Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Selective Licensing of Landlords is to be introduced to some areas of the borough in October 2010. The area it will apply too is all Church and Peel wards and parts of Milnshaw, Central, Huncoat and Barnfield wards. Over the last 10 days, Labour councillors their relatives and friends have delivered a leaflet explaining about the scheme (and showing a map of the area) - which will be the largest in England. Unless landlords have a license they will not be allowed to rent out properties.


If you want to know more -please send me a PM and I will send you more details. There was a report to the cabinet of Hyndburn Borough Council on 3 March 2010 - there is a link to the report below.

http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...ndlords_1_.pdf

The conditions for landlords are included in the report but I am also adding them below -
Selective Licensing of Private Residential Landlords
Licensing Conditions

Mandatory Conditions

1. The annual inspection by the Council of an up-to-date gas safety certificate

2. A declaration that all electrical appliances and furniture provided is safe

3. The installation and maintenance in proper working order of smoke alarms

4. The provision to the occupiers of written statement of the terms upon which they occupy i.e. an appropriate Tenancy Agreement

5. The licence holder is required to obtain references for people wishing to occupy the house

Additional Hyndburn Borough Council Conditions

6. That all properties to be free of category 1 hazards

7. That an Energy performance Certificate has been prepared for the property within the last five years

8. That to provide proof of the mandatory condition mentioned in 2 above, a appropriate electrical test certificate be provided at least once in every five years

9. Where there are gas appliances in the property, that a suitable Carbon monoxide detector be provided

10. That the licence holder reminds occupiers of their responsibilities as regards the storage of refuse on the property

11. That the licence holder does not knowingly allow the property to be overcrowded

12. That at change of tenancy the dwelling be in a clean and tidy condition with reasonable levels of decoration

13. That licensed properties which are vacant be kept secure and free of accumulations of refuse


14. That all applicants for a licence be either members of the Hyndburn Accredited Landlord Scheme, or categorised as ‘seeking accreditation’

15. That the licence holder and the property manager be required to provide a contact point for the Council, so that problems with vacant properties can be swiftly addressed

16. That the licence holder takes all possible actions to remove occupiers were there is evidenced criminal activity or anti-social behaviour

17. That where the Council has incurred expenses as a result of having to make a Final Management Order with regard to the premises, which have not been recovered by the rent paid during the duration of the Order, then the payment of that debt be a licence condition

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Why is there no requirement for the renter to have some sort of insurance to cover the costs of damage/repairs caused by the negligence of the tenant or guests, e.g. chip pan fires following a drunken night out or electrical fires caused by the illicit growing of drugs .

Thanks

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Would imagine that would be their own responsibilty Steely? would be pretty dumb of n owner not to have?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Yep, agree the owner would have insurance to cover the building, but should he/she also have to be responsible for repairing misuse. kicked in doors or broken windows

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Not in my eyes, would be very hard to enforce though, theres loads of "Moonlighters"

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

this is what they have up here already lets hope they add criminal convictions to it and implement the laws..all hail death to the slum landlord..:theband::theband::theband:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Wrong, you see you have let your emotions control your brain,

in this case the punishment should be to live in the dwelling themselves with no chance of parole.
:)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

This is long overdue and a positive move. I hope it's rolled out across a far wider area in the very near future.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I don't know, affordable housing is apparently difficult to come by as it is in UK so we're led to believe, won't this just inflame the problem ? If the Landlords/property leasers have to pay 500 Quid every five years (for renewal, or am I reading it wrong ?) It's not hard to guess where they'll be getting their money back from is it !

Added to that because they're Council authorised this appears to be "Carte Blanche" for the underhanded ones to demand ridiculous rents as the people looking to rent have nowhere else to turn to for housing, as only Landlords with the required paperwork (from the Council) are available to prospective Tenants.

It appears to be a fly by night grab a quick "Buck" enterprise to me! All the safety aspects are good but who's paying & who's gaining from the checks will they be independents local firms or Council subsidiaries/sponsored ? I'm sorry but it seems as though the Council are trying to fill their Coffers via officialdom. Remember I'm an outsider looking in & that's how it looks from here.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Good point there , seems this could backfire , seem to remember reading lots of stories about various London Borough Councils paying thousands of £s in rents to private landlords because that "is the going rate" for the area and no 'council' homes are available , does HBC have any contracts with private landlords to provide social housing .

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Dave I appreciate that you are an outsider looking in. In Hyndburn at the current time, there are approx 2000 empty properties and many properties that are rented out by private landlords that are not for purpose. As you can appreciate the landlords who are not concerned about looking after the buildings they own, has a very detrimental effect on anyone who is an owner occupier (or a landlord who does look after their property) in the area. In many areas of the borough houses prices have fallen because of the poor state the rented property is in (and the fact that some landlords couldn't care less about who the tenants are, provided they are getting their rent). A lot of tenants in private rented accommodation get all, or part of their rent paid by way of Housing Benefit and as I said before so long as thy are getting their rent the landlords are not bothered about the state their houses are in. Last year I was contacted by one of the residents of Church ward (who had ben made redundant), he was behind with his rent because his claim for Housing Benefit had not been sorted out. His landlord was threatening to enter the property, whilst he was out and change the locks - dumping his families belongings out in the street. Whilst this action would have been illegal it could quite easily have happened. The rent on this house was £100 per week, none of the gas fires (or the central heating was working) they had to use electric fires and an oil filled radiator and the roof was leaking. It is to try to eradicate landlords like this that the scheme is being implemented.
The scheme will be administered by HBC and will only cover the running costs. It certainly is not being implemented to 'grab a quick buck' it is making use of relatively new government legislation designed to combat the problems of bad landlords- many of whom bought houses at auction, never having been anywhere near the borough, but thinking they could rent them out and they would make a quick profit.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Nice idea but I doubt it will work in practise, how are they going to know who all the landlords are in the first place & what can they do if they do not join in this (is it another "voluntary" scheme?) and what about all those landlords that the council cannot even contact now?
How are they going to contact them to get them to obey this missive?

The good landlords will follow this but the bad ones will shy away & have nowt to do with it.

And what law will require them to follow this?

Before you answer about the law, make sure it includes all the above requirements within the act or its worthless

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

its better what weve got now and a step forward.i wonder if landlords who have been done with housing benefit fraud will get one.:confused:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

its very easy to put this onto the landlord to do this and that

but what happens to the tenant who wrecks a property? nothing. the landlord is left to take care of the bill themselves

what will happen to the dss claimaint who cant get a reference from previous places? no doubt they'll be the first to shout out discrimination!

and no offence but there's no chance in hell that they'll find landlords within that area let alone if it was rolled out to a bigger area.

a local landlord had anti-social tenants and went to the council regarding this. sorry its a civil matter which meant 3 months notice and even then they didnt leave.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

like there will be a good landlord register there should be a bad tenant register that a 3rd party can verify that the tenant has indeed been a bad tenant.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Good point.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Spot on Mani, if not its discrimination against the good landlords.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Information that came my way today tells me "Local Conservatives" voted AGAINST this measure, now to me it seems a long overdue step in right direction, as the local tory councillors give our site a wide berth seemingly, i wonder why our local arse lickers have not commented on if they think this should be brought in????:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Funny the've all bin online since i posted this.:D

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

One high profile Tory councillor's occupation is always given in the press as businessman, and 'landlord'.

:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Long overdue..local councils and housing associations have been under these rules for years, there is no reason why private Landlords should not be governed by the same rules.
No surprise the tories opposed these regulations, after all they are the ones that promoted private landlords by forcing councils to sell the stock off at marked down prices.. most of that housing stock was sold to non English "property development companies"..but they where never developed.. just rented out.

I am not so sure. Rents will then be cheaper outside the red line where landlords have ample vacancies and no scheme to worry about.

With all the empties it is a very competitive market between private landlords. We might see stock consolidation with increased owner occupation sales within the red line.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I don't know about any "red line" but I can tell you that most of the bought flats on the bottom of tower blocks in London are going for at least a thousand quid a month.. and they are rough.. manky central heating ..no carpets/floors.. just a flat.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

This is what I don't understand (Sorry if I seem thick). The cost of the permit is going to be passed on to the tenants through rent increases, and if the Rents are being paid by Housing benefit (either Central Govt. or Local monies) all this means is more public (tax payer) money going into the landlords pockets
Someone please explain where i am going wrong, thanks :confused:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

All this should have been sorted out a long time ago..if you rent anything then both parties have an agreement..and just heard yesterday that some councils now have the power to build more houses from the income they get from sales..somethingT Thacther and "her boys" did not allow.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

If someone wanted to rent out just one house, they'll pay £500, which will be passed on to the person paying rent. If someone is renting 100 houses, they'll pay £500.

Is this correct?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I can't see that being the case. They are being forced into a scheme which will cost money from the off, added to that all the obligatory tests & certificates they will have to present & renew on a regular basis will continually be pulling Money from the Landlords pocket, he of course isn't going to swallow these costs up himself he'll sure as hell pass them on to the Tenant.

Now if the Tenant is on Social it isn't going to bother them as whatever increase crops up, the benefits system will cover it. (See SJ's post #25, I see exactly where he's coming from) Yet those unfortunate enough who work hard & pay their own way are going to struggle as the costs to them rise. So they will be looking elsewhere for cheaper housing & probably move away from the area, returning you back to square one ! empty Accommodation which you are trying to avoid. So it appears that this proposed legislation will be self defeating.

I can understand the thinking & yes it is a good idea to make sure that those living in these buildings have good & safe standards in their dwellings. But those responsible for the implementation should also at the same time put forward strict & stringent rules to ensure the "Rental" costs aren't going to be used & abused, a cap perhaps ? or as with Army Accommodation, dependant on size, bedrooms & amenities pay bands be used. That way across the board the playing field would be even.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

You make a good point. I don't know if the council have passed it yet, but they were throwing around the idea of taking empty property council tax from 50% to 100%. Doubling the council tax on empty properties, presumably to encourage landlords to get their houses occupied. However I'm sure it doesn't make very much sense for landlords to ever have their homes empty, so I imagine they're always trying to fill them! It's going to cost them double to have it empty, and this cost too is going to be passed on to the tenant.

I can see a situation where Hyndburn suddenly has much higher rents, just at a time when many people are having to rent due to economic circumstances, struggling to get mortgages etc.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

OK , heres my solution to all the empty houses , modern day families DO NOT want to live in 2 up 2 downs no matter how many improvements , they want more room/space , so whats the problem with the council allowing the expansion of two adjacent teracced houses being knocked thru to provide a decent modern day living space in redevelopment areas , cuts down on parking problems , creates an area density similar or less than new greenfield estates , Theres no necessity for Council tax to be doubled since the new occupants are using only half of the council ammenities and you have vibrant areas with families near to the down town business area ...... just an idea :confused: :confused:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

They will pay £500 per property that they rent out - provided the property is in the designated Selective Licensing Area.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

can i ask why some areas of hyndburn are "Outside" the red line? don't seem to make a lot of sense to me.:confused:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Lots of people, including families, and myself, prefer living in a stone, well built, terraced house, rather than a newly built Wendy House.

To prove this further, some two-up, two-down, traditional terraced houses in Hyndburn, are more expensive to buy than three bedroomed modern houses, with gardens and garages.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

That isn't very clear ! You're saying they will pay GBP 500,00 per property but the official papers states the following :-

4.2 Legislation and guidance allows the Council to charge a fee for a licence but the fee can only
cover direct administrative costs of the licensing scheme. The Council consulted on the basis
of charging a fee of £500 for a licence term (5 years), but discounted to £450 for members of
the Council’s accreditation scheme.

Looking at the official write up I was under the impression as I believe many others were that it was a one off fee of GBP 500,00 to get the licence/paperwork & it then applied to all the buildings owned by the Landlord, but from what you're saying it's GBP 500,00 per building which will not only make the whole process even more expensive, I believe it will encourage Landlords to shy away from the plan & try by other means to get round the system.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

They will not be able to 'shy away' plan as without a license for the property they will not be able to let it out and there will be penalties for not having a license.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

This scheme will incorporate approx 10000 properties (not all of which are rented accommodation) and will be the largest scheme so far sanctioned by the department of communities and local government. Once it is up and running it will hopefully be able to be extended to other areas of the borough.

This a link that explains the legislation in more detail-

Selective Licensing - Housing - Communities and Local Government

If you have a look at Salford Council's website, you will see how their scheme has been rolled out into other areas of the city. Salford were the first council to be granted a license in September 2007 in the Seedley and Langwothy area.

Salford landlord first in the country - Salford City Council

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Ta fer the response claytonender, the problem i can see with that, from personal experiance is simply "Define how long up n running is" plus who does that descision come down to?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

If this happens,i think the landlords will put up the rents to cover it,so in the end the person renting the house will pay for it.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Middlesbrough Case Study – A positive response from a landlord
The tenant, her family and visitors to her home, had been responsible for criminal offences and serious anti-social behaviour over a long period of time. A range of legal measures had been used in an effort to curb their criminal and anti-social behaviour, including two separate custodial sentences for the tenant for dealing class A drugs, and the granting of Anti Social Behaviour Orders for the two eldest sons.
The nature of the complaints received included, drug dealing, gang nuisance, threatening and intimidating behaviour towards neighbours, verbal abuse, criminal damage and graffiti. Due to the refusal of the landlord to work with the Housing Respect Team, the tenant her family and visitors to the property were able to continue to behave with impunity. Residents, afraid of reprisals, were reluctant to report any breaches. However, with the implementation of selective licensing the landlord began to work with the council.
He accompanied the Enforcement Officer on joint home visits and completed a tenancy breach interview. He reinforced the message that the tenant would be evicted if their anti-social behaviour continued and referrals were completed to the appropriate support agencies. Unfortunately, the family refused to co-operate so the landlord was obliged to serve a Section 8 Notice and apply to the Court for possession of the property. Because the tenant lost her tenancy due to her behaviour, she was deemed intentionally homeless and the local authority, therefore, had no statutory obligation to rehouse her. Consequently she lost her priority rehousing established through the regeneration clearance programme. She also lost the right to the displacement compensation payment of £4,400.
LACORS - Subject Content Details


Well I've trawled through tons of information regarding various resident's groups in the areas where landlord licences are already up and running, and there seems to be nothing but praise from the honest, hardworking residents who live in these area, and who apparently have only seen improvements in the quality of life that has resulted from landlord's licences.

Most honest, hardworking, private landlords seem similarly pleased, in having more control about what goes on in their properties.

If this means decent people, who are trying to bring up their families, have less drug dealers as neighbours, which most certainly is the case where it's up and running, that can only be a good thing.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Good find rindy, confirms my thoughts of its a step in the right direction, also confirms that many tories will continue to oppose this.:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

'I hear people putting down the councils all the time regarding these licenses and inspections and I’ve even had a moan too but without this inspection the property was unsafe and no one would have know better. Is this the kind of property you want one of your relatives to live in? Perhaps your daughter who is renting while in University? I think not! So you can say what you want about Salford Council requiring licenses in order to let out your property but in this case it has saved a potential disaster.'
Salford Landlord Licence Scheme Works | Advantis Home Maintenance Ltd.

The opinion of an independent firm of property repairers in Salford, on their website.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Sadly, somethings you just can't put a price on.

Maximum fine for buy to let landlord after tenant dies in bathroom tragedy.
'A faulty 30 year old electric radiator contributed to a mother of two being electrocuted while taking a bath in her rented accommodation in Cornwall.'
Maximum fine for buy to let landlord after tenant dies in bathroom tragedy - RL news

Here's someone else who wouldn't be able to carry on as he is, if his properties needed a licence, and benefited from inspections.

Landlord fined over 'house of horrors' that had a tarpaulin roof and holes in the walls | Mail Online

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Oh ya can............If yer a Tory.:(

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

This is not a silly statement to make, its the mindset of such people, but fear not the favour will be returned when i have spread it about you tart.:rofl38::rofl38::rofl38::rofl38::rofl38::rofl 38:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I'm sure reasonable people, whatever party they do or don't support, don't seriously think that 'Tories' would rather people die to save money. :rolleyes: So yes, it is a very silly statement that you made. Hence the negative karma, which I've given out on very few occasions since I signed up to Accyweb.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Oh i do in a general sense was obviously not refering to ordinary voters, who know no better, but to the real torys on high.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I will attempt to give ya n example- Think "Asbestos" think "Tobacco" those ******* were aware fer decades of the damage these products caused, but continued to let thousands suffer/die fer the sake of profit,:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Shame the same rules haven't been applied to "Council estates", from what I hear from family Shadsworth is a bit like the wild west these days :rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I didn't know drugs were a big problem in the Wild West, besides the generous line of coke, that came ready dissolved in each bottles of Coca-Cola.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

^^*lmao*

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Selective licencesing! Where did it come from, mandatory licenceing has been around for some time and was well publisiced. It seems looking at this Mr Jones has single handedly pushed this matter through with the obvious objection of HBC.

Interestingly, according to CLAYTONENDER “Over the last 10 days, Labour councillors their relatives and friends have delivered a leaflet explaining about the scheme (and showing a map of the area) - which will be the largest in England. Unless landlords have a license they will not be allowed to rent out properties.” A comment posted on the 5/4/2010, I would like to know how the leaflet was produced and then distributed over the last ten days, considering aproval wasn’t given until the 31/4/2010? Seems to me there is a little crossover here. Politics eh?

As a landlord myself, I concur, licensing is a good thing and should be introduced, however this scheme has been thrown through on a knod and a wink with blaitant ommisions and flaws, with little and no public consultation.

Reasearch consisted of 10,000 enquiries of which only 2,000 were returned, of the 2,000, 80% were in favour. Im not being funny but who interprets these facts and figures, is it a requirment that they have no uunderstandin of their goals?

It doesn’t take a genius to realise that the returned questionaires were returned by homeowners who would have inevetably been in favour. Does it not thereofre make sense that areas with a low response rate are likely high rental areas, as such are these not the very areas that need looking at further. Springhill, who knows the homeowner percentage figures, I have no doubt this area is in excess of 80% rented, not only that has anyone consulted the Police for information relating to anti-social instances in this area. I know what they would say and what about the state of the yards in this area. Just two of the things supposedly targeted.

Licencesing – good idea in principal – perhaps a little more selective though.
A few intresting requirements-

5. The licence holder is required to obtain references for people wishing to occupy the house

No more renting to friends or family without written reference.

7. That an Energy performance Certificate has been prepared for the property within the last five years

Welcome to a new stealth TAX – watch this space, EPCs where the backbone of the magical HIP. HIP what a waste of time, just a sly way of introducing EPCs to the home market, EPC have been mandatory for the last few years on all rented properties and comercial properties. Not too long from know your council tax is going to change probably banded within the current bands based on energy efficiency, just as they have with car tax and co2 emissions. Shouldn’t make promises to Brussells that we can’t keep!

10. That the licence holder reminds occupiers of their responsibilities as regards the storage of refuse on the property

Perhaps on this point we could get started on social standards and individual responsibility for own actions – or alternatively we could remove all the common sense in this world and legislate to cover our arses.

12. That at change of tenancy the dwelling be in a clean and tidy condition with reasonable levels of decoration

Don’t want to harp on, perhaps we could improve education, inject some sense of personal responsibility upon individuals and ask minority of “scumbag” tenants to leave the properties as the find them, better still maybe we could introduce a system that doesn’t require a landlord spends hundreds of pounds pursuing bad tenants and furthermore allows for a legal system that actually provideds for some justice when tenants leave properties in a mess. A tenant in receipt of benefit and not working can currently be taken to court if they cause damage and or owe you money, however the court “will not take any money from them whatsoever” as they are on benefits. That’s if you even know where they are, because the data protection act definitely wont let you find them if they don’t want you too.

13. That licensed properties which are vacant be kept secure and free of accumulations of refuse

Flytippers, how many landlords are flytippers? Empty house, rented next door suddenly your yard is full of rubbish, YOUR FAULT! Sort it within 7 days or ther will be hell to pay.

14. That all applicants for a licence be either members of the Hyndburn Accredited Landlord Scheme, or categorised as ‘seeking accreditation’

This is the BEST ONE OF ALL, sorry to go on. Hyndburn BC had one member of staff handling accreditation within the borough. Mrs Webb she went on long term sick a year ago and she hasn’t been replaced, official line from the council is that there is no one dealing with accreditation at this time. Council officials have stipulated you be members of a scheme that currently doent really exist, when asked by myself the official response is “we will get round it”. Bad news for any landlord that wasn’t accredited before 2008, you might struggle to get a licence.

16. That the licence holder takes all possible actions to remove occupiers were there is evidenced criminal activity or anti-social behaviour

Comes back to the courts on this one. Tenant must be two months in arrears to serve section 8 notice, or alternative section 21 can be serrved but must be minimum of two months, court applications have been taking up to 8 further weeks in Accriington (via Blackburn) non paying tenant doesn’t bother to turn up to court hearing and the judge will still give them a further 28 days to get out. Hows being a landlord sound so far?

Licensing could and would work, but drawing a line around most of Accrington isnt the way it should be done. Give more power to the enviromental health office, two strike rule for all landlords, publicise it to all tenants, that way the landlords that need regulating will be the landlords affected.

Typical government punishes the bulk of law abiding individuals for the shortcoming of the few!

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

First of all this is a step in the right direction. One of several important measures. If landlords are upset then it is likely we may not see as many 'houses bought for cash' in our areas. Landlords seem to like buying in the cheap areas and turning it in to 'rent land' or rented ghettos whilst in my experience giving the appearance of driving 2010 plated Audis and Mercs, living in 'big houses on the hill' and taking holidays in the Carribean.

As an industry landlords have failed to have a collective social conscience, and whilst capital profits have risen steeply and they have ramped up rents too, all to frequently they have still forgone essential repairs and caused decent tenants no end of problems.

I did one yesterday from one of these landlords who describes themselves as a 'decent landlord' and protesting why they were being picked on. Well here's why. The tenant thinks they are a bad landlord due to lack of repairs/care. They were asked for a year to fix a broken gas fire but the tenants was told there was no money to do so, even though the rent is over a £100 a week. When the gas man came over a year later he condemned it. The tenant had young children in there.

I have done property after property which you wouldn't put a dog in. I have had complaints from residents renting from letting agents. Letting agents who like you to think they are a good firm and why them? I know they also have problems.

The industry as a whole is rotten.

Some are so disgusting it defies belief and I think if landlords want an argument, it's an argument they are going to lose and lose badly.

Some landlords have started to up rents beyond the fee. This tells you everything you need to know about them and the industry and why it needs more regulation - like forced lower rents. Hyndburn Homes charges £63pw and makes a better do.

Don't resume the liberal capitalist Thatcherite economic model is de facto. I am a socialist and will not accept those arguments.

The industry needs to sort itself out and then the Council (the people) won't have to.

Like I said. I am conviction politician and times up for bad landlords. I live in a landlord area. If they try to wriggle out of their responsibilities or try to pass on costs, then there will be more medicine required in order that industry takes on board it's social responsibilities.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

A remarkably detailed epistle for your first post, welcome to the boards.

You've given a lengthy account of why you're not really in favour of the scheme but from speaking to landlords around Rishton they are all very much in favour of it, despite costing more money.

I live in an area which is rapidly turning into a rental zone and it is dragging it down because for every three or four decent tenants you get a family with no respect for anyone or the street where they live. The landlords who own the 'bad' properties are primarily based in Manchester and so really couldn't care less about the community they're ruining, so long as they get their money.

Over the past month, I have been working with a family in Rishton who are saddled with an appaling landlord and, due to changes in the way Hyndburn Homes dish out their houses, are trapped in a hovel. Through getting environmental health, local councillors and even the MP's office involved there is now some movement but the case is certainly not unique and it seems totally unreasonable that any family should have to get all those people involved in simple maintenance of a house.

Having now witnessed the squalid conditions that people are forced to live in under a bad landlord, I cannot understand how anyone would be against the scheme, particularly when it is supported by the reputable landlords.

Get these regulations instated everywhere, the sooner the better, and let's stop the rot from spreading any further.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Approval wasn't given, past tense, until 31st April, 2010?

Well either you're a time traveller, since you posted that on the 13th April, 2010, or you're from another dimension. In which April doesn't end on the 30th, and the 2010 refers to some non-Gregorian calendar, which would explain why you can refer back to time the rest of us haven't experienced yet.

However, since you say you think the licence is a good thing, and should be introduced, it does seem a little odd to pad out that statement with all the other, lengthy waffle.

Since you're hopefully one of the good landlords, and you think the introduction of the landlord licence is a good thing, that's all, er...good.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Must be a little difficult when you collect the rents.

'I've come for September, 2010's rent.'

'But it's only July!'

'Not in my parallel universe, pay up.'

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I think perhaps that was just a typo & he meant the 13th.

The bit about "Unless landlords have a license they will not be allowed to rent out properties." puzzles me.

Under what law will they be able to prevent that?

As for: "I have done property after property which you wouldn't put a dog in" well your renting - you have an option - find somewhere else to live.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

It's not quite as simple as that. Most landlords require a bond of a month's rent in advance plus a refundable deposit - this usually adds up to around £1000, plus there is usually a surcharge if you want to have a pet at the property.

If you end up in a property which develops problems that the landlord repeatedly stalls to put right, you're pretty much stuck.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Typo?

Posted 31st April, but really meant 13th, the day it was posted?

One would have hoped such a detailed first post would have strived to be accurate, otherwise people would start doubting all the other quoted 'inside' information.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

This only means the rents will increase to cover this cost, wont solve the problem of these bad landlords. Wonder how much the council will gain from all this extra income in the end being paid by the poor person renting the house.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Maximum fine for buy to let landlord after tenant dies in bathroom tragedy - RL news


Well according to an independent builder in Salford, where the scheme has been up and running for a number of years, it is solving 'the problem of bad landlords, and is preventing people from being maimed, or killed by defective appliances that are in the rented properties.

I suppose it all depends what price you put on an innocent life, when it comes down to costs.

Personally I think life is worth more than a few extra quid.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

There was probably people moaning about costs, when the law was changed so that smoke and carbon monoxide detectors, fire extinguishers, and annual boiler checks were needed in rented accommodation, and that furniture required evidence that it complied with fire safety requirements.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Can I ask how many local landlords were consulted?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I think that's probably part of the problem.

Many landlords aren't 'local' to the properties they own. They purchased them as buy-to-let investments, and don't see the problems that people have to live with, day in, day out.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

In this instance, I'd prefer to look at the merits of the scheme rather than simply the money aspect of it. The Salford model has yielded fruit in terms of happier tenants and better upkeep of rental properties, plus landlords are less likely to flout the rules if it means being publicly evicted from an accreditation scheme.

There are certain things which require far more regulation than they already have and rental housing is one of them. Bring it on.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

So we've established that the idea in principle is sound, but the question of the price still needs addressing ! Council takes its pound of flesh from Landlord = Landlord requires to make up short fall = Screw the prices right up on the poor unfortunates in the accommodation !

Yes Mrs Jones, I know its an extra 50 nicker a month you've got to raise to pay your bill but I've got a family to feed as well ! Now if you was on the social ! well you'd be laughing wouldn't you as it'd be paid for you, but since you chose to try & eke out a living by working & raising your kids yourself !

Is the Council going to make a stand for these people as well ?? after all that is the whole point of the exercise isn't it ? To ensure suitable housing which is safe & comfortable for all the Tenants ! Will they ensure the above scenario won't be repeated throughout the Borough ? as mentioned elsewhere, will they also include in the licence a clause to protect those who attempt to pay their own way ?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Garinda thanks for your limited responce, my appologies for the typo the date should have read 31/03/2010 although if it had have been the 31/04/2010 then despite my obvious time travel skills my point would have been the same. Our councillor friends have been telling the world this scheme is up and running prior to having had the official go ahead. If sarcasm was as high on my agenda as it is yours I might well imply it is them that are capable of your time travel skills. Thanks again for your constructive points though.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Glad to be of help.

When you're criticizing someone else, for allegedly not giving the correct information, it's always wise to make sure you yourself are being factually correct. Otherwise people may cast doubt on what you say as being truthful.

The Devil is in the detail.

;)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Though as you agree with what some wards in Hyndburn are doing, re: landlord's licencing, a lot of the other waffle seemed rather extraneous.

Sometimes brevity is much more effective in getting your point of view across clearly.

:)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Mr Jones has given a great response to my thread!

You will undoubtedly make a good MP, you have made no comment nor replied to any of the points I have raised.

Your response sounds as though you are the judge, jury and executioner!

Yes master, I’ll, take my medicine.

Mr Jones refers to the bad landlords, he perhaps hasn’t read my thread properly, I agree with Licensing, if correctly implemented.

Are you not a landlord yourself, Mr Jones and was it not your flyer that accused all landlords of Greed. Perhaps you could enlighten us all as to your motivation for becoming a landlord?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

" Fit and Proper" landlords as they are known in benefits lingo will not balk at this plan, it gives them a chance to be more selective about who they rent to. From personal experience I had to provide a bond and 2 references to rent my house, from a private landlord, I have been his tenant for more than 8 years now and have to say he is very caring and considerate, extremely conscious of safety issues and would be the first to tell me if he was unhappy with me as a tenant. He has about 6 houses on my street and all his tenants are well looked after. Our houses certainly don't "look rented", unlike the one across the road with the sheet wedged in the window frame acting as a curtain (been like that 4 months) and the majority of noise and nuisance actually comes from tenants who have rented from agencies that are nowhere near as fussy....

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I received a letter from the minister in the middle of January saying approval.

I believe what I am supporting is right and I am not for turning. If landlords want to jack up prices then a Labour Council will act to bring prices down.

We are more than aware of the matrix of issues and intend not to be a sit back council or one frightened of lobby groups

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Its my understanding that none were consulted, although we do know that there are good number of councillors who are also landlords, "i’m advised" a large number of councillor owned properties are within the Springhill district (but this is not qualified by me yet, i’m currently investigating), this is an area that has not been sighted for Licensing but most certainly should have been. mmmm..(and for the record I own property in this area, and would be happy to pay for licensing to improve the area.)

I would like to know if the local constabulary have been involved in the area selection.

In addition it would be good to know why the council voted against the current scheme as recently as Dec 2009, yet as a result of the one man army that is Mr Jones, it was then approved only one month latter.

Does Mr Jones know better than the council?

Again, just for the record, good landlords are not against licensing, this includes me as a landlord and an agent.

It should however be implemented in a more targeted manner and with an even hand across the entire borough.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Er...sorry to pop up again, but do we mean your 'post', rather than your 'thread'?

Perhaps he just took notice of the part of your post, in which you said you thought it was a good idea, and saw no further reason to address the rest of the meanderings.

:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I think that it is not to be borough wide because the ruling Tory group votred against it.

;)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

You never know, after May 6th it might be.

If I was you I'd be lobbying my councillors at this very minute, saying, as a landlord, that you think it's a jolly good idea, and should be made mandatory in every ward in Hyndburn.

No sorry I don't. I have one house.

It is difficult to answer a plethora of questions and half accusations.

You mid the point BTW. You are looking at through Conservative neo liberal spectacles. How it affects the individual landlord or tenant.

This is about the wider community and social responsibility.

I have worked hard on a number of policies to help landlords as a side.

Mr Eafield. You cannot as an industry expect to make money off the backs of poor communities and not expect them to countenance the lack of social conscience within the industry.

Have you seen what your industry has done to Woodnook?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

The scheme was actually approved at a meeting of Hyndburn Borough Council's Cabinet on 3 March 2010 see agenda below
http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...da__030310.pdf
and also the minutes of the meeting
http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...tes_030310.pdf
Minute number 506 refers.
The scheme was on the agenda of the Council meeting on 30 March 2010, but was only a report of a key decision informing the Council meeting of the Cabinet decision, this is a link to the report presented -
http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...y_Decision.pdf

So your remarks about Labour councillors telling everyone of the decision are disingenuous.
So maybe you should apologise for your ignorance of the correct information.

Also it might be helpful if you could inform everyone, which HBC councillors are landlords.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

So you didn't make a mistake, even though the person accusing you did, by posting a nonesense date, and you had indeed posted the correct, factual information?

I think a humble apology is the very least that you're owed.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Where do the "bad tenants" with youngsters go when they have been evicted under the new rules , cannot for the life of me see HBC allowing a tent city being built on Broadway , are they going to take the homeless kids into care (split up a family) or re-allocate the family to a "Council" owned property a few streets away :confused: :confused:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Dont suppose execution is being considered?:D

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

They're given one new crisp five pound note, then shipped of to the former colonies.

Please make sure you're nice to them.

;)

:D

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

More chance of being struck by lightening! seems to have done one after reading it.:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I am not against you on this concept! We need to improve standards of many things in today’s society, but are we right to say that all landlords are responsible for the state of our housing problems in Accrington.

Poor housing is an issue and needs to be dealt with, however the current plan is not even-handed?

What will happen Oct 2010 onwards?

Bad landlords will dodge the scheme or simply dispose of the assets they are unable to let, these "people" will then simply move on to other areas, that have not been encompassed by your scheme. More rented in other areas, those areas will quickly worsen, particularly the ones that should already be included in the scheme.

This current scheme stinks of "NIMBY". Does it not make sense that we target the bad landlords and thus prevent them from simply moving the problem from one street to another.

Your current scheme requires a landlord to ensure poor quality tenants are dealt with and removed if necessary, where exactly do you think they will then go?

We should also be considering the fact that “truly good landlords" can be unfortunate enough to have bad tenants from time to time. Nice couple moves in two years no problems, girlfriend leaves partner, partner goes of the rails and falls in with the wrong crowd and becomes a bad tenant. Who’s fault is this? The Landlords, apparently.

We are trying to make landlords responsibly for the shortcomings of some elements of society, should there not be some form of combined and targeted effort to improve bad landlords and bad tenants alike.

Should we will be sending all speeding tickets to Audi for building the R4!

Isn’t it embarrassing that as a country we do not have the ability to apply a little more common sense to things.

On the subject of a labour council reducing rents, perhaps you could elaborate how in a free democratic market you intend to do this.

You have previously quoted HBC as charging £63 and doing a better job than the private sector. This a somewhat arrogant statement, considering you are not privy to the conduct of the entire private sector, however you could perhaps elaborate on how well HBC would do without the private sector considering there are currently just 4 properties available to let vie the HBC website ( 2 of which are 1 bed flats).

I should very much like to discuss the matter further, I did try to call you although you advised you were not able to speak with me for the next three weeks.

Selective licensing should most certainly be introduced, but can you not concur that the current scheme will not be effective and that it would take little effort to take further consultation on the way in which this scheme is introduced.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

FYI I was a labour supporter, I may well still be, however you fail to grasp the content of my argument. Again I am not against Selective Licensing. I am against the current scheme.

On the subject of Woodnook, perhaps we could discuss its turning point and Salford Housing association, purchasing half of the area under the cover of Space Ltd, receiving government grants for refurbishment and moving all the scum bags they didn’t want on their own door step in.

A similar knock on effect I should anticipate will come from the proposed scheme.

I am not a Conservative neo liberalist and politics are not relevant to my views on this subject, please remove the labour cap and simple consider my points objectively.

As per my last thread, I would welcome as would many landlords and normal decent individuals, the opportunity to “discuss” the scheme further.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

My information was supplied on two separate occasions by the current head of licensing Mr Julian Hickinbottom (apologies if not spelt correctly) Please feel free to check what I have been advised with him directly . The fact that the cabinet agreed the scheme, does not take away from the point that formal approval from the DoC was still to be received.

I do however apologise for making a big deal over this point and for the record concur the ultimate outcome would not have altered.

Perhaps you could comment on all of my other points.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I did helpfully supply a case study, much earlier in the thread, from an area where the scheme's up and running, that positively addresses just those issues. Much to the landlord's delight.

;)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I would like to know where are these 'three one bedroomed flats advertised on the HBC website':confused:. I have looked and not seen. I am registered with B-with-us and each week there are between 30 and 40 tenancies advertised in the 'social housing' sector.

I did not think that HBC retained any housing when the big transfer to Hyndburn Homes happened a few years back.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Your case study does noting more than helpfully provide backbone to my argument and I am amazed that this is not grasped by you.

Your case study saw a landlord ultimately evict what was a bad tenant, yes he maybe took too long to do it and yes the council had to get involved, however the end result was that she was evicted.

Where did she go?, because the council didn’t house her!

We can be pretty certain she isn’t living in a cardboard box, so "there it is" my friend she’s moved in next door to some other poor sole within a district that is obviously not licensed six months later.

You better hope you live in a licensed area. If not now’s the time to be nice to your neighbours, because the next time one falls into debt and sells to an investor you could be living next to your case study.

Oh and under current law it will take even the best landlord at least five months to evict her for you.

Good luck!

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

'we are committed to caring for your property in your absence and to maximising your financial return'
Home.co.uk: Eafield & Maple Website

I think for many residents, living in areas blighted by problems associated with poorly tenanted properties, many with absentee landlords hundreds of miles away, who bought into the area purely to profit, somethings are more important than pounds and pence.

Fot those honest, hardworking people, trying to raise their families, quality of life rates much higher than profit.

;)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Are you still posting?

I was first waiting to read an apology, for accusing an elected public figure of telling lies, which has been proved to be totally incorrect.

I think you're lucky that the person said they expected an apology, which will be somewhat less expensive than facing a libel action.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

Margaret you are quite correct that HBC did not retain any housing after the transfer to Hyndburn Homes.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

'Eafield & Maple are...committed to caring for your property
and maximising your financial return'
http://www.eafield-maple.co.uk/rental_doc.pdf

:rolleyes:

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

This puzzles me, are you saying that any housing coming under the umbrella "Hyndburn Homes" was in no way connected to HBC? Find that hard to believe but would love to be proved wrong. When you register with Hyndburn Homes are you not directed to HBC'S website for properties available and then asked to bid? Luckily Iwas offered and accepted a property (without the need to be on-line) not everybody is but seems HBC and Hyndburn Homes think everybody is:(

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

“LMAO” I don’t think you and I are going to see eye to eye on much.

Do you not have a job, do you not strive to provide your family with a quality of life. When I last looked, there was little bar love in this world that comes for free.

A landlord is not a criminal, they simply choose to invest in property rather than banks. I think I’d love to hear your views on the state of our banks.

When you talk about striving to bring up families, do you not feel it is equally important that our children are able to go to school day in day out without the adverse effects of unruly children who are a result of poor social and moral standards. Should we start to license and blame teachers for the falling standards of childhood values within our schools?

I am a landlord because I know there will be no pension for me in the future. I make a very small profit on my properties and my tenants are all happy with me as a landlord.

Am I not allowed to be a honest, hardworking individual?

Shoot all landlords. Never mind the fact that we currently have in excess of 2000 empty houses in the borough. Where would you propose people live?

Might you agree that you and many others seem keen to stereotype all landlords?

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I speak as a tenant in a housing association property for the past 7 years. Prior to that I was an owner occupier for 42 years (at 8 different addresses), and once even a landlord, when I bought a house for my son to live in.

The property I rent is not ideal for my needs, but the 'security of tenure' is an important aspect that having a 'social landlord' provides.

I doubt that I will ever find that little bungalow in a quiet district that I seek.
I still look, both on the B-with-Us and the private sector.

There appear to be widespread social problems in whichever area of Hyndburn you look at.
I sold my last owned property at a loss to a man with 'ringlets and a black hat from Salford' just to escape my neighbours.

Now that landlords in the private sector are coming to terms with the fact that their investments are worth a heck of a lot less than the thought they would be, it maybe is time for all rented properties to be regulated in the same way that social housing associations are.

At least I now have a 20th century bathroom even though I had to wait 3 years to get it :D

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

If you continue to post incorrect statements, and then don't have the good grace to apologise, when what you posted was proved to be totally inaccurate, you're probably right.

Another little tip.

This is a family forum, and bad language, even when disguised by asterisks, isn't allowed. I've had to report one of your posts because of this, making more work for our site moderators.

Perhaps a perusal of the forum rules might be wise.

http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/f...mer-29681.html

An introduction, in the relevant thread, after issuing your apology, might be a wiser move still.

;)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I think a more urgent need is to address lettings agents, that think there are thirty one days in April, and that it's already past, in this year of 2010.

You don't exactly fill us with confidence, with your woefully inaccurate abilities to be factual.

I won't be investing in you, and therefore...I'm out.

;)

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

I for one welcome Eafield's informed contribution to Accyweb.

No councillor has yet let us know how many landlords were consulted. All we know so far is that Eafield was not consulted despite letting several homes in the area.

Re: Selective Licensing of Landlords
 

'Consultation was carried out via:

Borough wide questionnaires to landlords (1,000 – 11% return)

Landlord’s forum meetings.

Information to East Lancashire Landlords Association (ELLA), Residential landlords Association (RSL) and National Federation of Landlords (NFL)

...the landlord questionnaires were posted first class to all landlords of properties in the Borough that could be identified.'

http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...ng_-_App_C.pdf