Local vs County
 

Just to help out when people are considering what they are voting for in the forthcoming elections I took this off Hyndburn Life's website. It is useful to know who to blame for what! :D

Here in Hyndburn we are served by a system which is known as "two tier" local government. In other words, we have two sorts of council serving local people - a county council and a district, or borough council.
We have one county council, Lancashire County Council, and a borough council, Hyndburn Borough Council.

The main services provided by Hyndburn Borough Council include:
housing
refuse collection
leisure services such as swimming pools and leisure centres
environmental health
local planning

The County Council's main services include:
education and schools
social services
roads
bridges and transport
strategic planning
libraries and museums
economic development
tourism promotion
trading standards
street lighting


What it doesn't add is the sort of glossy bit that Hyndburn should be doing like securing investment in the town, generating businesses and promoting it as an individual tourism destination, plus working with the people to create a welcoming place and more vibrant place.

Re: Local vs County
 

Is there a hint here that HBC is neglecting some of its duties?

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:eek::eek::eek:
NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS!!!!
:D

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It makes me wonder if Blackburn with Darwen have got the right idea and kicked Lancashire CC out (for want of better words).

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It rather looks as if the gloves are off and the campaigning has begun in ernest.

For those of you who don't already know, Gayle is standing in the coming council elections as a candidate for the Labour Party.....against Peter Britcliffe.

I never imagined that I would ever offer my support to a candidate for the Labour Party but, in this instance, It is easy to make an exception.

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Oh! See I come here browsing every day and didn't even know that. I'm going to stick my neck out and admit that i've no idea how the council elections work.
(Luckily it's unlikely that my politics teacher reads this forum so I can take a guess...)

The area is split in to wards, then the wards vote for a counciler (like regions in national elections)?
And then is a leader voted for seperatly? or.. *shrugs* maybe somebody could just be kind and explain! :p

Re: Local vs County
 

The area is split into wards, then the wards vote for a councillor. Then the party that has the most wards has the control of the Council. Whoever is leader of that party becomes leader of the Council.

Each year only about a third of the wards are up for election, so this year there are 11 wards up for grabs. 8 are currently Labour and 3 are currently Conservative. Conservatives currently have over all control of the Council. In order for Labour to take control they have to keep all of their 8 wards plus win at least one of the Conservative ones. To keep control all the Conservatives have to do is hold their current 3 wards.

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You make it sound almost exciting when put like that Gayle. I can't understand why some wards have more than one Councillor. If the ward is too big for one, why not make the wards smaller?

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Ah thankyou! Now how do I find out what ward I am in :p
I like the fact that a councillor posts on a public forum. If you become leader will you still post here often? As I would assume it would be hard to do that with public scrutiny and all.. :o

Re: Local vs County
 

I suppose, and I'm only guessing here, that each ward Councillor will have roughly the same number of constituents so where there are two ward Councillors in one ward they'll have double the constituents. I'm also guessing that the reason they don't just divide the area into smaller areas is because they are roughly divided by towns or logical areas within towns.

What makes sense to me would be if a ward had two Councillors it would be beneficial to the ward to have one of each party. That way most of the people would be represented by one or the other of the two main parties on the Council.

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Does this help?


http://www.hyndburnlife.co.uk/rounda...dents/hbc.html

Re: Local vs County
 

Whoops double post.

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You are right. As far as is possible all Councillors -within the same authority - have the same electorate.

Re: Local vs County
 

With some Councils in the North West, all Councillors are elected at the same time and this can result in the Councillors from one ward belonging to different parties.
However with HBC approximately one third of the Councillors are elected each year so as far as the electorate is concerned they only have one vote to elect one Councillor
If you are going to have proportional voting you have got to change the voting system

Re: Local vs County
 

I'm not suggesting proportional voting at all. Although it has happened in Hyndburn before when all the seats were up for grabs at the same time and the voters got a couple of votes each. I think that was when both Cllr Britcliffe and Cllr Walmsley were elected in St Andrew's.

But let's take St Andrew's ward as an example - it currently has two Conservative Councillors, only one of which is up for election this time. Therefore, will have at least one Conservative Councillor remaining after the election - it would make sense (to me) for a Labour Councillor (as an example) to be elected in the seat that is up for grabs so that the majority of the people of the ward are represented on the council. Of course, I am slightly biased so I might not be the right person to advise on this.

Re: Local vs County
 

It might be some time before she becomes the Labour leader :). She is running for ward Councillor not leader. Peter is the current leader of HBC, if she wins the election it wont make Gayle the leader.

Are you hoping to be one of the elected Councillors this time round Bill?

I am quite keen on the idea of 1 party running the whole show, both at local and national level. At least it might stop local Tory Councils trying to blame the Labour Government for its own mistake and vise versa of course

Just a tad ;)

Re: Local vs County
 

That's an interesting idea but unless you're suggesting that the Councils are tied in to the national elections in some way I'm not sure how it could work. I agree that there is too much 'blame' between national, county and local and it's an easy thing for any one of them to say 'not my fault guv, blame the others' for things.

I'm going to say something daftish here but the one thing that I really don't like about politics is the 'politics' - by that I mean the 'blaming the other party' culture and the internal politics of voting once elected i.e. everyone voting down party lines. I believe (and this is very idealistic) that when you get voted on to the Council you should then be part of the bigger 'Team Hyndburn' and should all work together for the good of the area. I'm not the only one who thinks like that as there are some excellent Labour and Tory Councillors who currently work as a team and clearly I would be happy to work with them for the good of the area. Whilst I agree that structure is needed I think 'Team Hyndburn' should come first.

If every politician thought that way then it would negate the need for your idea as everyone would be working for the greater good and there would be less 'blame' and in fighting.

I think we're both a bit too idealistic on this though Neil as we have a system and it's unlikely to change so I think we just have to live with it.

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You do get MP's voting against their own party at national level so I assume you do at local level.

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I hope so for the sake of common sense.

There is such thing as a whip and there are ocassions where Councillors are instructed by the whip as to which way they should vote. The situation there is that you can either vote against (and be in a whole heap of trouble with your party), vote for or abstain. As I'm not a Councillor (yet) I don't know how this works in practice.

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I think the votes should be secret. None of this shouting rubbish. The whole system we use to vote PM's etc. into power relies on secret ballot so you can't be pressured. Then you get to Parliament and your MP does what he is told by his Party. There is something fundamentally wrong with that.

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Well, whilst secret ballots are useful in some ways they are open to fraud - no one can dispute a show of hands.

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Not if done correctly, this is the 21st century

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Try telling polititions that. Some think its still the C19 and they can do as they please.

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The whip system is just a formal arrangement (an alliance) to prevent chaos. Hyndburn has 18 Cons and 17 Labour councillors. If the Conservatives did a lot of work on something but their members could vote willy nilly at the end then potentially they could have wasted a lot of time. Particularly if Labour is opposed to an idea from the start. In Hyndburns case one maverick Tory means a lot of work gone to waste.

There is a lot of merit in a proportional voting system. It would do away with the whip system and would also give power to fringe parties such as the greens and liberal democrats (only joking Bill!!!) and perhaps make for more radical government by consensus. There are of course downsides as well.

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Very rarely at local level unfortunately.

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A lot of councillors start out with this idealistic way of thinking gayle but when they actually get voted in they fall in to line in the party. Even independant non politicals do it. They fall in to line with who ever they get on with the most. Very rare is it that someone gives their own opinion regardless of the rest of the councils. For one thing it would, I imagine, make them very unpopular, like I am now with most of the councillors, yet when I first got involved they were all all over me, wanting me to fall in with their line of thinking. Now they realise I have my own line of thinking based on what i think the people will want they don't like me much.
I may just put myself up again at next elections, and actually bother to canvas this time, as I'm always being asked by people to stand.

Re: Local vs County
 

Yes - Nomination papers just about to go in!
________________________________________________-

To all those who read this - Why don't you stand for election. All you need is four things
Live or work in Hyndburn, for the past year
Ten people willing to sign a piece of paper (this is a lot easier than it sounds).
A liking for people
A wish to serve.
Thats all it takes. You do not have to belong to a party.
If you want to know more send me a Private Message

Re: Local vs County
 

Will you be creating your own canvassing material or do you have people to do it for you? ;)

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Gayle, sounds like there is proportionality. Imagine if it was 17 +17 +1 :)

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Decisions would never be made and we'd be an even worse mess. :D

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last year i voted for the very first time.i am going to be completely honest and i am completly thick about elections and i dnt see the point as i dnt understand? (we should be taught about it in school and not have german language)(another story)
I voted and whats my vote gone to? they say its important and that you get a say but its not really saying anything putting a cross on a piece of paper?
im cluelss to it but i only vote just to keep people quiet. :confused:

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Does that mean that if it was a choice of doing what was best for Hyndburn you would not do it becasue it meant voting with another party!!!

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Fortunately, that's not a problem that I have!!!

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I'm interested. I am an experienced canvasser and leaflet producer but am always interested in learning more.

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You need to think of ways to get your name in The Observer. You need to find something new and interesting. Being a naughty boy, writing your own weight loss column, moaning about icy roads and stopping smoking have all been covered. I wonder if any of our AccyWebbers are in the publicity business and might have some good ideas for you.

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I think when you speak your mind these days you are too quickly criticised for it, and these days its more likely to be abrasive rather than questioning.
The less tolerant people are, and we are becoming less tolerant , the more politicians feel its best to sit on the fence or pass the buck.
:engsmil::engsmil:

Up at again at the next elections. Is this in Hyndburn?

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This Friday is the last chance for all that stuff as purdah begins so unless he's got his letters in now it will be too late. And yes, I have sent a letter in, it had to be done didn't it?:D

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It's a bit late for begging letters :p

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Never too late for that! :)

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perhaps the best thing to do would be to talk to your parents and friends, as their opinion and weigh up which you think is best. You have parents that that are very much in the centre of the comunity, and I'd value their opinion on whats best councillor for your area. I don't believe parties have anything to do with it, one area can have great labour party councillors and get a lot done, that the comunity wants, other areas labour party has strangled the comunity for years and gona against conservative lib deb, just for the sake of it, despite what the community needs. If you have councillors like that, regardless of party, they need getting out.
It should be about people at local level, not staying faithfull to national political parties

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I take it you won't be supporting PB then:D

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If voting for a polition based purely on personality was the norm a lot of them wouldnt be polititions. The comment below is an example of being out of touch.

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You have to vote for the best you have g gones, if he's not the best for the people then I wouldn't. personally if I was up there and had my vote up there Id vote for a go getter with some fire in their belly , someone that has vision, hope , someone that wants to do things to improve the place, that asks what people think, what they want, then tries to do it, someone that realises that people actually have to live their and that they deserve the best.
Personally from what I've seen thats gayle.

Re: Local vs County
 

I think you have summed up what a lot of people think, including myself.