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So many good & valid points being made as there was last night.

It is always difficult when we perhaps are not in view of full pictures of what is going on behind the scenes and where things are at?

I understand people's frustrations and why some have chose to stay away I can imagine it not being an easy desicion for any fan, LD mentioned something earlier on which I have seen which is fan power up close and in action at Anfield & Turf Moor in the past and what it brought about.

The Clouds have gathered for too long over the Club it needs time to breathe and space to grow by that I mean the ownership issues needs resolving once and for all.

I am not sure what I can offer if anything to help that come about?

Moving back to last night
The Club itself had some good initatives
with the game for a fiver
three for two offer
taking the Club out to the Community
players being more involved
as Sparkie has mentioned with the Community Trust development side of things which will bring so many people into contact with the Club across a broad range of age groups and spectrum of people

It may be the first of a few steps but the Trust side of things has to be rebuilt with fans & community etc. first & foremost to become something that people want to be part of whether that's fans coming back through the turnstiles or new fans coming along to support their "Town" or "Community" club.

This may just be a starting point and I hope it grows the more people who become involved in the Club & take an interest the more chance at some point down the line of the Club becoming self sufficient.

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I hope not but maybe Ilyas is as fed up as some supporters with the way things are going off the field ?

At the end of the day two of the people that run the club turned up empty handed in court after the people of Accrington raised a large amount of money in the clubs hour of need and were willing to let it die. I admire the work that JC and JB have done with the team regardless of working for these people however until the ownership issue is sorted I don't think a lot will change, but good luck trying there has been a number of good posts and ideas.

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Maybe the message isn't getting across enough ?

The statement at the top doesn't name names or take sides. It states what all Stanley fans want regardless of which side of the fence they sit.( and non Stanley fans with an affection for the club :) )

Maybe if a group of people delivered that message clearly where it can be seen, and do it often it enough the message may be more powerful ;)

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******, third attempt at typing this out so forgive me if it sounds rambling - it was better structured the first time!

why luckily SM? I couldn't give a toss if they had put my name next to my quote. I dont actually get what is the point of the PDF though. I downloaded it expecting to get an 8 page document outlining what the club proposed to do in this campaign, what I got were 8 quotes on 8 pages. Is the point to show that Accyweb (as a proportionate cross section of the support) is negative? each of the quotes contains a modicom of hope though, so maybe they are emphasising the point that not all is lost?

I didn't attend because i fully expected to a) come out of the meeting none the wiser than I went in and b) fully expected all the hard questions to be fully swerved. I would have been right on both occasions. I have read all the posts on here, the fishy site, Facebook and press release in the Observer - none of which carry any particular meat or substance of what will happen other than a) the Community team will continue to do what it already does but under the headline banner of 'Back the Boys'. b) the commercial team will continue to do what they do but under the same banner - and hope that the business community will be more receptive because of the banner. c) the club will look to its fans to give them the ideas to move the campaign forward. Does that sound about right to those that attended?

As most have already pointed out in this thread and elsewhere for the past three years, the inherant problem at the club is the lack of trust. That wasn't O'Neils fault, it was Whalley's. Can't dress it up any other way. When O'Neil took over it was an opportunity to sweep clean, remove the cobwebs, sweep out the crap and start again. To some extents that happened, but the lack of trust remains. Firstly through inaction and secondly through a web of lies or silences. The questions remain. If I was still financially sound i'd still be on the games, still buying the merchandise and still drunk every match but I still wouldn't be willing to bust a gut to help out with ideas or proactivety. Because I don't know what the motives are behind anything that goes on.

Right, so thats covered.

Moving on. I do really hope that this campaign has some success. I want my club to do well and be succesful within its own environment. I want the community to love us whether they attend matches or not and I want JC and JB to enjoy the successes that they undoubtedly deserve. I do have some ideas that may or not be taken onboard so I will email them across to Martin as soon as, whether they are looked at or not I'll have done my bit and will continue to try to do a bit (as opposed to a lot) and they'll have my best wishes to go with them. I hope that anyone else with any kind of idea will do the same, be it big or small let them know and see if they can expand on it. Let's give them that help and that 'push' and see where it gets us.

Moving on further. If the campaign does not meet with any success then that leaves the club, the hierarchy, and its fanbase in the gutter on their own. We'll know whether there is any hope to be gleaned from the community soon enough, and we'll move on in accordance with that knowledge.

Best of British chaps and I'll see you on the other side :)

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Good Post Rob and a fair summary

Highlighting the pro's & con's

As you say through the OSC & other voices in the past few years ideas have been floated at the Club and usually do just that float past them.

Now is the time if they are serious to take them onboard and look to move them on to the next level.

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I'm not convinced about Rob's quote. I understand why he said it, he probably has one of the most difficult jobs in football because of the situation , and a constant headache from banging his head against the wall, BUT is positivity that difficult to achieve ?

One change and Stanley will have more positivity than they can possibly handle. They will have enough to bottle it, sell it and compete for the Champions League on the proceeds :)

I can't wait to see Jimmy's 101 ways to support the club. do you reckon it was on off the cuff remark and Coley has made him sit in a corner and write them all out. :D I think I would struggle to get to double figures. I hope he has copyrighted the book :)

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Reading some these posts is enough to make you cry.
Here we have a club that so many love and want to help develop in so many ways but, apparently, with one exception - the person who claims to own it.

Stanley needs regime change in the boardroom.

But, and I really don't like to admit to thoughts like this, I fear the club will be forced to sink again before anything changes where it matters. I just hope I'm wrong.

At the moment the team and fans are like the crew and passengers of a ship but it's captain/owner (having already jumped off once) seems willing to see it scuttled.

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The bulk of the views seem to repeat the same feelings, that being the case what can be done ? If you've got a splinter you dig it out with a sharp pin ! So what in this case is the metaphorical pin ? Lawyers, board of enquiry by the FA ? What do you set in motion to dig it out & stop the infection ? Sort that & you're half way to fixing the injury !

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got no interest in getting involved while oneill and co remain

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Well, it's easy for me to agitate from afar, so why not:

back in the mid 1990s, Brighton fans were becoming increasingly upset with their chairman (Bill Archer, I think). They took the fight (peacefully) to him. This included, whilst on an away trip in Lancashire, demonstrations outside his house and the chain of DIY stores he owned. The gruesome twosome appear to lack shame, but perhaps a the threat of a demo and media presence outside businesses with the accompanying embarressment might concentrate peoples minds?

But peacefully.

Maybe with flags, providing of course they are suitably fire retardent...

however, as others have, I note Ilyas' lower profile. I guess he has his reasons and that's fine and I respect that and all he has done for the club. But if the aim is to create room at the top, let's make sure that the person we want to fill it can do.

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Ever heard the old saying 'Everything comes to him who waits' ?

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Perfectly true yerself, trouble wi that though tis very hard to get folk to return when they got used to other things.:eek:

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the present club could have some success in winning people back, the team could undoubtedly do that by winning a lot more games. However I would suspect that should Ilyas finally get the keys to the kingdom then that would spur a huge and immediate influx of glory hunters. The team and the Ultras would then have to keep them there

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agree rob the present team is very fair IMHO, sustaining a long winning run though would be a tough un though, wi small good squad. Ilyas to my mind is the only key to a big improvement.

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I'd rather be in the position of attempting to keep the glory hunters who had turned up, rather than the present situation of trying to entice an indifferent and sceptical public who are resolutely staying away. The only way forward is with Ilyas (provided he still wants to be involved!).

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As you say, Ilyas seems to be the designated saviour, but isn't it expecting a little too much from the man ? It's always coming down to what he can do for the club, maybe he's just as annoyed at the lack of compromise & movement & has decided that his position has been made & that he isn't going to throw more good money after bad.

Let's be honest, wouldn't you feel the same if you were in his position ? There is only so much he or anyone can do & as long as these efforts are rebuked & denigrated personal patience will run out & a declaration of enough is enough will be given. The situation then arises that the fella sits back & tells you to sort your own mess out ! A clear case of biting the hand .........

Some people won't & don't want to learn !

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I think the hope is that Ilyas has decided to sit back and let whatever unfolds be, at the right moment, hopefully, he'll step forward again.

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In regards to Ilyas it seems very unlike him to be so quiet recently and hasn't replied to PM's left for him. He is normally the approachable person that we have been seeking. I am glad that the forum was held for fans to ask what questions they wanted to. There did seem to be a few loaded questions asked of Rob Heys.

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To be honest someone should of told the club theres no point tryin to attract new fans when the existing one get treat like ****e and no body knows who exactly they are giving there money to!

But yet they will smile and say 'come support accy' but then will **** on you behind your back!

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Not sure what you mean by laoded questions ? Until one issue is resolved either way then the questions will always be the same no matter how many forums they arrange. Unfortunatley until somebody comes out and says something else, then the answers willl always be the same too

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It seemed to me that a few questions being asked were to try and get something more out of Rob Heys to see if he has better ideas than just general ones such as putting signs out and about. Ie, putting flesh on the bones of it. I think the way they were worded was to try and make RH looks daft and to show that probably doesn't actually have a concrete strategy to back up the "Back the Boys" campaign.

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I guess it depends what people thought the forum was being held for, an ideas forum or a strategy forum. I thought from the advertising blurb as a campaign it was a planned intiative and therefore assumed the flesh was on the bones and the strategy was concrete.

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I wasn't at the forum but I don't see what the problem is with putting questions to a Chief Executive, especially if he finds them difficult. The question I'd like answered by someone who was there is - did the club management convince you that they have a realistic and achievable strategy?
If the answer is no, then Mr Heys would every right to look daft.

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I don't have a problem with people asking fair questions of our Chief Exec as I thought his answers to the strategy were very general and wooly, things that any of us could've come up with. This is what concerns me about the campaign, its all well and good coming up with ideas it's the implementation that will define it. I think that the questions asked were good but were asked to prove a point hence why I was saying loaded questions.

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There is the press conference launch here Accrington Stanley | Facebook in audio in three parts.:)

What I would like to see is more ideas from the Club that involves them all, involving the fans is one thing in collecting ideas but the Club need to take the lead and come come up with the iniatives.

In the local Friday paper last week the Clarets had a two page spread entitled "Ready Eddie Go" which was basically local business's supporting the appointment of Eddie Howe as Burnley Manager.

That's the sort of thing that works as it shows cohesion between the Club & the local Business Community.

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Sorry, BDC, if it came across that way, but I wasn't implying you had a problem.

As for Stanley and the local business community, how many barge-pole manufacturers are there in Accrington?

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Google Page Ranking, sorry mate but dream on! Our club has shot itself in the foot on more than one occasion as far as local business is concerned. If they, or anyone else thinks that local businesses are going to jump at the chance of getting involved then they are delusional. Change at the top has to come first, then and only then can the club start to move forward.

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Exactly !!!

Our club at the moment is doing the exact opposite to bfc and other top flight clubs as with burnley ( I have researched :) ) the club cannot exist without it's town and it's town cannot survive without it's club, if the club struggles as does it's town if the club is on the up the town benefits ( employment, economics and general wellbeing of the town is up - win=win situation - hence why it does play an important role, Brendan flood works on that forefront. We knew 48 yrs ago and given chance again not learning!! That's what's the problem.

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Pete sorry if I didn't explain myself the point I was trying to make is the Club has to be proactive they have to be out there on the knocker. in peoples faces telling the Business's & community we do exsist and what can we actively do to encourage them to become involved.

Looking to put things right and not asking what you can do for your Club but what can your Club do for you!

Hope that clears my point up?

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Neil, I did understand your point, sorry if my reply seemed to say otherwise!

It is all well and good should the club actually become proactive, however my point still stands. Whilst Whalley, and to some extent O'Neil (SOS campaign cock up, lies etc) remain at Stanley, then no local businessman/woman in their right mind would touch us with the preverbial bargepole.

It is true to say that some change has occured at the club, you only have to look at what Lew has done with the shop, and what the Community team has achieved, however I am hard pressed to come up with any others.

Unless and untill changes are made at the top of the pile, then Im afarid that all the good ideas and objectives will amount to nothing more than false promises.............not because the instigators are paying lipservice, but because those above them, the people that pull the strings will, by the very nature of still being at the club, put off/hinder any local businesses looking to get invloved. Whether that involvement is financial or otherwise.............the old saying applies, 'Once bitten, Twice shy'

When you sit down and think about it, that really is a sad state of affairs................in laymans terms, the club is NOT trusted, and neither Whalley or O'Neil have done anything to improve that situation.

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But you mention whalley or find out whalley still is the owner - many businesses won't be interested. Trouble is mud sticks and still opinion that people won't come back to the club so still not ridding the problem that's why ownership is a big deal

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Same minds think alike UK lol :D

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LOL, yes, and trust you to say it in less bloomin words than me :)

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I take onboard and know the points of the ownership issues and like a one legged duck it keeps going around and around.

Can we as fans influence what goes on at the top?

Is there a way for us as fans to emphasise and support those points?

At the end of the day for me at the moment it's about the team on the pitch and I don't want to lose sight of that, that is something we can all influence and do something about by supporting them that surely is the common ground for us all?

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What ? :confused:

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Dave engage me in this

I come in Giftprint tomorrow I want five polo shirts

Do you just look to sell the five polo shirts or do you engage in the fact that I may perhaps work for someone who buys these things regulary and perhaps more beside?

What I mean as a business you look to tailor to the customers needs.

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I know what you mean BUT, lets forget the sound bytes and get straight to the point, both need each other, the town (SHOULD) benefit from having a football league club BIGGER BUT the club needs the local community and businesses to fund it's survival. As both Pete, Mel, Yourself and many others have pointed out, you can't keep taking peoples money without giving something back. The problem for years has been the giving back is usually something from the back end of a bull. something has to give and the club has to be the giver to regain the trust. Which takes us round the ever bigger circle, nobody will beleive a word until the ownership changes.

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Something Jimmy or John said at the forum made me wonder. I think it was Jimmy that said they didn't know of any bitterness from the fans following the SOS appeal.

Does this mean Accyweb is not representative of the fans ? Some people we speak to at the shop who are Stanley season ticket holders don't have a good word to say about what happened then and is still happening, yet they aren't Accyweb members. Are they in the minority as well ?

So do people at the top really know the true feelings of fans, after all there has never been a presence to tell them otherwise, or are people who post on here really just the minority who feel things aren't right. ?

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well accyweb or none accyweb. ive yet to speak to "Anyone" wi a good word to say about the infamous 2, the SOS Appeal, or Local Business people who are happy wi em.:(

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The only thing ASFC wants from any business in town is simple MONEY, they have sponged as much as they could from the people of Accrington with the SOS and now want the business money and what will they give back to the town ?? Nothing thats what and probably stick two fingers up to them once they have spent that money as well.

I'm all in agreement with supporting the team as many say but the people in charge have to go to move forward as said before.

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But who owns the club?? Is it EW who has 51% of the shares who has no active part in the day to day running of the club ,or is it D O'neill Who says hes buying the shares off EW under an agreement,but has yet to rase the cash and is only at the club every now and again,or is it IK our chairman whos money along with ours saved the club from folding,difficult to know really and i guess thats why we find our selfs with this new venture by Rob Lew Martin and other stanley staff to try and hold there own in an uncertain future.IMHO:)

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Officially it's EW isn't it ?

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If 51% means you own it then yes,but if hes not interested in the day to day running of the club and has no active part in any of the decision, which come from the board or Rob what can he do..

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To be honest that is probably all most football clubs want from local businesses. I think the only thing most of those businesses want in return is to know that their hard earned is actually being used correctly and anything the club can do for the business can be reciprocated. I'll let you figure out what I'm trying to say :D

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The club needs investment and expertise. If hanging on to those shares means that investment and expertise can't happen then the answer is obvious, so whats the hold up ?

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Spot on Dave:)

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Course it is but I think I'm too late for the Commercial Manager's job :D

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Good questin!!may be hes waiting for someone to offer cash,only Eric knows how much he wants for the shares , Getting back to "Back the Boys" this was thought up by Rob Lew Martin and JC to open up the club and try and interact with the supporters,its whats been called for by meany for a while now and lets hope theres more to come,if owt good comes of it then thats good in my book:)

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What is his role now then ?

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Think hes still on the board and Managing Director,

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There you are, Dave, you've got an order.


PS - He wants "O'Neill and Whalley out" printing on 'em. ;)

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He's starring in "How To Win Friends And Influence People":rolleyes:

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The printing will be free :D

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So EW doesn't get any income from it? He don't have to do the day to day that's what robs there for but does bet he still has a say in what's going on with the day to day :rolleyes:

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So what income do you think EW gets from the club SM, and how long do you think Rob would last if he was leting EW have a say in the day to day of the club if Ilyas thought that!! lets not foreget that its Robs chance and may be his only chance to prove to Ilyas that he is the right man in the job, and i cant see Rob wanting to jeopardize his position. IMHO

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Part of the problem with Stanley is that it’s never taken itself seriously, it been too accepting of tat and make-do policies in the past and a something will turn up attitude to the future of the club; this is an attitude that pre dates the current club and still haunts all of us today.

Nothing less than a full on engagement with the community and a substantial inward investment into its infrastructure will do if Stanley is to remain a viable asset to anyone.
We have had to very good seasons under Coley working with a minimum budget, that clearly can’t go on if supporters are staying away and the business community won’t invest in the club with the two aforementioned gentlemen insitu.

Maybe it’s time to take a different approach, maybe if some of the community’s Key Businesses with an interest in the club; along with supportive elements of the council where to form a delegation and took the message directly to the board that there is a total lack of faith in the current establishment, maybe someone may wake up.

Failing that; form another SOS campaign and buy them out

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Must admit when I asked the question I felt uneasy with the answers:o

I think regardless of if they read the messageboard or not they must now have understood some of the depth of feeling towards what has gone on, certainly after the forum.

There are bigger questions that we perhaps can pose but whether we get the answers to those I am not sure?

I suppose something Mab has posted makes you think we are on the outside looking in what must it be like on the inside looking out?

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Taking on some of Doug's points you can also be in a system that means you can become over streched in staffing terms and perhaps just end up fire fighting on a day to day basis?

Who would support an SOS campaign?

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Not much anybody can add to that :)

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How about this for a novel idea. You give the club some money and they give you a share, bit like actually owning a stake in the club. Then if there's enough people owning these small stakes they could call it something like a community club. Bit far fetched da ya reckon ? :)

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or try ... you could give the club a lot of money and they give you a share, bit like actually owning a stake in the club - except that it isn't cos your share wasn't a share it was a share package which isn't actually a share cos it was never registered
:alright:

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well i must be totally stupid, cos that to me is a Criminal Offence? Deception?:confused: or did i have a bad dream.?:rolleyes:

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Is that what happened with the (in)famous share issue that DonGon pulled eighteen months ago?

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We've all been fooled and continuously fooled by the cardboard owner and his twin and will always try to fool us! It's still happening all under handed of course they honestly think we're stupid. Think those that bought shares get together and pressurise them to get it registered wonder if trading standards apply to footy clubs ???

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For legal purposes, a football club is no different from any other business enterprise; those of you who did purchase shares 18 months ago - or maybe even prior - may wish to look at this:

Members/Shareholders

If you are concerned about whether your name is on the shareholder's register or not, then just follow those instructions.

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Oo that's quite interesting certainly for people that bought shares and not listed - thanks Tealeaf :D

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nice to see the Stanley players playing an active role, also looks like the ASCT is off to a flyer:)

Back to school for Reds | Accrington Observer - menmedia.co.uk

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:( Barrow Barrow Barrow Barrow Barrow Only in your Dreams:rolleyes::D

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You can check out the Trust on the book of faces these days;

Login | Facebook

There's also some twits in yon portakabin :)

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i didn't have ceased goin down town as much since they shut the bogs, was at the match anyway.:) just wonder how many other owd gits like me are now avoiding town?:eek:

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am well aware of those bogs ta sherry, its a principal thing wi me, till this stupid council reverse the decision about the peel st bogs sod em.;)

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Why?...what did it say?

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I think Sherry means there is a new committment by the club to use advertising hoardings to show match details. I do remember being surprised to see one somewhere, but I can't remember where it was!:(

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There was an poster advertising the game pinned on the blackboard outside the Crown if that counts? :)

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Why not ? Somebody may have been walking past the Crown at about 7.40 on Tuesday night and not known there was match on until they read the poster :D

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The Crown advertising board was aimed at the hundreds, maybe thousands of cars, buses, walkers that passed by on Monday night and Tuesday.

I like the massive council sponsored board at the end of Gigg lane on Manchester Road Bury. Anybody passing by that knows exactly when Bury are playing. Our friends at the Turf have one as well. Don't do their main matches but it also has reserve games on as well.

I believe our CEO is on the case:)

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Maybe we should look at a sandwich board person or walk round with big placards like they do in the big smoke for the various attractions.

Joking apart the trailer unit that used to be around would be the perfect thing if something could be implemented into it with being able to change opposition dates & kick off time the beauty of being mobile is it can be moved around.

Or on the Crown Wall but also needs to be something in the centre as well alongside Ossy Mills these are also musts.

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Didn't want to start another thread on the thorny topic of ownership but I found these two articles of interest.
First the problem.
Stanley owner wait delays deals (From Lancashire Telegraph)

Then one possible answer.
BBC - Matt Slater: Fans club together to claim fair share

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Interesting comment in the Telegraph article. How come players like Jimmy Ryan contract can't be expanded because of the situation but Ian Craney was given an 18 month contract :confused:

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I don't know, but I guess it takes two to sign a contract, and maybe some players are understandably reluctant to commit to a club whose owner(s), whoever they may be, seem unwilling to commit to its future.

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Ian Craney's 18-month contract takes him to the end of next season.

Jimmy Ryan currently has a 2-year contract and would expect/deserve at least another 2-year contract when it expires at the end of this season. Maybe the current regime won't sanction any contract beyond the end of next season?

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Good point :)

Given his potential even 2 years is probably too short if as expected they want to cash him on him one day

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But, I thought that it was signed 18 mths ago???

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Jimmy Ryan, Phil Edwards and Chris Turner all signed two-year deals in June 2009 ... they will expire at the end of this season.

My point was that the current regime may not be committing funds for more than one season at a time.

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My point was that the current regime may not be committing funds for more than one season at a time.[/quote]

There will be some of us who hope that it's because they know they won't be around next season. The current regime, that is, not the club.
The big question is, who goes first - Hosni Mubarrak or the Cardboard Millionaire?

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Mubarak, unless we organise a protest occupation of the Broadway precinct.

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At the lower end of the Football Leasgue it is very rare for any club to offer more than two year deals. We have had enough players who have suffered long term injuries. Liam, Cavanagh, The defender we signed from Hereford (he hardly played at all) we cant afford to have money tied up in players who cant play. risking money on long term deals could finish us
two year max. But please dont let it drag on so we lose any good young ones.

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Are you referring to Mr Andy Tretton? How dare you....I'll have you know he played a gargantuan 7 times for us and played a blinder against Ramsbottom in the Lancashire Junior Cup ;) :)

Seriously if the power struggle is making players question their future at the Crown it's just one more in a long list of reasons to (sorry Macca) "Jog On Don".

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Sorry Whalley Red :o Mis-read your post!! 2 year contracts are iffy at our level, but exceptions must always be made, Jimmy Ryan is an exception!! :)

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Bang on the nail Joe, Mr Ryan will play at a higher level i have no doubt, just hope its wi stanley.:)

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apologise ye not Sir Monk de chip, feel free to reproduce the quote as ofte as ye like