Detention without charge poll
 

Given half of those detained to 28 days were innocent, do you support or oppose increasing detention without charge to 42 days?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

i thought this was settled and the laws have been passed or are you just trying to stir up more anti labour thought

dont wory yourself most of us are fed up with them we dont need you to point out that they are making a cock up of things and besides i think most of us have more pressing issues than how long a terrorist can be held like price of food and fuel

if i am wrong and the issue hasnt been sorted yet please add another option - i couldnt give a toss so that everyone can vote

thankyou

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Why have you made it a public view vote? I suspect a lot of people will ignore this thread now.

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so that if you disagree with him he can put your name on a hit list lol

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Its not anti labour no, I've met lots of Labour voters, and past and present Labour MP's who are against this legislation.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I voted “Opposed” because I think that it is wrong to detain someone for more than 24 hours without being charged. In fact I think that it is wrong to detain someone without arresting them for a specific crime.

But that is a typical loaded question andrewb and you could have put “Given half of those detained to 28 days were guilty, do you support or oppose increasing detention without charge to 42 days?”

The fact that half of those detained were innocent or guilty should have no bearing on the issue. But you have phrased the question to push people towards the oppose camp. But then that is what politicians and prospective politicians do when they favour a particular result and look to the electorate to go along with that view.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

So that neither those for or against can say the poll is fixed as has been accused of national polls.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

but is this poll relevant , we have had it before and discussed all the views from how an innocent man can be held without charge been disgusting to hold them as long as it takes to catch a terrorist

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I'd rather the goverment focussed on locking up for more than 42 days all the thieves, gun/knive carrying kids, and general ruffian/anti social crowd.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Please vote to support the increase, in the hope that someone will eventually get the message.;)

Even though, like Dickie Davis's by-election, it's all fairly pointless now, as the government won the vote to increase the time of suspected terrorists could be held without charge from 28 to 42 days.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Well I refuse to vote - the whole bye election was a fiasco and so is this.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

in agreement here

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

And if the poll is supposed to back up DD's stance then it's flawed anyway. It's only dealing with one subject when he 'allegedly' stood on many subjects :D

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Vote in support then, as a protest.

Unlike the fiasco of a by-election we don't have the option of voting for a selection of other nutters.:D

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I'm writing my protest placards as we speak.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Yes, he also wants to rename the Palace of Westminster as Winnie Mandela House.:D

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Well i voted YES (just to tip the balance)

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Indeed I did it like that on purpose, to see what the reaction is once people understand that many are innocent. As many automatically see the word terrorist suspect and want to bang them up for life, but thats not what this legislation is about as I appreciate you understand Jambutty. :)

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

This question is nothing to do with the by-election, feel free to vote.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Let's just be glad Myra Hindley is dead and burned, otherwise Dickie Davis, the fighter for people's freedom, would be probably be trying to get her released.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

How stupid.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Tend to agree with Jammybutty. The question has not been impartially presented and confirms my suspicion that Cyfr tries to get people to agree with him by asking loaded questions - he's obviously got a great career in politics ahead of him!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I agree.

Very poorly worded, and weighted.

The poll I set up was at least fair.:)

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I have already agreed that without knowing the argument people see 'terrorist' and think 'lock them up longer'. As we have seen in national polls, once people hear the argument a lot are swayed.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

With his talent for selling political ideas to us plebs, he could go all the way to the top

....that's if Peter Britcliffe's retired by then.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

What has Dickie Davis and The World of Sport got to do with this:confused:

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Vote
Support!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

To me David Davis is a bit of a Dickie.;)

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

No, I don't want to lock innocent people up and destroy their lives for no increased safety.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

You complain when I call you patronising, but you prove yourself worthy of that word time and time again. People are not as stupid as you think - they do actually undrstand that a "terrorist suspect" is just that, without any prompting from you.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I will vote - if you can explain to me WHY so many innocent people are being detained.

Your figure of 50% indicates that 50% of people are innocent when in fact, that is not necessarily true, they are released but does that actually mean they are innocent?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Ok, what about if Myra Hindley was still alive?

She'd served her lawful sentence, would you and Dickie Davis be pleading for her freedom?

Or is some freedom different from other freedoms?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Vote support,
if even one innocent life might be saved from terrorist murderers.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Why did a huge amount of people change their mind once we had a public debate in the last month?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I would think he would make a better defence lawyer for terrorists. He's gullible enough to fight their corner and beleive everything they tell him.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Which it wont so please stop the childish propaganda gary!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Absolute rubbish Gary. This is why I got ****ed off in the original thread. You know very well theres a difference between innocent people and guilty people. Stop being so silly.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

if a fanatical tory thinks its a bad idea to investigate fully any individual suspected of been a terrorist should i be assuming that tories dont want terrorists caught ?


i bet you any amount of money if cameron suggested 1 year detention without charge he would be right behind the idea

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

That's soooooooooo rich, coming from you.

http://www.bittermancircle.com/my%20...tDeadHorse.gif

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Tell that to the victims and families of the victims of 7/7 and 9/11.
If it prevented things like this happening then im all for it.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Not silly.

A fair question.

In law she had more than served the sentence for the crimes she committed.

Would you be campaiging for her release, because her freedom was important?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I do so pity people without stamina.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I talked to Rachel North, 7/7 survivor. She said 42 days would not help because it was not needed. She said doing what we've done increasing the detention is doing the terrorists job for them. All they want to do is take our freedom and they're suceeding unfortunately. :(

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

wasnt a girl from accrington killed on 7/7 ?

for a young tory who i assume is hoping to enter accrington polotics i do hope that it gets remembered that he is all for less been done to catch people who do things like this

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Quite simply because the legislation allows anyone to be detained without any evidence at all. They can be detained for the whole period 'just incase' some eviendence were to come to light. I don't think its right to do this to innocent people, it should just be terrorists punished.

They're as innocent as anybody else who is arrested and then let go.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

terrorism is like cancer , you have to take some of the good to be sure you get all the bad

im sure if you google enough there will be cases where guilty people have been let go because time ran out to question them and they went on to commit terroism

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

So much ignorance in this thread. Disagreeing is fine but being blatently ignorant to what I am saying is another thing.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

On the subject of ignoring - have you bothered answering my question yet?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

So the Tories agenda goes something along the lines of; Do less about terrorism, hug a hoodie etc?

Wow, you've got my vote :rolleyes:

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

...and can be financially compensated.

Sadly the innocent victims of terrorism don't find much use for money, after they're dead.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I think Myra Hindley would have had to be released if she hadn't conveniently died.

As you say, she had served longer than her original sentence so the government would have had to release her.

However, no government wants to be remembered as the government who released Myra Hindley.

I wonder if she really is dead or if we were just told that and she's living abroad somewhere......I don't remember seeing any photos from the funeral in the papers.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

No, not at all. As I said, lock them up and throw away the key, if they're guilty.

Locking innocent people up is wrong. It creates more anger in communities where terrorism has originated in the past. Its counter productive.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Even this second poll on the subject looks just like your party's attempt to block increased security measures, i.e. it's failed.

How long does it take for a loser to realise he's lost?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

i think it should be free , holding a person is one thing but charging them is ridiculous

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I have done?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Yeah but surely the point of detaining them is to find out if they are guilty?
You can't try and gather evidence on people without arresting them because you could be risking national security.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Indeed, but 42 days is too much. The crown prosecution service themselves say that 28 days is easily enough. Thats why I don't back 42 days legislation, it is just being used to make the government look tough, while achieving nothing.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

But you haven't answered my question at all. What is it about some people that makes the police want to detain them? Are innocent people being victimised randomly? You are making it sound like the police randomly swoop on innocent people and detain them without any reason i.e. just plucking them off the street. What I want to know is why these people are plucked off the street in the first place - what makes the police think they are terrorists.

Do you have any case studies?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Well I've not lost elsewhere. Only on Accringtonweb. It doesn't help when you're here spreading ignorant views.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

28 days is probably excessive in some cases but not enough in other cases.
Who is to say what length of time is long enough anyway?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I don't. However I suspect its the same as any other crime. Wrong place wrong time. However normally people are just released quickly, under this legislation they can be detained for 42 days just in case some evidence appears. If they were guility and the police heavily suspected them of it, thats different because they would release them on the last day and then use survailence, but they simply have not done this in the innocent cases under the terrorism act.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

now you are just being silly , using the Crown prosecution Service as an example in anything requiring common sense , these are the clowns who prefer to prosecute and jail home owners for defending their property against thieves and burglars :D

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

The people who have to gather evidence and charge! The only ones guilty who have gone close to being detained for 28days have had their evidence found in 4 and 12 days respectively. That should be a clear indictator to say we dont need to extend it.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Thats not to say that you won't ever need 28 or 42 days?
At least if its in place to detain people for upto 42 days then it can be used if needed.
I would rather be safe than sorry.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

But then innocent people will be detained for even longer, when its not even necessary to have that many days to convict the guilty. Whats to stop them changing it to 100 days, 1000 days, just to be safe rather than sorry?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

When is the Lords debate,only I'll need to get some cans in for the next andrewb show.:jimbo:

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Di-dums.:dummy2:

If you can't stand the heat...

there's a nice cool cell over there.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I only won't be able to stand the heat when you start arguing using relevant things. ;)

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Whats worth more?
Someones life being interrupted for 42 days or somebodies life?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I Have suggested this before: High Court Judges in the UK are paid a considerable amount of money to administer the interpretation of the law.
If extra time to question suspects is required, let them earn the money they receive from the public purse and adjudge yes or no to the extra detention.
There is no need to pen extra legislation for 42 day's...the legislation is already in place.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

[quote andrewb]they would release them on the last day and then use survailence, but they simply have not done this in the innocent cases under the terrorism act.[/quote] How do you know whether the police have had the people under surveillance or not? I am damn sure they don't inform us when they are going to keep their eye on somebody, so from where do you get your evidence??

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

poppycock investigations can lead to other avenues that need investigating and a suspect should be held until all avenues have been explored

are you sure your a tory because you sound like bleeding liberal to me

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

How do you know whether the police have had the people under surveillance or not? I am damn sure they don't inform us when they are going to keep their eye on somebody, so from where do you get your evidence??[/quote]

David Davis has fully investigated it and nobody has come out to say hes fibbing!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Every avenue should be explored. Every other civilized country manages to explore them without needing 42 days. In fact, we manage to do it within 28 days, so there is no need to extend.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

were british we like to do things properly infact other police are so pathetic we had to send in british investigators to help conduct the search for madelin

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

What about the USA?
Guantamo bay anybody?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

David Davis has fully investigated it and nobody has come out to say hes fibbing![/quote]Oh well then it must be so, do you really think that the police are going to tell anybody who is under surveillance???

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I presume you count the USA as a civilized country?
maybe we should hold terrorist suspects on an Island and hold them for 5years+ without charge!!!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Oh well then it must be so, do you really think that the police are going to tell anybody who is under surveillance???[/quote]

He was the shadow home secretary. You can't tell me you honestly believe hes lies and nobody has said a thing during the whole campaign? Surely those in favour of 42 days would have had a field day!!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

The one example (which is being scrapped because its wrong)

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

He was the shadow home secretary. You can't tell me you honestly believe hes lies and nobody has said a thing during the whole campaign? Surely those in favour of 42 days would have had a field day!![/quote]

You are trying to tell me you believe politicians don't lie!!
What planet do you live on?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

You are trying to tell me you believe politicians don't lie!!
What planet do you live on?[/quote]

If he lied about that they'd come straight out and say he was, nobody has accused him of doing that!

God I can't believe I'm having to argue these things just because people want to find any possible way to make my argument invalid.

Quite clear that the majority of people on Accringtonweb couldn't care less about locking up innocents. All I can say is I hope it never happens to you or your families.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

He was the shadow home secretary. You can't tell me you honestly believe hes lies and nobody has said a thing during the whole campaign? Surely those in favour of 42 days would have had a field day!![/quote]I am saying that the police are unlikely to disclose whether they have kept people who have been released under surveillance!!!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

good now sod off.:D

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Why would you presume that Sunshine?
I think you are trying to cause upset where there is none 'My Son'?
You may fool people some of the time but it takes a small amount of time to suss out where you are coming from.
Contribute to forums to the best of your ability, and if your ability is limited to the crap you have posted recently I think you should sleep on it.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

If he lied about that they'd come straight out and say he was, nobody has accused him of doing that!

God I can't believe I'm having to argue these things just because people want to find any possible way to make my argument invalid.

Quite clear that the majority of people on Accringtonweb couldn't care less about locking up innocents. All I can say is I hope it never happens to you or your families.[/quote]

We care about protecting our country and loved ones from terroism.
Why do you presume lots of innocent people will be detained anyway?
Surely there is some evidence needed before an arrest?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Trying to cause upset were there is none? mugchops! there's plenty of that on this subject
you couldn't "suss" out a game of cluedo you plump!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Andrew why pm me?
Fair enough you are making your point but why not post on here like everything else has been.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Very clear and concise response from a muppet :dancedog:

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Andrew............................................ .................



Shhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

I think thats one of the most sensible things that has been posted all night!
Wish i had thought of it sooner!

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Hurrah!

Yes, the majority of us obviously care more about saving innocent lives, than we do about fourteen more days incarceration of suspected terrorists.

Now go and have a little lie down in this nice padded cell.;)

http://achristian.files.wordpress.co...added_cell.jpg

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

you started the whole thing but i am sory if the whole world dosnt agree with you , perhaps you should leave the country and go into politics somewhere more favourable to your liking

i hear iraq is missing a dictatorship

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Isn’t one of the reasons why many people don’t want corporal punishment brought back because it is better to let nine potentially guilty go free than hang one innocent person.

So shouldn’t that principle apply to this issue? Or is it yet again a case of double standards depending which way the wind is blowing?

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Perhaps you should write to David Davis.

That fighter for freedom and liberty also supports the return of the death penalty.

BBC NEWS | Politics | Tories' Davis backs death penalty


I wonder how he would try to compensate those innocents who might be hanged.

Rather makes a mockery of his worries about fourteen more days in jail for those poor innocents, who are suspected of terrorism.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

sorry mate have to spread it around.:rofl38::rofl38::rofl38::rofl38::rofl38::ro fl38::rofl38:

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

i would love to see the death penalty back infact i think having it back would improve things a great deal and with more advanced forensics it would be highly unlikely we got the wrong person

just think how many less murderers woudl be walking our streets today or how many children would have been saved from abuse if the pedophile had been executed and not relased to do it again

anyway thats another post waiting to happen but im strongly behind holding people untill all avenues have been explored

i dont have any worries about been held indefinatly because i hardly fit the profile of a terrorist nor do i hang around with people that would bring suspition of terrorist activity upon me

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Wonder what your views are on the death penalty andrew?
Do you support davies on this too?
How stupid to be against an extra 12 days detention for terroists but support hangings!
At least if innocent people are locked up they can get on with their lives afterwards.
Theres no going back if you kill an innocent person.

Re: Detention without charge poll
 

Perhaps he's not that passionate about people's freedom after all.:rolleyes:

Perhaps it was just one big ego trip....at the tax payer's expense.