Go away Moss
 

Get back to wherever you came from. You can't be serious about cutting another tree down.Ossy wasn't a great saga now you want to cut the market hall tree.

re: Go away Moss
 

Deep breath, breathe in, hold & slowly release & repeat! Now then, could you please inform/highlight for us knowlessmen just what it is thats got you all of a tizzy? From what I can make out, it has something arboreal as its foundation?

An explanation or article would probably help. :)

re: Go away Moss
 

They are planning to chop down the horse chestnut trees in front of the market hall.
The powers that be seem to think they detract from the elegance of the building.
If I can find a link I will post it.

re: Go away Moss
 

Seems some FOOL is on about cutting all the trees down in front of the Market Hall dave, i wasn't aware what clown was behind this folly. but now i am.:D

re: Go away Moss
 

Didn't think anyone could cut down those trees unless there was something wrong with them & certainly not for aesthetic reasons

re: Go away Moss
 

Some fool has made a comment that all the trees should be cut down as it is a town centre, not a forest. Since when did a couple of trees constitute a forest?

re: Go away Moss
 

The council have applied for planning permission to cut them down.

re: Go away Moss
 

Trees face chop in £3m town square plans - Accrington Observer
There you go Son...this tells you all about it.

re: Go away Moss
 

And if you notice, they are cutting down two majestic mature trees and the replacing them with others....oh and a statue of a dog(?)...it is the Pals dog so maybe that makes it alright.

re: Go away Moss
 

So they've applied to give themselves permission?? - Blimey Moses, I've heard it all now :rolleyes:
Thanks for the link Margaret but having read it can't believe that bit that says the community as a whole supported the plans, since when has 41 people constituted a whole community?
And it's not just a statue of the Pals dog, they're also proposing a sculpture of Stanley's groundsman's dog from 1962 plus a squirrel - jeez Louise!;

re: Go away Moss
 

Seems like a sure fire way to succeed.

re: Go away Moss
 

Cheers Ma. :) On reading the article it makes mention of 6 new benches (forgive my ignorance, but weren't several benches removed not so long ago?). As to the Chestnut trees, personally I'd rather see a couple of majestic "Conker trees" as some scrawny Birch for shade & contrast.

Then there's the suggested sculptures, unless they're on raised plinths these things have got "Compo" scrawled all over them (much like the guaranteed graffiti that'll adorn them shortly after unveiling) as people will be tripping over them left, right & centre making them "Priceless" in more ways than one. And lets not forget to mention the unbridled attraction these "Bronzes" will be for P'keys & assorted other illicit scrap metal collectors!

re: Go away Moss
 

re: Go away Moss
 

Yes, Retlaw. It just seems to me that if there can be a tenuous link to the lads who gave their lives for our freedom it will be used(or as in this case, abused).

Accymad, I cannot see how the views of such a small number of the population can be considered to be of any value at all...but they are grasping at straws and you can be sure that this will go ahead and make Accrington even more of a graveyard.

The benches will be put in just for a photo shoot...when folks start sitting on them to have a fag or a yarn, they will be removed because for goodness sake we don't want the front of the market hall to look untidy.

You cannot polish a turd.

re: Go away Moss
 

41 outa a population of oer 40.000 is really taking the pee outa the general public in my eyes,:(

re: Go away Moss
 

66 in actuality Cashy (according to the blurb), in a week long "Public consultation"??? Just exactly who were these 66 demagogues whose opinion represented the multiple minions of Accrington?

It would be interesting to know whose opinions were sought & acted upon to come to the conclusion that they did.

re: Go away Moss
 

re: Go away Moss
 

re: Go away Moss
 

Retlaw, a dog is 'safe'...by that I mean it is not something immediately connected with war, death, guns...you know those nasty things that the liberal loonies would like us all to forget...they want everyone to rub the nose of the dog.
To me it feels like the good folk of Accrington are the ones who are having their noses rubbed...but rubbed in that turd that can't be polished.
It is time the council woke up and spent some money on trying to get business into the town.
Do they think that having a town square and tram seats, or trench benches will bring folk into the town? If they do, they are deluded.
And before anyone stamps on me and tells me that it is an effort to improve the town...I will say that they are headed in the wrong direction...just because you are doing 'something' doesn't mean it is the right thing.

re: Go away Moss
 

What a great council we have. Nothing new here ,same as our M.P. Just ignore the wishes of the council tax payers

re: Go away Moss
 

I honestly think it would be better getting shut of the whole damn lot, ok theres a couple who dont deserve it, lets call them collateral damage, just like they treat the general public.

re: Go away Moss
 

Re: Go away Moss
 

Every Autumn I see kids doing what we did at their age, collecting the fruit of those trees ready for 'the season'.

Which season? the one and only great conker season that's which season,

I don't know the age of these trees but they do belong to our and our children's history why should they be removed? The centre of Accrington has already been removed in stages, this is just another stage that shows no real thought, everyone that still uses our town centre has so far been able to navigate around and enjoy them, replace them with what?

Twiglets that will be vandalised? A giant redwood to cause controversy for a future generation?

Those trees ain't broken don't try to fix them.

Could it be?

They aren't evergreens and someone has worked out that cutting them down will save X amount of pounds sweeping up the leaves every Autumn?

If they were diseased yes remove them, as it is they are the only part of the centre not cocked up by interfering short term idiots.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Retlaw, you are right it isn't council money.
It is still money that could be used to better the town.
It might be that cutting down the trees is one of the conditions which they have to abide by to get the funding.
I don't know how long the trees have been there. I can't remember a time when they were not there.
They say that these trees stop an uninterrupted view of the market hall.
Personally I would prefer to see the trees.

Re: Go away Moss
 

To see the market hall all you have to do is walk nearer, I like the statues on top of it, though perhaps they should be removed because they block the view of the roof?

Re: Go away Moss
 

Now, c'mon Less...that is far too sensible a solution to be thought up by council members.
And for the part of the year when the trees are bare, they obscure nothing.

Re: Go away Moss
 

And dont let people that cant provide any evidence saying that the trees are damaging the buildings.....Thats the latest one!!!

Re: Go away Moss
 

So the Council have applied to the Planning Committee - isn't the Planning Committee run by the Council? The mind boggles at such a waste of time.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Yes, indeed. It is farcical.
But as mentioned in a previous post if you are asking yourself for permission, you are sure to get it. Success on a plate,nae bother.

What is dafter is that they will chop down two beautiful mature trees and replace these with striplings...at what cost.
They could leave the two horse chestnuts and save the money for the chopping down,the purchase and the planting of new trees...but it would not surprise me if(when it all comes out) that axing these trees is part of the T's and C's of getting the lottery funding.

We have a rake of shops around what will be the town square, that are empty...but they will waste money on street art(statues) and benches.
We had benches and the council removed them because the street drinkers were using them.
So rather than tackle the street drinkers, the council in its wisdom(?) removed the benches.
Does that make any sense at all?

Re: Go away Moss
 

I'm pleased to see you put a (?) after "wisdom" Margaret.

Re: Go away Moss
 

All those in authority that are involved in this Farce must be totally stupid and bereft of "ANY" common sense, imho.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Wasn't Ken Moss the clown who wanted to remove the cross from Accrington crematorium?
We all keep complaing about this buffoon but have we got we deserve? After all it's the people of Hyndburn who vote Moss into office.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Re: Go away Moss
 

Well on that basis Retlaw, if they got money to close and demolish Haworth Park, these clowns would accept it.:rolleyes:

Re: Go away Moss
 

Had to Russell, there seems to be nothing like any wisdom in our council...either that or they are hiding their light under a bushel.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Yes Retlaw I do fully appreciate that the money can only be used for this project. I was just making an aside.
I am sure that there must have been opportunities whereby the council could have made improvement(generally) to the town, but everything they do seems to be another nail in the coffin.
We have an absolutely abysmal market, with more vacant stalls than occupied ones. This gives the impression that the town is on the bones of its ar$e.
Maybe it no longer matters as the footfall is diverted down Union st.
I despair, and worse than that I actually hate going into town these days.
I still have to go into town to service Ma's needs, but if it were not for that I think I would give Accrington the flick.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Tree protection orders are also controlled by the council, however I have heard of council plans being thwarted before because someone got a TPA on a tree before the planning meeting.

Perhaps contact the appropriate dept at the council and see if one exists on it already.
Stupid idea overall really, looking at the pics where would the taxies drive that cannot read the existing no vehicles signs?

Re: Go away Moss
 

Ken Moss was the councillor who defended the council officers in the areas he is responsible for when they followed government guidelines and removed the cross. You won't find many councillors that will do that, I can think of a few that would have pushed all that blame onto officers doing their jobs correctly. Don't believe everything you read in the papers.

Re: Go away Moss
 

I can't see Haworth Park being the first park to close in Hyndburn because of the art gallery so doubt that will be a problem. It will be one of the parks that isn't tied into a large externally funded project with contracts stating it stay open or pay back the money that will close first.

Re: Go away Moss
 

The planning authority issue TPO's and they also give permission for work to be done on trees with TPO's including removing them so a TPO would only slow things down a bit. I would be very surprised if those trees met the criteria for TPO's

Re: Go away Moss
 

I cant, but that wasn't the point.:rolleyes:

Re: Go away Moss
 

Re: Go away Moss
 

Those people ( do you always have to be rude? ) who are responsible for lottery funding are just that, responsible for millions of pounds. It may look like they are making applicants jump through hoops but they have to ensure the money is used correctly and that the benefits achieved will match what the applicant says they will. It would be irresponsible of them to just give out the money without all the relevant checks in place.

Re: Go away Moss
 

So you reckon removing those trees in front of the Market Hall is using the money correctly Neil?

Re: Go away Moss
 

I can assure you I give as much credence to what is printed in newspapers as I do to anything you post on here.

From The Daily Torygraph:
Crematorium cross removed to avoid offending non-religious visitors - Telegraph
Councillor Ken Moss, who oversees Hyndburn cemeteries, said this reflected the increasing number of humanist and non-religious funerals held at the venue.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Yeh give Neil that much credence?:D

Re: Go away Moss
 

So it's better to spend it on something that's neither wanted or needed than lose it? Surely that's just spending for spending's sake,bit like the stupid bus lane in Clayton!
And if it isn't allowed to be spent on anything other than the proposed town square project how on earth would it find it's way to the people in France, a totally unrelated & needless comment about the migrant community which imo has no place in a discussion about Accrington town centre

Re: Go away Moss
 

Seem to remember that although it was a guideline, Mr Moss put through the removal of the cross?

Re: Go away Moss
 

I don't know much about the details of that project and have only seen plans online. I would like to be able to see the magnificent building without trees in the way though.

We need trees, lots of them and I've been involved in projects to plant trees but they need to be in appropriate places. Horse Chestnut trees are not appropriate for that location. The are too big and too close to the building.

The plans include the planting of new trees in different locations.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Like I said before don't believe everything you read.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Does that include the above?

Re: Go away Moss
 

It must be wanted by someone because a group came up with the plans to be submitted to the lottery.

The mind boggles on that one. I ignored it as a xenophobic comment but maybe it should have been deleted

Re: Go away Moss
 

I really don't see the point of removing two mature trees to replace them with less mature trees. As for being able to see the building, I think the trees add to the building rather than detract from it...and it isn't really such a beautiful building, it is a provincial market hall that has a bit of masonry decoration on it.
Trees soften the hard edges in towns and they are ever changing.
This tinkering around the edges of the town do nothing concrete to improve the place.
It is just throwing good money after bad....and it doesn't really matter that it isn't money from the council coffers...if it is just being spent because it is ther to be spent, but will not do anything ,other than a bit of top dressing, then it is pure folly.
That is just my opinion.(and I know it is worth very little)

Re: Go away Moss
 

maybe he just likes taking wood down

Re: Go away Moss
 

He will have a wood burner at home

Re: Go away Moss
 

Perhaps a certain person is looking for a good supply of fuel for his log burner?

Re: Go away Moss
 

I hadn't realised you were an expert on arboreal matters.

Re: Go away Moss
 

As usual the 'we know best brigade' know best, IF, there had been folk complaining about the trees those that know best would have moved heaven and earth to ensure the trees stay where they are, giving all sorts of reasons why they must remain.

Lets face it, nobody gets out of their cars to take a closer look at the Market Hall, clear away the trees and they have even less reason to get out of their cars, (o.k. we've glanced at the market hall now let's head for a town where we can do some shopping, no need to park up).

Re: Go away Moss
 

seems an expert on everything.:rolleyes:

Re: Go away Moss
 

Instead of moaning about this work that other people have given up their own time to make happen why not get involved with the decision making process yourselves?

As usual very few want to help until the end and then many pop out of the woodwork to say it's all been done wrong.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Why is it wrong to expect Councillors to have sense?

Re: Go away Moss
 

Neil, do you really think we could have any influence whatsoever?

I am in town most days on some errand or another and I never saw anything about this ill thought out development.
Yes, people have spent their time getting the funding and I know that this is a tortuous process, but who are these people who think this development is good value for money?
Do they really understand and appreciate the deep rooted problems of the town centre?
My feeling would be that they don't.
I can see no rhyme nor reason is spending 3million pounds of lottery money on something like this.
It would be far better spent elsewhere....just because we aren't actually paying for it out of our taxes doesn't mean it is a worthwhile project.
Some folk will have anything if they think they are getting it for nowt.
I have spent all of my working life serving my community and yes it is sometimes a thankless task, but to canvass the opinion of so few people and then to imply that the majority of folk in Accrington want this development is underhand.

There is absolutely no point in doing all this window dressing when the town has been allowed to deteriorate so badly.

When Ken Moss used to come on here he used to portray Accrington as a good place to visit, to do your shopping. He could not see the glaring problems because his rose tinted specs did not permit that view.

Accrington might not be the bumhole of the world, by by gum you can smell it from here...and all our councillors want to do is fiddle about making a useless town square.

The lights are on, but there's nobody at home with an ounce of an idea on how to rejuvenate the town.

These are just my opinions.As this is a public forum I think it is appropriate to air them here.
Not that anyone will take a jot of notice. They (the ones who have these hare brained ideas) do not want our thoughts or our opinions and even less our ideas. They want us to shut up and be grateful...that's not me!

Re: Go away Moss
 

It's not just councillors/officers making the decisions, you could have been involved as well

Re: Go away Moss
 

That is something i may well have took part in, but not being "Kreskin" knew sod all about it.:rolleyes:

Re: Go away Moss
 

Yes I do think local residents can have an influence or I wouldn't have been volunteering my time for almost 12 years. You have to be involved with the group to influence it's decision making process. Too many people are happy to let someone else do it all then complain afterwards they weren't consulted. Many people actively avoid being consulted and run a mile when they see someone with a clipboard asking questions.

One thing I find interesting about these sorts of things is that only those against actively speak out. Those that like the idea tend to say nothing and just wait for it to happen. Hyndburn has lost out on a few good projects because of a few complainers and a weak council at dealing with them.

Re: Go away Moss
 

I would like to know how?
And if it would make one jot of difference?
I have been in meetings where ludicrous proposals have been put forward. Those gathered would say nothing until they came out of the meeting and the lambast the proposals.
When asked why they hadn't said their piece in the meeting it was because they wanted to take the line of least resistance...they didn't want to 'rock the boat'. They would rather deal with being landed with something unfit for purpose than open their mouth and say something.

I wonder how much of this goes on in council business?
I think I am just saying what quite a lot of the residents are thinking, but if this is not the case, then I am sure they will come along and put me straight.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Neil,I know that you have done sterling work within the community for a long time.
Such work needs continuity and commitment...this is something I can no longer give(due to family commitments).
I think if people thought it was a good idea, something which would improve the town in a practical way, then we would be hearing more about it on here.
I do not recall any of this development being publicised...shouted about, so that people could get involved and give their views.

It is no good spending this sort of cash on something when the town needs other things to get it up off its knees.

The market could be promoted more. The empty stalls should be let out...at a loss if there are no takers. After all the empty stalls are generating zero revenue....so let them out for nothing. Make the market less like a ghost market, get some footfall. Get the bus companies to have drop off points in the centre of town to bring folk nearer the market.
There are things that could be done, but clearly they aren't and with every dismal market day that passes people stop coming, because there is NOTHING to come for.
A town square, no matter how delightful,will not do it.
Get someone who is really interested in getting the town up on its feet...not the artsy fartsy consultants who couldn't give a flying fig about the town as long as they get the nice fat consultancy fee for the sweet drawings of how the town might look.

Re: Go away Moss
 

I also have been to many meetings when younger and have spent most of my working life helping people at work also. also what Margaret P has just stated is perfectly correct in my experience, also i am at the stage of life where in the main i have better things to do, But i certainly refuse to shut me gob, to humour you Neil. if i agree with summat like yer tree in the park i will say so and i did, these trees i disagree strongly i will also say so, its called my opinion,:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Re: Go away Moss
 

Cashy I would love to be able to devote my time to something like this. It would be a cakewalk rather than dealing with what I have on my plate right now.
That said, I believe that these decisions are arrived at regardless of the opinions of local folk.
It will be rubber stamped and we will get it whether we like it or not.
The suggestion that the trees spoil the view of the market hall is too daft to laugh at.
Who goes to LOOK at a market hall.
Well, pretty soon no one will bother to come to Accrington for anything...and the shiny bus station will just ferry folk away.

Re: Go away Moss
 

If someone goes to a meeting and does not say they disagree with something and vote against it then by default they agree with it.

A lot of it will depend on who is making the application. I've withdrawn a successfully secured funding application loosing the Council almost £50,000 because we could not come to an agreement with the council over a lease.

Re: Go away Moss
 

The problem is what does the town need that will cause improvements.

I don't agree with letting them free when other traders have to pay. The council are struggling for money and cutting services everywhere. Maybe it's time to let the outside market close and concentrate on the indoor market.

I don't believe £3 million is just doing a town square, that is part of the project but is the only part getting attention due to a few trees. Consultants take their direction from those commissioning them to do the job, they don't just dream up the ideas themselves

Re: Go away Moss
 

Neil, the market is dire. Many stalls are empty. This means that the stalls that are being used are paying over the odds because folk don't come...so those who are occupying stalls get less footfall. There is certainly no longer any 'passing' trade.
It might not seem fair to have some stalls occupied by non payers, but at least it would generate some interest,by that token it would generate more trade for the current traders.

Whatever the cost of the town square, it will not create the environment to bring people into town...so if it was only costing half of that price it still would not be worth it.

As for the question of what does the town need to create improvement?
Well, it needs something that will bring people into town...whether that be for a shopping experience or something else. It appears that there is very little appetite to do anything other than this window dressing...a bit like putting pictures on the glass fronts of empty shops to make it look like they aren't empty...it is a futile exercise.
One which we will pay for in the long run.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Oh yes, and I know how consultancy things work...but if those who are commissioning a project don't know their arm from an elephant( I have cleaned that up...but you get the gist) then there really isn't much hope.
I don't believe those who commissioned this project have a clue what the town needs.

Re: Go away Moss
 

I would imagine quite a bit of the money will go on statuary. After all bronze sculptures are not cheap... This is like putting fairy lights up when you have no glass in the windows...like I said artsy fartsy.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Re: Go away Moss
 

Maybe you should have a look round Bury Market. That seems to be doing well to say that it is in close proximity to Manchester...and it always seems to have plenty of folk trotting round...not many empty stalls either.
The things you mention could be helped by a reduction in the rental costs. This would make it viable for traders and interesting for the shopper too.
Yes shopping habits have changed a lot but people will still come if you make it worthwhile.
And making it worthwhile means having stalls that are full of traders...something to look at.
Otherwise they could have knocked it down and made the whole thing into car parking.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Looking at those artists views I wonder where the police cars are going to be parked? What about the other vehicles that are generally parked alongside the market?

Like the current status, there will be no enforcement of the no vehicle zone, making the whole thing a pointless laying down of bricks.

As for changing things, yes if you join the groups that make these decisions then you get a better say in them.

BTW it appears that the market hall itself is a listed building, so making a change to it (and features within its curtilage that can affect it's look) require planning permission.

The whole thing may well be a storm in a teacup and never happen.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Quite true Margaret, a relative who lives in Doncaster goes to Bury Market on a coach trip a couple of times a year.
The Town Square may encourage local people to come and have a look, but with the few market stalls it is unlikely they would bother coming a second time.
As for free stalls - I don't agree with that, but reduce the cost substantially to all stallholders for a period. Better to have a little income rather than none.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Yes Barrie, you are right about better having a little income than none, but currently at my last visit there were more vacant stalls than occupied ones. How can this be good business.
If an asset is generating no revenue then it ceases to be an asset and become a liability.
The council should endeavour to have every stall filled, but I really don't think the market is a priority.
Nor do I really know what the council considers a priority. There appears to be very little being done to regenerate the town.

Re: Go away Moss
 

There is plenty being done to regenerate our town, it just so happens it isn't working!

A brand new bus station, free parking where busses used to roam, surely adding a new vista to the Market hall that no-one any longer uses (because it's been interfered with) is just another dream come true?

Lets not mention the fact that modern folk don't need to pee (At least there's a chance of getting the benches back).

Yes, Neil I know, I shouldn't believe what I've read, I've just read this and don't believe it!

P.S. If Mr. Moss didn't remove the cross why did he take the blame for that particular cock up? Come on Neil, you seem to be in the know, you hinted earlier, now come clean, unless of course Your time as a 'volunteer' has meant you share secrets with those that know better...


...can't share because ordinary folk can't cope with them?

Re: Go away Moss
 

Trees certainly create a lot of discussion in Hyndburn. Plant a few on the 'The Coppice' and there's uproar, remove the odd one from a local park and one or two from outside the market hall and uproar again. I'm on the side of the trees.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Sorry Less, again you are right. I'm not sorry you are right, just sorry that I mislead folk...into thinking that nothing was being done. What I meant was what you said. I just didn't make myself as clear as you did.
I despair of the way the place is going. I really do not like the place anymore, if I were younger I would up sticks and leave.

Re: Go away Moss
 

They are trying to make improvements to the town centre but when it comes down to it the majority of people don't want to shop in Accrington or it would be busy. It's declined because not enough people use it and it will keep declining until there is nothing left. People want to use Lidl, Tesco, Asda, Aldi, Iceland, etc and do all their shopping in one place and either put it in the car or get a taxi home. Online shopping is massive now and is as much to blame as supermarkets, maybe more so

Re: Go away Moss
 

Complete bull, the town centre has declined in the main,simply because our so called leaders have ruined it.:rolleyes: everyones aware online shopping is massive they are aware of that fact in Bury and other places as well.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Who is or are this 'they'? You claim it's not the council but a group of anonymous volunteers that have put forward this plan?
Who or how were 'they' recruited and by whom? Why does no-one else seem to know about this all important 'they'?

Earlier on in the year there was a slightly larger public consultation in which 30 million were consulted it was the Brexit referendum to leave it resulted in a majority and yet many folk are dissatisfied with this result and complain, they have a right to complain.
The above 'public consultation' seems to have polled around 60 people out of a population of 80,734 (Census 2011), yet you say we shouldn't complain?
Hardly seems a democratic attitude does it?
Had there been more public consultation and at an earlier stage a more positive attitude might have resulted?

Re: Go away Moss
 

If you do not want the tree to be removed, setup a petition and get lots of people to say so too, then the planners idea of what the council determines as the people of Accrington are happy for its removal can be changed.

Re: Go away Moss
 

Had more people been aware and consulted maybe we would have had something which would serve the community better.

Neil, a lot of your points about the change in shopping habits are true, but there are still a lot of folk who cannot for one reason or another do their shopping online, do not have transport to go to the huge supermarkets(which tend to be away from the centre of town anyway)and they are not usually well served by public transport...and if they were who wants to be laoded like a pack horse and trying to get home on the bus?

Other towns even small ones(think Ramsbottom, Hebden Bridge) seem to have a good footfall of shoppers.

Our council representatives over decades(so not just the current crew) have allowed the town centre to decline. I may be wrong,(and I am sure someone will enlighten me) but there seems to have been no appetite to make Accrington into somewhere worth coming, for a very long time.
Look at the money spent resurfacing Broadway. Have you seen it lately? It is an eyesore with bald patches all over the place.
If the council spent the public money as they would their own(with and eye to quality and value) then maybe things would be better.

It seems to me all this 'improvement' is 'top show', when what is actually required is an overhaul of the whole place.
Accrington is a dismal place to come to and I never thought I would be saying that.
This new project will not alter that in any meaningful way.(and will deprive the community of two mature trees)

Re: Go away Moss
 

Wasting yer breath we are, trying to explain the truth to Neil.:rolleyes:

Re: Go away Moss
 

Cashy, truth comes in a variety of coats and depends very much on where you are viewing it from.
The sad fact is that you and I, and people of our generation, can remember when the town was a proud place. A place that was worth coming to. It is never going to be that again.
It has been devalued over the years by people who couldn't have cared less about the future, they only concerned themselves with the present and their reputation.

Re: Go away Moss
 

As opposed to believing the words of a politician who cuts and runs from this forum, (of which you are the self styled 'super' moderator), when proved incorrect or simply cannot answer questions from the voting public regarding the removal of benches...


And this is why I have no faith in amateur 'do-gooders' who propose cutting down trees or building moronic panopticons on the coppice..the kind of person who posts absolute garbage like this :-

Totally ignoring the fact that :-

a) we had a massive free, easy to navigate car park, that was replaced with the brick monstrosity called the arndale

b) we had a bustling undercover outdoor market with plenty of space for extra pitches, that was replaced by a few stalls in a wind tunnel offering uneven paving complete with deep puddles and dripping awnings, topped off with a red brick monstrosity glorified £1 shop

c) we had a market hall filled with character and characters replaced with an open plan abortion that Blackburn market tried 30 years ago and has since knocked down

d) we once had some benches that us old fogies could catch a breather on (of course that was nothing to do with your in the know mate was it..*sigh*)

e) we used to have buses that dropped us off at the actual market as opposed to the local McDonalds drive through and is probably geographically closer to 4 possibly all 5 of the supermarkets that you quote than it is to the actual market that you think should be totally destroyed!

Please stop volunteering to help Accrington....you really are crap at it!

Re: Go away Moss
 

Oh Guinness! Are you inside my head?
That is soooooo what I have been thinking and you have put it into words very eloquently...probably far better than I ever could.
Nail, head, direct thundering hit!

Re: Go away Moss
 

When I was a teen, I worked on the periphery of the market, in Slingers Cooked meat shop.
Each market day we( the three workers in the shop) would have a competition at guessing from accent where folk came from.
They came from all the close local towns and I could recognise the difference between those from Balckburn, Darwen, Butnley, Bolton, Preston....yes folk actually came from those places to shop on Accrington Market and in our shops.
Yes...I do know that we live in different time, with different shopping habits but this only affects poor markets, poor shopping centres. The ones that make the effort to deliver what the customer wants(good products, pleasant surroundings, personal service etc) are still busy.

The decline of the town is down to wanton disregard of what the town needs.
The personalities and inter party fighting within the council, with the desire to score petty political points, is what brought about these dire consequences.
The people who are implicated,know who they are and should be hanging their heads in shame.

Re: Go away Moss
 

I tell you what, I will withdraw all criticism of this scheme (including the trees),
IF this anonymous body can change their plans and instead of commemorating some dumb mutt, actually put forward a plan to remember what was important, the men that died to enable us to freely come up with such stupid ideas.

Re: Go away Moss
 

According to Retlaw the dog had nothing to do with the PALS, it was a stray that probably thought it wonderful that so many men were taking it for a walk. Whoever proposed a statue to a dog should have done a modicum of research into the history of the PALS and then they would not have come up with such an idiotic idea.