Oswaldtwistle War Memorial - Page 2

Gayle · 05-07-2009, 12:11

It is slightly frustrating Retlaw, that you knew this in advance of the names being engraved and yet you deliberately chose to not communicate with the council and the people who were organising it.

Now you're doing exactly what I predicted and pointing out how wrong the memorial is and blaming other people for those faults!!

Retlaw · 05-07-2009, 12:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

It is slightly frustrating Retlaw, that you knew this in advance of the names being engraved and yet you deliberately chose to not communicate with the council and the people who were organising it.

Now you're doing exactly what I predicted and pointing out how wrong the memorial is and blaming other people for those faults!!

Wrong again Gayle. I did contact the council, and got the run around. Could'nt get any where with them, contacted my local councillor and he could'nt get any where either, even the Telegraph got nowhere other than the responce from britcliffe if Mr Homes has a probem he should contact Roy Lockwood. I don't have a problem
Some of the mistakes they already knew about, they are greyed out on the list that was available online, but they've been included.

Roy Lockwood knew I already had all the men from Ossy well over two years ago. PLus 165 pictures of them.

Why should I go to the trouble of contacting him, I have enough work to do without chasing amateurs, to correct obvious errors, he should have contacted me, he said he would at Bill Turners funeral.
Before you accuse me of any thing, you should get all you facts together. Nobody question Bill Turner's works on the Pals, and the Memorials he did, so why should my work be questioned.

Retlaw.

Gayle · 05-07-2009, 13:32

I'm not questioning your work - in fact the opposite, on many, many occasions I have called you the expert in this subject.

If you contacted the council and got the run around then that's a shame because I knew that we'd get to this point. There's about 300 names on that memorial and as far as I'm concerned every single one of them could be wrong - I personally have no way of knowing which ones are right and which ones are wrong.

Yes, I could go and check in the library etc but like you pointed out - you've been doing this for 26 years, I'm more likely to make a mistake or not get anywhere if I started checking.

I honestly don't know what the answer is to this now!

Neil · 05-07-2009, 13:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

I honestly don't know what the answer is to this now!

It is probably too late now.

Sounds to me like several people have been rather stubborn and put personal differences before the honour of the men concerned.

Retlaw · 05-07-2009, 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

I'm not questioning your work - in fact the opposite, on many, many occasions I have called you the expert in this subject.

If you contacted the council and got the run around then that's a shame because I knew that we'd get to this point. There's about 300 names on that memorial and as far as I'm concerned every single one of them could be wrong - I personally have no way of knowing which ones are right and which ones are wrong.

Yes, I could go and check in the library etc but like you pointed out - you've been doing this for 26 years, I'm more likely to make a mistake or not get anywhere if I started checking.

I honestly don't know what the answer is to this now!

Here is proof of one of their mistakes, neither they or the tripe dreser could find him in the Commonwealth War Graves, so they pick one that has no family information which they think can't be contested.

George Booth survived 10 months in hospital and went back to the front and was discharged from the army in 1919, his address on discharge 10 Mason St. Check, Check and Check again. Thats what I do, thats why it takes me a long time, I hate mistakes.
Why did'nt you go round to Roy Lockwood and tell him, before the list was sent for engraving.
Retlaw.

Gayle · 05-07-2009, 14:18

I didn't go round to Roy Lockwood because I had no idea what was wrong and what wasn't.

Neil · 05-07-2009, 17:33

Maybe they can turn the plaques over and start again on the back

Tealeaf · 06-07-2009, 09:22

Given the large number of Germans who were working in the UK prior to 1914 (a little like the Polish presence in the UK today) I wonder if there would have been any in Ossy who would have returned home and then been subsequently killed while wearing the coal scuttle? If so, should their names be on the monument?

garinda · 06-07-2009, 10:08

When this idea was first mooted they asked for all the names of the town's war dead to be included, that's why my mum contacted Roy Lockwood about her father, who died in 1944.

I can understand why this hasn't happened, as there would be a lot more names. I just wondered why they asked via the press for a list relating to every war, then changed their minds.

Looking in old articles of the Observer, it's clear the council were made aware of mistakes relating to the list of the fallen from 1914-18, way back in 2004, thanks to Retlaw.

Memorial bid for forgotten heroes - News - Accrington Observer

Sadly the whole thing is becoming a shambles.

We can split an atom, but we can't make a correct list of those from Oswaldtwistle who gave their lives in the Great War.

Retlaw · 06-07-2009, 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

When this idea was first mooted they asked for all the names of the town's war dead to be included, that's why my mum contacted Roy Lockwood about her father, who died in 1944.

I can understand why this hasn't happened, as there would be a lot more names. I just wondered why they asked via the press for a list relating to every war, then changed their minds.

Looking in old articles of the Observer, it's clear the council were made aware of mistakes relating to the list of the fallen from 1914-18, way back in 2004, thanks to Retlaw.

Memorial bid for forgotten heroes - News - Accrington Observer

Sadly the whole thing is becoming a shambles.

We can split an atom, but we can't make a correct list of those from Oswaldtwistle who gave their lives in the Great War.

Lets hope Gayle reads this.
They had enough notice about those missing.
They also knew who I was.

Retlaw.

Retlaw · 06-07-2009, 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf

Given the large number of Germans who were working in the UK prior to 1914 (a little like the Polish presence in the UK today) I wonder if there would have been any in Ossy who would have returned home and then been subsequently killed while wearing the coal scuttle? If so, should their names be on the monument?

One way to find out is to go through the 1911 census for Oswaldtwistle looking for German names, might take you a while though.

Retlaw.

Tealeaf · 08-07-2009, 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retlaw

One way to find out is to go through the 1911 census for Oswaldtwistle looking for German names, might take you a while though.

Retlaw.

It was pretty much a speculative question, Retlaw, and it would certainly take massive time and effort to undertake such an exercise and that would only be the start. There was just a passing possibility that you may have picked up something in the local papers from the period and immeadiatly afterwards. I know that in Kings College Chapel, Cambridge, there is a German list (ex-students) next to the British dead (which includes the name of Rupert Brooke) and there is another example I have seen but at the moment I just can't remember where.

Retlaw · 08-07-2009, 10:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf

It was pretty much a speculative question, Retlaw, and it would certainly take massive time and effort to undertake such an exercise and that would only be the start. There was just a passing possibility that you may have picked up something in the local papers from the period and immeadiatly afterwards. I know that in Kings College Chapel, Cambridge, there is a German list (ex-students) next to the British dead (which includes the name of Rupert Brooke) and there is another example I have seen but at the moment I just can't remember where.

There were two members of the Accrington Pals who could speak fluent German. one of them was Anton Peltzer.

Retlaw

Atarah · 08-07-2009, 20:01

Hi, for anyone who cant get to Oswaldtwistle to see the memorial, here are a few photographs.

Retlaw · 08-07-2009, 21:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atarah

Hi, for anyone who cant get to Oswaldtwistle to see the memorial, here are a few photographs.

Do you mean like these right way up.
Light were'nt to good it was raining.
Retlaw.