Diving Divas

[jambutty]

Ok.

The proposed argument to bring in video replays would slow the game down too much (thus taking away a very large percentage of money being put into the game). Replays for diving, replays for offsides, replays for free-kicks, replays for penalties, replays for throw-ins, replays for corner kicks etc etc. Where does it stop?

Your suggestions are well thought out Jambutty, however involve a lot of erasing the past. It can not be judged by panel anywhere that had the 'illegal goal' not been given by the referee, then the rest of the game would've had the same result, just minus that goal. Thus making football a laughable spectacle full of panels and hearings arguing about the past.

Football's flaws make it the exciting, electric game that it is week in week out, attempting to eradicate them all would make the game dull and lifeless.

Most people will agree that there is too much cheating going on in the game today. I don’t mean just fouling a player but the underhand stuff like pulling a shirt, pushing a player out of the way rather than a fair shoulder charge, diving in the box as well as elsewhere and not forgetting the ubiquitous flailing arms when jumping to head a ball. What about holding out an arm to prevent an opponent from getting near the ball.

I accept that it is difficult not to raise both arms when jumping to head a ball, but watch a player doing so when not challenged by another. The arms don’t go up anywhere as near as much.

I see nothing exciting about my team losing to the only goal that has been gained by a player diving in the box. In fact all that does is create bad blood.

 

[jambutty]

Like I said I was stating fact.Sky started the demise with giving more money to the rich clubs.Then came 'The Russian' at Chelski,then 'The Gnome'at Old Trafford and another 'Yank' at Anfield with Gillett.I feel slowly but surely our game is being slowly choked by foreign investment.

But that isn’t part of this topic. Although I agree with you in principle.

 

[mthead]

Most people will agree that there is too much cheating going on in the game today. I don’t mean just fouling a player but the underhand stuff like pulling a shirt, pushing a player out of the way rather than a fair shoulder charge, diving in the box as well as elsewhere and not forgetting the ubiquitous flailing arms when jumping to head a ball. What about holding out an arm to prevent an opponent from getting near the ball.

I accept that it is difficult not to raise both arms when jumping to head a ball, but watch a player doing so when not challenged by another. The arms don’t go up anywhere as near as much.

I see nothing exciting about my team losing to the only goal that has been gained by a player diving in the box. In fact all that does is create bad blood.

In some circumstances the arms go up naturally to protect ones self aswell.Wouldn't fancy challenging for a ball with Vidic,he doesnt use his arms just thunders in like a bull ready to gore the matador.

 

[jambutty]

The fourth official is told by the referee how much time to add on.

Well there you are then. I always thought that it was the fourth official who determined how much time to add on after consulting with the referee.

We live and learn all the time.

 

[jambutty]

No Jambutty but it will be 'swings and roundabouts'

“Swings and roundabouts” Gayle means there will be winners and losers. Would anyone like to be a loser if they were cheated into being a loser?

plus if this sort of thing came in to force it would limit the number of divers long term until it wasn't so much an issue.

That’s the idea! Stop the divers whilst at the same time rewarding the team for being sinned against!

 

[jambutty]

No, it's not fair to them. But maybe you're team could be playing against somebody whose main goal threat is banned for diving. Thus tipping the balance in your favour slightly.

That’s almost advocating it all balances out in a season – but we know that it doesn’t.

The result of a match is the important bit and cheating should not be allowed to influence that result.

 

[jambutty]

Where are all these ex-referees going to come from ? There is already one ex-referee at each game as an assessor.

In a few years time they will be lucky to have enough referees for all levels of senior football in this country.The number of games without referees at grass roots level is already over 20% every weekend now. The constant abuse they get and video scrutiny will only increase that percentage, eventually upper levels of the game will feel the knock on from this.

That’s why I stated that it probably wouldn’t be practical to have a panel of ex-referees at each match but a central panel to view the evidence from all complaints after the games.

 

[jambutty]

You say where will this money come from, but have we not just had an announcement from Sky that they are putting even more money into the game? Some of this money shoud therefore be given to the referees in their pay packet. In most other occupations, if you do a demanding job, you get a decent wage for it. This could act as an incentive to get more referees at the grass roots level.

Excellent suggestion.

 

[jambutty]

You should put yourself forward Dave Do you recon you could put up with it again?

And here we have a perfect example of how a thread gets dragged off topic.

 

[jambutty]

In some circumstances the arms go up naturally to protect ones self aswell.Wouldn't fancy challenging for a ball with Vidic,he doesnt use his arms just thunders in like a bull ready to gore the matador.

I couldn’t agree with you more, the arms do go up to protect yourself against the opponent’s arms going up. Two wrong don’t make it right though.

 

[cashman]

the whole concept of "diving" could be eradicated over time by coming down hard on the manager/as well as the player. some high profile managers always(never see the incident) to me that encourages certain players to dive.

 

[AccyJay]

the whole concept of "diving" could be eradicated over time by coming down hard on the manager/as well as the player. some high profile managers always(never see the incident) to me that encourages certain players to dive.

Very true. I think that a directive needs to be put in place from FIFA.

 

[jambutty]

the whole concept of "diving" could be eradicated over time by coming down hard on the manager/as well as the player. some high profile managers always(never see the incident) to me that encourages certain players to dive.

Agreed cashman but you still have to establish who is diving and when before you can crack down on them. Until that happens managers will continue to hint to their players to take a pecuniary advantage whenever they can and players will do so anyway without encouragement from their manager.

The name of the game is to win a match and if a team can do so by bending the rules they will. Well most of them will.

A FIFA, EUFA or FA directive is only as good as the teeth behind it AccyJay but it is they who must set things in motion instead of just paying lip service to the problem.

Heavy club and individual fines and points deduction have been put forward as a means of punishing the cheats but first you have to prove the case.

I have outlined two ways of doing so and maybe there are other ways but no has come up with any so far.

 

[Mancie]

I do not like the idea of videos/cameras deciding the result of a football match..jambutty I'll bet after you watched the busby babes in action the notion of having a stewards enquiry at half time or full time, and then another enquiry a few days later would have been blasphemy!.... why should we let telivision and technology change our game?

 

[cashman]

nobody would be diving jambutty,if it was eradicated, prevention is better than cure. springs to my mind.

 

[jambutty]

I do not like the idea of videos/cameras deciding the result of a football match..jambutty I'll bet after you watched the busby babes in action the notion of having a stewards enquiry at half time or full time, and then another enquiry a few days later would have been blasphemy!.... why should we let telivision and technology change our game?

Blasphemy is reserved for religious issues. In spite of some people claiming otherwise, football never has been, nor is it now a religion. It’s a game that has got above itself and turned into big business.

If the Busby Babes lost a match due to the opposition diving in the penalty area and scoring from a penalty I would not be happy. I would be equally unhappy if the said Busby Babes won a match due to a dive in the penalty area – not that any of them would do that.

Diving to gain a pecuniary advantage is CHEATING – plain and simple.

Most people agree that diving is bringing the game into disrepute and debate and moan to each other about the unfairness. Some try to console themselves and even excuse diving by suggesting that the wrongs even themselves out over a season. But that is absolute nonsense.

If you don’t like the idea of using TV retrospectively then come up with an alternative to stop diving and other cheating ways.

It is time that every avenue is explored to get rid of the cheats and if that means use TV then so be it.

 

[jambutty]

nobody would be diving jambutty,if it was eradicated, prevention is better than cure. springs to my mind.

It’s all too easy to glibly state, “Eradicate diving”.

My question is HOW?

 

[cashman]

It’s all too easy to glibly state, “Eradicate diving”.

My question is HOW?

thought i answered that in post 51. thats my solution.

 

[jambutty]

the whole concept of "diving" could be eradicated over time by coming down hard on the manager/as well as the player. some high profile managers always(never see the incident) to me that encourages certain players to dive.

How do you propose to come down hard on managers and players?

Threaten the wrong doers with fines, suspensions or points deductions?

Fine but how does the FA prove their allegation? It’s great if the ref or either of the assistants sees the incident, but what about all those incidents that go unseen by no one, except the manager of the wronged team and the team’s supporters?

It’s all very well introducing rules but they are waste of time if they are not enforced, rigorously. And right now too many divers get away with their cheating.

 

[cashman]

It’s all very well introducing rules but they are waste of time if they are not enforced, rigorously. And right now too many divers get away with their cheating.--- that statement is beyond any doubt.but my suggestion of(come down hard) on managers and players, certainly would not mean fining them,of which fines mean nothing to these overpaid prima-donnas,as for exact form of punishment,i would prefer to let the authorities sort that one,though my favourite personally would be points-deduction.