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I've been debating whether to post this or not, but in the end decided I should.

I was racially abused and then assaulted by four Asians whilst walking home a few nights ago. I'm not going in to details but it comes down to the following:

I got punched in the face, completely unprovoked, by somebody I have never met before. If I wasn't so quick on my feet I would defiantly have been incredibly worse off than a bust nose as I managed to run past one of them when I was surrounded escaping with just a punch to the face. If they'd have got hold of me properly I dread to think what state I would be in now.

Once I was "safe" I followed them at a distance to ensure the police caught them, one was arrested. Kind of miffed that the others were not arrested only cautioned, because they played an active part and if that first punch had knocked me to the floor, there's no doubt at all in my mind that they would have all joined in.

I honestly don't know what to say. It happened at the opening of broadway, Union Street side, its got CCTV. How do you prevent society from getting kicks out of unprovoked attacks? All CCTV can do is monitor it and later prosecute on the off chance that the camera is facing the wrong way.

Luckily my face has no bruising, it just hurts a lot. I am very lucky I managed to escape them though.

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I'm glad you decided to share this with the forum, and as said via pm, am glad that you are not too badly hurt.

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That's awful Cyfr, I suppose it's lucky that they were caught. My dad was attacked by 4 Asian youths in Blackburn when he was coming home from work... This was last year, and despite him giving the police their car registration number and having several witnesses, the police claimed that they could not track these lads down.

It is stories like yours which make me shudder at what a hell hole England has become. The older I am getting, the less opportunites I can see for both myself and other law abiding citizens in this country.:mad:

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Terrible.:mad:

Glad you escaped without to much injury.

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At least one got arrested. About 5 years ago I lived in Brierfield and a group of them turned up at the house with baseballs because I wouldn't let my stepdaughter come to the door earlier in the evening when one of them came knocking. They threatened to burn the house down. I reported it, and got given a leaflet by the police on how to deal with racial discrimination.

Then they wonder why the BNP is well supported in the Burnley area :mad:

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lucky you were fast on your feet .hope police are going to press charges.

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That's awful.Thank God you're ok.You come away just being thankful you're stll alive don't you?Not like some unfortunate people who finish up getting kicked to death over nothing.These unprovoked attacks are very frightening.My husband had experience of one several years ago.I bet the police are saying it wasn't 'racially motivated' are they? They wouldn't be saying that if you'd attacked a black guy,that would be a racist attck straight away.What I'm saying will probably be controversial but I can assure you all I am not a racist person.I take all people as I find them and whether I like or dislike them has nothing to do with the colour of their skin.It just annoys me that whenever a black person is attacked by a white person it's always reported as racism but when it's the other way round it never is.I don't know why because these attacks are everywhere but they're always played down as not racist when it's a white person that's been attacked:mad:. Anyway glad you're ok and hope your injuries soon feel better.

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Cyfr, im 100% certain you were correct to post this, glad yer ok mate,too many of these type of incidents go unheard of, probably cos young uns dont want to be looked on as soft, its nowt of the sort, people tend to think-well this will not happen to me, well it does, hope they bounce the cowardly scumbag.;)

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That's a misconception. The law, including the race laws, are applicable to everyone in this country, irrespective of the colour of their skin.

There have been plenty of successful prosecutions brought against people who have committed race crimes against white people.

Here's just one of many examples.

BBC NEWS | UK | Racism and race crime redefined

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I think the misconception is that the law is applied fairly ;)

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That's actually correct. It's also a requirement of the police to record all offences as racially motivated, if the victim makes that claim.
That's one of the reasons why the number of racially motivated crimes have increased in the statistics.

Glad you're ok Cyfr.

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Well all the latest figures prove that it is being applied fairly, and that the police, and the courts, take all cases of racial assault seriously, irrespective of the colour of the victim.




'Police figures show a record number of racist attacks in the area - out of 572 reported cases last year, 60% of the victims were white - and detectives are investigating a total of three racially-motivated incidents during last weekend. '
BBC NEWS | UK | War veteran in 'racist' attack




'Nearly half of all victims of racially motivated murders in the last decade have been white, according to official figures released by the Home Office.'
Racial murders: nearly half the victims are white | UK News | The Observer

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The article backs up your statistics but also backs up my opinion of what has been happening for years.

"Senior police officers have admitted that 'political correctness' and the fear of discussing the issue have meant that race crime against white people goes under-reported. 'The political correctness and reluctance to discuss these things absolutely does play a factor', he said. 'A lot of police officers and other professions feel almost the best thing to do is try and avoid it for fear of being criticised. We probably have all got ourselves into a bit of state about this. "

Mind you I think the application of the law in this country is too soft regardless of creed or colour.

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I am glad that you are ok Cyfr, you are quite right to post about the attack on here.

I find Garinda's statistics about racially motivated attacks last year (and especially the murder figures) very disturbing. For anyone to be singled out for whatever reason to be attcked is appalling, but especailly so when it is because of the colour of someone's skin.

Lettie, you said that nothing ever came off the attack on your dad last year, desoite him having witnesses and a car reg. Did he not try to find the people himself and bring a private prosecution - as it was Blackburn did he try to contact Jack Straw to complain about there not being any outcome.

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Glad you're ok Cyfr, also pleased the police arrested someone, as Lettie said when our Dad was assulted last year they didn't want to know.

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Glad it wasn't any worse, Cyfr. Hope you heal soon. Bet it's going to make you nervous walking around town alone, though. People who do this sort of thing obviously believe they are going to get away with it. I think PC definitely plays a role. To make matters worse, I know it is frowned upon over there by the "powers that be" for you to defend yourself in any meaningful way. It is indeed lucky that you were able to exit the scene. Hope there will be a prosecution forthcoming. Is the Broadway/Union St. area considered to be particularly dangerous?

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Glad it wasn't any worse, Cyfr. Hope you heal soon. Bet it's going to make you nervous walking around town alone, though. People who do this sort of thing obviously believe they are going to get away with it. I think PC definitely plays a role. To make matters worse, I know it is frowned upon over there by the "powers that be" for you to defend yourself in any meaningful way. It is indeed lucky that you were able to exit the scene. Hope there will be a prosecution forthcoming. Is the Broadway/Union St. area considered to be particularly dangerous?

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It was about half 10 at night, but I hadn't been out drinking or anything. :)

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Cyfr......that is terrible. I am sorry to hear that you were the victim of this cowardly act, and I am pleased to hear that due to your quick thinking you were not more seriously hurt.
I am glad that someone was held responsible, though it is bad that not ALL the culprits were apprehended.
It surely is coming to something when the law of the jungle prevails in a town like Accrington.

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Cyfr, if you do manage to make it to the meet, you'll be on free drinks all night!:p

(This is an observation, not a promise, though I may buy you one or two glasses of pop.)

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I got beaten up by a group of chav girls once on the way home from the shop, got taken by behind and pinned down while the main girl smashed me in the face. Didnt prosecute though as I knew I didn't have much evidence it was her against a full group of her friends who could provide alibi's and there is no cctv on the road I was on.

On a brighter note, asians commit the least crimes statistically (or thats what it says in my sociology book in front of me)
Saying that when your of a minority (yes a minority) its bound to look like they commit less than white people.

Black people are well known for being racially discriminated against by the police as well. 1 in 5 black youths are stopped more than 5 times a year. I imagine its probably a lower figure for asian lads but i bet the statistics still show some discrimination of ethnicity!

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I too am very sorry this happened to you Cyfr. What a terrible experience to have and completely unprovoked. I would never had even thought of that happening as I strolled all around Accy downtown.

Thanks for sharing as it puts more Accy members on alert to this. Both for themselves and then for their loved ones. I know Ianto does alot of walking around down there so be careful out there . . . No, not from Ianto :p. . . for all who stroll the streets!

I'm curious, are there any/alot of self defense courses taught over there. Having a couple of Bruce Lee's kicking the crap out of these thugs might make em think twice!

Brian

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Sorry about that Cyfr hope you are feeling better. At least they got the one who punched you. Why do people do this when its unprovoked though. What kicks do they get. I dont understand why they do it maybe because i was brought up not to get into fights unless i was defending myself. Always got told let them throw the first but always make sure you throw the last and harder!!!

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Thanks for the positive responses guys. :)

I just feel I need to post again because I didn't write just how helpful the police have been. On the night they were brilliant, they phoned the next day early in the morning, they phoned later on in the day and I got a phonecall today as well.

It's great to be updated like that it feels like you matter and the case is being dealt with.

Unfortunately hes on bail. Which isn't great news but i've no idea how the legal system works in that respect but I doubt its the fault of the actual police officers.

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Glad your ok Cyfr. Think it is down to the CPS to decide what charges (if any) to take them to court and NOT the police. Also glad they keeping you up to date with what's happening.

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How much is a bust nose worth these days from the CICB? I reckon you should get your application in ASAP and on the form play up on the trauma side. Put in a claim for a least a grand - they'll probably give you five hundred quid, which should mean you'll be able to get at least two or three full rounds in at the following Accy Web meet. Let us know when you get the dosh so we can all plan for free drinks that night.

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Cyfr, I'm really sorry to hear about this and hope that the idiots who did it get some sort of retribution. I would hope that whether they were Asian or white or any other colour for that matter - it's good that you managed to identify them to the police and they can keep their eye on them.

I know you said it was four Asian lads who did this but how can you be sure it was a racist attack? I'm not trying to say that it was any less of a crime - just want to know if you're absolutely sure it was because of race. There are many incidents of attacks where the victim and attacker are of the same race so why if the two are of different races should it automatically be assumed that that is the reason for the attack.

Just checking.

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Racist abuse was used before the physical attack.

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Fair enough Cyfr.

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oops, missed those last 2 posts. :o

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Whatever the reason Cyfr, twas an assault in any language, so good luck in bringing these idiots to justice. Forget the money/compensation, not what it is about, and sure you know that.

Sure your parents are behind you in this, as we are here, if it were my lad, would move heaven and earth to make sure they don't do it again ... :mad:

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Cyfr pm'd me what had happened to him, before he posted about in a thread. I didn't think to question him, when he told me it was a racist attack. From his posts on here I know he wouldn't have labelled the crime as racist, unless it actually was.

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...he said in the very first post, in the second sentence, he was racially abused and then attacked.

Seems prtty clear cut to me.

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How come it's fine for a blackman to call anyone he chooses the famous N word and yet, when a whiteman uses the same, word in the same context, he'd better make sure there ain't a cop listening? I also am not a racist. I'm groupist, does that make me groopist or a groupie? :D

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good point and correct to the best of my understanding,its something that really "BUGS" me.

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Strange that Gayle felt strongly enough to call in her complaint to Channel 4, thinking the bullying of Shilpa Shetty was racist, but questioned whether the attack on Cyfr was, even though he said he was racially abused before he was attacked.

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Garinda please don't try to provoke an argument when there isn't one there. The two things are completely unrelated.

I have pm'd Cyfr (and you) to clarify why I asked - I have also acknowledged on thread that that it was a racist attack.

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people actually did that on this forum lol? I can't help but ask the question why anyone needs to question someones ability to decide whether an attack against them was a racial one or not.

Cyfr and Shilpa Shetty are both old enough to decide whether attacks against them were racially aggravated or not, it doesn't take a busy body to point it out for them!

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Are you speaking from personal experience piltymon?.. can you back up your statement with actual figures?.. how many people have been arrested for calling someone a nigger?.. give us some facts and figures.
Just on a personal note can I ask if you call people niggers in day to day conversations?

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Back in my post (#24) I asked the following:

I'm curious, are there any/alot of self defense courses taught over there. Having a couple of Bruce Lee's kicking the crap out of these thugs might make em think twice!

I don't believe I received an answer but I remain curious on this.

Brian

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just read this and i am so glad you escaped with minor injuries cyfr although it should be none at all ..it makes my blood boil that you cant walk down the road without being abused /attacked .... as with other members whom have had the displeasure of this sort of thing (maybe not to your extent) its a damn disgrace that more is not done ..... i live away from accy / ossy now but it saddens me that it is becoming more frequent htere as with most places ....at least one of those horrible little scumbag thugs were caught ...

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Any martial artist will tell you that the best way to win a fight is to not be in it! Second is, if in one, get out of it. Cyfr did the right thing. I'm a trained kickboxer and I would have done the same as he did. I say well done for your quick thinking Cyfr and making the right choice. Many people would freeze up and have been beaten!

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Martial arts don't tend to be about fighting and you can actually be kicked out from a society if you use the training unwisely but actual self defence classes are very useful.

I think on the whole Accrington (and districts ;) ) is very safe to walk around at night and its not too common that racial attacks like these occur.

As a victim of an attack myself I have to say that self defence might seem worthwhile but its not always useless, I got grabbed from behind and pinned down and there is nothing I could've done, as although I knew they had been following me and shouting stuff at me, I really didn't expect it to happen on a main road. I think most people tend to think the best before getting ready to have to defend themselves against an attack.

I knew the main girls name and address and everything but I was advised not to take it any further as it was likely it wouldn't be taken far enough and may have led to more trouble so I didnt bother. I see the girls on their own sometimes as I easily recognised a few of them and it is so tempting to say something to them and make them feel as small as they made me feel but I think they feel worse with the silence I give them, like I couldn't care.

Giving them recognition doesn't always make them feel sorry for what they did.

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Knowing martial arts is ALWAYS a good defence! It's always better to run away than to be beaten however. My opinion is that martial arts training is both good for your health because of the exercise and, as a last resort, good for defence. Bruce Lee is only in the movies though! Escape and call the police is the best advice. That is what Cyfr did and I applaud his actions.

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I think there's a difference between self defence classes and martial arts courses. Yes there are martial arts courses and like others have said you are taught in them not to use the techniques you learn as a means of street fighting. I know a few people who attend such groups and have attained different levels of grading including black belt but they would only ever use martial arts as a last resort.

There is the other problem too if you retaliate you are also likey to end up being done for assault.

We are always told that the best form of defence is avoidance. Even those handbag sprays can get you into trouble.

A similar thing happened to my daughter. The police advised her not to pursue it because they said it would probably only end up worse off for us. Not only would she probably get attacked by the same person again, or by friends of that person but we could well end up with the windows being smashed and graffiti daubed on our house.

It is awful that people should be allowed to get away with things like this though for fear of retaliation.

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Maybe its diffierent now. I had a friend tell me about it because she did kung fu or something and she said even using it for self defence has to be avoided if possible.

Its called Martial ARTS for a reason much greater than self defence in my opinion and shouldn't be used whenever you can.
Self defence classes are just basic moves to get yourself out of certain grips and get yourself out of the situation. Martial arts in my opinion is much different and is taught for different reasons.

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And this is the problem. I think Cyfr did the right thing in trying to get away from the scene. In his case, it was successful. But if it doesn't work, (and there are several assailants), what options do you have? You should be able to fight back with superior force. And this notion of not pursuing prosecution for fear of retaliation is insane and just invites more violence.

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But if you are the one facing the reality of retaliation it isnt insane at all surely. It is abhorrent but you cant condemn someone who is too scared to come forward or to sacred to testify- after all what support would they receive.

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The CPS offer victim support but having never used it I wouldn't be able to comment as to how effective it is.

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Its not really the CPS but the Victim and Witness Care Units that provide this- the problem with that however is that their central remit is to 'secure conviction'- ie to ensure that the victim/witness is sufficiently supported to enable them to testify and thereby for justice to be served. But and lets face it it is a big but- what about fater court? Post sentence?

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If the situation was bad you might be put on witness protection.

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Yes but it would have to be VERY bad. Bear in mind that Police reported crime last year was 5.3 million but the British Crime Survey estimates 10 million offences were committed- one hell of a lot is going unreported. Part of the reason for this is the fear of reporting, the belief that 'nothing gets done anyway and varying degrees of tolerance for crimianl activity in varying communities.

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Threats of violence can cause almost as much distress as actual violence.
Five years ago I presented documentary evidence of threats against me to the police and hurredly left the country for 3 weeks.
On my return I was dismayed that they had done nothing about it, and the threats continued, so lived fearfully for a further 3 months until the police issued them with a warning, and they only did that after I told them I was going to 'arm myself'

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Yes - but it took me a long time to get over the trauma. Thanks for your concern
PS Just noticed you are banned

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Threats of violence does actually class as an assault you know. You should've took things further than that, maybe sued the police for failing to act.

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I would've thought sending pupils back to school than a juvenile prison is a better option anyway.

Recurring threats are dealt with as assaults and it should be in a persons interest to have that threat stopped. Perhaps the problem is that people expect the police to do too much without actually doing something for themselves.

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Normally theres more to pupils misbehaving in class than just being a bad egg. It normally derives from something the teacher has actually said or done towards the pupil.

I had a really disruptive lad in my history class, but it would've been unfair to shove him out of the class as he was also a really intelligent lad who just needed to be kept interested. If the teachers had labelled him as badly behaved and treated him like a delinquent he wouldn't have managed to complete the year as he'd have started to believe the bad things they say.

I've never met anyone in a class who honestly says they cant work because of someone else being disruptive, theyre most likely to just be making excuses to avoid another reason being brought up. I haven't met anyone who has honestly been deprived a top grade due to someone being disruptive.

I'm one of the quiet ones as well at college who would rather not say anything to someone being noisy and just get on with it. I have never suffered because of anyone else, it would be a pathetic excuse if i did claim that.

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You have also got to consider the 'vicious circle' of exclusion- the majority of excluded pupils become invovled in offending when out of school- how can this be a sollution. Better to address the problem on site but because that is the harder option lets just send them home and let it be someone elses problem.

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With great great difficulty especially wwhen things have reached the extent you rightly point out that they can. There is a need to completely overhaul the mindset of how conflict is resolved in a school setting. This is not a quick fix however and takes months to achieve. It is however ultimateky achievable as long as the school and all of its staff both teaching and non teaching are motivated to change.

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People where excluded from the school I went to, particularly at primary school. Funnily enough the teachers were more of a problem there. One got done for assaulting a student, she actually grabbed him by the throat, another male one got done for sexually molesting several of the students.
The situations in schools aren't all one sided. Badly behaved students usually act that way because the teacher has at some point made them feel either incapable or has humiliated them in some way, then the student retaliates by acting abusive towards the teacher to humilate them instead.

You could say their deviant behaviour is a way of them claiming back some dignity. Usually the students aren't bothered by it if they're hard working students, if anything it teaches them how to stay focused in difficult situations.

The only problem I do think is serious in schools is bullying, and often it isn't tackled properly, but that generally isn't because a child is just born bad either, its often an attention/power thing due to some underlying problems at home.

Maybe I just have a very observant nature due to being in these different experiences and I have a very analytical mind which often I cant control. I have to think deeply into possibilities about everything, and then of course with having studied psychology and sociology it always has me looking at angles as to why people do things, not just because they are bad.
I also was bullied by a girl who was just slow in class and had little support. I resolved the bullying by offering to go to her house and help her with her spelling, we wouldve been between 8 and 11 during the worst bits. We're still friends today. Most of the time it just takes a little sympathy and some understanding to help someone understand themselves that they do not need to behave in such a way. Labelling them criminals doesn't help matters, thats when they start to believe thats all they are.

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think the main problem in schools stems from the lack of respect/discipline call it what you may, from some pupils, which again stems from underlying problems as blazey said at some homes, of coarse theres some teachers that dont come up to the mark,you witness this lack of respect frequently on public transport,or in the street, they may be in the minority,cos most kids are ok, but theres also too much pressure nowadays and that can contribute to all kids good n bad. its very easy to say this, but very hard to solve.

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I didn't realise children put their feet up in the lessons. This must be a relatively new thing as obviously I only left high school two years ago. I know that kind of behaviour doesn't go on in my younger sisters primary school either, whom is nearly 9, or she would say.

Perhaps you just happened to come across a class full of delinquents that day or someone you know teaches a particularly bad group of children. I had the 'class clowns' in my schools dont get me wrong, but there was nobody on the scale your saying. Then again in both schools there were one to one support available for children like that, thats not something new, thats just something clearly all schools dont have.