Where are all the people
 

Parked on Arndale car park this morning and walked via Broadway to Market Hall and back. We saw very few people and was able to park where we wanted on the car park. Not quite tumbleweed blowing on Broadway but not far off.
It is such a shame that Accrington has been allowed to sink to this level.
Mark

Re: Where are all the people
 

By the sound of the above, it isn't often you come into Accy or it wouldn't be such a shock, been going downhill for years perhaps it's our own fault for not using it regularly? Or maybe too much council interference killed the golden goose that looked after the thriving centre of the past?

Re: Where are all the people
 

You are right we don't go into Accy a lot probably because there is so little to go for. It just seemed worse today.
Did people stop going as the town was so different to the past, or did the changes happen because people stopped going? The arndale seems to have little purpose now, we go to Oddies but very little else. Occasionally call in the museum. Once Woolworths went and then quite a bit later M and S, the town no longer had a main shopping area.
Can it be revived? I would hope so but not sure.
Mark

Re: Where are all the people
 

Mark, I think the time for rejuvenating Accrington is long gone.
The town has been allowed to slide down the slippery slope of previously individual Industrial towns.
Some of the blame can be laid at the door of successive councils in their apathetic(or maybe that should be pathetic) attempts at turning around the rot.
The latest one was the chopping down of two beautiful mature chestnut trees in order to make a town square(these were said to be diseased, but looked healthy enough)...and one which cost the taxpayers of this borugh 1.5 million quid...not that the square cost that..it cost 3 million, but the rest was coughed up by the Heritage Trust Fund.

It is a wasteland of paving stones punctuated by a few Duckboard seats...said to represent the towns First World war heritage( the cynical old baggage in me thinks it was designated thus so that we, the people of the town would feel bad if we said anything against it).

Moving the Bus Station has been the death to the market...but it still says on the planters 'Floral Market Town'

Today was probably busier than other days if you went round the market..it seems the flea market attracts more folk than the real market...that might have something to do with the number and variety of stalls.

So tell me why can't the council put two and two together and make four...if variety and number of stalls equals a better footfall then why can't measures be put in place that would ensure market days were the same? A good footfall to the market usually will benefit other retailers too.
You tell me...because I don't know.

Some of the blame has to go to the folk who go out of town to shop to the retail parks..but even they are having a toughish time of it...or shop on the internet for convenience...but other towns manage to have a vibrant centre....markets that are well patronised(bury for instance)...close proxomity to Manchester should be a drawback, but it clearly isn't.

The Arndale is one of the most depressing places to visit(I usually hurry through it...there is little to make me stop and look around
The swish new bus station doesn't bring people in...it takes them away from what is a dire place to visit.

Accrington has absolutely nothing noteworthy to bring people into town.
I can't see that changing anytime soon.

Re: Where are all the people
 

One council( in the not so dim and distant past) spent a quarter of a million pounds on resurfacing Broadway with a few millimetres of resin surface.
This surface attracted dirt and chewing gum...it broke up leaving bald patches, the company who laid it were brought back to make good, but the finish is poor quality and has broken up still further and looks very shabby.
This is a main thoroughfare....and one which you have to cross if you come into town on the bus.
It adds to the raggedy, 'down at heel' look of the town.

It would have been far better to move the market onto Broadway and use the current market space as a bus station.
People would get off their bus in Peel street.....go into the market hall - possibly spend money in there....then go to the market on Broadway and maybe even to the Arndale.

The rental price of market stalls should be cut to the bone...far better economic sense to have a stall selling something and bringing in some revenue, than empty and deterring people from coming to the market.

It is just basic common sense, but then common sense is not that common.

Re: Where are all the people
 

I REALLY, REALLY should listen to cashy.
He is always telling me that you cannot put sense where there is none

Re: Where are all the people
 

Theres only one thing wrong with Accrington, has been for years, "The COUNCIL" couple of decent shops on warner st these days little else.

Re: Where are all the people
 

Some years ago I returned to Accrington for a family funeral. I was shocked but not surprised at the dilapidated state of the retail shops in this once thriving market town.
The root cause was bloody obvious in that all the arteries into the town had been cut, constricted, redirected or generally screwed up. A town that could once be approached from all points of the compass had been cut off. Now you could only sneak up into it by circuitous route then wander around to find the least convenient parking space to access the place you really wanted to visit.
I hate to say it but you could see it coming. I put pen to paper and wrote to the Observer to give them my forecast of the dim future along with a "Cunning Plan" to restore the town arteries and invigorate the retail operations. I know what works and have seen successful implementations on five continents. It all hinges on accessibility and traffic. People who shop for essentials will spend considerable amounts on non essentials if they are marketed in the correct manner and are part of a vibrant pleasant shopping experience.
Sadly that no longer sounds like Accrington either now or ever again.
What a waste.
-Joe

Re: Where are all the people
 

hey joe thats correct, thing that happens these days though is if anyone says anything, people jump and say your running the town down, instead of accepting whats happened to our town, to me its as if they are brainwashed.

Re: Where are all the people
 

That is exactly what they are.
Few people these days want to think for themselves.
They are happy to be spoonfed media pap...they swallow it without a second thought.
That is a very sad fact of life

Re: Where are all the people
 

being an out of towner with no agenda regarding the town centre all i can say is that my visits there get rarer and rarer as the years go on and its straight up to the wham for the match and straight home again. might stop off in colne if we need something on my way back. think those last few words tell it all.

Re: Where are all the people
 

Amazon - online shopping replacing the trip to the shops are there any big superstores around there?

Re: Where are all the people
 

That's happening all round the country now - and more noticeable in small place like Accy not to mention people ordering food shopping on line etc

Re: Where are all the people
 

The changes I have seen on the odd visit (weddings/funerals)remind me that Accrington is going down the gurgler. I prefer to stay away and remember Accy as it was in the 50/60s. If you blame the council, think, who voted them into power? Sadly most cities and towns are going the same way.

Re: Where are all the people
 

I dont honestly think its anything to do with who voted em in Frank, Both Labour and Torys have been in, none of em really have been anything to write home about, as for the market hall and outside market its always been balloons running it, it was in mid 60s when i worked on it. and nothings changed no matter who is running the show.

Re: Where are all the people
 

The current outside Market ...Peel St side is going to be knocked down.
The council have already sold the land that it stands on.
Stalls using this side of the market will be re-located inside the Market Hall.
There was no consultation, the stall holders were not given any alternative options.....it was a take it or leave it deal.

The council have no interest in maintaining a Market......and the demise of the town can be laid at the door of local politicians, both past and present.

Nothing to come into town for....is there?

Re: Where are all the people
 

Thats normal for this lot !! NO Consulting, pathetic but there you go. By the way Margaret how did you find out? no-one i know at this point was aware.

Re: Where are all the people
 

Greg Who has the cooked meat stall on the outside market is a friend of ours and he was telling us.

the stall was full of customers at the time so it is not a secret...it just has not been reported in the local paers(no surprise there as neither paper is really local anymore).

Greg sais he would not go into the inside market, but he has no option..it is that or shut...and he has a lot of regulars to serve.
I think that come the day he retires, that will be it.

Re: Where are all the people
 

There is absolutely nothing being done to keep the town centre going.

There is a Town Square...and we paid 1.5 million quid for it(OK...so the same amount was put in by the Heritage Trust Fund) this does not seem good value for OUR money.......and the tumbleweed blows across it.
Oh sorry...there was some sort of Chocolate Festival on Saturday...like that will bring people in.

Re: Where are all the people
 

The old market stalls used to be a small business incubator. Get an idea, give it a shot, try out a stall, in some cases a share of a stall. If it takes off you are in Fat City. I can think of half a dozen examples of people who started that way and went on to thriving success. The market represented a chance without expensive commitment to long term leases.
Sad end to a "Market Town".
-MoreJoe

Re: Where are all the people
 

Have you any idea what the land will be used for Margaret?
What about the bric a brac and odds and sods dealers who use the outside market?
Seems strange that someone would want to buy a small strip of land between the market and a free car park.
Methinks someone wants to enlarge the parking and put meters up.

Re: Where are all the people
 

No Gremlin....I am not aware of who has bought this strip of land...or what they intend for it, but I suspect you are right.
As for the Flea Market....which is always busier than the regular market.....don't know how that will be accommodated...matbe in the underused Town Square.

I think that the failure of the market has been calculated.
(Many of the inside Market stalls have gone because they are uneconomic to run.....this will drive current traders indoors ??at a higher cost...and it won't be long before that is empty too)
Had the council wanted to make a go of the Market, then it would reduce the cost of the stalls.
It makes sense to me to have stall filled at a lower cost, than empty and making nothing.
Not only that a thriving market brings people from other towns...but it seems that is not what was wanted in this instance.

Moving the Bus station to Union St was the root cause of this lower use of the market...it was predictable...but of course the council did not want to see it.

Re: Where are all the people
 

or perhaps they were too thick?

Re: Where are all the people
 

No, Cashy, I really think they knew what they were doing and were playing the long game.
After all, the land the outside market stands on in Peel St is already sold.....and none of us knew of these plans.....and I still have not seen anything reported.

Re: Where are all the people
 

There's a good article in yesterday's Accrington Observer (Lancs Life):

https://www.lancs.live/news/lancashi...ngton-17022169

It would seem that the council have recognised the problems involved.

Cheers

Re: Where are all the people
 

This far too little and far too late.
They do not say what provisions will be made for the very successful Flea Market.

The Thursday Flea Market has far more occupied stalls, is busier and the footfall is higher because people WANT to see what is on offer.
Why can't the powers that be,see that occupied stalls(even at a cut price to the vendors) is good for the town?

The general Market has been neglected for far too long.....not enough attention has been paid to keeping the market going.....encouraging sellers, offering deals to sellers.

The inside Market too has not been used to its full potential.
It is not rocket science to be able to see that occupied stalls generate, not just money, but interest too.

A large open space is just that.....and no-one will come to see a large empty town square.
To be successful the Town Square needs to be used....and used for something that is interesting.....something that will bring people into town.....but if they come there needs to be something for them to spend both their time and money on....like a vibrant Market....not a car park.

Re: Where are all the people
 

And it looks like Gremlin was right.....it has been sold off to be a car park....like there are not enough parking spaces in town.
We are one of the few towns that have free car parking....and still it does not bring in trade.Why might that be then?

Might it have something to do with the dire experience that shopping in Accrington is?

It is alright to look at Altrincham for inspiration, but I am not sure their model would work here.
Something said by Cameron Smith the market manager rings some alarm bells....he mentions 'chancers' and those who just want rent free access to a stall for four weeks.

He should really be encouraging chancers....and maybe the four weeks rent free should be changed to a low flat fee for a short period of time.

If we could see more stalls occupied then a trip into town might be worthwhile.

But then it is all academic as the plans are already made....

The council really do not want a market...they just want to fill the inside market because they do not wish to be left with a grade II listed building that is bringing in no revenue and costing lots to maintain.....and that is the crux of this matter.

Re: Where are all the people
 

if you put cameron smiths brain in a budgie it would fly backwards, how that clown has got the job defies belief,

Re: Where are all the people
 

Well, it is time they got someone who is up to the task....well, that is if they are serious about solving the issues.