Accrington Web - 11 plus

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Growing up in England I had to take my 11 plus exam, I was one of the dummys that failed, and has a result ended up going to a secondary school. My Question is how many people out their reckon that this shaped there future.there weren't many career opps when I left school, woodwork, metalwork, army,

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Originally Posted by expat

it certainly never shaped my future and i didnt fail the 60s had a much bigger effect on me as i was a complete nutter.:D

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Originally Posted by cashman

the 60s had a much bigger effect on me as i was a complete nutter.:D

I sometimes wish I'd failed my 11+, then I could have gone to Accy Tech, met Mr C and I'm sure the 60's would have been even more, shall we say, "eventful" than they were...plus I would have known about that house on Birtwistle Street for wayward young ladies! ;)

Well, I passed the damned thing and for the first year had "Yerself" poking me in the back about a dozen times a day; 6 years later, as a prefect I had some cheeky third-former with his snotty-nosed pals continually giving me lip. He is now also a valued member of the Accy Web ; I won't give you his pen name, but his initials are GP.

I was very bolshie and only filled name date etc and the put a line across every question, I hated the grammar school uniform and thought most of the kids stuck up.
You can imagine my horror when I was sent instead to "The convent of the daughters of Mary help of Christians boarding and day school" The name was bad enough and the uniform worse, I did get a very good high school education though for which I am grudgingly grateful.
I changed my job every few weeks. it was easy I left school in 61 full employment and easy living.
Not sure how it shaped my life, still bolshie, still hate uniforms.
Did give me a love of the arts and music.
My very first job and one I loved most was while I was still at school, too young to join the local jazz club I got a job washing glasses in the kitchen at the weekends, so in my breaks I could peep round the door and listen.
That was cool.:coffeecup
.

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Originally Posted by Tealeaf

6 years later, as a prefect

They must have been hard-up for prefects. Were you a blue one or a red one? Big round letters luv, big as yer 'ed.

they were all blue then. (or was it red?)

Back in ’48 (that’s 1948 not 1848) I sat an exam that would determine where my secondary education would take place. No one passed or failed but how well they did in the exam would decide if they went to Accy Grammar or St Mary’s College in Blackburn or Ossy Tech or one of the many secondary schools. In other words they were selected on aptitude not the result of an exam. Scholars who showed an aptitude for working with their hands were sent to Ossy Tech. The brain boxes got Accy Grammar or St Mary’s. The rest got secondary schools. That was for the boys and there was a similar scheme for the girls.

The lessons at Ossy Tech were biased towards trade skills.

A school day was from 9:00am to 4:00pm with an hour for dinner and a ten minutes break at 10:30 in the morning and 2:30 in the afternoon (just enough time to grab a fag passed around half a dozen lads in a toilet cubicle). Each lesson period lasted up to 45 minutes. One full day was spent doing woodwork and then metalwork at an annex behind the Grammar School. One morning or afternoon was for football or cricket at the King George’s playing fields subject to the ground condition. Half a morning was for swimming and half a morning for PE. The main lessons were Maths, English, Technical Drawing, Science, Geography, History, and French. Single lessons for RE, Art and Music. French was dropped after the second year, as was History.

Each of four years was split into “A” & “B” classes containing about 30 pupils. End of term exams could see the top two or three in a “B” class join the “A” class and conversely the bottom two or three in the “A” class would join the “B” class. The movers could well move back after the following term.

Only two teachers had a car, Mr Marsden the head master and Mammy Archer the fat Geography/English/Music teacher. Mr Abbot the Science master came to school on a Corgi scooter. The other teachers came and went by bus with the pupils. No rowdiness on the buses.

Each teacher specialised in one subject and had very good knowledge of at least one more and would teach each year at their level. So we had the same teacher for say Maths the whole time that we were at school. He/she knew us and we knew them. The other good point was that the teachers taught - not just hoped that we would learn what they showed us.

In those days we had an inter school swimming gala at Accy baths once a year and also an inter school sports day at Church Cricket Ground.

We had four ‘Houses’ and sports and swimming competitions between them were organised once a year.

Prior to the summer holidays the top three pupils in each class were given an award, which was usually a book. Each pupil had a choice from the offered selection made prior to the award giving.

We also had an end of school year ‘concert’ where under the auspices of the Music teacher volunteer pupils would perform. Singing, reciting poetry, sketches, magic, comedy etc.

So the equivalent of the 11 plus worked well in those days and worked for me. In fact come to think of it, it was known as the 11 plus then.

Many pupils from the secondary schools went on to gain an apprenticeship whilst I left school to work as a human pit pony down a coalmine. Money was my motivation because working in a pit paid the best wages. But I went on to learn a trade in the Royal Navy. So the 11 plus was not the be all and end all.

I went to Paddock House, where I had to pass the Entrance exam as well as the 11+, and I had a very good education. I left school after O levels at 16 and got into the Civil Service, doing A levels at college on Day Release and at Night School. My husband was also Grammar School educated and became an electronics engineer in the RAF, going into computers when they were very new and, usually, about the size of a small bungalow.

So we both had a good education and we did OK but 2 of the wealthiest people I know were 11+ "failures" and both would tell you they didn't have much education. One was a market-stall holder who just worked damned hard and the other was a builders labourer who became a property developer; both are now worth £millions.

Makes you think, doesn't it?

I failed the 11+. But Mr Hinchcliffe ay Peel Park School told me that I would, and that I was wasting my time taking it.
Yes, the failure did affect my life for a long time. I left school in 1962....the following year was the first year that pupils at Secondary Schools could take GCE's. My English teacher tried to persuade my father to let me stay on at school and take the English and Maths.......my father refused, saying that i had had my chance and blown it.
I had to go out to work.......that was no big deal, but the lack of qualifications meant that I couldn't do the job I wanted to do. This steeled my resolve and I did eventually get to do the job I had always wanted....which was to be a Nurse. I made a fair success of my career, and in the end even taught student nurses. So it all worked out right in the end.

Anyone remember when the 11+ results came in different postage for passes and fails? The ones who passed got a sealed envelope with a tuppence ha'penny stamp and the ones who didn't had an unsealed one with a three ha'penny stamp. The postman always knew who'd passed before anyone else did.

I failed my 11 plus and instead of going to Accy Grammer School I ended up going St Christophers. Luckily at the time the Grammer School was going down the pan and Chris`s was the best school in town!

I never saw my results, but I do remember being very upset that I hadn't passed......and I cried because I felt worthless, and felt that I would never amount to much. Motivation was the key....and later in my life was the right time for me to do what I wanted. I had also developed some life skills by this time....life skills are very under-rated.

It was terrible that a child could be made to feel worthless in that way. It was even worse when the "failure" could have been due to a bad day, not being well etc. My elder daughter started at Grammar School in Durham when she was 11 and she was selected by assessment at Primary School as they had abandoned the 11+ exam.

I'm not totally in favour of the Comprehensive system and I do think the old Grammar Schools had much to recommend them but I always thought the 11+ system of selection was far too rigid. I also think it was a pity that they did away with the Technical Schools, which were ideal for students with the right aptitude. My eldest brother went to one and ended up with a very good career.

My 2nd elder brother failed the 11+, long before the Comps came into being, and he was the only one of the 3 of us to go to university, which he did in his late 20s. Selection at 11 wasn't always the right way.

I failed mine too but was classed as a 'border line' case and was sent to Rhyddings. The first year was Moorend, followed by a year at the main school and the last three at Ossy Tech.

Thankfully, I managed to pass enough GCE's to enter the Civil Service and enjoyed every job I had with them.

PS: If I'd taken History instead of following the lads who chose Geography, I might have had another one!!

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Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

didn,t fail mine wyn but thats another story, think i told you on our afternoon out?;)

Passed mine..Accrinton Grammar..Was something out of Tom Brown's Schooldays in the late 60's...Ben Johnson walking round in black cape, no access to the school via the front door except for staff (wonder what todays fire regulations would make of that), sixth form bully prefects dishing out lines for the hell of it..( those guys still aint on friends reunited...wonder why?)....a fine education did absolutely nothing for me ( I have a job I love, but am paid less than my Hollins brother), except I can spell and punctuate reasonably well!

They told my parents for me not to bother sitting the exam, as I had no chance at all of passing. So I did'nt, I knew I had'nt a chance, so what was the point,I always thought I was at the back of the queue when they were giving brains out.

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Originally Posted by Alan Gilmartin

ah but al you were well up the frontend of the queue with your musical taste.;)

I have to say, I have known some very brainy people who were ridiculously thick when it came to common sense.
As someone in an earlier thread observed....the 11+ wasn't the be-all and end all....some of us succeeded despite not having passed.
My problem was that I didn't learn to read until I was 7......I think I had a mild form of dyslexia....but it wasn't recognised then, they just labelled you as 'thicK'

I passed mine and went to Paddock House. When I was in sixth form I decided that I wanted to go to Blackburn College to do my foundation year in art. I was accepted on that and it wasn't dependent on good A level results. Being told that it didn't matter what my results were meant that I didn't really apply myself to my A levels and only got one. After my foundation year I went to Salford to do an HND in Graphic Design.

Basically, what I'm saying is that I went more or less through the whole system. The thing that I have learnt in life though is that it does not matter one jot what your academic results are - you learn far more after you leave school than you do at it. Life skills are more important.

I think secondary schools should have more emphasis on politics, banking and money and all those other real things that you need.

Don't get me wrong, I loved my school days and had a fantastic time.

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Originally Posted by Gayle

Even though we are the same age, I did the same course at the same college as you ( me=child prodigy because I was there first;)) You needed a minimum of 5 O-levels or two A-levels, which you must have had, because at that time that was the entry requirement for degree courses for which the art foundation course prepared you.

Back on thread... I think it was wrong that a whole generation was consigned to more menial jobs just because they didn't pass an examination aged eleven.

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Originally Posted by garinda

Nope, I didn't have two A ' levels and they weren't interested in my A level results at all. They even told me that I could fail them if I wanted because it didn't matter to them - they wanted me to go there regardless of results. Then when it came to getting into Salford (remember I did HND not Degree) they were only interested in my work on my foundation year so again, the A levels didn't come into it.

I had a great time doing two years of A levels and an even greater time when I was told that I could coast through them and the results didn't matter - I did get one of them though.

But back on thread, I don't think people were consigned to menial jobs because of an exam they took at 11. My Dad failed his 11+ but because of that he was actually at the top of his year group at the secondary modern. If he'd have scrapped through his 11+ he might have been in the bottom stream at grammer school and have got demoralised and not succeeded. As it is he's quite happy with his results in life.