Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Your thoughts please.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Sure - but the title is wrong, should it not read Managers and Players who should go and who should stay!

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

branch , whalley , carden , miles , roberts ( coleman messed his head up ) and evil should all go . think Kenny A will go as well by his own choice . bring kemps back , and try to get godwin here .

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

For me who should go are :- John Miles, Lee McEvilly, Paul Carden, Graham Branch, Shaun Whalley, Sean Webb, Ian Dunbavin, Leighton McGivern, Robbie Williams. ( I can hear the booing from here!!!:do-one:)

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Players who will go though will be :- John Miles, Lee McEvilly, Paul Carden, Sean Webb, Leighton McGivern, Graham Branch, David Brown, Mark Roberts, David Mannix, Mark King

I also think other players will either move on or be bought :- Phil Edwards (bought) Kenny Arthur (uncontracted, move up) Ian Dunbavin or Martin Fearon (to cut the wages), Jay Harris (move up)

I think some will be offered contracts out of loyalty (Rocky) and at least one will stay that isn't really good enough (Shaun Whalley)

When you look at what that leaves us you get :- Paul Mullin, Peter Cavanagh, Leam Richardson, Ian Craney, Andy Procter, Bobby Grant, Peter Murphy, Jay Bell, Chris Turner, Andrew Smith

Five senior players and five rookies, how inspiring!!!:(

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Have a horrible feeling Evil might be around for a bit longer yet. (1) We're short of strikers and (2) As he's been out on loan twice I would have thought if the management wanted him out permanently, he'd have gone by now. Suspect sending him on loan might have been to get him football and to get people off his back.

Don't think Sparkie will be too far off with those predictions. Rough on some who might feel they haven't had a fair crack of the whip. On the bright side: that side will need an entirely new back 5, pretty much. King Arthur apart, this year's hasn't exactly covered itself in glory, has it?

A lot of clubs in Leagues 1 and 2 are starting their clear-outs already. I hope budgets have been agreed so that we aren't left behind in recruitment (having seen the Barnet goals, someone who could head a ball in our own box would be nice).

Wonder whether we'll re-sign any more old boys next season?

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

I live in the deep south, so I do not see enough , that is why I am seeking " properly informed opinion".

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

As I recall he was signed on a one year contract with Stanley having a window of opportunity to make it two.

The fact he has spent so much of the season on loan suggests to me that Stanley would not be thinking of exercising that option.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

The players that should stay, for me, are:

Kenny Arthur (best keeper we've ever had)
Ian Dunbavin (capable back up)
Peter Cavanagh (captain marvel)
Phil Edwards (solid defender, finally hit the form he deserves)
Robbie Williams (controversial I know, but personally I think he has the ability)
Leam Richardson (very solid, very consistent, versatile player)
Andy Procter (as long as he keeps improving. he's a tireless midfielder with more guts than Rambo)
David Mannix (good techincal football brain - needs to improve consistency and work rate though. needs umph.)
Ian Craney (not his biggest fan personally but he has the abilty to be superb if he's played in central midfield. needs to improve attitude)
Jay Harris (one of only two defensive midfielders, tireless and solid. Needs to improve temper and consistency though)
Bobby Grant (probably our best winger)
Shaun Whalley (can be a very good striker for us, I think he's lost on the wing)
Paul Mullin (no reason needed)
Jay Bell, Peter Murphy & Chris Turner should stay as they look good for cover & depth.

However, we'll probably lose Kenny because he's too good :(

Players that should leave:

John Miles (useless)
Graham Branch (useless)
Lee McEvilly (even more useless)
Sean Webb (too slow)
Leighton McGivern (not had his chance, and not going to get it. would be best for him to move to a conf. club)
Andy Todd (I think his last season with us was his peak, think we could get a quicker winger to replace him)
Mark Roberts (lost his bottle after fall out incident, not going to play at his best for us again - not his fault though)
Paul Carden (not really our player anymore anyway)
David Brown (don't believe that he can play at his best in our team, intelligence doesn't sit well with Coleman it seems.
Mark King (manager clash - no chance to get back in squad)

Should bring in:

Darran Kempson
A quick right winger with league pedigree that can cross.
An out and out striker.
A decent goalie should be lose Kenny.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Whilst I cannot agree with you on some of the issues above, one thing that I would like to say is that of the players you have as leaving - particularly those who have clashed with the management, I would say, get in some new management (old record I know, but I believe Coley and JB have taken us as far as we can go. I am also aware that yes we have had some brilliant times in the past, but you cannot live in the past. and if anyone asks about who to come in, what about Gary Peters as another hat in the ring). I do agree about Darren Kempson though and I would prefer players with ability and height to come in because we cannot win against a big team.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

While I was typing out how many players had confrontation with Coley, I was considering your point. However for me it comes down to collateral damage. Ok, on one hand we'll lose the fringe players who have had argy bargies with the gaffer... but which one of those will really be a big loss? Mark Roberts wasn't consistent enough in my opinion, and a bit too slow - even before the fall out. Mark King had a few tricks up his sleeve but is behind in the pecking order anyway after Leam at left back and Bobby and Shaun at left wing. David Brown, though a player who I admired in some games, just isn't consistently solid as a midfielder and doesn't score enough as a striker.
On the other hand, look at the amount of players we'll be likely to lose if Coleman leaves: Craney, Cav, Phil, Whalley, Grant, Harris & Rocky. Now, on top of that we'd be left clutching at straws/scraping the barrel for a manager to replace Coley.

No brainer for me.

As I've said before, Coley does have to get rid of his attribute that makes his personal problems with players affect squad selection. His tactics need help also, and if Asa signs full time he should get that help. But I do believe he has the ability to take this club forward.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

I am still in the keep Coley camp (is he camp :o?) but just assuming he was to leave through choice or otherwise, would the dissenters be willing to take a chance on Jimmy Bell alone?

I would assume that they come as a package and would go as a package but if offered the job would he take it? I believe that as a partnership they are the yin to each others yang, but the one thing I do not like about Coley is the isolation of players who have clashed with him. Would Jimmy Bell alone have enough about him to give the club and team what it needs without Coleman?

Its only a theoretical question to the dissenters as I still believe, like Shakey, that Coley still has the minerals.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Why? What evidence is there that a clutch of players leaves a club when the manager leaves, other than those that the new manager wants to get rid of? Are you saying that these players have such devotion to JC that they will leave? Or are you saying that another manager would move them on as not good enough?

I know this is often said, but I'm afraid that I just don't understand it at all. There are scores of potential managers out there - current managers of clubs just below league level who would love to move to league level, and players who are retiring and are keen to move into management. If the argument were to be "The devil you know is better than the devil you don't know", then I could understand that while not necessarily agreeing with it. But I cannot accept the argument that there are no perfectly competent potential successors out there.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Yes. I suggest that the devotion of the players mentioned is not to the club but to the manager. Sad but true.

I can't help but restate my original point. There isn't one person out there who is a realistic target that would do the job better than our existing management. Players retiring wanting to move into management? Non league managers wanting a break in the league? Sounds like scraping the barrel to me!

Let's gain a little perspective here. Coley has not failed at all. On paper we have improved gradually. If in a good five years from now we are in the same position with the manager parading the same faults - then we should start looking for a replacement. Right now there is frankly no cause. The manager needs time to learn and improve, we owe him that at least.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

If that is true, and I cannot believe that it is, it's time for them to go. The club is bigger than any individual.

How can anyone possibly know that? We might believe it to be true, but we cannot state it as a blanket assertion.

How so? Surely that's where managers come from. Almost all league managers. Some prove to be better than others, but that's a different issue altogether.

It depends which part of the paper we look at. Goals scored, goal difference, average home attendance - have they improved?

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

It's still scraping the barrel! Coley's bad points consist of tactical nouse & personal immaturity, and so what we would need from a replacement would be an experienced league manager. Ergo, neither a retired player starting in management nor a non league manager wanting a break in the league - would suffice.

Simple. Points.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

[quote=shakermaker;568834]so what we would need from a replacement would be an experienced league manager. Ergo, neither a retired player starting in management nor a non league manager wanting a break in the league - would suffice.
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Sorry - non sequitur. There is ample evidence of recently-retired players and non-league managers having both tactical nous and personal maturity. One has only to look a few miles down the road at Ewood Park.

But if it must be an experienced league manager, I see that one has just become available - Peter Taylor, who says he is awaiting a call from a league club.

In your previous post, you asked for some perspective. Well let's consider some "experienced league managers" who could be available. Peter Reid? Graeme Souness? Brian Kidd? Carlton Palmer? That's just 4 that come straight to mind. Hardly an array of tactical nous and personal maturity on view there.

Anyway, thanks for the debate - it's been interesting.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

I asked Bobby Gould to his face (he lives here in Havelock Nth for 6 months of the year) if he would ever consider managing a club like Accy.His answer was " Yes,definatly-though his missus might have to be persuaded".

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

There's a big difference between Mark Hughes and Carlton Palmer! (Especially seeing as Hughes was an international manager before a domestic one).

The rest in the list? To me, they're just 'names' that (a) we couldn't afford and (b) even if we could afford them, wouldn't last five minutes anyway due to their respective egos.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

As he couldn't get Stevenage (average attendance 2,251 and presumably a budget to match) into the Blue Square play-offs, I think he may struggle with the resources available at Stanley!

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

the only managers name I have come up with who I think could possibly be interested, could possibly do a job and who WOULD do a bit on the getting bums on seats job is Jimmy Mullen. Currently caretaker manager at Walsall and was reportedly in the running before Coleman got the job but wanted too much money. But I'd still stick with the guy who has never took Stanley backwards in nine years.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

make it easy keep everyone except
Dunbavin
Brown
evil
williams
branch
todd
carden
mcgivern

Miles might come back like fleetwood would of. Because he also did nothing for us getting quarters and half games playing in an unprefered position.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

[quote=Revived Red;568872]Keep Dreaming Mate! We dont have the money for any of them. And tbh i wouldnt want them. They wouldnt do any more then coley has done so far! I think alot of you including revived red are just greedy. Weve had an alrite season , stayed up in league 2 , i dont get the problem! I really dont! If we dont go up your all after sacking the manager! Where small club that need to get used to the league and to get the right players i and that takes time! Id rather be a stanley fan then a mansfield or a wrexham one at the moment! Be happy! Were playing league football next season! Keep Coley For Deff!:D

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

[quote=fc:stanley;569001]It certainly took Hereford a long time to get the right players didn't it?

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

[quote=fc:stanley;569001]Please read what I said - not what you think I said. Shakermaker commented that it is only "experienced league managers" who can have tactical nous and personal maturity. All I did was quote 4 "experienced league managers" who lacked tactical nous and/or personal maturity. At no time did I link them with Stanley - nor would I ever want to. Sorry that you did not understand that.

It would have helped if you had followed the posts from the start. All my posts were about general principles. Again, sorry that you did not understand that either.

Please don't attribute to me things that I have not said, suggested or even implied.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

[quote=JEFF;569018]The original quotation referred to did not come from me.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Sorry RR, was way off! Long day :D

Well instead of just "experienced league manager", I'll add "with a good record", that do? :)

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

And now, 2 Seasons on, and assuming that John Coleman is not the mug that many making their unqualified voices heard on our Forum seem to think he is, and this making HIM...'an experienced. !. League Manager'..albeit of a shorter tenure than some of the alternatives suggested...It must be assumed that he has the ability to take this 'experience' on board..and lead he Club to greater things next season.
The possible alternatives, if available, can offer nothing more than JC has given over the years !.

'ON STANLEY...ON!!.....

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

sorry to be a killjoy, but for the club to move forward, the only person who should go is Eric Whalley, he needs to sell out to somebody with a bob or two, don't think fer a minute he will, but fer me its the only way forward.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Keep:

Kenny, Fearon (back up keeper)

Phil, Leam, Cav,

Mannix, Craney (as a midfielder), Grant,

Mullers, Whalley (as an out-and-out striker), Evil (top striker if we get the best out of him)

Everyone else can go. Toddy sadly isn't the same player, Jay and Proc have occasional great games but they are both playing for one place in the side and i beleive mannix can do a better job than either. Perhaps keep one as back up.

So that leaves room for about 3 defenders (of which Kempson should be one if we can get him). We also need two good quality wingers and another pacey striker

Perhaps a couple of the youth/reserve squad to fill in any gaps / provide cover

We also must develop a side capable of playing without Mullin - good as he is he is not getting any younger, but more importantly we are a very predictable side and need to mix up the attack a bit.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

we should keep jay harris he always puts top effort in hes a good player! i think we should keep rocky becuase he is a good defender he has put in some good games this season and next season when he comes back he will be in good form we should also play McGivien more often to take over mullins role as he is more than capable of doing. i hope mannix stays but think he can play at alot higher leave and king can aslo

My Assesment of the Squad..... who to keep and who to go
 

Arthur- Looked abit dodgy again, but surely hes our number 1? STAY
Dunbavin- No problem with shot stopping ability but has the moment of madness, a number 2 tho. MAYBE
Fearon- Good prospect, hopefully will get a chance next season. STAY

Cav- Mr Dependable, hopefully no injuries next season. STAY
Edwards- Looks a much better player at center back. STAY
Richardson- Solid. Must play Left back in my opinion. STAY
Williams. Shocking season. GO
Roberts. Very Dissappointing. GO
Webb. Solid but no Pace at all. GO
King. Looks the best left back in the league but doesnt get a chance and plays toddy at left back. GIVE HIM A CHANCE! STAY
Murphy. Looks a great prospect at center back. Surely cant be relied on 2 start next season tho at 18? STAY
Bell- Looks a decent back up, again i emphaise BACKUP! STAY

Proctor. Needs to up his game again next season, tho he has scored more goals than ever. STAY
Whalley- Great Prospect, hopefully more consistent next year. STAY
Harris- Yes he gets stuck in, thats not enough im afraid. GO
Miles- Most disappointing signing for me. GO
Carden. Who? GO
Branch. still got the brain, just no legs. GO
Brown. Steady but thats not enough. GO
Craney. Needs to improve but big signing wont leave. STAY
Mannix. Injury prone?? Or another failed signing?? MAYBE?
Todd. Does not look the same player as last year. MAYBE?
Grant. Another promising youngster. STAY

Mcgivern. Not given a big chance looks decent still tho. MAYBE?
Mcevilly. Seems to score everywhere else but here? MAYBE?
Mullin. Mr Reliable. Hes not a big goalscorer anymore, needs to be looked at as a League 2 version of Kevin Davies. Still Important tho. STAY




My Opinion what we need.

1 Keeper.

2 center backs. Kempson would do nicely alongside edwards.

1 right back. Will cav stay fit?

2 wingers. Toddy doesnt look the same player. Whalley inconsistent still.

2 strikers. including a GOALSCORER. ROSCOE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




we shall see what Coleman can magic up

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

sorry didnt see this thread, ive posted my opinion in a new 1

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Merging.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

todays Telegraph says that the players are due in on tuesday (tomorrow). They have some fitness letters to give out to those that are staying and only thanks to give out to those that are going. Anybody fancy parking on the car park and doing commentary on who comes out with letters

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

and of the players that do leave how many will make the trip over to sligo do you reckon? also can anyone help me out on carden's contact length, im sure he's still tied down after this year i maybe wrong though

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

think kenny A should go , dodgy keeper

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Me, too. Bring back Bossu!

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

Coleman is a god. He will remain and we will prosper.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

All I want is whoever stays or comes in is to have pride and know what it means to wear the colours of Accrington Stanley:)

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

After witnessing the performance on sat against bury i think the whole squad apart from mullin + proctor should go we desperatly need some new players :hesoff:

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

We also need £1million for a new stand, or we'll be leaving the League anyway.

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

If we keep the squad we won't need a stand. ;)

Re: Players who should go , who should stay ?
 

I knew there was method in all this madness! ;)