Unused medications
 

Was having a debate with a friend this morning regarding unused medication. Its a well known fact that lots of meds are over prescribed in the NHS, especially in cases where a certain med is stopped or changed. I know I'm not the only one on this site who are and lots of daily meds and from time to time I have had one med stopped and put on another, I manage my meds quite well and never allow anything to run out so I a certain med is stop I may have a full box in hand. I know we have people on here who work in pharmacy and I'm sure they will back me up when I say that if any unused meds are returned they are just destroyed and cannot be re issued. I could understand this in the years when tabs were dispensed in bottles, but today virtually all meds come in sealed containers so why can these medications not be recycled and re issued, they could be removed from there original boxes and dispensed in small boxes which even now happens from time to time. I don't know what anybody else feels on this subject, but with the cost of these new meds costing more and more money, merely to flush unused meds down the loo is a nonsense to me

Re: Unused medications
 

No thank you.
I don't want any pills that someone else has had before.
How do you know what they did to them?

Have you forgotten the problems with contaminated foods and why jars etc have tamper proof seals?

Re: Unused medications
 

Most pills today are 'blister' packed so if the 'blister' is intact you know it has not been touched.
Yes, you are right Jaysay, if you return drugs to the pharmacy unused they are destroyed even if they are in date.
This is because the pharmacy cannot guarantee what conditions they have been kept in...temperature etc.....so they figure it is safer to destroy them.

A great bugbear of mine was always..... when people go into hospital and they already have a supply of perfectly good meds that they were taking at home......why can't they continue to take their own meds in hospital? After all, they are told to bring all their current medications into hospital with them.
That would save hospitals an untold amount of money.

perhaps it is to make sure the patient is getting what the hospital doctor prescribes?
After all, if for some reason the patients tablets are from home & haven't been kept correctly who will they sue if they get worse instead of better?

Re: Unused medications
 

The point is Less, they would have been taking these medications at home.

Most people are quite sensible about the storage of their medicines too.....
I did say most but not all....some patients have bottles of mixed medications.....where they have popped all the pills out of their blister packs and put them all in one bottle......how on earth some of them didn't kill themselves was beyond me.
We would take these from the patient, then make sure they knew how dangerous it was to mix the medicines in one container.
The hospital invariably dispense exactly the same medications to be given during the stay.
But yes, you are right....that was the reason a pharmacist gave me when I asked.

It just seems to me to be an unnecessary expense...especially now the pills are blister packed, well labelled and boxed.
I can't imagine many of the pills have been stored in excess of 25 degrees C.

Re: Unused medications
 

Oh yes.....a point I forgot to mention......I am pretty sure the current documentation could be amended to fit something in that says the patient is taking their own medication, brought in from home....then they would have no claim against the hospital.

For every problem....there is a solution of one description or another.....it is just not always right to take the line of least resistance...especially when we are so strapped for cash.....allegedly.

Re: Unused medications
 

Things may have changed a little Margaret, when I was last in I used all my own meds that I took in with me, in fact they actually asked if a certain drug could be brought from home

Re: Unused medications
 

It's to do with chain of evidence, just like the police. Everything must be signed for at every handover. It was originally brought in for use with controlled drugs such as opiates but is now used for all medications. Mainly because of adulteration and storage problems.

Re: Unused medications
 

I know that sometimes we used to use patients own medication...especially if it was something unusual(didn't happen often)......and as for signing for everything, at handover, I don't see how using patients own medication would hinder that.
The patient hands over their medications on admission. The medications are placed in the ward medicine trolley, and administered by the nursing staff at medicine rounds.....I would imagine that at handover the nurses taking over do not physically check every medication in the round trolley.

And what has happened to the self medication system? This was being done on some wards(usually long term patients).....patients had their own locked medicine cabinet beside their bed.....they took the medications themselves at the time they would normally take them at home.

Re: Unused medications
 

The med cabinets are virtually standard now Margaret (well on the medical wards I've been on) but they are locked and the nurse on med rounds still give them out, maybe (in my case) with the exception of nebulisers which are usually written up as when needed

Re: Unused medications
 

I work in hospital pharmacy as some of you know so here's what happens now. Medications returned to pharmacy from patients homes have to be destroyed because we cannot 100% guarantt they are fit to use, storage, tampered with etc. However we now do use patients own drugs in the hospital, all patients are asked to bring in their own supply, which we check and assess for "fit for use". It means that the patients dont miss doses, we dont have to change their brands and we can make sure that the correct medications are prescribed on their In-patient charts, we check if patients have further supplies at home and only supply on discharge if we need to which helps to cut down on waste, hope that answers some of the questions.
I agree it sometimes seems a real shame to throw things away, but can you imagine the uproar if they were used and they'd been contaminated in some way....

Re: Unused medications
 

When Ma was in last June they were still doing the medicine round with the trolley.......I really, really wanted to take my coat off rollup my sleeves and get stuck in.

Re: Unused medications
 

All wards now have patients own drug lockers fixed or already part of the bedside cabinet, well certainly at Royal Blackburn. I think the only exception are the day case unit and escalation ward.:)

Re: Unused medications
 

Hooray, hooray........I am really glad about that.
When I was Ward Sister I was always banging on about how it could save lots of money....also patients would say that we weren't giving them the right meds, because they were getting different brands to what they used themselves.....or were getting generic versions(unbranded) which were either different shapes or different colours.

Thanks for that info Grego.....I know this may sound really sad, but you have made my day!

Re: Unused medications
 

They did when I was in back in June last year, I was kept waiting over 1/2 a day to be discharged waiting for the pharmacy to bring up some meds for me to be sent home with, as the nurses used my tablets and so I had virtually run out by the time I could go home.

Re: Unused medications
 

Thanks for that grego, I think its a better idea with regards to TTOs I used to go home with a shipping order, in fact I could probable given them some, now they come and ask if you are okay with meds at home, which is a bonus, saves waiting for ages for them to come from the pharmacy

Re: Unused medications
 

nice one grego, seems summats going the right way to me.;)

Re: Unused medications
 

Agree with the above, worked at Boots for a couple of years and all returned meds are destroyed ( controlled drugs under strict supervision too) , I queried it when I started there but it's just that you can't guarantee how they have been stored and if they have been tampered with. Can't be too careful in that line of business.

Re: Unused medications
 

Lindsay, I can see the sense in that, but from the hospital viewpoint, patients are hardly likely to have tampered with their own meds.
I used to bang on about using patients own meds at every opportunity.....there was always someone who threw up objections. I am really glad to see that it is now happening...even though I am no longer there to see it.
I'm not sorry about that.

Re: Unused medications
 

It was about time things changed Margaret we had been trying to implement the new system for years but you know what the NHS is like.
Only half a day Wallop! Thats quick, unfortunately patients are always told its in pharmacy but its usually not even written at that stage, for that reason everything that arrives and leaves pharmacy is now logged so we can produce the real turn around times if we need to...:)

Re: Unused medications
 

Margaret , I was purely referring to meds returned to pharmacies. I wouldn't know about hospital practice, but obviously you would expect patients to look after their own meds. Glad I'm out of it to be honest, I didn't like being responsible for any mistakes my pharmacist ( on 4 times my wage) might make!

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Yes, I realise that Lindsay.
I'm glad to be out of it too.

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Depending which medication you're on you could recycle/reissue them yourself and make a few quid at the same time. I'm sure if you stood outside Maundy Grange you'ld get a few takers, so to speak.;)

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Steady now,a lovely charitable institution......:eek::eek::eek:

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Pharmacists don't make mistakes do they:eek: To be honest Lindsay if I am put on a new med I check to see if there are and adverse reactions with other meds I'm on, I take nothing to chances with my own health;)

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It takes me all my time to stand on two feet these days yerself never mind outside Maundy Grange;)

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Yes they do, everyone does.

I collected a prescription from the chemist last week and there was only 40 tablets in the box instead of 100

Re: Unused medications
 

Did this halt the growth of your new breasts?

:egged::egged:

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I don't need any when I can play with yours :p

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Oh come on Neil my statement was tongue in cheek mate hence the EEK smiley:D

Re: Unused medications
 

I spend money on food supplements and organic food in order to regain health.
Many people get carrier bags full of drugs delivered free (and stay sick;)).

I don't expect a refund of my costs, but wish that the NHS would be less biased in favour of pharmacutical products, when sometimes the 'folk remedies' work better (and cost less)

Re: Unused medications
 

Food supplements have been accused by some researchers of *shortening* lifespan:
BBC NEWS | Health | Vitamins 'could shorten lifespan'

And as for organic food it's not totally clear that it's always better for you either. There are some studies that have shown some health risks I think, like carcinogenic mould or something like that, plus the carbon footprint of buying organic can be bigger sometimes I think.

Re: Unused medications
 

I can see you and mags getting on like a house on fire, perhaps I need to start a book on how long before you join the rest of us on the 'ignore list!:D

P.S. head for the introduce yourself section and find some friends, quickly.:)

Re: Unused medications
 

Thank-you, I will.

Re: Unused medications
 

A great bugbear of mine was always..... when people go into hospital and they already have a supply of perfectly good meds that they were taking at home......why can't they continue to take their own meds in hospital? After all, they are told to bring all their current medications into hospital with them.
That would save hospitals an untold amount of money.[/quote]
I would have to disagree on that Margaret, my daughter went in hospital, and took her meds, they were taken off her and supposedly being kept until discharged, on that day when she asked for her meds there were only two tablets left in the box when there should have been twenty, the staff had been dispensing them to other patients, then to cap it all the nurse said I'll get you a new prescription, I'll be two minutes, the sod went on her lunch break, and my daughter didn't get her presciption until two hours later.
Thats not the only instance I've heard about with some of the staff at that meat factory in Blackburn. If I have to go in there, my medication won't be going, they wil get a copy of the prescription & thats it.
I would have to be unconscious before they could get me in there.
Accy Vic, or Royal Preston OK, but not Blackburn.
Retlaw.

Re: Unused medications
 

I would have to disagree on that Margaret, my daughter went in hospital, and took her meds, they were taken off her and supposedly being kept until discharged, on that day when she asked for her meds there were only two tablets left in the box when there should have been twenty, the staff had been dispensing them to other patients, then to cap it all the nurse said I'll get you a new prescription, I'll be two minutes, the sod went on her lunch break, and my daughter didn't get her presciption until two hours later.
Thats not the only instance I've heard about with some of the staff at that meat factory in Blackburn. If I have to go in there, my medication won't be going, they wil get a copy of the prescription & thats it.
I would have to be unconscious before they could get me in there.
Accy Vic, or Royal Preston OK, but not Blackburn.
Retlaw.[/quote]


Yes, I know of instances like the one you quoted.......but my point about patients taking in their own medications was that they be used for the patient that is named on the box.....not someone else........and as I also said, it was proposed that all beds had lockable medication locker, so that patients could continue to manage their own medications.
I am told that this is now what is done.

Though I worked in the NHS for almost 30 years, I would have to be very sick(unconscious even) to submit to hospital admission........I just don't like hospitals/doctors/medical meddling.
That is just how I am.

Re: Unused medications
 

Yes, I know of instances like the one you quoted.......but my point about patients taking in their own medications was that they be used for the patient that is named on the box.....not someone else........and as I also said, it was proposed that all beds had lockable medication locker, so that patients could continue to manage their own medications.
I am told that this is now what is done.

Though I worked in the NHS for almost 30 years, I would have to be very sick(unconscious even) to submit to hospital admission........I just don't like hospitals/doctors/medical meddling.
That is just how I am.[/quote]
Things seemed to have changed somewhat Margaret, with individual drug safes for each bed. If I have to go into hospital I have already in my case (which I keep packed with necessities like towels etc)a full current list of the medications I take, the strength of the meds and when I take them, I also have a small amount of those meds in my case(which I replace every month) ready for admission to a ward, As I say now with drug safes at each bed the meds I bring in are then transferred into that safe. Mind you I have always been very organised with respect to my own health care and by having this list saves a lot of misunderstanding, as sometimes I'm not really in a fit state to tell the medical staff just what meds I'm on

Something seems to have gone wrong with the quote facility

Re: Unused medications
 

Yes, John...that was what I had been told........and I do think it is good, because often the suppliers of the hospital meds will be different, and folk think that they aren't getting the right meds because they are different size/shape/colour....all very unsettling at a time when you have enough to deal with.......and the big plus is that it saves the local hospital some money.

Now if we could just get them to ditch the PFI....we'd be laughing!

Re: Unused medications
 

Think we've been saddled with that for many years to come Margaret:mad: