Legal or not?
 

Hi All,
My son works for one of the big supermarket chains and has done for 3 years or so now. He enjoys it but this year has not been able to take all the holiday due to him. After trying to book some days off in October his line manager stalled and stalled until in late Jani=uary he was told that the budget for holidays has been spent and there's no way he can
1. have his days off before the holiday year ends
2. be paid for the days he can't take
3. carry his holidays forward to next year (April-April)

This strikes me as somewhat odd and although he does not want to make a fuss, I suspect that his immediate superior is pulling a fast one and keeping department costs under budget at the expense of his younger, less worldly -wise staff.

Your thoughts and comments are welcome (especially if you've got a bit of employment law under you belt). I'd like to know a bit more about his rights before i contact the regional HR dudes...

Re: Legal or not?
 

Is he full time?
The minimum legal holiday entitlement is now 5 weeks. Has he had his 5 weeks off? If not I would be reminding his manager of the 5 week minimum. He could also ask to speak with someone in Human Resources or whatever his company call it.

Is he in the union? (If not why not?) Speak with the union rep about it.

Re: Legal or not?
 

As far as I know.

It is upto your employer when you are allowed to take your holidays.
However you must have the legal minimum of now 28 days (20 days + bank holidays).

As far as I know As long as he has the entitlement, then if it is entirely his employers fault for not allowing him to take them when requested then they must ensure that he takes them at the end of the years holiday period.

See
Holiday entitlements: the basics : Directgov - Employment

your rights: Does my employer have to let me carry forward my unused annual leave into the next holiday year? - from workSMART.org.uk

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employme...ys/DG_10034711

By the way, how many letters in his employers company name?

Re: Legal or not?
 

You first link says the minimum is 5.6 weeks for someone working 5 days a week.

Last time I looked it was 5 weeks.

So you legal entitlement is the number of days a week you work multiplied by 5.6

Re: Legal or not?
 

Holidays and holiday pay

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/...oliday_pay.pdf

Re: Legal or not?
 

Look again, things have changed. :D I doubt a government website would be wrong, our government does not get things wrong does it :D

Re: Legal or not?
 

I take it he works for Morrison's then ? I work for Booths as an artic driver . I have tried to get days off during the year , but no chance ! The manager will tell him to take the days off that he decides .
They will make sure he will get the proper entitlement they have too ! It may get carried through to april , but he will have to take them in april !

I have a few days left to take between now and the end of march . I have been at this company for 15 years now . They just cannot have too many staff off at once ! I know i will get my holidays in !

Re: Legal or not?
 

Thanks folks
Neill-he is part time (16 hours per week) but gets the equivalent of 5 weeks holiday. No he isn't in a union (USDAW always seemd pretty useless to me when I was in retailing)
Matty: thanks for the links I will check them out. His employer is JavaScript.
He is, as I said unwilling to kick up a fuss (way too laid back) but I thibk that it would be a valuable life skill and profitable exercise for him to stand up for himself* in this case.

*With a little help from his dad and you lot

Re: Legal or not?
 

I do hope he does.

It is not really kicking up a fuss. Just getting what he is entitled to. Get him to ask his manager or a copy of the company grievance procedure. His grievance is obviously with the manager who says he cant have his holidays. That will worry him as the grievance will have to be delt with by his managers manager.

Re: Legal or not?
 

Too be honest , he has had all year to book them . Now we have to take them off between certain months . I E 2 week between april/august then 2 weeks between august/november then 1 week between november /march the end of .

Re: Legal or not?
 

The first post says the manager was stalling him taking them since October. That is half way through the holiday period for him.

Re: Legal or not?
 

I get that very often

Re: Legal or not?
 

The trouble is he did request them, was fobbed off, then told January was blacked out for holidays then told no more hols this year (ie from Feb-April). I suspect some folk took their entitlement then ceased their employment...

Re: Legal or not?
 

I can only take of time when I can be covered by others as we have a minimum staffing level on each shift.

Being fobbed off for 6 months and then told tuff is not fair though.

Re: Legal or not?
 

That is why you work a week or whatever in hand. So when you leave they can correct your final pay depending who owes who holidays.

Re: Legal or not?
 

Alot of people i know , try and save their holidays , to when its nice and icy outside so they can lie in bed and stay there . Personally , I would wait to April before you even think about taking action !
If he is fobbed off , they will have to pay him in cash then ?

Re: Legal or not?
 

He is a picker at morrisons Neil ! Am i right Eggs&chips ?

Re: Legal or not?
 

Fraid not dave he is on the tills at JavaScript

Re: Legal or not?
 

Is this a test of your psychic powers? :rolleyes::D

Re: Legal or not?
 

Oh well close hehe

Re: Legal or not?
 

I did try ??


Well tell the lad to get onto his superviser that he is owed these holidays and he wants them !

Failing that , tell him to go to doctors and say his back is hurting and get a month off instead !

Re: Legal or not?
 

What's in his contract ? failing that speak to citizens advice legal I assume they have something in that direction.

Re: Legal or not?
 

If eggs&chips takes action now , he will lose his job ! belive me ? they don't want any bad Karma off anyone .

Re: Legal or not?
 

There is a very large warehouse at Leeds that Morrisons owns , worth a try ?

Re: Legal or not?
 

from someone who works part time .. we are allowed to carry one week forward .. every year .. if we have 2 weeks holiday left we are only allowed to carry forward one week .. the other week is lost we dont get paid for it, its our fault we havent took it. Also we arent allowed to have 2 of the same department off at one time ..

Re: Legal or not?
 

i worked for a company that used to let you use holiday entitlement to cover sickness so if you know the boss is an arsehole and the company allows taking holiday entitlement to cover sick periods simply ring in sick and take the sick as holiday entitlement :)

retail is a bitch to work in you usually find the managers follow their own rules they make up in their head and crap themselves when a greivance procedure is started .

only problem is once you stand up for yourself they usually find another way to get rid of you for somone more compliant :rolleyes:

Re: Legal or not?
 

You are right Accyman. It's probably not hard to find a way to get rid of a part time teen who is about to go to uni anyway, and it will be extremely easy to not find that person any holiday work when he is back here.

Re: Legal or not?
 

I would put my holiday request in writing and if refused I would ask for the reason to be given in writing.
Keep copies of all correspondence.

Re: Legal or not?
 

Regarding holidays they cannot discriminate between part-time employees so you will be entitled to the same statutory holiday entitlements as a full time employee, pro rata. Its your right to take them and not your problem if they are unable to cover. Telephone Acas if your not in a union.

Re: Legal or not?
 

Hope he has a contract, if he not it still would apply due to the fact he has been employed for 3yrs, under implied terms and conditions of all other employees.

Re: Legal or not?
 

The pen truly is mightier than the sword.

I learned very quickly that when you are 17 there are any number of unscrupulous managers (more often than not deputy managers) who will screw you over at the first opportunity. I was duped over my hourly rate, my holiday entitlement and eventually what we used to call 'time owing' where you worked extra for hours off rather than overtime.

Two little words in a letter usually got the ball moving very quickly indeed and I was only ever part-time at this company for seven years: Head Office.

It took me almost a year to start fighting back through that stupid English trait of not kicking up a fuss. If he's going to university I suspect he'll be erudite enough to string a decent letter together. No need to be abusive but state your case in a letter and copy it to the General Manager with the threat of a copy to Head Office.

If that doesn't work I'll be extremely surprised. Most of the deputy managers and supervisors I ever worked for had less backbone than something in a tide pool. I'm self-employed now and don't have to answer to anyone like that ever again - damned hard work but immensely satisfying.

Re: Legal or not?
 

My other half works for William Hill and I reckon they recently pulled a fast one with holidays.. they have a new contract were all bank holidays like Christmas day. new years day ect are not extra holidays but incorperated in to the 25 days for the year.
in sort she has to book Christmas and New year day, Easter as a holiday even though bookies are not open

Re: Legal or not?
 

From the directgov website linked above Holiday entitlements: the basics : Directgov - Employment

The basics of holiday rights
There is a minimum right to paid holiday, but your employer may offer more than this. The main things you should know about holiday rights are that:

you are entitled to a minimum of 5.6 weeks paid annual leave (28 days for someone working five days a week)
part-time workers are entitled to the same level of holiday pro rata (so 5.6 times your usual working week, eg 22.4 days for someone working four days a week)

you start building up holiday as soon as you start work
your employer can control when you take your holiday
you get paid your normal pay for your holiday
when you finish a job, you get paid for any holiday you have not taken
bank and public holidays can be included in your minimum entitlement
you continue to be entitled to your holiday leave throughout your ordinary and additional maternity leave and paternity and adoption leave


So first thing is yes they can include Stat holidays. Does she work 5 days a week? If so she should be on 28 days not 25.

Re: Legal or not?
 

does anyone remeber when sunday was classed as overtime before teh government screwed us over with sunday trading :rolleyes: