cant bare the pain, they can't move either, they can't tell you they need to move, that is excruciating pain..............being left in one position for days upon days.

Next time your bottom goes numb, see how long you can last before you really have to move, it wont be long. Then think of how these people must feel.

To do my job properly, I always try to put myself in the persons shoes, it usually works and that's how I know how to deal with things.

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Errr good point slinky no i dont like numb bum:(

Its bad that residential have to pick up the pieces of hospital failings though i know you do a sterling job:)

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Perhaps the six non executive directors, including our ex-Mayoress Sonia Bramley-Howarth, all on a salary in the £6,000-£10,000 bracket, might be in need of treatment to their bums, from all the sitting they must do on them?

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Hospitals do a fantastic jobs too, don't get me wrong...........but the issue on pressure sores is disgusting, and all care staff, even doctors should have to do mandatory training to make sure they know the implications of pressure sores and there causes. It's a very common problem, but some times brushed under the carpet.


Anyway Mel.... the chances of you developing a pressure sore are slim really, there are other factors involved such as age, dehydration, malnourishment, age, mobility, weight.

So don't have night mares.........please sleep well!!;)

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PMSL!!!!!!!! though i suspect they have tossed aside the NHS for private health care including massage to numb bums:rolleyes: package grrrr:(

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How did you know i was watching most haunted mmmmm psychic eh:rolleyes: PMSL!!!

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Can't be that psychic really, they are the famous lines from CRIMEWATCH!!!!!:D

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ooooooooh chilling cant watch crimewatch it scares me much more than MH lol & definately cant sleep after specially when they say that - least no pressure sores there with the tossing & turning LOL:D

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least no pressure sores there with the tossing:D[/QUOTE]

That's your private life, get a room, you dirty bird:D

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I got one of the magazines - the only thing is I live in Rossendale so doesnt apply to me because i come under Burnley Pendle and Rossendale!

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That's your private life, get a room, you dirty bird:D[/QUOTE]

I wondered how long an innuendo would come up:D

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Very laudable sentiment Slinky and I am sure that you are a very competent carer. In respect of your comments I can remember a time when it was the other way round and the flow was from the private sector into the wards, how times change eh? I’ve never met you but I would be more than comfortable in offering you a job.

I’ve been a care adviser in the private sector for a few years and I am certainly aware that in reality things haven’t change all that much. Many residential care homes and the domiciliary home care sector still neglect this type of training in favour of the staples like Moving & Handling, Health and Safety, Food Hygiene and First Aid at the expense of training in Adult Protection, Continence, Bowel Management, Pressure Relief, and Fluid Balance and many other areas of training.

National Occupational Standards for Health and Social Care and the current Skills for Care consultation in respect of certificated Induction Standards should rectify some of the shortfalls still in the system. However, the low rates within the private sector and effects that profit motivated care providers have on the system will mean that some people will continue to suffer unnecessarily. The recent Green Paper on Independence, Well-being and Choice promises much but relies on changes within the sector without additional funding being made available. I have much more faith in agencies recognising the benefits of pulling closer together in realistic partnerships and adopting achievable person centred approaches and outcome based practises.

I do believe that you are being a little unfair and the Nursing Profession in some of your comments. Mainly that they don’t train or understand basic principles of care, they do on both counts. What you might find is a lack of commitment in some sectors, major understaffing of wards, indifferent managers and some nursing staff that have become overqualified and feel that they are above delivering basic care to users, above all else is the lost of basic care management skills on the wards.

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As discussed in previous threads, nurse training has changed to a more academic focus. IMO, this change was not for the better. Some student nurses now think that they are above such menial tasks as helping to keep wards clean, and basic nursing care, ie, pressure area care, oral hygiene and toileting.

This magazine may have cost a fortune to produce, but if it contains statistics about dental care then it has more than likely been produced by the PCT rather than the hospital trust. The PCTs are funded separately to the hospital trusts and have different management. I will await my copy and see if I can track down where it has come from.:)

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I couldn't agree more. We have no money for extra staff, which would go a long way towards improving services, but the NHS (whether it is PCT or Hospital Trust) can produce a glossy mag which literally tells people nothing.

Bear in mind that when anything changes in the NHS it usually stems from some government report. These are lengthy, boring reads but basically recommend what they consider to be best practise within the NHS. Keeping patients informed of services is usually amongst them. The government get their info from surveying what people want, through the use of various working parties, research papers, pressure groups and Trust Boards which contain 'lay' members. They are shortsighted when it comes to setting up such services, in that they will often provide a certain amount of funding, but it is never enough to actually set up and staff the new service without cuts being made elsewhere, eg. staffing of general services in favour of specialist services.

When you look at the top government bods who are in control of health services, it is hardly surprising that the NHS is a shambles. Patricia Hewitt (the health secretary) has a background in working for Age Concern, National Council for Civil Liberties, Press Officer and the Institute for Public Policy Research. She was once investigated by MI5 and is actually Australian by birth. Liam Byrne (parliamentary under secretary for care services) has a background in investment banking. Caroline Flint (parliamentary sec for public health) was a local government officer and political officer for the GMB union. Jane Kennedy (Minister of state for quality and patient safety) was a social worker.

Where are the doctors, nurses, midwives, health visitors, radiographers, pharmacists or in fact, anyone who has worked recently in frontline NHS...........

No wonder we are in a mess...

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Lettie you are right the magazine was produced by Hyndburn and Ribble Valley PCT.
They have a website at www.hrvpct.nhs.uk

There's also a number to call if you'd like a copy of the magazine, which is on the website.

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practice and preach spring to mind there Slinks!!!

Totally disgusting that Nursing staff are not trained in pressure care/relief. I think if training is done at source it tends to filter down. I think people who trained a few years ago are pressure area aware (remember the backs trolley ), but from my experience nurse training today is less 'hands-on' and more management based. Which really isn't (in my opinion) a good reason to choose nursing as a career, I am all for management and promotion but in nursing 'hands-on' should be the the main reason for wanting to nurse.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Romps I am all for management and promotion but in nursing 'hands-on' should be the the main reason for wanting to nurse.

Totally agree with you there Romps. Apparently , many moons ago, when elderly were placed on Nightingale wards, pressure care and other training in regards to the health of the elderly were taken and training was given.

But now that we have nursing homes and residential homes, apparently the hospital has taken a hands off approach to the prevention of pressure care, and this is why many hospitals are under the impression that if the patient is placed on a Air mattress, then there is no need for Re-positional routines for this patient. :rolleyes:

Anyway, No more of this, or I will get pounced on for thread wondering!!!!!!!!:D

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When all the hands on stuffis lost thats when standerds slip faster than a stock market crash. Yes management is need but so are nurses who are good at the caring hands on part of the job. If the knowledge is passed from group to another then patients benifit but when a link in the chain breaks the patient suffers. Nurses have always been the people that patients and patients family interact with. Remove these skills and it will be a sad day in nursing.

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In the last six months I've seen some wonderful nursing, both at Queen's Park and at the Royal Victorian hospital in Manchester.

I also had the misfortune to meet one of the most badly suited people ever to go into nursing. I'd love to name and shame the little twit but we are in the process of making a complaint against him so I can't. Suffice to say he apparently left his career in the motor trade and went into nursing because he wanted to meet girls and find a wife. He's in charge of a ward at Queen's Park, and has as much nursing skills in him as the Yorkshire Ripper.

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MMM got me a thinking head on now!!!

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I think that a little red mist is developing here. I feel that you are being a little unfair and most likely a little misinformed. You will find good and bad in all Hospitals and you will find that this is true both in the past as it is now. All nursing staff receive basic care principles training, including pressure relief, undoubtedly there are individuals who believe that they are above hands on tend to be led by the assumption that through RGN Qualification they are trained managers, They maybe trained to manage on paper but in practice they are not because a trained manager would organise, motivate and delegate to the ward staff whose job it is to deliver hands on care, these would include Staff Nurse’s, Auxiliary Nurse’s and Health Care Assistants. In the eight years I spent in the front line of Geriatric nursing I have meet and worked with some excellent carers, nurses, doctor’s and specialists. I have all so met some real s***s but they didn’t bring the field down with them. Be assured that training is given and experience is passed on, but there will always be exceptions. If care is not being given to the homes or hospitals you work in do something about it. In respect of unaligned tutors who seem to be able to spread contempt without understanding the damage they are doing I have little regard for. To receive qualified training in pressure care the tutor providing the training must themselves be qualified.

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I suppose the NHS can only be as good as its funded:(

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Perhaps less spent on stupid, management based, glossy magazines and more on actual health care?

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Very true!!!! its quite hyprocritical really that they produce these glossies only to gloss over the real problems, i mean do they not think we'd find out the truth ?? LOL

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Yes it was in very small print that the general dental services budget has been slashed by more than two thirds, and even smaller print that the mamagement budget for the same period has risen.

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accymel, I love you dearly but your taking bedpans..........................or is it the bits that hang out of urine bottles.....:p

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But at what cost? People who care enough to access the information could go to their website, and not have it delivered to, I presume, every home in Hyndburn and the Ribble Valley.

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Aww Doug thankyou for your declaration mmmmm is it catherter change time already?? & thought you was offering to change it for me;)

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Yes I know most people wouldn't give two hoots about the information included in the glossy magazine. People without acess to the internet could have been alerted to the information, and requested a copy if they so wish, through the much cheaper alternative of placing an advert in the local press, rather than delivery to every household in the area, most of which I presume went straight into the bin.

I've already seen that the back page is given over to informing us that the magazine is also available in four Asian languages, as well as in Braille and a larger print version as well.

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P.S. Never accuse me of thread wandering again.;)


Put it away.:(

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Pardon me for wandering, although I must admit you do better than anyone I know………:rolleyes:



In respect of the Magazine and the cost involved, it matters squat. Budgets are in place specifically to pay for it and a host of other informative documents that the NHS and Local Primary Care Trusts have to provide under regulation in order provide us with information that we apparently asked for.

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We asked for?

I agree that when asked at election time, most people would say they would like more money put into education, the police force and the NHS.
But I think most people want the money spent on actual health, care not glossy information delivered to all and sundry, or salaries paid to the paper pushers.

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For what they pay pen pushers and for pulbicity I wonder how much pound for pound pro rota the NHS could get extra?

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Don't start flirting with me now.


I've already told you I have a winky!

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Ok, perv.:)

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P.S. Don't flatter yourself sunshine, the only person I'd go out with who has a mustache is Sophia Loren.;)

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That is total speculation, and you can't substantiate that inflamatory remark because you can't possibly know, no one can.

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Maybe, maybe not, Benefits are currently costing us £8 million per day to fraudsters, cheats and immigrants illegal or other wise, which run people smuggling operations, drug syndicates, prostitution and illegal work gangs. If you are going to choose to defend the world of Rind against my apparent speculative and inflammatory remarks at least focus on the real threats to our society. Obviously this is only my opinion which I, like you choose to express.


Have a look at the health sector in regards to funding.

http://www.audit-commission.gov.uk/

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As you say, the answer is you can't say were any money saved from publishing and delivering pointless magazines would be spent.

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Don't involve me in your family fun fantasies Pa.


Whoever decided that every household needs this expensively produced information is wrong.

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You're very defensive, and for once knowledgable [but wrong.]

Have you anything to declare?

I've just my genius to declare.:)

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Come on.

I can see you are replying, I haven't got all night.;)

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B*ll**ks....How's that.

If you don't read the small print, how do you know what it say's Clever b****rd :) but wrong.

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Six minutes for that?

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So I've heard.........:p

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I was making a brew...........:) and your wandering again..........

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I'm off now.

I need snappier people to entertain.:)

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Actually Doug is right... As I mentioned in a previous post, the government act on what 'we' want. They gather their information through various means as also mentioned earlier. If the money has been provided to the trust for them to provide information to the public then they have to use it or lose it.. It's totally wrong but I'm afraid that's how it is.

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With great respect, I have to tell you that NHS Staff DO have training in the prevention of pressure sores......all patients on admission will have an assessment done....it is called a WATERLOW score. This is used to determine how likely it is for the patient to develop pressure sores.....it takes into account their mobility, nutritional and fluid status and their sex......this score is updated whenever there are changes in the patients condition.....like if the patient is going to go to theatre.....well, it is certain that they will be immobile for a period of time. Interventions are implemented when the score reaches a certain level.....pressure relieving devices are used.....and not just the air mattresses.....there are a wide range of devices available. Sometimes though, the patient will get a break even though you have done your level best. I WAS one of those ward managers.....but I actually preferred the title of Nursing Sister.......I can assure you that I was not 'indifferent, but very much involved in the day to day care of the patients, and took my responsibilities very seriously indeed.

I agree with Lettie about the nursing students, it appears that they only want to be involved in the very technical stuff and relegate the basic care to Auxilliary nurses who they sometimes appear to look down on.....OK, maybe not all students do this, but a large portion DO. Some of the best nursing lessons I ever learned were taught to me by the Auxilliary nurses. Nursing Auxilliaries are there as assistants in care, but I feel that the care delivery should be supervised by trained nurses......and that these nurses should nurse patients rather than trying to emulate Doctors...and getting paid a fraction of their salary.