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Mancie 10-06-2008 23:43
The Price Of Oil !
 
The Yanks (well the Democrats) are up in arms because the price of a gallon of petrol has gone over 4 dollars.. I reckon that to be around £2.50 a gallon... the oil companies have as usual, reported massive increases in profit.
When will the Governments put a stop to this blatant profiteering ?

blazey 10-06-2008 23:47
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
I blame the conservative party.

cashman 10-06-2008 23:51
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by blazey (Post 590643)
I blame the conservative party.
:D:D:D:D nice one......;) mancie theres more chance of seeing a statue of hitler in Tel Aviv n the goverment reducing the taxation.:rolleyes:

Mancie 10-06-2008 23:57
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 590647)
:D:D:D:D nice one......;) mancie theres more chance of seeing a statue of hitler in Tel Aviv n the goverment reducing the taxation.:rolleyes:
I don't mean taxing them (oil barons) I mean more pressure has to be put on them.. the sort of pressure they may take onboard.. like sending armed forces into the board rooms!

cashman 11-06-2008 00:09
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mancie (Post 590655)
I don't mean taxing them (oil barons) I mean more pressure has to be put on them.. the sort of pressure they may take onboard.. like sending armed forces into the board rooms!
i know that mate, but cannot see any otherway to reduce the price, these people are flogging more oil to the likes of china,india etc, and are perfectly happy to do so,without increasing production, so to put it blunt, they have us oer a barrel.;)

jambutty 11-06-2008 03:38
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mancie (Post 590639)
The Yanks (well the Democrats) are up in arms because the price of a gallon of petrol has gone over 4 dollars.. I reckon that to be around £2.50 a gallon... the oil companies have as usual, reported massive increases in profit.
When will the Governments put a stop to this blatant profiteering ?
If you think that is profiteering what about the $23 billion that mainly US and a few UK businesses have managed to con out of the US Treasury - as revealed on Panorama Special last night.

Mancie 11-06-2008 05:05
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 590797)
If you think that is profiteering what about the $23 billion that mainly US and a few UK businesses have managed to con out of the US Treasury - as revealed on Panorama Special last night.
I do think it's the big companies making a mint.. now ..is this about the "He's got crop circles.. on his head,...crop circles on his head ..he's got crop circles on his head.. he's got crop circles on his head ?

andrewb 11-06-2008 10:31
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 590797)
If you think that is profiteering what about the $23 billion that mainly US and a few UK businesses have managed to con out of the US Treasury - as revealed on Panorama Special last night.
The US Federal Reserve is farcical. I will be watching this on catchup service, thank-you for raising it Jambutty!

Boeing Guy 11-06-2008 18:47
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Well it would help if our Labour Goverment would reduce tax a bit.
More chance of bombıng Iran than that though.
Funny though £2.50 per gallon I would be happy to pay that, just goes to show how much duty there ıs on fuel here.
Opec need to be dealt wıth.
İt's all well and good for Gordon Frown to go on about North Sea Crude, but the oıl we get from there cannot be refined in our refinerıes, ıt ıs not sweet enough, So we send it off to the east.

Benipete 11-06-2008 19:03
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
May be wrong but i think the tax in America is about 17% while we pay 80%,Big differance

Boeing Guy 11-06-2008 19:10
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Must be Thatchers Fault then!!!!!!!!! Or is it Heath's????

Benipete 11-06-2008 19:24
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boeing Guy (Post 591165)
Must be Thatchers Fault then!!!!!!!!! Or is it Heath's????
All our leaders that still think we are a world power and spend our money accordingly.I'me not taking the party whip on this one.All to blame as far as I can see.:mad::mad:

cashman 11-06-2008 19:31
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benipete (Post 591170)
All our leaders that still think we are a world power and spend our money accordingly.I'me not taking the party whip on this one.All to blame as far as I can see.:mad::mad:
no question at all that is the case.:(

derekgas 11-06-2008 19:39
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
People are as much to blame in many ways, we have all watched it happening and have sat back and allowed it, we know they always punish the smokers, drinkers and drivers, and many still do all these at the same rate they always have, granted, some people have given up smoking, and the non smokers havnt gone back drinking, but very few use the car less, or make use of one car instead of several cars, between a family.

Eric 11-06-2008 19:45
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
So everyone is still blaming the oil companies and government; but the real culprit is us. GM doesn't send goons to force us to buy the big gas guzzlers. It's us the consumers who have squandered the oil with the SUVs and the pickups and the minivans and now we have to pay the price. There is a positive side to all this; we are being forced into conservation, forced by high prices to do what we should have been doing years ago. Whole new industries and opportunities are opening up in the "green" sector. Wherever you drive in Canada you can notice the increase in the number of hybrid cars, particularly the Toyota Prius. The extra tax dollars our governments, federal and provincial, are collecting are being passed back to the people in the form of reduced income and sales taxes, increased govt spending on health and education, and passed directly to municipalities for infrastructure improvements. And the point that was made about low taxes in the States: what would you rather have, cheap gas or govt. funded health care?

Bonnyboy 11-06-2008 20:23
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by derekgas (Post 591185)
People are as much to blame in many ways, we have all watched it happening and have sat back and allowed it, we know they always punish the smokers, drinkers and drivers, and many still do all these at the same rate they always have, granted, some people have given up smoking, and the non smokers havnt gone back drinking, but very few use the car less, or make use of one car instead of several cars, between a family.
You are right saying that we use the car more these days. In quite a few ways I think there is a need for us to use the car more though.

People work further away from home these days. I know a few couples where the hubby may work in Manchester, the wife Preston.

Shopping trips are by and large done differently these days. Weekly groceries are no longer done on a daily basis, say picking a few bits and bats up from the local shop, they mostly shut years ago. When I was young my mother and gran used to do the main shop for food at the weekend, in town and it was whatever they could fit into their shopping bags, the rest of the food bought locally through the week. Most of us take the car to the big supermarkets now and fill the car boot up

Out of town shopping centres are another relatively new thing. As are the big DIY stores, there weren’t really any of those around when I was a kid, folk tended to go to the local hardware store.

The government know all this and encourage the development of industrial estates in the middle of nowhere for us to do our shopping for Sofa‘s, electrical goods etc. Then try to price people out of their cars with a supposedly “green” tax.

It’s even being done with our hospitals now, the local ones are all but shut and these new “Super Hospitals” are being built.

Seems only logical to me that more use of the car is being made.

cashman 11-06-2008 20:28
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
good post BB, well thought out.:);)

Benipete 11-06-2008 20:30
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
I have never mentioned the oil companys because like most people I don't know thier % profit or indeed how many gals.of petrol is refined from a barrel of crude and what the value of the bye-products are.All I know is that 80% of my £1 spent on petrol goes to the goverment.Money that as far as I can see is wasted on trying to be a world power when we are not,except we can afford to spend in the region of £78 billion on a new Trident defence system and roughly the same to bail out a private bank.So to conclude,its not the taxation I object to but the way it is spent.Excuse me while i have a roll up and a can from the Asda.

Bonnyboy 11-06-2008 20:33
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 591215)
good post BB, well thought out.:);)
Thankyou cashy, good of you to say so :)

jambutty 11-06-2008 22:00
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 591193)
So everyone is still blaming the oil companies and government; but the real culprit is us. GM doesn't send goons to force us to buy the big gas guzzlers. It's us the consumers who have squandered the oil with the SUVs and the pickups and the minivans and now we have to pay the price. There is a positive side to all this; we are being forced into conservation, forced by high prices to do what we should have been doing years ago. Whole new industries and opportunities are opening up in the "green" sector. Wherever you drive in Canada you can notice the increase in the number of hybrid cars, particularly the Toyota Prius. The extra tax dollars our governments, federal and provincial, are collecting are being passed back to the people in the form of reduced income and sales taxes, increased govt spending on health and education, and passed directly to municipalities for infrastructure improvements. And the point that was made about low taxes in the States: what would you rather have, cheap gas or govt. funded health care?
I don’t know about Canada but the majority of car drivers over here drive cars that they bought second hand because that’s all they could afford. Or if they did manage to buy a new car it is now several years old and replacing it with a new one is not an option.

The real villain of the UK is the government starting with Thatcher and egotistical Blair. Blair for thinking that he was a world leader and wasting billions (not forgetting lives) on two illegal wars. More billions on replacing Trident when we couldn’t fire a nuke missile without US approval and permission. Even more billions on an NHS computer system that has yet to work properly. Yet even more billions on creating unnecessary Quangos, plus still going ahead with a very expensive ID card system that not only no one wants but has been shown that it will have no effect in combating terrorism. Not forgetting more billions on issuing the police with equipment and a computer system to enable them to catch Road Tax dodgers, when the most cost effective system would have been to just increase the price of petrol/diesel and dispense with the Road Tax all together.

Thatcher for destroying our manufacturing industry so that people had to seek work well away from their homes. With a public transport system that became a joke people had no alternative but to turn to a car.

But I have to agree that we the electorate, or more accurately those who did not vote, must also share some of the blame.

LancYorkYankee 12-06-2008 00:51
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Just a bit of clarification. First off, the price of a gallon of gas in the US stands at $4 a gallon which is "only" about 2 pounds per gallon. It's just the most current thing Americans have chosen to whinge about.

Also, I believe the average American drives about 15,000 to 20,000 miles a year which is quite a big difference from most Englishmen right? Instead of any desire to cut back on miles driven, the huge size of vehicles desired (many for merely status symbols), all kinds of fancy doodads and high over-use of their airconditioning (IMO), the lefteze wish to "go after" the big bad oil companys.

IMO, it's all about supply and demand over here. If the average American cut back just a little, we'd see our prices go down quite a bit. But again, we whinge with the whoa is me mantra and try to blame anybody but ourselves.

Brian

BERNADETTE 12-06-2008 01:00
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
BonnyboyIt’s even being done with our hospitals now, the local ones are all but shut and these new “Super Hospitals” are being built.
With not an adequate bus service to or from them. The direct bus service from Accrington to the Royal Blackburn is diabolical from Monday to Saturday and completly non existent on Sunday!!!

Neil 12-06-2008 01:28
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LancYorkYankee (Post 591361)
Just a bit of clarification. First off, the price of a gallon of gas in the US stands at $4 a gallon which is "only" about 2 pounds per gallon.
Is that a US or a UK gallon. Your gallons are only 3.8 litres, ours are about 4.5.

steeljack 12-06-2008 04:10
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LancYorkYankee (Post 591361)
Just a bit of clarification. First off, the price of a gallon of gas in the US stands at $4 a gallon which is "only" about 2 pounds per gallon. It's just the most current thing Americans have chosen to whinge about.

Also, I believe the average American drives about 15,000 to 20,000 miles a year which is quite a big difference from most Englishmen right? Instead of any desire to cut back on miles driven, the huge size of vehicles desired (many for merely status symbols), all kinds of fancy doodads and high over-use of their airconditioning (IMO), the lefteze wish to "go after" the big bad oil companys.

IMO, it's all about supply and demand over here. If the average American cut back just a little, we'd see our prices go down quite a bit. But again, we whinge with the whoa is me mantra and try to blame anybody but ourselves.

Brian
Brian ....you are forgeting something.........it's my/our God given American right to "the persuit of happiness" just as an example, I usually drive 40 miles on Sundays to meet up with friends for brunch , and 40 miles back , Its not my fault my 4 wheel drive ( think I've used the four wheel drive once on the beach) American made pick-up truck only gets 15 mpg freeway, less if its a warm day (70 deg F) and I have to use the AC .
I followed all the rules and bought "made in America" . so now my late Sunday morning Dungeness crab omellete costs nearly $33+ tip , $24 for gas/petrol and $9 for the food , I'm not including the increase in prices at the car wash and Starbucks before I set off , Jesus (pronounced Heysous) the guy who usually does the detailng on my truck now expects at least a $4 tip ........plus , my registration tags (road tax) this year went up to $55 , (thanks Arnie), wheres it all going to end I want to know . ;) ;)

entwisi 12-06-2008 06:23
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 591193)
Wherever you drive in Canada you can notice the increase in the number of hybrid cars, particularly the Toyota Prius.
Probably one of teh most un-eco friendly vehicles ever made but hats off to Toyota for a stunning piece of marketing!

teh oil is there, the price rises are due to China and USA sucking most of the supply that is currently available, OPEC won't increase teh supply so are keeping it at an unnatural high level. The fact that we use X gallons a week is irrelevant, there are still huge reserves and more being found. They might be in more inhospitable places but its there all teh same.

Taxation on fuel in the UK is a total joke. Look at the state of roads in Accrington, they are disgraceful for teh amount of money we pay in road fund and fuel tax. I can take you to a major road with at least half a dozen holes in the tarmac so bad that the old cobbles are showing through. When was the last time you actually saw a road in accy being resurfaced?(and I don't mean that stupid tar and chippings thing that they do that is lethal to bikers and puts hundreds of stone chips in your pride and joys paintwork.)

derekgas 12-06-2008 06:57
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
I have heard that the council cough up for damage to vehicles caused by potholes on a regular basis, but also heard it is 95% ethnics who make all the succesful claims, mmm!

bullseyebarb 13-06-2008 16:56
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 591193)
And the point that was made about low taxes in the States: what would you rather have, cheap gas or govt. funded health care?
Cheap gas, of course.

bullseyebarb 13-06-2008 17:23
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LancYorkYankee (Post 591361)
Just a bit of clarification. First off, the price of a gallon of gas in the US stands at $4 a gallon which is "only" about 2 pounds per gallon. It's just the most current thing Americans have chosen to whinge about.

Also, I believe the average American drives about 15,000 to 20,000 miles a year which is quite a big difference from most Englishmen right? Instead of any desire to cut back on miles driven, the huge size of vehicles desired (many for merely status symbols), all kinds of fancy doodads and high over-use of their airconditioning (IMO), the lefteze wish to "go after" the big bad oil companys.

IMO, it's all about supply and demand over here. If the average American cut back just a little, we'd see our prices go down quite a bit. But again, we whinge with the whoa is me mantra and try to blame anybody but ourselves.

Brian
My local gas station currently has gas for $3.79 per gallon. We haven't yet gone to $4. Our governor also signed off on some tax abatement recently. Every little bit helps.

Put me in the category of, "drill here, drill now, pay less." We have tremendous resources in the U.S......oil, natural gas, coal, shale. Unfortunately, we also have a Congress seemingly determined not to allow its citizens to utilize said resources. Talk about insanity. Yes, we do need to diversify - but this world still runs primarily on oil and we need to be pursuing that full tilt because it's going to be quite a long time before we can switch over to something else. Right now, about 95% of the world's oil is controlled by governments - most of whom are dictatorships. So we need to be as independent as possible.

As for oil company profits.....there's a difference between profit and profit margin. Their profit margin is around 8%. So even though the total profit rises due to current market prices, the profit margin stays the same. Lower than banks, insurance companies, pharmaceuticals, cosmetics, etc., And certainly lower than the government takes in taxes. I am against subsidies. None of the above mentioned entities need them. They are perfectly capable of competing in the free market. The IMD Business School in Switzerland has ranked the American economy as the world's most competitive for the 15th straight year.

This is a supply and demand issue. There has also been quite a lot of speculation in the market. The bubble will burst eventually.

steeljack 13-06-2008 17:39
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 592327)
My local gas station currently has gas for $3.79 per gallon. We haven't yet gone to $4. .
$4.60 a gallon here for the cheap stuff , nearer to $5 on the other side of the Bay Bridge . Biggest problem we have on the west coast is that no off-shore drilling is allowed , most of the California and Oregon coast is classed as a "marine sanctuary" ........interesting point to note ...not one of the Rigs in the Gulf of Mexico had any 'spill' problems during Katrina

bullseyebarb 13-06-2008 19:07
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by steeljack (Post 592333)
$4.60 a gallon here for the cheap stuff , nearer to $5 on the other side of the Bay Bridge . Biggest problem we have on the west coast is that no off-shore drilling is allowed , most of the California and Oregon coast is classed as a "marine sanctuary" ........interesting point to note ...not one of the Rigs in the Gulf of Mexico had any 'spill' problems during Katrina

You have my sympathy.

I love nature....but the radical environmentalists don't want us to touch ANYTHING. They sue at every turn. And, of course, nuclear isn't an option for them either. It doesn't matter to them that there were no spills in the Gulf during Katrina or that technology is so improved now that you can extract oil in more environmentally sensitive ways. Their aim is to impede free enterprise and economic growth as much as possible.....especially in the U.S. And Congress sits in its little bubble, as per usual, oblivious to the hardships endured by those who actually make this country work.

However, Americans always get what they want and if it takes $4 a gallon gas to finally get their attention, I am all for it. I believe we are going to see some changes in the not too distant future or there is going to be hell to pay.

In the meantime, I shall be cheerfully adding to my so-called carbon footprint. Flying to NY State tomorrow and will be driving around up there for a while. Already have the next two trips booked for July and September. Whoo-hoo!

Eric 13-06-2008 20:35
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LancYorkYankee (Post 591361)
Just a bit of clarification. First off, the price of a gallon of gas in the US stands at $4 a gallon which is "only" about 2 pounds per gallon. It's just the most current thing Americans have chosen to whinge about.

Also, I believe the average American drives about 15,000 to 20,000 miles a year which is quite a big difference from most Englishmen right? Instead of any desire to cut back on miles driven, the huge size of vehicles desired (many for merely status symbols), all kinds of fancy doodads and high over-use of their airconditioning (IMO), the lefteze wish to "go after" the big bad oil companys.

IMO, it's all about supply and demand over here. If the average American cut back just a little, we'd see our prices go down quite a bit. But again, we whinge with the whoa is me mantra and try to blame anybody but ourselves.

Brian
While I sort of agree with what JB said, this is what I was talking about. We have met the enemy and he is us.

Eric 13-06-2008 20:46
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 592385)
You have my sympathy.

I love nature....but the radical environmentalists don't want us to touch ANYTHING. They sue at every turn. And, of course, nuclear isn't an option for them either. It doesn't matter to them that there were no spills in the Gulf during Katrina or that technology is so improved now that you can extract oil in more environmentally sensitive ways. Their aim is to impede free enterprise and economic growth as much as possible.....especially in the U.S. And Congress sits in its little bubble, as per usual, oblivious to the hardships endured by those who actually make this country work.

However, Americans always get what they want and if it takes $4 a gallon gas to finally get their attention, I am all for it. I believe we are going to see some changes in the not too distant future or there is going to be hell to pay.

In the meantime, I shall be cheerfully adding to my so-called carbon footprint. Flying to NY State tomorrow and will be driving around up there for a while. Already have the next two trips booked for July and September. Whoo-hoo!
A true lover of nature indeed ... damn those radical environmentalists like Al Gore and David Suzuki ... but it would be nice if the Americans were content merely to screw up their own country in their thirst for oil and not go overseas and leave a mess behind when they get their asses kicked out ... it must have been a profound love of nature that led to the use of agent orange in Viet Nam.:rolleyes:

Royboy39 13-06-2008 20:59
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Petrol in Spain topped one pound a litre for the first time. (1.27 Euros) today.

Hate to break up the Americas arguement...but who the hell is David Suzuki?

steeljack 13-06-2008 21:01
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royboy39 (Post 592430)
Petrol in Spain topped one pound a litre for the first time. (1.27 Euros) today.

Hate to break up the Americas arguement...but who the hell is David Suzuki?
no idea , never heard of him , maybe a Canadian ?

jambutty 14-06-2008 08:45
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Royboy39 (Post 592430)
Petrol in Spain topped one pound a litre for the first time. (1.27 Euros) today.

Hate to break up the Americas arguement...but who the hell is David Suzuki?
He makes motorbikes – doesn’t he?

jambutty 14-06-2008 08:53
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 592327)
Unfortunately, we also have a Congress seemingly determined not to allow its citizens to utilize said resources.
So you pillage the world’s supplies when you can to preserve your own resources.

jambutty 14-06-2008 08:56
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 592385)
In the meantime, I shall be cheerfully adding to my so-called carbon footprint. Flying to NY State tomorrow and will be driving around up there for a while. Already have the next two trips booked for July and September. Whoo-hoo!
Spoken like a true selfish moron.

shillelagh 16-06-2008 16:08
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/7456458.stm

Just seen this ... £1.99 for a litre of petrol or diesel. Wonder how many people will use his garage afterwards?

LancYorkYankee 16-06-2008 17:21
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
I fully agree with Barb about utilylizing more of our resources. I do believe we could do this without causing hardly any of the blight and environmental destruction tauted by the environmentalists. It just a simple question of common sense . . . Hello Congress, business, radical groups, greedies, self-satifyers, etc. etc. won't anyone really listen and understand?

Nah, doesn't suit their own selfish motives:(:confused: Oh yeah, IMO.

Brian

Benipete 16-06-2008 20:09
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shillelagh (Post 593489)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/7456458.stm

Just seen this ... £1.99 for a litre of petrol or diesel. Wonder how many people will use his garage afterwards?
Heard this on the news this morning while i was bleaching and stoning my front step.He said he was trying to conserve supplies and not fleecing his customers.Why do people tell lies?:D:D

bullseyebarb 27-06-2008 15:17
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 592592)
So you pillage the world’s supplies when you can to preserve your own resources.

Hooey.

bullseyebarb 27-06-2008 15:23
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 592594)
Spoken like a true selfish moron.
On the contrary. I am contributing to the economy of my country. Utilizing airlines, rental car companies, hotels, restaurants and shops, etc., helps to ensure that my fellow Americans maintain full employment.

So, which irks you the most......my having the freedom and means to travel at will or that I relish the fact?

It is worth noting that no matter when or where I travel, I sure do run into a lot of Brits - all of whom are having a whale of a time. Quite in keeping with the concept of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Perhaps you should reserve a little of your ill-conceived contempt for them. After all, how dare any of us spend our money in ways that do not earn the jambutty seal of approval.

cashman 27-06-2008 15:39
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 599212)
On the contrary. I am contributing to the economy of my country. Utilizing airlines, rental car companies, hotels, restaurants and shops, etc., helps to ensure that my fellow Americans maintain full employment.

So, which irks you the most......my having the freedom and means to travel at will or that I relish the fact?

It is worth noting that no matter when or where I travel, I sure do run into a lot of Brits - all of whom are having a whale of a time. Quite in keeping with the concept of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Perhaps you should reserve a little of your ill-conceived contempt for them. After all, how dare any of us spend our money in ways that do not earn the jambutty seal of approval.
good on yer Barb, go fer it girl, stuff the saddos,enjoy life.;)

jaysay 27-06-2008 16:13
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 599213)
good on yer Barb, go fer it girl, stuff the saddos,enjoy life.;)
Couldn't have put it better myself cashy, whats the use of living if you can't enjoy life, I know there are people who like to think they can rule your every waking monment, but we'll get rid of them at the next election:D:p

jambutty 27-06-2008 16:46
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 599211)
Hooey.
Hang on a mo!

You stated that your Congress doesn’t allow the American citizen to utilise the country’s resources, yet you still have oil etc aplenty.

If it didn’t come from the states it must have come from your abroad.

That is using the world’s supplies whilst conserving your own.

And that is not just “Hooey” to your denial but “Phooey” as well.

jambutty 27-06-2008 16:59
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 599212)
On the contrary. I am contributing to the economy of my country. Utilizing airlines, rental car companies, hotels, restaurants and shops, etc., helps to ensure that my fellow Americans maintain full employment.

So, which irks you the most......my having the freedom and means to travel at will or that I relish the fact?

It is worth noting that no matter when or where I travel, I sure do run into a lot of Brits - all of whom are having a whale of a time. Quite in keeping with the concept of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Perhaps you should reserve a little of your ill-conceived contempt for them. After all, how dare any of us spend our money in ways that do not earn the jambutty seal of approval.
Absolute codswallop.

You admit that you don’t give a fig for your carbon footprint just as long as you can continue your life style as you want and excuse it by saying that you are helping to maintain American’s full employment. And this in the full knowledge that there are millions around the world starving because their crops won’t grow because of changed weather patterns, which in all probability are cause by excess CO2 in the atmosphere.

In spite of your puerile denials and protestations that is being utterly selfish.

jambutty 27-06-2008 17:00
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 599213)
good on yer Barb, go fer it girl, stuff the saddos,enjoy life.;)
I have enjoyed my life and continue to do so albeit cut back drastically.

The only saddos are those who live in denial of what is happening to the world and selfishly bash on as if nothing is happening.

jambutty 27-06-2008 17:05
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysay (Post 599219)
Couldn't have put it better myself cashy, whats the use of living if you can't enjoy life, I know there are people who like to think they can rule your every waking monment, but we'll get rid of them at the next election:D:p
And replace them by the same under a different name.

cashman 27-06-2008 17:07
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599243)
I have enjoyed my life and continue to do so albeit cut back drastically.

The only saddos are those who live in denial of what is happening to the world and selfishly bash on as if nothing is happening.
disagree,the saddos are those who think individual effort will make a jot of differance, when governments get off the pot n become really serious then we will perhaps see a differance. then i will take things more seriously.:rolleyes:

bullseyebarb 27-06-2008 17:18
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599230)
Hang on a mo!

You stated that your Congress doesn’t allow the American citizen to utilise the country’s resources, yet you still have oil etc aplenty.

If it didn’t come from the states it must have come from your abroad.

That is using the world’s supplies whilst conserving your own.

And that is not just “Hooey” to your denial but “Phooey” as well.
It's the word pillage that I object to. It suggests the taking of booty. Oil is a world commodity which we buy on the open market at the same price as everyone else. Our major suppliers are our neighbors Canada and Mexico. The Saudis come in third.

It isn't as if these yahoos in Congress are preserving our own resources for future use. No, they want us to wait until "alternative" energy sources have been perfected and use no oil at all.

bullseyebarb 27-06-2008 17:41
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599240)
Absolute codswallop.

You admit that you don’t give a fig for your carbon footprint just as long as you can continue your life style as you want and excuse it by saying that you are helping to maintain American’s full employment. And this in the full knowledge that there are millions around the world starving because their crops won’t grow because of changed weather patterns, which in all probability are cause by excess CO2 in the atmosphere.

In spite of your puerile denials and protestations that is being utterly selfish.
Because I don't buy into the carbon footprint fraud. Obviously, you think that man is so omnipotent that he is capable of altering the climate. What hubris.

The poor millions of whom you speak suffer less from the natural weather cycles than they do under dreadful governments, a lack of freedom and capital investment.

Maybe when that buffoon Al Gore quits flying around in a private jet, using up massive amounts of energy at his four homes across the country, all whilst preaching to us that we ought to stop harming the planet, I might reconsider. But I know that is not going to happen because this whole riff is about control and depriving us of our freedom. The elites will still be doing whatever they want to do.




Eric 27-06-2008 19:40
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 599246)
disagree,the saddos are those who think individual effort will make a jot of differance, when governments get off the pot n become really serious then we will perhaps see a differance. then i will take things more seriously.:rolleyes:
Have to disagree with you on this one. If we sit on our duffs waiting for government to do something then it will be too late. Govts in general don't give a rat's ass about anything but getting elected. And if being green will do this then they will be greener than Kermit. If enough individuals get green, then the pressure will be on govt to act .... if "green" means votes then they will act. And it's not really govt that got us into this mess; it is us ... we wasted the gas when it was cheap. My first car, when I came to Canada was a '69 Dodge Charger, 383 magnum, with a six pack, headers and racing cams. I could pass anything on the road but a gas station .... but with gas at 45 cents a gallon, who gave a damn. In our next general election ... and with a minority govt, this could happen at any time ... the two major issues will be, getting our young men and women out of the mess in Afghanistan (85 killed in action so far, and god knows how many mangled physically and mentally), and getting serious about the environment. Our present PM is parroting GW's bs, I don't think he is going to take his head from out of his rear end long enough to look around and see that Canadians are getting tired of his "don't give a damn about the environment" attitude. We have already destroyed one political party for getting too cozy with the US. And we can do it again:alright:

cashman 28-06-2008 11:29
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
know what yer saying eric, but do you honestly think governments of nations like china, india, etc will do anything to save the planet? they don't even give a rats about their own people, me n you n uncle tom cobbley doin our bit,will not make a jot of differance cos money does not take notice of oiks.

jaysay 28-06-2008 12:01
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599244)
And replace them by the same under a different name.
This lot are pasing legislation after legislation JB, and as soon as it upsets their own backbenchers they have to start making deals to satisfy these decenters, Its a pity they don't think things through before acting, scrapping he 10p tax rate spings readily to mind:(

Eric 28-06-2008 17:26
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 599465)
know what yer saying eric, but do you honestly think governments of nations like china, india, etc will do anything to save the planet? they don't even give a rats about their own people, me n you n uncle tom cobbley doin our bit,will not make a jot of differance cos money does not take notice of oiks.
I think that you are looking in the wrong direction for problems. I believe that the Chinese are aware of the problems of global warming and industrial pollution, and so are the Indians. In both countries, there is a level of political, and technological sophistication that we don't take into account in the West. If you look west you will see the US, with a President who can't spell enviormnt, let alone understand the imlplications of global warming, who consume an outrageous amount of the world's resources.... and there are the greedy, arrogant gun toting gasguzzling idiots who live in certain areas of that country .... which by the way decided not to sign on to Kyoto, like the conservative govt in my country. There are people in power in Canada who see the disappearance of the Arctic summer ice, not as an ecological disaster, but as an opportunity to exploit the mineral wealth in the area for chrissake:eek: I also don't by the argument that it is the emerging economic powers who are to blame for the mess that we in the west have made of the planet.

cashman 28-06-2008 20:12
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 599579)
I also don't by the argument that it is the emerging economic powers who are to blame for the mess that we in the west have made of the planet.
i don't think that at all, just pointing out imho that as far across the globe as you can travel, nobody that really matters or can do owt gives a rats, but the common people will be expected to save the planet, or at least in this country- pay fer the priviledge, well that don't sit well with me.

jambutty 28-06-2008 20:25
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysay (Post 599473)
This lot are pasing legislation after legislation JB, and as soon as it upsets their own backbenchers they have to start making deals to satisfy these decenters, Its a pity they don't think things through before acting, scrapping he 10p tax rate spings readily to mind:(
That’ll be the day when any government comes up with what they consider to be a bright idea and thinks it through before implementing it.

In the meantime we pay the price. We always have and we always will until such times as true democracy can be implemented.

Eric 30-06-2008 08:43
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599690)
That’ll be the day when any government comes up with what they consider to be a bright idea and thinks it through before implementing it.

In the meantime we pay the price. We always have and we always will until such times as true democracy can be implemented.
"True democray" ... are we talking Athens in the fifth century BC ... or is this something you have just come up with that you will explain later:confused: And if there is a true democracy, is the one that exists now a "false" democracy.:rolleyes:

jaysay 30-06-2008 09:14
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599690)
That’ll be the day when any government comes up with what they consider to be a bright idea and thinks it through before implementing it.

In the meantime we pay the price. We always have and we always will until such times as true democracy can be implemented.
It looks like the latest green tax to bite the dust is the increase in road tax for older cars, yet another U Turn, whats the point o making legislation only to scarp it when the Indians get restless, this ain't government its total capitulation

jambutty 30-06-2008 13:11
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 600202)
"True democray" ... are we talking Athens in the fifth century BC ... or is this something you have just come up with that you will explain later:confused: And if there is a true democracy, is the one that exists now a "false" democracy.:rolleyes:
As I understand it democracy is the rule by the wishes of the majority. As far as the UK is concerned that is not the case. The government voted into office is there because of the wishes of the minority of those eligible to vote in the country. But the government twists the democracy rule by using the majority of those who cast a vote.

However even then democracy is squashed. Each MP voted into Parliament has one vote when it comes to deciding a course of action. Yet one MP can have attained office with 65,000 people voting for him whilst another only had 10,000 vote for him. Yet both votes in Parliament carry the same weight.

A strange form of democracy!

jaysay 30-06-2008 16:43
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 600341)
As I understand it democracy is the rule by the wishes of the majority. As far as the UK is concerned that is not the case. The government voted into office is there because of the wishes of the minority of those eligible to vote in the country. But the government twists the democracy rule by using the majority of those who cast a vote.

However even then democracy is squashed. Each MP voted into Parliament has one vote when it comes to deciding a course of action. Yet one MP can have attained office with 65,000 people voting for him whilst another only had 10,000 vote for him. Yet both votes in Parliament carry the same weight.

A strange form of democracy!
And non of them actually vote how their electorate want them otherwise we would have capital punishment for murdering scumbags instead of giving them a life of luxury behind bars and a beter living than most pensioners

Neil 30-06-2008 18:14
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysay (Post 600456)
And non of them actually vote how their electorate want them otherwise we would have capital punishment for murdering scumbags instead of giving them a life of luxury behind bars and a beter living than most pensioners
As a man well known in political circles maybe you could explain that mystery to us all ;)

Eric 30-06-2008 18:31
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 600341)
As I understand it democracy is the rule by the wishes of the majority. As far as the UK is concerned that is not the case. The government voted into office is there because of the wishes of the minority of those eligible to vote in the country. But the government twists the democracy rule by using the majority of those who cast a vote.

However even then democracy is squashed. Each MP voted into Parliament has one vote when it comes to deciding a course of action. Yet one MP can have attained office with 65,000 people voting for him whilst another only had 10,000 vote for him. Yet both votes in Parliament carry the same weight.

A strange form of democracy!
Seems like you are in favor of some form of proportional representation ... and this I would agree with ... just for an example, and this is not an indication of my politics, the Canadian Green Party won about 10% of the national vote in the last General Election, but won no seats. Under some form of proportional representation, the thousands of people who voted Greeen would have a voice in parliament. I don't know how it is in England, but in Canada, in both Provincial and Federal elections, the winning party often has less than fifty per cent of the vote.:(

jambutty 30-06-2008 19:50
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 600540)
Seems like you are in favor of some form of proportional representation ... and this I would agree with ... just for an example, and this is not an indication of my politics, the Canadian Green Party won about 10% of the national vote in the last General Election, but won no seats. Under some form of proportional representation, the thousands of people who voted Greeen would have a voice in parliament. I don't know how it is in England, but in Canada, in both Provincial and Federal elections, the winning party often has less than fifty per cent of the vote.:(
I am indeed.

And what you describe is a mirror of the UK “democratic” system.

Eric 30-06-2008 20:16
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 600578)
I am indeed.

And what you describe is a mirror of the UK “democratic” system.
It's even crazier here; Federal elections are ususally decided after the vote is counted in Onatario and Quebec, because these are the most populous provinces. This means that because this is such a huge country, stretching across five and a half time zones, the election is over while people in British Columbia are still voting. TV and radio stations are not allowed to release results in the western provinces until all the polls are closed ... but in this digital age, anyone can access results on the net.:eek: So if you are voting in MST or PST areas you know the results of the election before you go to vote.

Eric 30-06-2008 20:21
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
I think that I am wandering a long way from the price of oil .... but we have billions of barrels of the stuff still in the ground, so we don't worry about the price of oil, just the level of govt. taxation on the stuff. Unlike some in the US, most of us prefer to have free health care and good access to education than cheap oil and gas. Our Liberal party is proposing a new revenue neutral tax scheme that looks interesting, and is receiving the nod from both the left wing and the right.

steeljack 30-06-2008 20:23
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 600589)
It's even crazier here; Federal elections are ususally decided after the vote is counted in Onatario and Quebec, because these are the most populous provinces. This means that because this is such a huge country, stretching across five and a half time zones, the election is over while people in British Columbia are still voting. TV and radio stations are not allowed to release results in the western provinces until all the polls are closed ... but in this digital age, anyone can access results on the net.:eek: So if you are voting in MST or PST areas you know the results of the election before you go to vote.
similar situation here , the east coast polls close and the 'talking heads' are out with the exit polls and predictions , though they do wait until the west coast polls close before issuing any results , though no one seems to care that Alaska and Hawaii are still voting ....
my solution ... the US and Canada should be like China and have only one timezone ;)

Eric 01-07-2008 18:36
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by steeljack (Post 600594)
similar situation here , the east coast polls close and the 'talking heads' are out with the exit polls and predictions , though they do wait until the west coast polls close before issuing any results , though no one seems to care that Alaska and Hawaii are still voting ....
my solution ... the US and Canada should be like China and have only one timezone ;)
Or form a new country consiting of California and BC (British California) ... oh, and lets add Alberta because it is floating on a sea of oil. And Oregon and Washington because they are so beautiful.:rolleyes:

bullseyebarb 06-07-2008 17:42
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 599690)
In the meantime we pay the price. We always have and we always will until such times as true democracy can be implemented.

Be careful what you wish for. In a democracy, individual rights are irrelevant. If the majority votes that half of your income be confiscated before you can even buy groceries.....well, what are you going to do then?

jambutty 06-07-2008 18:45
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 602960)
Be careful what you wish for. In a democracy, individual rights are irrelevant. If the majority votes that half of your income be confiscated before you can even buy groceries.....well, what are you going to do then?
Don’t be stupid.

What sane group would vote to lose half their income before even getting access to it?:rofl38::rofl38::rofl38:

entwisi 07-07-2008 11:16
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
the well paid who are on 40% tax and NI and then all the tax that we already pay. They don't have a chance because there isn't a party that will change any of that.

bullseyebarb 08-07-2008 18:20
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambutty (Post 602984)
Don’t be stupid.

What sane group would vote to lose half their income before even getting access to it?:rofl38::rofl38::rofl38:

No sane person does......yet it still happens.

I was merely making the point that democracy is mob rule, which makes it a very dangerous form of government. But what care you if the majority vote comes at the expense of the minority.

To paraphrase one of Cyfr's favorite quotes.....
"Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what's for dinner."

'Tis better, I think, to restrain the wolves and arm the sheep.

Eric 08-07-2008 19:02
Re: The Price Of Oil !
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullseyebarb (Post 602960)
Be careful what you wish for. In a democracy, individual rights are irrelevant. If the majority votes that half of your income be confiscated before you can even buy groceries.....well, what are you going to do then?
Now I get it ... Barb is an anarchist:alright:


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