Pies
 

Hello,

My name is Katie and I am part of the Sisterhood of the Travelling Pies. We have created a website based around sport's stadia and their pies. Within the Sisterhood, there are four of us all studying Football Business and Marketing at UCFB.

Our degree doesn't just involve assignments and exams, it is also about gaining experience in the Football Industry and meeting people who are profoundly involved in the careers we intend to pursue.

You can read our blog post about our recent visit to Accrington Stanley here... Accrington Stanley ? Sisterhood of the Travelling Pies

Despite not finding any pies on the day, we would appreciate feedback and comments regarding matchday food and your personal thoughts...

Many Thanks
[email protected]

Re: Pies
 

Please refer to the "who ate all the pies" thread on here. Some very interesting posts!

Re: Pies
 

I do find pies are expensive at football grounds. Currently £2.50 at ours. A bit OTT. they could sell Pie and peas for £2 and still have a good mark up. I know the smaller clubs need the revenue but they could increase the volume. Generally food at football grounds are not of the best quality to say the least. People just accept the lower quality as part of the football experience.

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Pretty sure we had some at the home end ;)

I'm not a fan of the Pukka Pie as football ground fayre, the pastry is too thick and holds the temperature of the filling for far too long. HOWEVER, I am slightly forced to retract my original disdain of the Pukka Pie as I forced myself to use a fork last time out. This meant that smaller amounts of grub went in my mouth at any one offering, so I didnt burn myself to the same degree. The pie was indeed reasonably tasty.

Alas, I will now retract my retraction because I want to eat my pie with my hands.

And a further note of desolation, i dont want it open in a tray. When half time comes I want my pie, I want my pint and I want 3 cigarettes. Hollands Pies were nicely cellophaned up so I could get two pie n pint deals and pop one pie in each jacket pocket whilst I slurp lager and create my nicotine cloud. Ergo, my expenditure has decreased.

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This is the root of the problem!
I remember we debated this matter last season & the club have done nothing to resolve it.
I know we treat the subject of pies as a source of humour but for a lot of fans, a pie & a pint is a matchday ritual.
Massive Pukka Pie hoardings dominate the wham, yet away fans aren't able to buy one!
I remember last season the vitriol on the Carlisle forum, not about the game, but the dire catering on offer to away fans.
The 'Sisterhood of the travelling pies' article only makes us look ridiculous.
Last week, some friends who came to support PNE, were charged over £4 for a burger at the away end, whilst Stanley fans are charged £2.50!
Surely we want away fans to enjoy their visit to the Wham, rather than leaving feeling disappointed, or worse - ripped-off!

Re: Pies
 

If thats what we do to away fans, why the hell should they ever return to the Wham? its certainly not encouraging them to do so. STUPID IMHO.

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Pies at Watford cost £4. At Swansea they are £3.60.... don't think either can be described as affluent areas. £2.50 for our pies, however crap they are, represent remarkable value. Simply remarkable.

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Lord D. No one disputes the undoubted value of the pies at the Wham.
The problem, as highlighted in the post from 'The Sisterhood of the Travelling Pies', is that away fans are unable to buy one - at any price!

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Other than forest green, is there a single club who sells edible pies fit for human consumption?

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You some kind of nut cutlet, quorn sossy munching weirdo? :eek:

https://www.theguardian.com/football...-football-club

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Only places I've experienced edible offerings were at Kidderminster Harriers (excellent but not cheap, and quite some time ago) and Brizzle Rovers (best pasties this side of the Tamar). Unfortunately, neither on Stanley's itinerary this year. Most food and hot drinks at most grounds is over-priced and pretty disgusting.

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other than forest green is there another club that forces fans to be a veggie for the day. what has always made me wonder is why clubs charge high prices inside grounds when they have a number of cafe,s around em. doesn,t apply at stanley but does in a lot of places.

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To me they charge high prices,simply cos the greedy sods know damn well people wi a few bevvies in em are likely to pay up imho.

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Gentlemen,
Your fond memories of pie based consumables at other grounds only detracts from Katie's original problem.
Why can't away fans buy a bleedin pie at the Wham?????????????
It's time the club got rid of the outside caterers at the away end & brought catering in-house like the fanzone.
Surely this would put catering profits back into the club & stop away fans leaving the Wham with a bitter taste in their mouth.

Re: Pies
 

Or no taste in their mouth cos they couldn't purchase a pie. . . . . .

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It's time the club got rid of the outside caterers at the away end & brought catering in-house like the fanzone.


funny that a lot of non league clubs do in house catering and although its a similar price to league clubs it,s a lot more edible and the lasses that serve who in a lot of cases are volunteers seem to have a smile on their faces.

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Kidderminster even at 5 quid a throw was always well worth a go and always sold out before half time.

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I.m very surprised that AH hasnt replicated the fan zone at the away end and taken the catering in house

I.d be pretty sure that the total fans using the away end over a season wouldnt be far off the Clayton total and that would be made up for by the fact that away fans tend to have a larger food/drink spend

And yes i remember the Carlisle spat over the catering vans but people who live in glass houses shouldnt throw stones the catering and service at BP is just about the worst in the league and thats at a club thats owned by a local pie manufacturer/retailer.

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Lord Stiff - think Chris thinks the cost of a pie is too high? My response was aimed at that.

Don't really have any views on Away fans catering except to say it would be nice if they let the Away fans into the fanzone.

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The price is irrelevant if yeh cant get one?;) not to have any views on away fans catering is never likely to increase our poor attendance?

Re: Pies
 

Northernsoul,
If my memory serves me right, the criticism from the CUFC fans last year was because one of their fans had posted on their forum along the lines that they were in for a treat at the Wham, as you could buy a pie & a pint for a fiver - football cordon bleu! :D
Unfortunately, he was unaware that this deal was limited to the home fanzone. :o
Needless to say he was tarred & feathered after the starving Cumbrians discovered that the only treat awaiting them were tins of beer & overpriced burgers. :mad:
Can't comment on the catering at Brunton Park, but assume that even away fans can at least buy a pie????

Re: Pies
 

A little disingenuous there Cashy if I may say so. I made two unrelated points:
1. That I don't think £2.50 is not expensive for a pie (but Chris thinks it is)
2. I have no views on Away catering because I've never been there, know very little about the situation, so find myself unable to comment. (I know that ignorance doesn't stop some people voicing off). Whatever the situation is, allowing Away fans into the fanzone seems a nice idea to me. Obviously the laid back bar staff would need to pull their socks up to deal with the additional demand but since it's only for 15 mins I'm sure they could if they tried.

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Why disingenuous? its obvious that some fans enjoy a pie and a pint as a ritual at football matches, away fans we live off cos our homers certainly dont,so the fact they cant have a pie when we can may well put some off returning,?

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as a club who really do not have enough home fans we have to make the wham a better experiance for away fans as we need em more than a lot of clubs do. with the position and geography of our ground plus most of the teams being southern based i imagine they turn up thirsty and hungry. a lot of home fans i imagine live say 10 mins. up the road so drink and food will be less of an importance. an open terrace or a bus shelter to sit in hardly puts us on top of the list to visit and poor catering facilities especially in winter could be the last straw.

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Spot on my Simian friend!

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Well said monkey hanger

We need a USP beyond our name, and if that's high quality home made catering then so be it.

It all helps, and no doubt it can bring in a decent profit

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Half decent food at the Crown ground would certainly be a USP that very few other clubs could compete with.
Morecambe has (not quite literally) been dining out on having (allegedly) the best pie in the league for some time.
Mrs Exile and I mainly attend away games, and do not buy the c**p on offer at many other grounds a second time around.
As far as I can judge, the quality on offer has nothing to do with the size of the crowd or stadium. Big venues also sell inedible food and tepid tea, usually at even higher prices. FGR, for all the ranting about veganism, and Morecambe show it's got nothing to do with the number of customers, just the will to offer something slightly better than the worst possible food that a captive and hungry punter will eat.

Re: Pies
 

We all know the club have had only limited success in attracting more home fans to the Wham.
However, the potential of attracting more away supporters has largely been ignored.
Feedback from visiting fans regarding their visits to the Wham have not been exactly glowing.
As far as I am aware, there have been no real improvements at the Coppice end for many years - and it shows!
I know these cost money, but perhaps the club should consider this as a matter of priority.
Surely we want visiting fans to feel welcome & to make their visit an enjoyable experience.
This would quickly pay dividends if future posts on away fans forums were unanimous in their praise of visiting the Wham;
'Always an enjoyable experience to visit Accy. Warm, friendly welcome and the best value beer & pies in League 2!'
At the moment, I wouldn't repeat some of the comments I've read on what away fans think of their recent visits.

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Summer 2016 should have seen The Whinney Hill stand go up - it didnt
Summer 2017 should have seen the Main Stand redevelopment - it hasnt

I think Andy has downed tools :)

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Dont think so meself, reckon its been spent elsewhere?

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Maybe he's just sent them away to be re-sharpened? ;)

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I hope so Exile.

It would be easy for Andy to get upset that his "build it and they will come" attitude is failing - but he needs to remember that fan retention is important too

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Good points;

Don't think Andy has "downed tools" just think he he needs more proof that what he does (infrastructure wise) will increase HOME crowds and secondary revenues ;)

No point in paying out £1.5million for a stand that has 100 home fans using it.

Re: Pies
 

Kinda chicken & the egg situation really - just worried that if we don't have the required no.of seats for the chickens (or the eggs) to sit in due to having removed them on the proviso that we were building the new stand, will we get into trouble?

Re: Pies
 

Whilst we would all like to see a new stand at the Wham, it was only ever viable on the back of promotion.
I can understand Mr Holts reluctance to invest such a massive sum with current attendance levels + the fact the club don't own the ground.
AH has transformed facilities for home fans & created a playing pitch worthy of any in league 1, or even higher.
I'm sure that if we can get off to a good start this season, gates will increase. After all, nothing succeeds like success!
To be honest, I'd rather see a fanzone created at the away end, as I'm certain it would return vital revenue if catering was brought back in-house.
PS. In the meantime, please can I have some fried onions on me burger!

Re: Pies
 

Not set up for in-house catering as yet, the out lay alone ie the cost of either building or even buying a burger van wipes any profit for a few seasons! Better having out side caterers in who pay a sizable up front fee for the privilege, they loose out if game is called off. I'm sure if asked they would provide a range of pies which complements there other offerings :)

Re: Pies
 

a glorified garden shed would do. many non league clubs catering outlets are no more than this. if a mobile burger van was purchased it could be moved around to other events on a non match day. i,m sure there,s a fan we have who,s got all the relative food hygene stuff who,d do it. outside caterers rerely offer a product most want. if we did our own i think people whould accept any shortcomings as well.

Re: Pies
 

Is that the nux of the problem? An outside 'caterer' who, it appears, doesn't offer what many customers want and has to be told!

Re: Pies
 

The Fanzone made clever use of the area underneath the Clayton end terrace.
The food kiosks themselves were just single wall breezeblock painted grey, with a power supply provided etc.
Yes, this cost money, but I'm sure AH doesn't expect to receive an instant return on his investment. It will probably take a few seasons before the fanzone sees any profit.
The big problem with burger vans is their need to be mobile. They usually consist of only a hotplate for frying burgers etc.
Few, if any, have ovens. Which is what you need for pastry based savouries.
This is the main reason away fans cannot buy a pie for love nor money.
Employing an outside caterer is the easy option for the club.
They get a fee & the caterer gets guaranteed business.
BUT! Because it's only a few hours on 1, or maybe 2 days a week, they tend to charge exorbitant prices to make up for it.
The loser is the customer - and away fans ARE customers; who get little choice at inflated prices.
The question is, do we want away fans to enjoy their visit to the Wham?
To feel that the club welcomes & appreciates their custom?
Or do we carry on offering them expensive burgers, tins of beer & Portaloos?
For the answer, visit any of the league 2 fans forums.

Re: Pies
 

Well i would of thought if he wasnt doing the stand this summer a fanzone at the away end would of been a good idea 50k wasnt it for the Clayton one even less if the grant application had been done in time.

Away fans do like to come to Accy because its retro like it used to be but that doesnt mean you couldnt increase the numbers coming with a roof and decent catering and toilet facilities a la the Clayton End

Last year Carlisle took 3k to Blackpool yet brought only a third of that to Accy and AH and all at the Crown should be asking why and if they really did want to know i would be more than happy to tell them.

It seems to me it would be easier and probably more cost effective to increase the aggregate attendance by 12k in away fans than it would be with locals.

Re: Pies
 

Most clubs Blackpool attracts more fans always been the case,

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Ah my friend!
If only every visiting team brought 1000 followers to the Wham.
We'd be rolling in it!

Re: Pies
 

if we,d have gained promotion the other season i,m sure this would have happened as well as locals realising there is a football team in accrington. missing out on promotion pushed our ground development back in my opinion and only when we do gain promotion is when the home crowds will rise. the years of playing teams like stevenage, crawley, yeovil, cheltenham etc. can be wearing a little thin. lets hope this is our last season in div.2 and promotion is achieved this time round.

Re: Pies
 

Don't,t forget also all the ground work and general tidying up that as been done gas supply put in the central heating in the clubhouse actually works Andy has done a fantastic job so far maybe it has something to do with buying the ground or he has just put the brakes on for now but eventually I think we will see new office's roof on away end new stand and new changing rooms and clubhouse all takes time and costs money.

Re: Pies
 

Yes thats noted and taken into consideration but come on a factor of three three times simply doesnt cover it.

They have taken figures of up to 3k to plenty of grounds over the years and last year took just short of 2k to Morecambe as an away fans sell out and believe me theres not much of an attraction there.

This year they have very few "local" away games and i.m pretty sure if Stanlley made an effort marketing wise and set a target of 2k they could get pretty close to reaching it.

Re: Pies
 

This year they have very few "local" away games

they don,t have any real local away games. seems once you,re a carlisle fan you have to be prepared to travel and they are. good train links and the M6 does really help plus they seem to have more than the average number of exciles.

Re: Pies
 

Perhaps it has more to do with the unfortunate remarks Coley made after Brunton Park was flooded & they were given permission to use Bloomfield Rd to complete their fixtures.
It coincided with several of our own games being postponed due to a waterlogged pitch & Coley felt they were given preferential treatment.
Naturally, it didn't go down well in Carlisle after their players helped in the flood disaster relief.
Perhaps they felt they owed Blackpool a debt of gratitude.
Some folk have long memories!

Re: Pies
 

[QUOTE=Lord Stiffupperlip;1198324]Perhaps it has more to do with the unfortunate remarks Coley made after Brunton Park was flooded & they were given permission to use Bloomfield Rd to complete their fixtures.
It coincided with several of our own games being postponed due to a waterlogged pitch & Coley felt they were given preferential treatment.


think you are correct there. they certainly had it in for coley after that and don,t think they hold us and our club in high esteem due to it.

Re: Pies
 

Youre both right Coleys unfortunate remarks were taken the wrong way by a number of fans but i dont think either that or owing Blackpool a debt for letting them use BR for the cup game against Yeovil has anything to do with the low figures that come to Accy compared to other NW grounds.

In fact a lot of fans have a soft spot for the Accy fans after the day the Ultras came to BP after the previous floods with the big Banner and all the inflatables etc.

The truth is that they consider 20 quid to sit in the cramped Whinney hill seats with no proper facilities is a Joke in this day and age.

Secondly the catering is seen as a big issue both on quality and price and believe me they are experts on crap overpriced food given what they have to put up with at Brunton Park for the last 20 years.

Finally what ****es them of is the Loyalty card issue which is seen as a way of getting around charging away fans more than home ones for what amounts to considerably interior facilities.

Being stuck where i am in the middle i can see both sides points on most of the issues above but what disappoints me is that Stanley could double the amount of fans who would travel for the game if they just made a little effort and if they could do it against Carlisle you never know similar effort with other teams might just pay similar bonuses just think back to Blackpool last season and the 800 they brought to Accy wasnt much more than a third of what they took to Morecambe for a journey of a similar distance but one thats a lot easier both by car and definitely by train.

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To me theres a lot of Common Sense in that post Northern Soul.!

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can,t have common sense on here. the season is less than a week away now.

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Makes up the balance for some of the comments on other threads though :D. . . . . . . I'll get me coat

Re: Pies
 

While northern soul makes some good points junta, I would add - it's fairly common for away fans to get a worse deal in terms of price and facilities than home fans although that doesn't make it right.

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due to segregation you,re usually stuck at one end of the ground or in a corner with a poor view. thankfully we don,t play york or stockport anymore as these are two of the main culprits. hopefully we,ll not be useing the open away end at swindon next season. don,t do standing for 2 hours in the rain anymore and paying twenty quid for a great day out.

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Think Afc Wimbledon was the worst experience, although the drafty corner at Bristol was a close second - thankfully both gone now but if we end up in the same league again I'd definitely think more than twice about going to either

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Got to disagree about York and Stockport yes neither end is covered but still good for creating an atmosphere and the food at York was always decent and cheap but cant remember too much about that at SCFC but both of them offered decent seating at the same price as home fans as an option.

Totally agree about Wimbledon so always pay for proper seats there but i preferred to stand at BRFC but good to know you could get in the temp seats if it ****ed it down and an extra mark there for the pasties methinks.

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And which ones would they be AM ?

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But the whole point of the ticketing regulations is that they shouldn't

While its often unavoidable that the end that they get will be open quite often thats negated by seats being made available if it rains and i.d say Stanley is one of very few grounds where the catering offer is totally different for home and away fans.

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Nothing in particular, just a general comment made in jest - hence the smiley face :)

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In no way condoning it but away fans at Aldershot only had a van with no alternative other than a disgusting greasy burger in a stale bun, and tins of fizzy pop. Thankfully that was a 'local' game for us, so we didn't have to suffer the effects.

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I hardly ever buy food at football grounds. But roll on Forest Green! Decent food AND real ale! :)

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So you two will be doing a car share in the veggiemobile then? :D

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talking about saving the planet, joys of a non meat diet and CAMRA wishing they were hippies all the way to gloucestershire and back.

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As far as i'm concerned yeh can shove forest greens slop were a monkey puts its nuts.:D

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couldn,t put it better myself cashy. just hate these types who think everyone should follow their lifestyle to matter what. all these hippy tree huggers can do one big style for me.

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Okies mate no probs just thought something i.d said in particular had upset you

I just think i maybe see things that some of you dont Being a Carlisle fan but one who soon developed a soft spot for Stanley when i moved here a decade ago

Re: Pies
 

Personally, I wouldn't go vegan in a thousand years, but it's up to FGR what sort of food they serve. Nobody's forced to eat it.

Secondly, if they serve real ales, then more power to them. It'd make a refreshing change to have a decent pint of real ale at a football ground.

Finally, as someone who has sunk a few pints of real ale with the man, in no way can Mike A. be called a tree hugger or a hippy! 😉

Re: Pies
 

northernsoul , i agree with you.

so i encourage all away fans to look for opportunities

About the 3rd or 4th season back in the league, we played Notts County away and it was £5 in the home end behind the goal, but full price elsewhere in the ground including the away end which was £18 from memory.

I went in the home end behind the goal, used the superior catering facilities, then told a steward i was in the wrong end and they happily moved me to the away end.

Re: Pies
 

I seem to recall nowt wrong with Wimbledon at the league match where Kettle infamously blew for half time. We were allowed to sit in the stand behind the goals with pretty much no segregation and a good view.
Some Stanley fans stood in a little shed to the side if memory serves. Not sure why as there were only a handful. Maybe it was a couple of quid cheaper there - if so, probably a false economy.

Also, referring back to previous mention of Morecambe's pies. I seem to recall me and Er Indoors sympathetically looking at some young kid trying to eat one of them. Dry, solid, inedible. Think I wasn't the only one who mentioned how poor they looked on the match thread at the time.

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Unfortunately my first trip to Wimbledon was for the play off game Lord D, when we were herded into the corner of the ground which only afforded us a view of the game on the section of pitch directly in front of us, those who had preferred to get seated tickets were ok but one or two of our fans who, on arrival & seeing where we were stood asked could they pay to transfer to the seated area were refused, despite some seats being available - not a good experience

Re: Pies
 

[QUOTE=Wynonie Harris;1198435]Personally, I wouldn't go vegan in a thousand years, but it's up to FGR what sort of food they serve. Nobody's forced to eat it.

could say the same thing about stanley and their food offerings for away fans then. if anyone knows the geography of their ground its on top of a steep hill and you are a captive audience if you get there late or don,t fancy the treck from the village so therefore they should cater for the majority and not what their millionaire backer wants.

Re: Pies
 

[QUOTE=monkey hanger;1198506]...and just like Stanley or any other club, if the food they serve doesn't prove popular, they'll suffer in terms of lost sales. But in the end, it's up to them to decide on what their food offering is. Not providing food with animal products on for a couple of hours on a Saturday afternoon is hardly "forcing their lifestyle" on anybody!

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no but if yeh dont provide for the pie@pint brigade, yeh got a good chance of some away fans not bothering imho. and if the provider aint bothered its our club that could suffer

Re: Pies
 

real ale will be served at the wham this season :cool:

Re: Pies
 

That's good news. Can you elaborate, will it be in the club or the fan zone or both ?

Re: Pies
 

Can't see any Stanley fan not making the trip to FGR because they can't get a pie at halftime. After all the only pie they can get at the Wham is a Pukka Pie, so they're hardly being deprived of some delicious, mouthwatering comestible. As for pints, they've got real ale. What more could a pint drinker want? 😉

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And if they do & find themselves hungry cos they can't stomach a pie without meat, I usually take a bag full of food on away days so if they seek me out I'm sure I'll have a spare butty or two :)

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Lucky for the real ale drinkers it will be in the clubhouse and fan zone :)

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Was referring to away fans that come to us.treat folk like crap yeh get what yeh deserve.

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We have always had rubbish facilities things have only improved recently, thanks to our new owner,

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Last time I was at FGR there was a club next door that was OK.

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Great news, Mick. Hen Harrier (4%) from Bowland Brewery on sale in the Fanzone on Saturday!

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[QUOTE=Wynonie Harris;1198521]of course it is. he,s one of those veggie types who think they should all follow him. just like me winning the euro millions, buy andy holt out and make the fanzone into a temberance bar. just because you think one way everyone else doesn,t. he chooses to be a non meat eater as i choose not to drink alcohol but i don,t or ever want others to follow me.

Re: Pies
 

So ..... if I come round yours one evening, will alcohol be available as a matter of course, the way you want meat pies to be available at FGR?

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Why would it not be? i cant drink aint done fer years but theres always some Alcohol in fer anyone that does.

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That's all right then. I thought I might have spotted a touch of hypocrisy :eek:, but happily I was wrong :). Apologies.

Mind, if I do go to FGR I think I'll have to try the quorn pie ..... ;)

Re: Pies
 

[QUOTE=monkey hanger;1198581]Lifestyle: someone's way of living (Cambridge English Dictionary).

Not being able to eat meat products for a couple of hours once a fortnight or in the case of away fans, once a season is not changing your way of living!

Re: Pies
 

yes chimer on both counts. as i,ve stated clearly its a not a matter of what i do but i have booze in for friends and family who want it. why can,t the veggie brigade get it. you are expected to cater for them so why won,t they do it for you. the only veggie i actually knew was a fellow bus driver who had more days off sick than the average man or woman did and looked ill when she actually bothered turning up.

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[QUOTE=Wynonie Harris;1198592]but its trying to promote someone,s way of living that,s all. don,t think we,ll ever get to some middle ground on this issue as i think our ideas are deep rooted.

Re: Pies
 

The only veggie I know is a vegan, tea-total Buddhist who is a Stanley fan mate of mine and Cashy's and seems in excellent health and is neither a tree hugger or a hippie!

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, Monkey Hanger!

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I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, Monkey Hanger![/QUOTE]

h ope we don,t disagree on a Stanley win on Saturday though.

Re: Pies
 

Me, I'm tempted by the badger pasty! :)

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Meanwhile in other news & to cheer us up on a bad news day for Stanley the Crown have announced they've teamed up with Hollands Pies & will be serving their new bigger pies on match days :)

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What has happened to Cissy Greens? :eek:

Hollands steak and pepper, great pie :)

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Pukka v Hollands!
Proper Pie Wars. It'll be a reality TV show soon enough.

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Well fer me Hollands aint as good as they used to be, but still far better than Pukka.

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I agree !