IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

I have just read the daily mail online and the headlines are that women going though ivf can now name anyone as the father. From what I understand this can include anyone who is willing to be responsible for the child. I am really not sure about this, I do think that for lesbian couples it does give the other parent more rights which can be beneficial for the child involved. I think this is a very controversial issue and am interested to know what your thoughts are.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Well it's a trap for the male ego, I'm getting to the age where if someone named me as the Father I'd be so proud of being accused I'd just have to say I am!

http://planetsmilies.net/obscene-smiley-1036.gif

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

So long as they don't make you say I DO Less:D

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

sorted Less.... i'll let you know when we have to go and register her :D

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

http://planetsmilies.net/obscene-smiley-7204.gif

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

This event raises so many issues it is difficult to know where to begin.

Women in need of IVF treatment need this service because they cannot conceive naturally. The reason could be that their partner is infertile or he has a low sperm count. If the latter then IVF is the only way. If the former and if she is desperate to conceive she should either dump the partner and find someone else or adopt.

However IVF could be storing up problems for the future. Meaning that if the woman is unable to conceive for genetic reasons then there is a fifty-fifty chance that any female offspring will have the same defect. It is not improbable to consider that at some time in the future there will be more women in need of IVF that those who do not.

Then there is the potential danger of ‘designer’ babies. It has already happened where a couple have had IVF treatment to bring into this world a child whose existence is mainly to become a donor (bone marrow) for a sibling.

In the animal world, if a female animal is unable to conceive her imperfect gene pool dies with her. That is nature’s way and you defy nature at your peril.

If the sperm donor is anonymous then the woman’s partner should adopt the child in the same way that a female divorcee with children can have her new partner adopt her children with the natural father’s consent. How you get consent from an anonymous donor is a riddle for the courts to solve.

Lesbian couples should not be allowed to have IVF treatment – FULL STOP!

In the first instance children learn from their parents and with no male parent they could easily grow up thinking that same sex partnership is the norm, when in fact it is not. In the main a lesbian is a lesbian because of her genes and these would be passed on to any female offspring.

Then what happens when it comes to mixing with other ‘normal’ kids in school? I know that kids are resilient and tend to accept life as it is but they can also be very cruel. Imagine what a child of a lesbian couple is likely to go through once it becomes known that it has two mothers and no dad? There is enough bullying in school for all sorts of other reasons without giving the bullies another arrow to their bullying bow.

I would finish with that the needs of the human gene pool as a whole outweighs the desires on an individual.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

We need the knowhow to do this IVF because pollution is reducing male fertility
BBC NEWS | Health | Traffic 'damages male fertility'
Pollutants 'damage men's fertility' | Society | The Guardian
..so that the men who aren't affected can continue to provide the next generations

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Wow jambutty good response. In my opinion I think their is a decline in the family uniy and traditions in general and I do not think this is going to help in anyway whatsoever. I do disagree with you on the issues of lesbian couples being entitled to ivf treatment. I think the bigger issues for lesbian and gay couples who adopt or use ivf are the rights of the second parent if they do separate. As for kids being resilliant I agree that kids may be bullied by other children but I think you have to remember that kids are growing up in a much more tolerant time. I know at my children's school there are a couple of same sex parents and their kids do not get teased. I have to also say that there are far more screwed up kids out there from hetrosexual parents who separate and spend lots of time and money fighting over their kids just to retaliate at the other parent.
For those who wonder no I am not a lesbian I am happily married with 4 children.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Its not just pollution it is also lifestyle. Mind you in the future a fertile man could make a comfy life for himself and have make a fortune when selling his little swimmers. Women would treat him as a god. The shoe would be on the other foot then.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

BIRTH CERTIFICATE

Name of Father: Mr. T. Baster

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

I belive this view is one that is incredibly out of touch with reality.
First of all, bullies will attack for reasons of personal cowardice, fear, and ideas of social gain. They will pick on any peer they view as weaker than themselves.
Secondly there's such a wide variety in family diversity on a modern day playground that any one child's family circumstance is very likely to differ greatly from that of any other respective child. For this reason I think the "I'm in a regular 2.4 children family and you are not" view of a bully is non-existant. There's more lone-parent families, inter-racial families, young families etc. than ever before and if anything I think it's the safest time for a child to be born unto a same-sex couple.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

this is all a bit de ja vu, werent we talking the other week about the kid who supposidly fathered a baby? i'm sure the mother to the baby thought the same, i thought she was naming ANYONE as the baby's father anyway :rolleyes: :confused: :rolleyes:

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:rofl38: :rofl38::rofl38: that is the absolute bigget load of tripe I have ever heard/read, following that logic , lesbians give birth to lesbians, so every mother of a lesbian is also a lesbian ........likewise the father of every gay male is also a gay ..............grow up ........go back to oogling/drooling over your childhood hero Stanley Mathews

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Ok but you would'nt have had the pleasure.

Retlaw.
:hidewall:

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

I'm afraid you've rather contradicted yourself there.

You say 'in the first instance children learn from their parents', implying lesbianism is something that is taught by example, i.e. nurture.

You then give the contradictory statement that 'a lesbian is a lesbian because of here genes', and that lesbianism is a genetic quirk of nature. Which today is the more accepted understanding when it comes to the sexual orientation of the animal kingdom.

Rather odd, and a little bit creepy, that you seem so preocupied with lesbianism. As the same issues you talk about apply equally to both men and women when it comes to same gender parenting.

Perhaps it's just some genetic defect that makes you see things this way.;)

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

He's obviously never met same gender identical twins.

One of whom is hetero, and the other homosexual.

That would be to much for his mind to take in, and he'd be really confused.

:D

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

I thought some women already did name who they wanted ... there was one in the paper the other week ... son thought dad was his dad ... turns out he wasnt it was another bloke.

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no your wrong , after all he holds the Eugenics chair at the University of Darwen :eek:, probably got his post-grad experience at Trebilanka and his Doctorate at Buchanweld ;) ;)

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seems some people convince themselves of the fact that one person is the dad when it could be several (back to my earlier post)

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

In the films Freddie has more than one dad?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_ikLgN2RxvE...uger-photo.jpg

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And I actually know of an example Rindi:D

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I could get a bit dangerous really, I wonder how many kids the likes of Brad Pitt could end up with to their name:rolleyes::D:cool:

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and thats what makes jeremy kyle so entertaining :D

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Oh come on ema you don't watch that tripe do you, I'd sooner have my teeth pulled without anaesthetic:D

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I think I know who you mean.

I don't know them, but have met three other sets of identical twins with differing sexual orientation, which sort of disproves the nurturing claim as a major contributing factor.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Perhaps they don't publish many research papers in publications such as Razzle's girl on girl special editions.;)

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i know a set of twins where one is gay and one is straight. i also have gay friends that have children that are straight and straight people that have children that are gay, that doesnt stand up to Jambuttys reasoning does it?

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Well this all gay thing was explained to me by a gay barman who worked at Martholme Grange. He was asked why, when there were so many young girls wearing short skirts and low cut blouses, did he fancy other men (by the way it wasn't me who asked the question) He gave the perfect answer, and I quote "I am the victim of circumstance, I have the mind of a woman in a mans body" don't think you can explain it better than that really

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

You need to get out more if you watch that rubbish.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Can the reason for that be put down to your genetic make up though?

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its on as i get back from dropping ty at school, i have a brew and my breakfast and watch jeremy kyle, theres some 'interesting' people on there, i like the ones that fail the dna and lie detector tests then still wont admit it and say the tests are wrong :D

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Well not my genetic make up I hasten to add, but I suppose that its like anything else Neil, a persons parents maybe fit and well but a child can have an health defect, don't think you an put down to genetic make up, although some diseases are passed on through genetics but not all:confused:

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

alice cooper was his daddy :D

although in an earlier film they said somat else

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Oh come on accyman Alice Cooper is much uglier than that:D

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

Am I the only one seeing a potential problem here? Any person who is named as the father of a child should be the biological father. It protects the child's right to identify any potential health risks/problems that may arise in the future and also ensures the stability of the gene pool. Could you imagine in the future if women who have had IVF and have used a sperm donor, claimed that Joe Bloggs was the father, when in fact Donor Number 12345 is actually the father. No one knows how many children Donor 12345 has fathered or where those children are. Incest comes to mind. It's not right and it's also one of the many reasons humankind shouldn't be messing about with creating life that wasn't meant to be.

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Was there not a case not to long ago about siblings / twins which had been seperated or similar, falling in love years later, only to find out that they were related? (or did I dream that one?? help anyone??)

Edit:

Found a link to what I was on about, glad i hadnt dreamt it, slightly different though, they share the same mother but the brother was put into care, but shows that it can happen and maybe siblings have a special bond whether they know them or not which it seems in this case has been mistaken for love

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/ar...t-met-20s.html

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

I watch it too, while I tidy up after breakfast, out of sheer fascination of the sort of people who appear on it. It may well be rubbish but there's lots more rubbish on TV. Each to his own. :rolleyes:

This naming of "anyone" as the father - well, it's been going on since registration first became compulsory hasn't it? What's that old saying? It's a wise child that knows its own father. :D

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I would have thought by now that if a bloke denies the child is his then either the mother or the government would have to prove if he is or not before his name can go on the birth certificate as father. After all a birth certificate is a legal document.

What happens then if a bloke says the baby is not his? What gets put of the birth certificate?

Its the same with child support. The calculations and amounts are set in law. Surely if a man denies the child is his then the mother/csa will have to prove he is before any money is taken from him.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

if he doesnt think the baby is his then he shouldnt go and get his name on the certifiate, unless he is married to the mother then she cant put his name on without him being there.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

I was thinking more of husbands who have believed they were also fathers but, biologically, weren't. There was a lot of it about in the 1940s so I'm told.

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I have not been in that position.
So does a birth certificate not have to name the father?
If that is the case how does the mother prove who the father is when wanting to get money for the baby?

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

jeremy kyle lol

the mother can name anyone she likes and if it is proved not to be the bloke she says it is she has to provide a name of the next possability and so on until they get a positive match,if the bloke refuses teh DNA test they automaticly assume guilt so they never actually ever know who teh father is but the records are kept straight and thats all that matters

it would be interesting to see if a woman accused prince harry of fathering their child wether he would have to have a dna test and if he refused would he be automaticly found to be the father

the csa have even pressed women who have been raped for teh father name , pretty ruthless organisation once they get their teeth into somat or somone

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unless married the father MUST be prsent if he wants his name on the birth certificate where he will sign the registration and also state his occupation if any

i am not on my eldest childs birth certificate as me and his mother had seperated but i am on my youngests birth certificate but i had to be present and even though i was seriously ill at the time they wouldnt make exceptions so i had to go if i wanted to be on it

even though my name is not on both birth certificates i have the same rights for both my children as i went to court and gained parental resposablity orders for them so wether or not my name is on their birth certificates is irrelivant

mind you 3 years on and im still in and out of court but thats a different story :rolleyes:

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

no it doesnt and that means that the father doesnt automatically get parental rights, he has to apply to court for them. I'm not sure about the csa and maintenance, Tys dad is on his birth certificate (although he doesnt have parental rights either because he was born before the rules changed). but theres only me on Graces.

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

i'm the only parent on Reece's birth certificate too

Shaun (i wont say his dad cos he's a ****** and doesnt deserve to be called dad) was living in Scotland when Reece was born, he didnt see Reece till he was 6 months old, he never wanted his name on it either, i get a letter from the csa every few months saying Shaun has to pay £0.00...it baffles me how he gets away with it

i used to work with a woman and she told me that her sons real dad wasnt on his birth certificate, but the bloke who she is now with.....is.....go figure that one out

Re: IVF mothers can name ANYONE as father
 

although not better fir the child to only have 1 parent on the birth certificate do you find it easier to be the only one with parental responsibility? means when i decide to move us out of the country i dont have to ask permission etc thats just an example, you know what i mean.

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yeah i know what you mean BUT.....

when Reece was 2, Shaun took me to court over access, to which i fought, i told the courts i only wanted supervised access, this was granted and Shaun had to come all the way over from Burnley to Accy to have it supervised in an old church (with lots of other dads) i told my solicitor that i was thinking of moving down to Felixstowe just to get away from it all and she told me that wherever i am i would still have to let Shaun see Reece....Shaun then only bothered turning up for 3 Saturdays, then didnt bother with him after that....what was the point in taking me to court?? he did it just to try and pee me off......it didnt work, it made me happy that i didnt have to take Reece to see him anymore :D

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tylers dad lives in kent and doesnt come see him,has never given me money for him or even sent him a card at xmas/ birthday... i doubt he would pay to go to ireland to see him...

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Shaun is the same, he bought Reece a push along sit on truck thing for his first birthday....and threw it against a wall in temper before he even gave it to him...so Reece ended up with a broken truck for his first birthday.....he's not had owt since, not that Reece is bothered

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he has you, its better to have a decent parent that will never leave you than to put up with a rubbish one just because they are your dad/mum, its better for the kids tbh. (only if the missing parent is rubbish before anyone has a go)

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lol that would mean Reece has no decent parents then :D