[garinda]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

I'm a democrat like you Mancie and the Lords is a joke to any forward-thinking democrat - an anachronism from an earlier age when us 'umble folks knew our place and doffed our caps to t'master. But what I'm saying is, your lot had a great chance to change it and bring it kicking and screaming into the modern era. But what did they do?...they got rid of some, but not all, of the hereditary crew and replaced them with toadies and bootlickers. You seem curiously silent on that. Now it looks like the Tories will be coming back in and there's no way they're going to reform it - you can see that from AndrewB's comments - so we'll be stuck with the likes of Uddin indefinitely.

Mancie's a traditionalist at heart, and changing the order of things, would probably upset him.

If you break down the 'us and them' barriers, he wouldn't know which way to turn.