Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

It has been announced today that our armed forces are going to work more closely with france.Is this right for us, france looks after france when push comes to shove as during the falklands war for example when they were still selling exocet missles to argentina.:confused:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Remember the Air France Concord crash? If the French had fitted new tyres(as BA did) instead of remoulds the bit of metal probably wouldn't have shredded the tyre. So Air France grounded its Concords but of course the French didn't like BA continuing to fly theirs!
So what did they do? They decided they would refuse to supply BA with any spares.Result-no BA Concords flying.
So come the day we say 'please may we borrow your aircraft carrier' if the French don't like what we want it for- guess what? The Charles de Gaulle will suddenly need urgent repairs.
Are we mad??

Cheese Eating Surrender Monkeys
 

I might live there but join with them militarily? May God forbid
As the Mayor of Paris said to the German General when they took Paris - "Table for two thousand Messieur?":eek::eek::confused:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Sorry, hadn't seen this when I erupted about Cheese Eating Surrender Monkeys

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

I merged your thread with this which is why your post is above

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

OK Neil, no problem whatsoever.:)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Always knew French at School would come in handy,

Je me rends

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

You are now seeing the start of the Armed Forces of the United States of Europe.
The French and Germans want it and we've now opened the door and let them in. And we as the biggest military power in the EU will naturally be the main contributor-at OUR expense! The EU already has its own Foreign Minister, soon it will have its own Armed Forces-mainly ours. No independant Foreign Policy or armed defence or intervention for the UK-another score for the EU bureaucrats, our new masters.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

and as usual the tories doing the opposite of what they say they stand for:rolleyes: lets hope the argentinians dont invade the falklands

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

The Fench I learned even the French wouldn't understand Less:rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

In the words of Charles De Gaulle 'Non'.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

If ever there was a RIGHT time to get out of Europe - this is most certainly IT.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

It hurts but I have to fully agree! The one party I thought would protect our independent Military!
The Charles de Gaulle is already inoperable and our planes(once the Harriers go) couldn't use it.So when Ark Royal goes be nice to the Argentineans or else!

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

nowt surprises me these days, in fact getting around the negotiating table wi Bin Laden would not be a shock,:rolleyes: after all it seemed a good idea wi Adams n McGuinness.:(

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Providing the French troops come under British Officers then it might just work - remember the Free French troops in WWII.
But French Officers - Non, Je ne peux pas accepter cela.
Under French Officers - The Peninsular War, Trafalgar, Waterloo, WWI, WWII, Dien Bien Phu, Algeria - Je ne pense pas ainsi (I do not think so)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

I know Cameron is making gestures as if he's standing up against the European Union in several ways. But this seems like it could be the first step towards a European Military?

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

But were these ******* not anti E.U. before elected?:confused:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Not the best of ideas, at some point it's going to come back & not just bite us but take our arm off ! Bad move. :(

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

on the plus side we are under tory leadership so at least any retreating argentinian ships that are of no threat will be seen to pretty sharpish ( cough )

lmao at the thought of nick clegg teh leader of the lib dems having to dirty his hands with war though lol

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Yes but no politicians going to take us out of the EU, apart from maybe UKIP - after all it was Ted Heath who first got us on the road to the EU!

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Are you sure we are?

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

well who,s bigger in the E.U.?:confused:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Yet another step along the road to surrendering our independency and sovereignty.

Wellington and Nelson must be spinning in their graves. :(

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Still wi any luck this will put Maggie back in hospital.:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

I knew that you would find a bright side to this FUBAR of a deal;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

I always try n look fer a positive Eric.;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Well it doesn't really bother me that much so long as purchasing a stock of WHITE FLAGS ain't in with the deal:rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

We're the fourth biggest spender on the Military in the world, after the USA,Russia and China. France is close behind, no one knows how much North Korea spends. Germany spends little, partly because after 65 years we still have a major presence there to protect those poor Germans. To add insult to injury, when we DO pull out we will have to pay billions as reparation for the damage and tidying up after we've gone! Britain, the mug of Europe!

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Draw down started back in the 80's then they let it lie for awhile & started up again in 2008, with 4 Mechanized Brigade going back to Catterick. Last Summer the ARRC (JHQ) started shutting up shop with the idea being that British Troops would be out of Germany completely by 2018-20 & now it's set to be 2015.

And yes there is the agreement that when it's all handed back it has to be all nice, shiny & modern, which will definitely cost a pretty penny or two.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

And in the 1975 UK referendum 67% of the voters voted to stay in the EEC .

I voted to come out .

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

In 1975 the EEC, as it was then, was sold to us as a grouping of states co-operating for trading purposes. The present-day EU is a completely different animal - a nascent state in its own right now rapidly assembling its own laws, common borders and even a diplomatic organisation with its own ambassador.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

On reflection it may be a good idea, better than having close military ties wi America, at least the French declared War on Germany in WW2, whereas the yanks signed a treaty wi Hitler to stay out of hostilities. some special relationship.:rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

True much has changed since 1975 , but there is also much confusion . The title of this thread is one example . The closer military ties with France have nothing to do with the European Union .

Another source of confusion is the Council of Europe and the European Court of Human Rights . These are not part of the European Union .

Many associate anything European with the European Union .

As I have already said I voted in 1975 to leave the EEC .
If there was a referendum tomorrow about whether we should stay in the European Union , I would not be as clear in my mind as I was in 1975 . I have yet to see a viable alternative to our membership of the EU .

Most of the debate is about single issues about which people are concerned . It's easy to pick on one topic to knock the EU , and sometimes to pick on one topic that has nothing to do with the EU to knock the EU .

There has been no serious debate about membership , or about what leaving the EU would entail .

Reading between the lines , you will probably see that my opinion towards the EEC , now the EU , has mellowed since our referendum .

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

ok JCB, if the European Court Of Human Rights are not part of the E.U. aint doubting ya just asking, why the hell do we accept everything "Lock,Stock,n Barrel" that they direct?:confused: beats me.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Quite right, JCB, the military treaty with France has nothing to do officially with the EU. However, there's a lingering suspicion that this is just one more step in a general dilution of sovereignty that seems to be an on-going process amongst EU states.

As for it being easy to pick one topic to knock the EU on, it's actually easy to pick a whole range of topics - the fact that we pay more in to the EU than we get out of it, the imposition of hundreds of new laws and restrictions that we haven't actually asked for, the totally skewed and unfair (both to ourselves and others) immigration system whereby a Canadian brain surgeon would have to jump through hoops to live here, but a Romanian beggar could walk straight in and start panhandling on the streets, the fact that while we are seeing cuts in our sevices, we will be paying more to the EU budget...I could go on.

As for your "mellowing" towards the EU, I would say most people have gone the other way. But who knows?...I could be wrong. However, as a true believer in democracy, I would be quite happy to accept the results of a referendum on membership. Unfortunately, Cameron, Milliband and Clegg don't believe in democracy, except when it's going their way, and as they're frightened of the hoi polloi not giving the "correct" answer, a referendum is still a long way away! :rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

The reality is that to leave the EU is not an option....not for decades, and even if a party such as UKIP gained power they would likely change thier minds once elected.. like it hate it we are in this Union and to my mind the only way to keep our own laws/policies is to get involved and shove our weight around.. instead of sniping from the sidelines.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

How do we know that it's not an option? Nobody's ever tried. Don't forget that the EU is in a state of flux and uncertainty at the moment with major players starting to question the Lisbon Treaty and countries like Turkey and Albania due to join, with all the attendant problems that'll bring. All options are on the table!

However, I agree with you that while we're in, we should start "shoving our weight around". I'll say it again, although you and a lot of others won't like it - Thatcher played a blinder by extracting our rebate from the EU by the simple expedient of refusing to pay our contribution otherwise. If only Cameron had the bottle to pull strokes like that!

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

I agree with much of what you and Mancie are saying .
We managed to stay out of the Eurozone .
We managed to get our rebate from the EU .
We managed to get opt-outs from certain parts of the Maastricht Treaty .

Our UK governments need to play the role of a British De Gaulle . I am sure many other member states would be on our side .

I can see no alternative to being in the EU , but that does not stop our elected representatives from being a bloody nuisance when it is in our national interest and hopefully in the national interest of many of the other members .

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Would agree with you on that one, JCB. Sadly, Cameron hasn't got the bottle to do it! :rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

agree, but can't think of anyone at the forefront of any party who has?:confused:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Nope, me neither. :(

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Well we got rid of one rabid Europhile who then went and got a top job with them.
Would Red Ed stand uo to them like Maggie did?

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Questions already been answered yeh stirring git.:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Barry, a stirring git, never, he's a perfect gentleman!!!!!!! except when he's on about football, then he is a stirring git:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Canada, of course, is not a member of the EU. NAFTA is bad enough, but the bright side is that we are saddled with only one basket case economy: the US. And membership of NAFTA doesn't compromise our sovereignty. This may seem like a wander; but it is addressing, though obliquely, the point under discussion. I'm really surprised at the sense of the UK's seeming powerlessness, and the reflection of this in the attitudes of voters (that's you guys);) I think it's time that your govt. was forced into doing something that the people want; something that would be good for the national (oops, that's politically incorrect) interest. I was reading in the local rag this morning that our Federal Government ... tories, free enterprisers, ant-protectionist ... has spiked a $39 billion bid from Australian mining giant BHP Billiton for Saskatchewan's Potash Corporation. Maybe you don't know all that much about potash, unless you are a farmer or avid gardener; but 53% of the world's known reserves are in Saskatchewan. Why would a free-enterprise, right-wing govt. reverse its decision to allow the sale? Answer is simple: the Canadian people, particularly those in Saskatchewan didn't want this immensely valuable Canadian resource to be owned by a foreign company. Of the 14 federal seats in Sask. (population less than a million), 13 are held by the tories. And the message was clear: ditch the deal or else risk losing those seats. And the tories are governing with a minority: so they listen. I think the point to this wander is that, on any major issue, the people can, or should be able to pressure the govt. to act as they wish them to. I realise you guys don't have a minority govt., but a coalition is close; so maybe it's time to cut out the fatalistic, "what can we do" attitude to things which affect the sovereignty and independece of Great Britain, and take a lead from the French people by letting the government know, in no uncertain terms, how the people feel.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

The problem is that would call for solidarity , a quality in short supply in the UK .

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

True summat i always said, remember the Poll Tax? a few pensioners went to jail, most others that said they wouldn't pay coughed up pretty damn quick, the only time ya get solidarity in Britain is during War Time.:rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Might be a good time to declare war on the French:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Only if we can use their Aircraft Carriers cos they will have planes on em.:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Don't see this as a problem .... the pilots of those planes, like the crews of the ships, are probably more adept at flying white flags than they are at combat;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

You'll have Charles De Gaulle spinning in his grave:D:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Maybe we should align ourselves with Iran or North Korea. At least they have leaders who are more than capable of scaring the sh-one-t out of the cowering west.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

According to the daily press, UK gas and oil supplies are likely to result in winter power cuts should Somali pirates succeed in intercepting ships heading for our shores. Can we expect the Frogs to come up trumps in lending a hand to exterminate these parasites? Highly unlikely I think. Then again the RAF, as well as the Royal Navy, is about to be reduced to a mere shell of what we have all come to know and identify with. A couple of Tornadoes could easily blast them out of the water . . . but would Cameron's flawed idealogy let it happen?

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Screw de Gaulle .... that's the guy who made a speech in Quebec which ended with "Vive le Quebec ... Vive le Quebec libre"! Agitating the faeces big time.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Take it you weren't a fan of De Gaulle then Eric:rolleyes:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Things are looking a bit serious in Korea, apparently France have already surrendered.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Doe's that mean we will be able to borrow their ships when the yanks get us involved. :D:D:D:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

And the Italians are looking very iffy too:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

There maybe a problem there Alan think they'll be left hand drive:D:D:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Probably smell of garlic and onions aswell. :D:D:D:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Not to mention snails crawling all over the place:D:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

On Wednesday Sarah Palin said in an interview , " Obviously we've got to stand with our North Korean allies ."

:eek: Someday she may be president of the USA . :hidewall:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Ya Bloody scary ain't JCB:eek:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Even though it was a gaffe , she and the extreme fundamentalist Americans still send a chill down my spine .

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Actually compared to some of the Clowns they've had there & those we've had here ! How bad can she be ? ;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Very bad Dave, she uses a gun herself:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

I wouldn't like her fingers anywhere near that nuclear button , Dave . :eek:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

More frightening than Ronald Reagan and George W even :eek:

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Would agree with you there, JCB. The thought of somebody who believes that the story of Adam & Eve and the Garden of Eden is literally true being in charge of the world's largest nuclear arsenal is somewhat unsettling!

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Somewhat unsettling Wyn:eek: you really should have gone into politics mate ;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Yes , those Fundamentalists in the USA go overboard in religion and politics . God's on their side , so to Hell with any against them .

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Like fundamentalists the world over I guess. But the thought of one 'em being elevated to such a position of power is worrying. I never had any time for George but he was just a good ole boy from Texas, totally out of his depth. This women's a different kettle of fish - she's got that worryingly intense, clear-eyed look that you see when Jehovah's Witnesses come a knockin'. As you say, the thought of her anywhere near "the" button is disturbing to say the least (that's my polite political phraseology, Jay. Cashy could put it in stronger terms.;) ).

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Oh Wyn you know us too well:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Come on guys , give Sarah(Mama Bear) Palin a chance , she's only crazy a little bit and easy on the eyes , not like the Harriet Harman woman and the other 'Blair Babes' ;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Oh you mean hapless Harriet, went to an elite girls school, then decries anyone trying to doing the same, mind you that went for most of the ministers in the Labour Government;)

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Palin, is of course, her married name; her maiden name was Heath. Which makes you wonder - is she in any way related to that old Tory bum bandit, Euro-nutter and Britain's greatest traitor, Edward Heath?

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Na she speaks funny Tealeaf, nout what wi speak like:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Aye, but your hero Ted never spoke 'owt like wi do.

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Spoke exactly like I did at Party Conferences in the 70s:D

Re: Closer military ties with France is this right for our armed forces?
 

Didn't know that, learn something new everyday on Accyweb ;) :D