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***Mr D*** 14-01-2008 16:57

Currys Finance and HFC
 
Just a heads up warning.

I purchased some goods from curries at blackburn and took advantage of there 6 months interst free option.

Now the bill to clear came today, So I rang them, earlier than the deadline to make payment.

Now I wanted to pay using my credit card as with christmas and all that funds arnt great, so what do HFC say.

NO we do not accept payment by credit card?????????

What/Why was my responce and after 5 phone calls to both currys (as they didnt advise me at point of sale) and HFC I am none no wiser so I begin my campain.

My opinion is they want me to be late and incure credit charges which for a £260 debt would increase to £521.

Any of you bankers on here have a explanation as to why there wouldnt accept a credit card?

hedman2003 14-01-2008 17:21

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Presume it's because they would have to pay some comission to the credit card company.

Surely it should form part of the original agreement or it should indicate that there is say a 3% charge if paying by credit card

What ripoff percentage would they charge if you didn't pay by the specified date!!!!!!!!!!!!

cmonstanley 14-01-2008 17:23

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
yes hfc stands for hard for customers..

katex 14-01-2008 17:56

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Thought you could now draw cash from most credit cards ?

And don't mean debit cards.

derekgas 14-01-2008 18:00

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
They want you to default, that way they make more money, and this, hey are good at, I would have issues with them not telling you about card payments when you applied.

***Mr D*** 14-01-2008 18:30

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by katex (Post 516848)
Thought you could now draw cash from most credit cards ?

And don't mean debit cards.

Yes I could, but then I would have cash withdraw fees applied.

Quote:

Originally Posted by derekgas (Post 516850)
They want you to default, that way they make more money, and this, hey are good at, I would have issues with them not telling you about card payments when you applied.

About £521 total APR 29.9% orginal debt £260.

I can sort this no problem, but there will be some people who couldnt.

But its more a principal matter for me, I dont see how/why they should get away with this, without advising the customer prior and at point of sale.

I have emailed both curries and HFC, I have also spoken to a solicitor, I awaite notification as to when it was advised to me or where on the agreement supplied at the point of sale it states this information.

entwisi 14-01-2008 19:47

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
If they did not make clear that credit cards are not accepted then they have to take it. You are making a legal offer of payment in a format that they accept(you might need to double check their T&Cs in detail to ensure tha it doesn't explicitly state not). Write to them registered saying that you have made an offer to make full reparations for the outsanding amount and if they don't accept you will deem the agreement paid in full.

lancsdave 14-01-2008 19:54

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
From what I have read on other forums they also charge you £25 if you pay too early :eek:

derekgas 14-01-2008 19:54

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ***Mr D*** (Post 516873)
Yes I could, but then I would have cash withdraw fees applied.



About £521 total APR 29.9% orginal debt £260.

I can sort this no problem, but there will be some people who couldnt.

But its more a principal matter for me, I dont see how/why they should get away with this, without advising the customer prior and at point of sale.

I have emailed both curries and HFC, I have also spoken to a solicitor, I awaite notification as to when it was advised to me or where on the agreement supplied at the point of sale it states this information.

I think the law is on your side here, as entwisi says, because they are not allowed to mis-sell you finance or insurance deals without the full t's and c's, some of the car credit people did it with payment protection insurances and got severely rattled off the trading standards.

***Mr D*** 14-01-2008 20:03

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by entwisi (Post 516916)
If they did not make clear that credit cards are not accepted then they have to take it. You are making a legal offer of payment in a format that they accept(you might need to double check their T&Cs in detail to ensure tha it doesn't explicitly state not). Write to them registered saying that you have made an offer to make full reparations for the outsanding amount and if they don't accept you will deem the agreement paid in full.

Thats my point, now Im saying it should of been advise at point of sale.

In there time to pay letter it says no credit or debit card accepted, only cheque, Bacs or some other awkward way. I have asked them to provide proof of where it states it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lancsdave (Post 516921)
From what I have read on other forums they also charge you £25 if you pay too early :eek:

Thats the one even when its payed on time the charge applies, must check if they advised me of that to.:D

Quote:

Originally Posted by derekgas (Post 516922)
I think the law is on your side here, as entwisi says, because they are not allowed to mis-sell you finance or insurance deals without the full t's and c's, some of the car credit people did it with payment protection insurances and got severely rattled off the trading standards.

So do I and Im one to stick it out even though I will pay on time and do it the way they want (Probably) I will question there selling practaces.

If they show me im wrong and it was put in writting I will hold my hand up, but it will make me think twice about purchasing anything for a retailer that uses HFC.

nikkival 14-01-2008 21:34

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
I'm not 100% sure about this, but I don't think you can use a credit card to pay off other credit, for example I can't use my Mastercard to pay my Visa bill & vice versa, it has to be a debit card. The easy way round it is to draw the cash off your credit card and pay them off with that.

claytonender 14-01-2008 21:43

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by nikkival (Post 516992)
I'm not 100% sure about this, but I don't think you can use a credit card to pay off other credit, for example I can't use my Mastercard to pay my Visa bill & vice versa, it has to be a debit card. The easy way round it is to draw the cash off your credit card and pay them off with that.

Some Credit Card will allow you to transfer a balance from another card (or even pay money into your bank account) at a special cheap rate of interest for a set length of time. Most however charge a balance transfer fee of about 3%. Also some credit cards supply you with cheques so yoy can pay off other debts etc by cheque.

nikkival 14-01-2008 22:52

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by claytonender (Post 516998)
Some Credit Card will allow you to transfer a balance from another card (or even pay money into your bank account) at a special cheap rate of interest for a set length of time. Most however charge a balance transfer fee of about 3%. Also some credit cards supply you with cheques so yoy can pay off other debts etc by cheque.

Yes, I know you can arrange to do that - I used to balance transfer every time the offer ran out, but this is a special arrangement & offer by the credit card company who wants your balance & potential interest payments. The cheques are just another form of drawing cash from your credit card to either pay yourself or others with.

What I've not said very well is that if you ring up to pay either your monthly payment or more with another credit card, they will not take it, it's debit cards only. It may well be that this is why HFC will not accept the payment, plus as someone has already mentioned they would have to stand the retailers commission charge.

My aunt used to be a bank manager so I'll ask her if she can shed more light on this HFC issue when I see her tomorrow.

MikeSz 15-01-2008 08:04

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Interesting one - as far as I am aware (and having some experience with the Consumer Credit Act) there is nothing to stop you paying by credit card, although I seem to remember that there is an issue with using credit to pay for credit in some circumstances. That said however, there would be nothing to stop you say using a mastercard to pay of an Argos store card for example.

Contract law can be extremely complex and is often decided on the terms agreed between the parties. Try not to think of this as offer/acceptance, rather think of it as you making an effort to satisfy your part of an executed agreement (by making payment). I will double check if there is anything in the Act that may have a bearing on using a credit facility to pay for a credit facility but in the meantime, check your terms and conditions. Even in the worst case scenario, all is not lost, terms and conditions can be struck out by a court if you can argue that they are unfair.

MUMMIBOO 15-01-2008 10:16

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
I always thought you couldnt pay credit with credit, humm but then whos to say you dont have paid up credit on the card then you wouldnt be paying with credit it would be your own cash! eee i dont know.

MikeSz 15-01-2008 10:24

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Having checked through this, im afraid I cant find anything that would prevent the trader from refusing to accept a credit card. Unless agreed otherwise in the terms and conditions (i.e. acceptable payment methods), they dont have to accept a credit card. Unfortunately, there is no 'right' to pay by credit card, just a duty to comply with the credit agreement.

I think that the trader is probably refusing to accept the credit card payment as they will have to pay commission on the transaction. There is nothing to stop you however sending them a credit card cheque or drawing the money from the card itself.

Hope that helps.

***Mr D*** 15-01-2008 11:16

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Thanks for the replys/interest.

Here is the Email I got back from them today.

Thank you for your recent Email

HFC Bank do not accept payment by Credit Card, and we don't accept
paying off credit with another form of credit. We accept all of the
following:

- Debit/ Switch Card
- Cheque/ Postal order
- Internet Banking/ telephone Banking

We do apologise for any inconvenience which may have been caused, but
if you wish to log a complaint, then please do so on the following address:

HFC Bank Limited
P.O. Box 2445
Birmingham
B1 3PJ

Regards
Customer Services

Now I have desided that I will pay them by cheque as Im sure my credit card sent me some, just got to find them.:)

I will be writing to them to say that it should be made clear at the time of taking the credit agreement that it cannot be settled by credit card when its due.

claytonender 15-01-2008 11:25

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
If you can't find your credit card cheques, it might be possible to ring your credit card company and get them to pay HFC Bank direct. You would have to give them HFC's bnak details and the ref number HFC have allocated to your agreement with them.

However if you do use a Credit Card Cheque (or get your card company to pay HFC direct), remember that your Credit Card company will probably charge you a balance transfer fee (most Credit Cards seem to be charging 3% - on £260 this would cost you £7.80)

nikkival 15-01-2008 17:17

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
I had a word with my aunt today who's an ex-bank manager, I just hope I manage to word what she told me well enough! As you've entered into a credit agreement with Curry's/HFC, you cannot use another means of existing credit (ie credit card) to pay it off, although there are ways around it such as credit card or Flexiloan cheques as mentioned before in this thread. It would be exactly the same if you took out a new credit card which gave you an opening offer of 0% for 6 months, you can't pay up before you are charged interest with another credit card.

For example I couldn't pay a Mastercard bill with a Visa card and vice versa every month - as I would never be charged any interest. I cannot pay a loan payment every month with a credit card, as you cannot use a credit card for anything other than purchasing goods or services from a merchant, i.e. you can't use it to pay off interest from another debt (with the exception of drawing cash or using cheques which is charged at a different rate). The banks, finance houses & card issuers are wise to every trick in the book and don't allow payment by credit card to protect the money they make on interest payments. None of the credit companies I use will accept payment via another credit card. However my catalogue account does, this is because they do not charge interest on goods bought over 20-52 week terms as they have already inflated the prices without having to charge interest! It all revolves around the interest as this is how they make their money!

When you balance transfer on cards this is a different matter - you are in effect accepting a new credit agreement at a different rate to your normal purchase interest rate, which is the same principle as taking out a consolidation loan or mortgage to pay existing debtors.

HFC also don't have to accept credit cards - they have the right to refuse payment by that method, just as some stores are now refusing to take cheques or some stores don't accept American Express.

I hope this is clear enough to understand!

***Mr D*** 15-01-2008 17:24

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by nikkival (Post 517236)
I had a word with my aunt today who's an ex-bank manager, I just hope I manage to word what she told me well enough! As you've entered into a credit agreement with Curry's/HFC, you cannot use another means of existing credit (ie credit card) to pay it off, although there are ways around it such as credit card or Flexiloan cheques as mentioned before in this thread. It would be exactly the same if you took out a new credit card which gave you an opening offer of 0% for 6 months, you can't pay up before you are charged interest with another credit card.

For example I couldn't pay a Mastercard bill with a Visa card and vice versa every month - as I would never be charged any interest. I cannot pay a loan payment every month with a credit card, as you cannot use a credit card for anything other than purchasing goods or services from a merchant, i.e. you can't use it to pay off interest from another debt (with the exception of drawing cash or using cheques which is charged at a different rate). The banks, finance houses & card issuers are wise to every trick in the book and don't allow payment by credit card to protect the money they make on interest payments. None of the credit companies I use will accept payment via another credit card. However my catalogue account does, this is because they do not charge interest on goods bought over 20-52 week terms as they have already inflated the prices without having to charge interest! It all revolves around the interest as this is how they make their money!

When you balance transfer on cards this is a different matter - you are in effect accepting a new credit agreement at a different rate to your normal purchase interest rate, which is the same principle as taking out a consolidation loan or mortgage to pay existing debtors.

HFC also don't have to accept credit cards - they have the right to refuse payment by that method, just as some stores are now refusing to take cheques or some stores don't accept American Express.

I hope this is clear enough to understand!

Cheers for that info and nicely put.:)

I can sort of under stand the reasons why but it should be pointed out to the customer.

I can use a credit card cheque but would be charged like I was drawing cash. IIRC 3%.

Ah well I will just put it on the debit card and treat it as a lesson learned.

claytonender 15-01-2008 19:38

Re: Currys Finance and HFC
 
It might be worthwhile, reporting Currys/HFC to the Financial Services Authority as they did not make the methods of paying the loan off before the end of the interest free payment period. As you signed a loan agreement all the terms should have been expalined to you in detail, befoire you sign the papers. If you had been told that credit card payments were not accepted you would possibly have not taken out the interest free loan. Also do you have to pay a fee for settling the account in full before any interest payments start? If you do was this expalined to you, as the loan would not then be interest free.

I know that Currys etc do press customers to take out loans rather than pay for goods in full.

I bought a laptop for my grand daughter before Christmas from Comet (the price was very low for the spec of the laptop - was obviosly a loss leader) I had ordered on the internet to collect in store, and had also order a 1/2 price printer and 1/2 price laptop bag. I declined the extended warranty and the charge for setting it up to a wireless network, did not but Norton. The Salesman was not very happy at this and then tried to charge me full price for the printer and case (luckily I had printed my order out). It is these extras that companies make their profits on.


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