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Over the past few weeks there has been animosity over "taboo" words that have been described as "racist!" I have kept a low profile during this time but would now like to bring the subject up if the moderaters will allow. This will not! be a platform for those that want to express their racial feelings ....but I am seeking answers that may clarify what is / is not racist.

I am a great fan of RAP and in particular 50cent and other members of the D12. In their songs, they refer to each other as "niggers." I find this distasteful but it is perfectly acceptable for them because of the colour of their skin.........so am I being racist if I mention that word?

It is very un-PC to tell "irish jokes" yet many irish comedians are famed for doing just that!

We are told to address people from Pakistan and India as "Asian".... but considering the unrest between these two countries, I cannot believe that they would like to be "bundled" up together in one label. I am sure that each would like to be identified by the country they come from!.....and why not? If you are Scottish, you would not find it offensive to be addressed as a "Scot" (or maybe you would, let me know) but many Scots would find it offensive to be called British as some prefer to disassociate themselves from the "UK"

Do our friends from "over the water" object to being called a "yank?" The Australians call the Brits "Pommies" Am I to take offence at that? and if I do, would ANYONE give a sh** about my protest? NO!!!

That is because this country is so "PC" it is the laughing stock of the rest of the world!

This thread is not anti-black/yellow/purple or any other colour! I would like an input from any Asian (Ooops) Afro/Carobean, White, European, or any other nationality to say if they feel threatened by what the rest of the world calls them

I have only recently moved to Accie and was both surprised and pleased to find that the Indian/Pakistani residents have intergrated into the community and have become part of it. (It is still quite novel and pleasing to go into a "corner shop" and have an elderly Indian lady, complete with sari address me in a broad Lancashire accent!)

Can we have an input from the "minority" please?

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You will be very lucky to get a response from the mods, usually your post or thread just disappears without warning leaving you to wonder what the problem was, but haven't we asked this question before in a previous thread?

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Although I am not part of a minority, I have to agree here. I had no qualms about being called a pommie when I was in New Zealand, they didn't have a problem with being called kiwi. The term Asian can cover a wide area, including Chinese, Fillipino, Thai, Malaysian etc. I work with a lady from Kuala Lumpur who does not like being classified as Asian, she is Malaysian. I agree that some of our Indian and Pakistani communities here do not like to be confused with each other. They are, after all still at war in their homelands.

I am not one for calling somebody a name which would offend them, but I really do think that some aspects of political correctness have gone way too far. An example of this would be a blackboard now being called a chalkboard. The most ridiculous one is the pudding 'spotted dick' is now referred to as 'college pie' at work. I still insist on calling it by its original name whenever I ask for it.. :rolleyes:

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Haven't come across the "spotted dick" one before, Are all the "Richards" in the world up in arms about it? Thank you Lettie, this is a good example of the rubbish given out by the PC clan. WELL! Are any "Richards" OFFENDED?

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I don't know why they've done it Busman, all I know is that the 'spotted dick' thing has not only changed its name in the NHS but also the Police force (so I'm led to believe.) There are probably other places that have done it too. I wonder what other things people have come across that has had a name change due to the over zealous PC brigade.
As posted earlier, I don't believe that we should be saying things to offend, but some of the most seemingly inoffensive things have been re-named, and quite honestly I'm struggling to keep up. :)

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Its not a new thing though is it... The golly thing was a very long time ago. Everyone knows the worlds gone mad.. but theres nowt tha can do about it:)

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What the hell is wrong with these idiots, I love my 'spotted dick' it’s part of our culture, I don't think that the term could cause anyone any offence what so ever.

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i doubt spotted dick was changed because it caused anyone called richard offence.. that would be wierd.. More than likely at the time it was changed there would have been another reason......

spastic there was a spastic society blah blah.. they had to change the name because the word had become used more as an insult over the years.. so the perfectly normal word used by charities and doctors blah blah was taken away and left solely as an insult..

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Lettie, You mentioned the police force, What about "IC1/2/3?" to denote the tone of skin or ethnic origin when looking for or describing suspects over the radio? They are ok to say tall/short/fat (ouch, I am not exactly thin so can I consider myself insulted?) but can they still use code to announce the colour of skin?

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ok Kipax, great theory, but can you think of another reason?

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do you know the saying "Richard Cranium" Perhaps that will be banned by those faceless minority pc lovers.

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Insults of have got worse over the years.. words that used to be used as insults are no longer used.... When I was at school the word "dick" could be used far more offensivly than it can now. People will laugh but I am talking along long time ago (sigh)

My point is.. meaning of words change.. what we sit and wonder about now...was once offensive... some of these where changes years ago... Does anyone know how long ago spotted dick or golly was changed?

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Found ths... It appears your PC brigade accusations are a load of old thingies :)

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ok, dick = penis, we all know that but 50 years ago, saucy seaside cards were a source of titilation but now are so tame that most people don't give them a second glance, surely we are not heading back to the Victorian times are we?

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but lets get back to subject.......I am still waiting for a reply from someone from the ethnic minority to give their opinions of their countries "slang name"

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I don't understand the question? Tesco want it changed because the name effects sales... what do they care what it means or anything else for that matter.. It effects sales... thatsit! ... its got nothing to do with anyone being offended or the pc brigade or people called richard.

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What makes you think someone will.. and if/when they do what difference will it make.. if 6 asians now post saying they dont care or they think its funny or they use it themselves... what difference will that make and more interestingly... who cares?

Whats the point to the question?

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Apparently someone feels that my "Karma" on this post is somewhat negative and has taken one point for their troubles. As far as I am concerned they can take the whole lot as it is a subject close to my heart and I feel strongly that we are being taken for a ride by faceless beurocrats and to be totally racist will say that they are white bigoted idiots.............

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Still wondering what the point of your question is?

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.and I am being accused of being negative Kipax!! Are you still going on about spotted dicks or do you mean to say that if 1 or 10 asians reply to my thread, it is still a waste of time because nothing will change? If it is the latter, you are probably right. Partly because people like yourself accept what is happening and will not challenge the do gooders!.........just lay down and go to sleep.
I have repeatedly asked for a reply from other races, not just Asians but Americans, Irish, whatever! Just about every country in the world has got a "slang" name and most take it on the chin and reply to people in a similar manner but we brits have been told to take it seriously or else be taken to court and have the key thrown away!

This is notabout Asians but about the rights of people from the UK to reply to others in a similar manner to which they are spoken to.

I want to hear first-hand from others what they feel is insulting but not from the do-gooders like yourself who want to tell me what other countries feel.

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I was having a nice chat with you and I merely asked what the point of your question was... thats all .. theres no need to be insulting.

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I've just worked the Karma out. How it works is, if Pikax doesn't agree with you he deducts points from your Karma.

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I think if you take the time to read this thread that I am in agreement with the subject that all this name changing and stuff has got way out of hand...his karma went down while I was agreeing with the thread.. the only time things have got sour on here was when for some reason busman has turned on me just because I asked why he was asking the question. I cant follow why he has though? it seemed a simple enough question and wasnt meant to upset him so much :)


But hey.. now I know where you stand.. seems you ahve somehtng against me eh.. cheers for that mate.

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Nothing against you whatsoever. But I've noticed on other threads you rise so readily to the bait that I just couldn't help trying to provoke you into doing so. If only the trout I try to catch took the bait with such enthusiasm.

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Well done.. you got what you where looking for. I reacted just as you suspected I would... Well done...

Like I say.. thanks for that :(

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Brilliant 6 more Karma points disappeared. Point proved I think. Lets see if I can't lose the last two.
Sell the Arndale Clock for scrap and use the funds raised to erect more speed cameras and/or road humps. Wouldn't work though, the clock isn't worth that much.

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Well I can assure you it wasn't me... But your probably not going to believe that as you ahve obviously made up your own mind by your response.. Nothing against me? It would seem you ahve.. first you try to wind me up for your own pleasure and now you presume I am really taking points off you..

Remind me again what I did to upset you so much?

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My Dear Mr. Kipax,
Please accept my unreserved apologies if, as you claim, you are not the phantom karma pilferer. I in turn can assure you that you have done nothing whatsoever to upset me. You must admit though, you are remarkably easy to wind up.

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If you meet someone who bleeds easy do you stab them to see for yourself.?

Like I say.. i didn't touch your kama....the funny thing is I doubt very much that you believe me.

Shall we leave it for now... unless of course your thinking of insulting me in another thread just because you find it amusing?

BTW Have you ever read your sig? :)

Off to footy now...saturdays.. Love em :)

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ok, now that Kipax is off to his football match, is there anyone who wants to comment on the original thread?

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I realise that I'm stepping aside frome the thread theme, talking about the handing out and pilfering of Karma points.... soz. :o

Would it be possible to know who we receive karma from? There is the option to give a reason for dishing out karma, when doing so, but we don't know from whom.

Also, if we were to know who our detractors were, and just as importantly, why they've got the hump, then any spat could be carried on via private messaging, and thus not bringing down the happy mood on an open forum thread.

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Well put sir............

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agree Sparkologist, I have been deducted 4 karma points while Kipax was arguing with "yerself"

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One person cannot deduct so many points within a given time of days or a week.. not sure the limitations.... you cant give or deduct karma to that extent.. its absoloutly impossible for me to have done what your all accusing...sorry but it just is not possible

Talk about a witch hunt.... grow up

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As stated earlier busman I was actually in agreement with you... All I did was ask you the point of your question...you turned on me for no apparent reason at that point and didnt you already complain of losing kama before that?

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sorry kipax, but I have never once associated your name with my losing karma points. get off your high horse please,

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Maybe it is just me being childish or overtly patriotic, but I once suffered what I believe to be a form of racism.
Four years ago, when flying to the States to work, I was given a temporary entrance visa form to fill in, during the flight. In the box marked 'nationalty', I wrote 'English'. When passing through customs at JFK airport in New York, an 'Afro-Carribean' scribbled out the word 'English', and wrote 'UK' in its place.
This I find to be gratuitously offensive. I am not Jockenese, or a Taffy, or a Mick, (Ooo Lordy, I can feel them karma points slipping away), I'm English and proud of that fact.
When I pointed out his error, the customs officer told me that England didn't exist, only the UK, and if I continued to complain, I would not gain entry to the country. I found this statement hard to take, considering it was coming from someone who appeared to have the IQ of a concussed goldfish. :(

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Political correctness has certainly gone mad, apparently Baa Baa Black Sheep is now to be referred to as Baa Baa Little Sheep.
Regarding racism I honestly do not believe the majority of the population to be racist. I do think, however, that even the most non-racist tend to get annoyed at the amount of positive discrimination that seems to take place.

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I sometimes wonder if there is an organisation behind this PC rubbish, Everyone seems scared to voice their opinions yet there is no tangible group of people/army/police to bang on the door in the middle of the night and drag dissidents away.......is there?

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It appears the way we are going,that black puddings in the future will be called,
"a mixture of pigs -blood,oatmeal,suet, and seasoning enclosed in a sausage skin pudding".

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Dont start on the BLACK PUDDING theve don nowt wrong, besides i like them :engsmil: :engsmil: :engsmil:

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Ooo, those puddings of a darkened hue, don't you just love 'em.
Slice 'em, then grill 'em till they're crisply sealed. There's nowt as grand as a tarmac burger. :D

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What will white puddings be called?????

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Honky puddings!.

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When folks refer to me as a cowboy I sometimes don’t know how to take it. So I shoot them anyhow just in case.

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Doesn't this imply that someone other than pikax and yerself was doing the karma pilfering whilst those two were having a heated debate?

Getting back to the real point of this thread though isn't it downright silly to conclude that Baa Baa Black Sheep is racist? It's simply a fact of sheep. Some are white, some are black, some are mottled shades of brown. Some around here are a very mucky grey. But they are SHEEP and nothing at all to do with races of people. Sheep don't seem to bother one way or the other what colour other sheep are.

It's the same with blackboards/whiteboards. They are not racial. They are flippin boards on walls for writing on. Some are black and we write on them with chalk. Some are white and we write on them with marker pens. How on earth did racism ever ccome into that? Did anyone ever imply that a blackboard was any better or worse than a white board? And even if they did and even if they were would that mean there was any connection with the colour of a person's skin? It's insane.

I have friends who are brown skinned (no, they are not black any more than I am white. They are brown and I am pink) and don't seem to mind chalking on a blackboard. One of the children had a gollywog as a young child too. I never thought of gollies as human. To me they were alongside teddy bears as just something loveable and cuddly.

As a Christian should I be careful not to celebrate Christian festivals which may upset my non-Christian neighbours? It's funny isn't it that I actually receive Christmas cards from some of them and they would think I was being strange if I didn't send them one.

Did anyone really object to shops having Christmas displays in their windows? Does it really hurt anyone else if one group of the population chooses to display part of their heritage?

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What, You mean somebody playing God......

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Check out your karma and ability to give karma.
You can only give karma once to the same person whether good or bad for a period of time, i'm not sure the details but it is a minimum of 24hrs. So if your loosing karma fast your upsetting lots of people it can not possibly be 1 person.

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How much karma can a person add or subtract in one go? I know someone could add two at once because she told me she had done so, but it seems that I can only add one to each person.

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Everyone agrees renaming things has got to the silly stage... Why is everyone asking the same question over and over again... ?

Is there anyone who maybe disagrees that changing the names of things for fear of upsetting people has got to a silly stage?

No....? well thats that unless someone else wants to ask the same question in the same thread about it being wrong:)

Or am I missing something?

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Also I don't think 24 hours comes into it because it's days since I added karma to anyone but I've just been told I can't give it to the same person until I have given it to a few other people.

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Ye gods and little fishes! The man asked a perfectly sensible question hoping for response from anyone who actually is offended by these non-PC terms and you lot wander hither and yon like the lost tribes of Israel.

I could choose to be offended by BigMikDick as my eldest son is half German (his late mother was German) and we still have living relatives in Germany. Do I demand political correctness and insist that Mik should not be permitted to use a term such as "Krautland"? If someone across the channel wishes to call me "Monsieur RosBif" do I take offence? No, we Brits are made of sterner stuff, and so I dare say are most of the people we claim to be protecting with our anti-racist laws which in my humble opinion merely serve to incite that very thing they claim to avoid.

If anyone saw the documentary on the BNP you will understand what I mean. We are dangerously close to a far more serious problem than whether or not we can refer to a gentleman from the Indian subcontinent who once had a stall on Accrington market as "Paccy Ali" - incidentally I never did receive a reply to that question.

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Didn't Paccy Ali used to call himself that? It's a long time since he had that stall.

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Sigh... again so theres nobody who is offended... so why are you all asking the same question.. No ones answered the orignal saying they are offended. No one has jumped in to say they are offended... Yet here you are still asking the same question..


The answer would seem to be a resounding.. No one is offended... But I bet some pillock comes on in a minute in this very thread and asks the same question ... deary deary me :)

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I think that's probably the whole point. No-one is offended so why do we have to try so hard not to offend them? That can end up being the thing which offends.

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Thank you gobsmacked for referring back to my original questions and making an imput. It can be fun going off at tangents.......as long as someone brings the original subject up now and again.
There are racist laws but surely that does not include black puddings and blackboards? There should be distinctions between outright racism and tongue-in-cheek comments that have always been used in the English (sorry) UK Language.

I will refer again also to my original comment re: nigger! Why is it ok for certain people to say it (and have it broadcasted on radio) but for others there will be a backlash if they mention that word in public? WHO IS MAKING THESE BOUNDARIES?

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Good manners perhaps? Also what do you mean try so hard?...is changing a word you use really so hard? How many times in the last year have you wanted to say spotted dick? or any of the other words your up in arms about

Mountains and mole hills if you ask me.:)

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Busman when was the last time you wanted to use that word in conversation? are you really that bothered ?

Just asking politely :) Try not to get as upset as you did when I asked you the point of the question.. you went well over the top after I asked that....Try taking it as a honest question and not some form of insult.. :)

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Kipax, I don't mean to offend but your comments come over as very negative. I understand what you say, yes you can go to the centre of Accie and shout "black pudding" at the top of your voice without being arrested (unless you are looking directly at a coloured person when you do it) but this chat revolves around pressure from unknown groups that are so powerful that large companies like Tesco and Sainsbury are sitting up and listening and changing their policies to please...but to please who?

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perahps if you refrain from calling me names then I wont be.. I havent called you names or made any attacks on you :)


Surely the example you give (tesco, sainsbury) are to please themselves... As stated earlier..if it effects sales then they will change it. sales is the bee all and end all.

I am not being negative other than in the sense that it seems pointless... Its probably some bloke in a little office somewhere being paid disgusting amounts of money to come up with words to change to make poloticians look like they care..

Some words as you say can be offensive in one use and not in another.. But also some words become more offensive over the years.. the example I gave "Spastic" was once a registered charity and a word for an illness... its now been removed and is just an insult and the spastic society rebranded.. because of its widespread use as an insult.

the P word to describe asians is short for the country and no different from jock or taff... but historically it has been used more to offend.... even as early as the 70s when skinheads roamed the streets..they went p***i bashing not pommi bashing or taffy bashing...

I find the n***** word you use as an example so offending that i wont type it... yet my kids listen to music that contain it and one of my favoroute actors uses it a lot in his films (samual l jackson) and it sounds right in the context used..

Its different things for different people and someone out there with his/her own values has the job of deciding which gets changed.... you could always apply for his job..


What a booring world it would be if we all felt the same way.... but we cant all make the rules.. someone has and you dont like it.. but for every rule you dont like.. someone will....

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When all said and done it boils down to respecting other peoples beliefs and feelings.Anybody not doing that is basically a rascist????

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For an explanation of the phenomena of 'Political Correctness', readers may wish to have a look at this:

http://www.ourcivilisation.com/pc.htm

It says it all, I think.

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Stuff Political Correctness.Its what is inside a person that counts.People being nice to your face and then slagging your nationality and beliefs off behind your back.Well that is what i mean.Its a feeling and respesct you give but should give naturally

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For those of us who are determined to defend 'Political Correctness', bear this in mind:

>>The philosopher Steven Pinker coined the phrase 'the euphemism treadmill' to describe the process in which euphemistic neologisms acquire all the negative associations of the words they were coined to replace.<<

Source:- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sapir-Whorf_Hypothesis

For the sake of clarity, a euphemistic neologism is a new word created to subsitute for an existing word considered too harsh or offensive.

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i cant find one single person on this forum defending whats being talked about...

just people posting exactly the same point about it being wrong and out of hand..

its a one sided fight that your all jumping into... the points been made that its wrong and out of hand and no one is arguing it..in fact everyone is agreeing it.... yet still you all flock to try and prove the point that no one is arguing... now even to the point that bob here is aiming his posts just specificly at those that dont agree..... there is no one bob! we all agree.. hehehehe

its dead funny :)

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didnt you know that black boards are now called white boards//

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No, white boards are actually white. They are shiny and you write on them with a special kind of marker pen. The new Springhill School has interactive white boards instead of blackboards. (not sure if they are up and running properly yet tho)

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yea i know but they had to replace the blackboards didnt they, we did it a few yrs ago at work

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Sooon a big touch screen monitor will replace both boards.. then what will you al complain about? ..... :)

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nothing he he ahh wot a life eh//

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OK, Kipax,
Firstly in reply to your "contribution" to this thread, WHAT NAMES HAVE I CALLED YOU? I notice that many have "accidentally" got your name wrong and called you "pickax" That is not my doing but you do chip away at the original question on most of the threads that you contribute to!
Your words "it seems pointless!" is what I mean when I say you are so negative. If you feel that it is pointless to discuss this, go and start a new thread discussing your bloody football team!! THAT is pointless! (but only in my opinion, many may join you in discussing football) Good, I will not join in for the same reason that you should not join this discussion........because I am not interested!!

I notice that you are scared of putting in the word "nigger" even though it is used on a regular basis by the Afro- Carrobean and the youngsters of today including your kids!.....but you are quite happy to "insult?" the Scots and Welsh by mentioning "jock" and "taff" THIS IS MY POINT!!! I ask the question "Who dictates what we say .. and What is insulting? You have illustrated it perfectly (but I doubt that you can appreciate that!

Yes, You will accuse me of insulting you, but every time you type a comment on my subject, you are trying to close me and my thread down!! I am interested in the views of others around the world as regards to what is acceptable or not and if you cannot make a worthwhile contribution, I suggest that you go and annoy someone else!!

If you still cannot see the point of my thread, then you have gone down in my estimation. If there are any who agree with Tipax, just take away my Karma! I feel that I have made a valid contribution to the forum but if you disagree.........what the hell!

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Well said Willow.

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Further to Busman's post here Kipax, what gives you the right to assume it is less offensive to insult a Scot or a Welshman than a black person of African origin? "Nigger" is derived from the word "negro" which itself literally means black. It is simply a matter of the language used. The Spanish word for black is "negro" (as in "Rio Negro") However, it is perfectly acceptable, nay required, that we use the term "black" and yet offensive if we use the term "negro". Is that very fact in itself not offensive to Spanish speaking peoples?

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Thank you "Big Mick" You are right in saying that it is respecting other peoples beliefs but there is an underlying current that says you must not comment on races or colour because "big brother" will drag you out of bed at 3am and you will "disapear" (sorry about the spelling) I like your comment about "What is inside a person!" THAT IS IMPORTANT!

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I think you've hit the nail squarely on the head there. Racism is surely about belittling people because of their racial origins, not about making an observation about differences.

If I say all black people have brown eyes is that a racist statement? Personally I would say not. It is merely a statement of fact.

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Assuming that the members of this message board are not unique in this aspect perhaps this is the very point of the whole thread. Why are we being told that these things are wrong and more to the point why are we simply sitting down and accepting what we are told instead of questioning it at a higher level?

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OK, I call an end to this post, We all agree that there is an injustice as regards what we say that can be classed as racism. No one has come up with an answer (not surprising) I am dissapointed that there were not more threads from those living abroad but the general concencus???Oh god, my spelling! is that we must accept the rules laid down by the minority are accepted by the majority! this is way that we must?? accept it. god help us all!!

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;) I still want to know if I'm allowed to say Paccy Ali. :D

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KIPAX wants to ask a question so lets all be grown ups and change his name and tell him not to post in this thread...

Well I happen to be enjoying myself so I am staying... Like it or lump it as they say.............Just suprised no one else is having as much fun as I am....

Try not to be so serious chaps :)

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>>now even to the point that bob here is aiming his posts just specificly at those that dont agree..... there is no one bob! we all agree.. hehehehe

its dead funny<<

Do you seariously imagine that I am such an empty headed, cloth-eared wazzock, that I do not realise that the majority of contributors to this thread agree with the opnions expressed? My posts were made to illustrate the fact that it is not just the contributors here who agree that political correctness is wrong. That there is a considerable body of intellectual and aceademic opinion that supports the contention that political correctness is an aberrant philosophical position which has consequences often a varience with it's stated intention.

But I suspect that you already knew that, and that you are merely trying Tealeaf's mantle on for size, in his absence. I have bad news for you pal, it doesn't fit! And before you ask, yes, it does make your bum look big.

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OK Kipax, ask your question. I am leaving for my holiday in about 15 minutes but if the question is intelligent, I will be back on Friday to reply.

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I asked enough times... You had all week.. Missed yer chance son :)

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:p I didn't realise there was a time limit to permitted responses on Accy Web. I've been on hols for a few days and going back again this morning so no doubt I'll be coming back in a couple of weeks and posting things which are far too late in your opinion.

Eer, did I miss the question somewhere by the way? :confused: What was it again? Were you asking what the point of this thread was? It looks to me like you've been answered more than once by all the people who have something constructive informative and intelligent to say on the subject. I've enjoyed reading the links because I have learned something from them. One thing I've learned is that I'm not alone in my opinion that too much PC "guidance" can be a dangerous thing. Some people can voice my opinion a lot more eloquently than I can.

In order for a thread to be worthwhile it doesn't have to consist of people in disagreement. We can learn a lot from people who agree with our point of view but have more information to provide.

It's like the buses thread, we can all agree that public transport leaves a lot to be desired. That doesn't make the discussion pointless because no-one has come out in defence of public transport.

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Wow niether did I? What is it willow.. hope its longer than a few hrs only I ahve to sleep sometimes... come on share then ? :)

It does when someone posts messages directed solely at those people that dont exist.. thats when it gets a little silly..

It isnt people agreeing wiht each other in this thread.. its people getting very upset (busman ya gotta admit you do get upset at the slightest thing) and asking the same questions.. when a questions been asked and everyone agrees.. thats great.. when a questions been asked and then more people ask the same question and they al get upset because no one answers.. then its silly... If you just want to find someone to argue wiht for the sake of it then good for you.. but an ounce of common while reading the thread will show you its not as you describe..

have you seen the insults and the childish name changing.. busman called me a do gooder trying to argue wiht him when i was agreeing with him.. he is that desperate for someone to argue the point...

I strive to find grown ups to debate a subject with and all i get is people who resort to childish insults when someone questions there side of the debate :(

I do hope none of you are like this in real life :)

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well i'm quite disappointed in the whole one-sided debate. If thats what you can call it

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This is the problem with different people's perception of the written word. You see insults where none are apparent to me and others see insults where you say you have insulted no-one. Could it possibly be I wonder that no-one actually intentionally insults anyone else but people take offence anyway?

Time limit? Well you said Busman has had all week and missed his chance.

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I think you might be right there willow

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It illustrates the point that we all bow to political correctness even though we don't agree with it. The things like baa baa blacksheep and blackboards make a mockery of real racism by lumping nonsense like that all in the same bracket.

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And I am in charge am I..Thats good to know:) Or was you trying to be sarcastic... just what the thread needs eh :)

Steph has a good point.. Its so one sided that you cant really call it a debate.. all these grown men looking for someone to argue with and getting upset when everyone agrees with them.

I agree with the questions asked.,... My mistake was to ask the point of the question...

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I agree that a debate is more interesting if we have opposing points of view but this discussion is also interesting because although people are in agreement with the basic idea they have brought up different points which we may not otherwise have known (such as the links I mentioned earlier) I have learned something from those so for that reason alone I would say this thread is worthwhile.

At one stage I was asked why I had started a new thread on a subject which had been mentioned in another thread, yet at the same time people are criticised for thread wandering and therefore encouraged to start new threads. If the very existence of some new threads is criticised by members of longstanding surely that would discourage people from starting new threads and the website would lose its point.

Anyway I'm off on the second stage of my holiday soon and if there's anything more interesting been added here when I get back I'll probably read it and say something else then too.

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I hope your not accusing me?

I find this thread very interesting.. I wouldnt be posting otherwise now would I? I mearely asked the point of the questions raised... other people getting upset isnt my fault..

If my answers upset you then dont ask scarey questions :)

So who are you directing those comments at willow? Is anyone criticising the existance of this thread? if so name and shame.. if not then why on earth mention it...

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I'm on holiday. :)

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AAAWWWWWW :(


hehe :)

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To go back to the first posting on the thread, I'm not American, but I do live in the U.S. so would like to address the "Yank" question. The only people (I suspect) who would object to being called Yanks are the people of the Southern States. I think the word probably originated when the civil war was being fought and the people of the states which comprised the Confederacy call the people from the Northern States "Yanks." Some of the die hards who believe "the south will rise again" still call them Yanks and they do it with a derogatory tone. I think that says a lot, the tone used can indicate something which is meant to insult. Having said that, I think there are words such as the "N" word which are derogatory no matter what tone is used. But these things change all the time. At one stage it was more polite to call negros coloured rather than black. Now that has changed. I think it has come to a ridiculous state of affairs now with the blackboard/chalkboard stupidity. I call it a blackboard because that is what it is. If that offends someone it's too bad as far as I'm concerned, it is not my intention to offend.

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Speaking personally, I have often thought that if it is ones intention to insult, belittle or offend someone, then it makes very little difference what words one chooses to use. If, for example, I wished to make offensive comments about Space Aliens, I am sure that I would be able to use whatever the currently politically correct adjectives were, in such a way that my intention would be clear from the combination of context and tone of voice.

I had an aunt who would never utter an expletive or swear word, she held them to be vulgar and beneath her. Instead, she substituted other words in place of the expletive she wished to avoid using, substituting the word 'Sugar' for '******' and 'Ruddy' for 'Bloody' etc.etc. Her intention and meaning was always clear and exact, but she felt that the substitution somehow absolved her from the shame of having to resort to the use of the common expletive. In my view this was hypocritical, since it was her intention that her substitution be understood as an expletive, even though it wasn't one.

Doesn't the insistence on the use of politically correct words, force us all to travel the same hypocritical road as my aunt?

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Yes I believe it does. Good point.

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It's a very good point

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Right after reading all of the threads i have 4got tha original question.....

any way i think this mite help u a little bit if not juz hit me back with another Q..

i myself am a british pakistani born n bred here so i dnt have a problem with people calling me that but when they do say asian i would not say that i do get offended or angry because it iz true i am an asian but would rarther prefer to be called a pakistani az like lettie was describin the word asian can be anyone 4rm india to china..... i dnt think it iz a problem for tha majority of our community and dnt feel tht we would or even do get offended when some1 say we are asian but i do feel we would rarther be called either british pakistani's or pakistani hpe this helped coz it got a bit confusin for my self nr the end ;)

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Could you tell us if the British Pakistani community finds the abbreviation of Pakistani offensive? It seems that most of us non-Pakistanis are split on this question as to many it is the same as aussie, brit, yank, pom, argie etc and is derived as such. Would you say that most things that some white lefty liberals say cause offence to the 'asian' community do not actually cause offence - such as hot-cross buns, the christmas nativity etc.

I (we?) would be very interested in hearing more from you.

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i dnt think or feel that the word pakistani is offensive to the majority of our community but when you do abbreviate the word then i would have to say is offensive and does make most of us feel angry and feel like others are then tryin to be racist..... regarding what some left right liberals have to say part of what they do say does cause discomfort within our community but as we have got used to this type of behaviour over the years some of it we just ignore as we know all they have is their own norrow minded view, which i feel everyone does a right to view their own opionion but it should be to an extent..