90 days detention
 

see the government has just been defeated on the 90 dayd bill,what really riles me is all the polls conducted show more than 70% of the public are in favour of 90 days,and yes mps are entitled to vote for their convictions,but more than 50 mps abstained- that i can't stomach! if you can't vote with your heart on matters of national security then these who crawled under the nearest stone should not be representing the general public.(:mad: end of rant)

Re: 90 days detention
 

I hope that the constituents of those who abstain give them what for!!!!

At times like this the public should be telling their MP's how they want them to vote. Its to important to all to let MP's vote based on convictions. We put them there to protect our intrests!!!!

Re: 90 days detention
 

How did Pope vote? Do we know yet?

Re: 90 days detention
 

Proberly abstained or against he wouldnt want to upset his "constituants" he needs them on side.

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Re: 90 days detention
 

I think it is disgusting that so many of them abstained....... They are voted in to speak on our behalf and in my opinion should not be allowed to abstain. If the people in power are not capable of making a decision then there is little hope for the rest of us.

No wonder this country is in such a sorry state.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Found this useful site

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/person/0,,-4221,00.html

Click the how they voted link to see just how much a whipping boy our bloke is.

Re: 90 days detention
 

SACK HIM ......... :mad:

as you can guess i am in favour of detaining terrorist suspects , i wonder how many more bombs have to go off or chemical weapons have to be found in our country before these idiots wake up

Re: 90 days detention
 

Ok what was meant as humour turned out true. Can we find a nice big tree and some rope please. Also require very sharp knife and axe to do the job properly.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Looks like my MP is against the bill as well which considering the target size of the refinery and chemical plants up here is a shocker.

Re: 90 days detention
 

One problem is that this bill would give them power to detain ANYONE who spoke against them for three months without charge. Remember that old bloke at the party conference? Yep they could have stuck him away till after Xmas with absolutely no charge or comeback just for disagreeing with Straw. Whilst I agree that we should be vigilant against terrorists you can't go locking people up for no reason. there lies the stuff of horror stories.

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what the old bloke did was shout nonsense,and was treated like a criminal for it, that seems a bit differant to me than detaining terror suspects!

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Re: 90 days detention
 

and thats just to turn up to a 999 call :(

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Thats on a good day wether permiting and providing there are no moterists around to persecute. :D

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what alot of the opposers to this bill are sayin is instead of giving htem 90 days to hold em lets maybe give the police more time than 28 but also give them the means to do the 90days work in less time eg more specialist officers

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Re: 90 days detention
 

Did anyone see the report as to how much money teh police forces of this coiuntry have in teh bank? I heard there was enough to pay for another 19 THOUSAND officers.

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The only person to come out of this well is Tony Blair. All the public opinion polls show that the majority of the country is behind the defeated measures of allowing the police up to 90 days detention for suspected terrorists.

It was bad enough the Labour back benches voted against it, but for the Tory party to put our national security at risk to try and score political points is disgraceful. It looks like it has back fired against the Tories anyway. I've just been listening to the radio, and life long Conservatives have been phoning in one after the other, saying that they are disgusted at their party for not listening to the advice of the police on this matter, and will not be voting Tory again.

Re: 90 days detention
 

from what ive seen and heard it seems to be all about blairs style of leadership-to autocratic! well maybe thats the case i can't stand the man anyway, but to vote against or abstain on a matter of our security is just despicable.

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I can't understand the fuss, absolutely no need for 90 days detention.

Anyone supected of terrorism should just be given a Brazilian passport and a 5 second start at the entrance to one of the London Underground Stations!

Re: 90 days detention
 

less its me being serious for once- but that has just cracked me up big time.:D

Re: 90 days detention
 

I haven't forgot this little matter, but will wait until the enquirey is published to reignite that gem of a thread.:)

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Errrrrr....Check again. It looks like our MP is sound on terrorism. On previous occaisions, he has voted FOR govenment bills and AGAINST watering-down amendments. But still don't know last nights vote.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Spuggie lives in Scotland, and so his MP is different to ours/yours.

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This actually has the makings of a good conspiricy theory, that guy probably wasn't a Brazillian but someone high up in the echolon of the terrorists and rather than him being turned into a martyr MI5 got in touch with the Brazilian authorities and bunged them a few quid so they could make up a story about some poor innocent being killed!

Result = no back lash from the fanatical terrorists, after all they won't care about someone innocent being killed!!!!!!!!

We'll know if I'm right if I don't post for a few days and you hear about me taking up hurdling over the barriers in the underground.

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Errrrr..... thats usually one of my tricks tealeaf lol:D :)

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Many of the electorate abstain from voting cashman so you can hardly blame an MP for doing the same.

Polls of just a few thousand people can never be truly representative of the umpteen million who are eligible to vote. It is only an indication of how they MIGHT vote if asked and we weren’t.

MP’s are not voted into office to speak on our behalf lettie but to act in accordance with the manifesto that they presented to their constituents before being elected. As most if not all MP’s were voted into office by a minority they cannot represent all their constituents. If something comes up that was not included in the manifesto then the MP is free to vote as his conscience dictates – subject to the Whips of course. But that’s another argument.

Personally I disagree with the 90 days without charge detention. 28 days is enough time to get sufficient evidence to charge them. Well it would be if the police had the manpower. The real problem here is a police force that has been virtually stripped to the bone so that they cannot cope with normal crime let alone suspected terrorists.

Quote:

I know mistakes can be made but I'd rather it be a mistake of holding and innocent person than of letting a guilty one go free and yet more people being killed.

That comment is directly opposed to the reason why we don’t have capital punishment WillowTheWisp. Rather one guilty person goes free than an innocent person is hanged.

We can’t have it both ways.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Re: 90 days detention
 

just heard micheal meacher saying he voted against 90 days because the case was not made for needing it. sir ian blair on the other hand said before the vote the police needed it, now we all know he isn't always correct but at the end of the day to me he has far more knowledge and in a better position to gauge the time required than meacher,or any of us, i would say to these sanctimonious cretins that voted against- how many MPs were blown up in london? NON it was all unfortunate members of the public. they are really looking after our interests.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Just looked at the Voting and heres a surprise with a No Vote a certain Jerry Adams you would have thought he would have voted against it, also Paisley voted for it! it a strange world when 2 ex, and I use the word loosely, terrorists vote on a matter like this.
The full list of voters
http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2005520222,00.html

Re: 90 days detention
 

Indeed. I totaly agree with the 90day terrorism bill (even if I do detest Blair, but no point voting against him for the hell of it when hes actualy talking sense)

BUT measures have to be put in so that the police can't abuse the terrorism act, the prime example of it is of course the guy at the labour party conference who was held under the terrorism act. Completly unapropriate and quite frankly an abuse of power.

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It's a pity the Tory's who voted against the bill didn't agree with you. Using this to score political points was a definite vote looser for your party.

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Personally, I think that it is disgraceful that British MP's should be more concerned over the human rights of a minority of terroist scum than concerned with national security and the protection of the lives of law-abiding, tax-paying British citizens.

It just goes to prove, yet again, how removed from everyday reality these people really are. As for Pope, he will do whatever the government tell him to do; rebels go to the back of the queue when preferment is being considered.

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Greg Pope!!!!!!!!!!!!! Well.:rolleyes: That just goes to show that mountain air is not that good for the grey bit between the ears. When tealeaf asked how Pope have voted I got confused and was trying to fathom what the hell the Pope had to do with it :o :o :o

I'm not joking :o

Re: 90 days detention
 

I totally agree with you A-B.

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Heres the first one on his way back, good old Greg, he might even move to Accy what would our leader do then?.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2005520291,00.html

Re: 90 days detention
 

He'll probably even get his benefits back dated.:(

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that took me unawares bazf-didn't take you for a sun reader.:D :D :D

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Yup, I dont get it and quite surprised at the way they voted considering what the prospective leaders have been saying..

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End result of this mad preachers will return. :(

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even he prefers our country to the sh1t hole hes been living in.

wheres he going to live when hes blown up this country the hypocryt :mad:

Re: 90 days detention
 

greg voted for this bill right???

that means he supported this bill

Re: 90 days detention
 

Yes Greg Pope supported the bill, and voted with the Prime Minister.

Re: 90 days detention
 

I quite agree though of course it was not the Police that detained him rather the cronies hired as security men by the Labour party for the conference. The man in question (the detainee) was advised to sue the Labour party for security guards do not have the right to detain only remove!

Though as as been proven the case many times already, Blair considers himself above the law!

Re: 90 days detention
 

sorry bad wolf blair is not above the law- blair is the LAW. lol

Re: 90 days detention
 

President I do as I please Blair got a wedgey this time but will it stop him?

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i cant believe joan humble (our m.p) voted no.... .
i realy do think we nead 90 days....

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that must be the opinion of those she represents granny! I THINK NOT lol;)

Re: 90 days detention
 

Lord Carlile, the LIB DEM peer, who is the independent reviewer of anti-terror laws has said he felt that the police needed 90 days to investigate terror suspects. He said that he knew of at least two or three cases where terror suspects could not be prosecuted on appropriate charges because police ran out of time.

Labour rebels, Lib Dem and Tory MPs, hang your heads in shame...

Re: 90 days detention
 

you just beat me to it wyn have just read it myself, what really amazes me is many of these plebs backed tony blair when he was wrong, now he's right for once they oppose or abstain, this is just political point scoring run amock.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Don't forget the Tories who are supposedly so tough on terrorism, but were quite willing to desert their principles for the sake of political gamesmanship.

Disgraceful.

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i aint forgetting any of em wyn to me they are all a complete disgrace to the people of this country and should be on the dole! a working person that cocked up like that - feet wouldn't touch.

Re: 90 days detention
 

When are our MPs going to listen to experts and their constituants and help sort out this mess before we have a 7/7 again or something worse?

Re: 90 days detention
 

after seeing the arrests in australia of the alleged terrorists- its claimed they have discovered hydrocloric acid,plus another substance used in the manufacture of explosives, also a training video at one of their homes, if this turns out to be accurate and the police have not enough evidence to make charges stick in the time period, the question i put to all these fools who think 28 days or 90 is not acceptable. should the authorities RELEASE them? their obviously not members of the local pool team. i would love any of the M.P.s who did not support the government to comment -if this was britain?:mad:

Re: 90 days detention
 

They would be heckled and egged then have the protesters arrested for be terrorists. :rolleyes:

Re: 90 days detention
 

going back to abstentions! i have noticed quite a few on this thread (cashy wonders why) lol:D

Re: 90 days detention
 

If they are believed to guilty hold em like the Yanks do "Indefinately" ;)

Re: 90 days detention
 

Indeed. Besides Cyfr, there has been very little comment from our Tory members on this.

Tories tough on terrorism my backside. Though more than happy to score political points against Blair, rather than protect our national security.

Re: 90 days detention
 

[quote=garinda]Indeed. Besides Cyfr, there has been very little comment from our Tory members on this.

quote]

How do you know who the tory members are?

Re: 90 days detention
 

Wonder if they would be happy scoring points if god forbid there was another terrorist attack as in Brighton in 86? How ould that be explain especially if the police knew something was afoot but didnt have the time they wanted to stop it. If police need 90 days to stop it and only got 28 and those that had been held went ahead and did the deed who would they blame? Answer everyone bar themselves. This bunch of wimps are endangering lives of innocent people for thes points they so desperately want. I am not a fan of everything Tony Blair wants but this is as vital as your heartbeat!!!!!! :mad:

Re: 90 days detention
 

well i wasn't JUSTrefering to our tory MEMBERS.;)

Re: 90 days detention
 

I voted Tory, Is that really a problem. :)

Re: 90 days detention
 

Not all. It's very brave of you to come out.

Do you think the Tories were right to support the Labour rebels to defeat the 90 day bill, just so they could make political headway?

Re: 90 days detention
 

Re: 90 days detention
 

There is more serious debate on this issue here than I thought there could be. Its good to see (without the hand bags wood be better). We have for against and abstentions, bit like Westminster. :)

Re: 90 days detention
 

i dont know if this has been said or not but one thing i find strange

when the anti-iraq protests were going on - and public opinion was showing we shudnt b participating in the war - blair totally ignored the public opinion.

now that he's lost this vote for the 90 day detention he's runnin to the point that the public wanted it...

Re: 90 days detention
 

All the evidence, including that from the police, suggested ninety days would be needed to collate all the information, and then to either charge or free the suspected terorrists.

If your going to be churlish about it, you might as well say that the evidence should be gathered in ninety minutes, and if not let 'em go.

Re: 90 days detention
 

the prob is that the 7/7 bombers were soo well "hidden" that british security ppl are now spooked into thinkin anyone and everyone cud b a potential terrorist. like that guy babbar ahmed - he's been let off by british police as not having any links with terrorisism yet the usa want to extradite him. his family are fearin that they wont see him for a few yrs as he probably will b taken straight to guantanamo out of us law.

with the 90 day thing i cud easily be locked up for 90 days as they trek thru my pc or search my back ground and be inconclusive. yet for that simple thing i know i wud lose my job straight away as i work for the home office.

Re: 90 days detention
 

Mani if you work for the home office then you would have had stringent background checks done prior to starting the job. These would be as tough or tougher than the ones some suspects would face.

You will just have to get rid of shoot em up games in case they consider that training. ;)

Re: 90 days detention
 

i've already had to delete doom and half life incase they thought i was gonna b spreadin some kinda virus and was using the game to practise my survival techniques... :(

dont even get me started on having to delete civilisation 4, command and conquer, airport tycoon and havin to throw away my dvd of the great escape...

Re: 90 days detention
 

Sad thing is mani that it wont belong before all that you said could be concidered training.

Re: 90 days detention
 

i used to have microsoft flight simulator but gave it up as a bad job..

the only thing under threat of a terrorist attack from me was the runway lol

Re: 90 days detention
 

Glad I aint the onlyone bad at gaming.

Re: 90 days detention
 

nope your still on your own its only flight sims ime crap at and their mainly for very sad people anyway so no biggie lol

the only thing sadder is train simulators how anyone can sit infront of a pc and drive a train for hours on end is beyond belief lol

Re: 90 days detention
 

I have a virtual life game, and have played it for years. I find it very rewarding and not at all sad.;)

Re: 90 days detention
 

In to the The Sims big time G?

Re: 90 days detention
 

lol spuggie garindas idea of a virtual life game is dressing up as a woman and calling himself mandy at the weekends

Re: 90 days detention
 

*L*

was it ever proven that the 9/11 terrorists used ms flight sim as training or was it someoen sittin in the office thinkin bloody hell they cud've used this.. wait a min! they must've! and then printed it...

Re: 90 days detention
 

Not Mandy.

Otherwise if I went in the Stag Paul would have me pullin' one.;)

Re: 90 days detention
 

yes because like anything to do with microsoft the end result was a crash :D

Re: 90 days detention
 

I think G.W is fighting the wrong people. Bill Gates is the one to watch he does want world dominace and has the tools to do it.

Re: 90 days detention
 

*LMAO* @ chav1

Re: 90 days detention
 

So reading all the views maybe we should have a vorte on the subject.I am for a minimum of 90 days

Re: 90 days detention
 

I am for 90 days minimum Mik

Re: 90 days detention
 

OK Spuggie then what we need is a moderator to start a vote.Seen it on the Forum a couple of times and at least we know the Genera Publics views.

Re: 90 days detention
 

OK.
Poll has now been added.