Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Hot news among the commentariat is that, having officially denied it just a few weeks ago, HM Treasury, HM Foreign Office and The Bank of England are speeding up plans for the disorderly collapse of the Euro. No timscale is forecast by HMG for the collapse, but commentators are speculating that it will come at some point within the next month to two months. How it will happen appears to be anyone's guess, but a sudden banking failure, triggering a domino-like collapse of banks across Europe seems to be the anticipated scenario de jour.

Just a few short weeks ago The Bank of England dismissed the probability of a Euro collapse as one chance in a hundred. Yesterday, the Bank was no longer dismissing it and put that probability at 50/50.

Extraordinary situation. A genuinely historic moment. What woes such a collapse will bring in it's wake we can only guess at. Does anyone remember 1973?

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Was just 10 in 1973 - of such matters i have no recollection -except that at junior school we'd had to learn first the old pounds, shillings and pence and then the decimal currency...

Is the scenario so devastating for the Eurozone?:eek:

Do you suggest a transfer a funds from Euro to Sterling for those of us living in the Eurozone? It is something i had already thought about recently...

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Oh, of course, you are in Italy!!!

Best advice is to make sure you know where the Embassy or Consulate is and possibly let them know where you are. They have been instructed to put together contingency plans for Bank failures and civil unrest. They will be best placed to advise.

Italy is not a poor country and operates a very healthy black economy so there is probably quite a lot of undeclared paper money sloshing around under matresses etc. So a few ATM failures will not cause too much trouble.

What will happen when all the paper money becomes worthless - I don't know. Perhaps stocking up on tradeable goods might be a good idea.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Might be worth transfering some, mobertol, but if the euro goes down the plughole I think the pound may follow it, our economy will be wrecked along with that of the spendthrifts who caused all of this.
At least they had fun while it lasted, we didn't get the chance.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

I think that if the Euro collapses initially there'll be turmoil & upheaval that's inevitable, but prior to the introduction of the European currency everyone managed well enough & each Country knew where it stood as it could organise & balance it's taxes, debts & credits without the constraints imposed within the Euro zone.

Rulings from other Countries which benefit the stronger economies & leave weaker ones struggling to keep up due to an uneven playing field being the main reason why the Euro is struggling. Wages aren't comparative within the different states so therefore it follows taxation levels can't be placed upon the same level so aggravating the situation.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Will start packing the notes under the mattress in my trolley case and will be over on Monday's Ryanair flight from Bergamo to L'pool then I can open an account in the UK -should never have closed it...:rolleyes:;)

I might tell - my son to remain in India and transfer all his money from here into Rupees, could be a better bet in the long run -he could live there quite comfortably for years with the cost of living there..:D

I hope this is just a bit of scare-mongering....:eek:

By the way, A-B you haven't ellucidated on 1973.....I am all ears!

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

The transfer of Assets from the eurozone to Switzerland, the US and the UK has been going on for some months. Indeed, this is the main reason that London house prices are so bouyant.

But the situation is such a tangled mess, everything appears dependent upon everything else, that it is difficult to see that transferred assets would be any safer here than anywhere else.

One thing is for sure, Britain will not escape lightly.

1973. Followed on from the previous year's Winter of Discontent. The oil dispute was ongoing which forced up the price of coal, inflation was rampant and pay rises were capped. The miners went on strike (yet again) and the government were forced to ration electricity. Companies were allowed to use it on only three days per week. Households endured frequent blackouts. Get the picture?

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

I wish it was, but I don't think it is.

Still, to look on the bright side, if it means we can get out of the cursed EU then, to my mind, any amount of pain is worth it in the end.

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Got it! Thought it was later than 73 -I remember the blackouts -having to stay in playing cards in candle-light with our coats on to keep warm...

So it'll mean going back to the good old days...:(

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Got it! I was young enough to be able to regard it as something of an adventure. I was 16 at the time and knew nothing about anything. But I do recall that for my parents and my older workmates it was hard going.

Backs to the wall. The very situation where Britain is usually at it's best.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Yes, that is the one and only time I have ever drawn dole money.
We had to sign on to get our card stamped....the money was a pittance.

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I can only imagine what that must have cost you, Margaret. But we got through it, as we will whatever is coming down the tracks at us now.

I wonder how much longer this government have left?

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

In post #93 in this thread in 2009
http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/f...tml#post756537

I said "Massive debt is not just a local (UK) problem.
I have been watching Gerald Celente's forecasts for several months now."
"The dollar is about to collapse completely.
The first sign will be a prolonged 'bank holiday' when cash movements will be frozen."

In post #75 in this thread this month
http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/f...tml#post947236

I said "The collapse of ALL banks is imminent.
If you have savings, spend most of it on what you long for most.
If this doesn't leave enough left for the undertaker, so what ! - nobody gets left on top."

It is good to see that at last someone-else is heeding warnings

http://www.trendsresearch.com/gerald.php

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

It was indeed, a very tough time, but we got through the best way we could...we helped one another. There isn't really any other option, is there?

It is like when someone has gone through a great tragedy, and people remark on how brave they are......there is no bravery about it....you just live minute to minute and do what has to be done.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

I remember '73. A collapse of the banking system will be worse than that.
It is the sort of catastrophe that sparks revolutions.
...and some are already underway for other reasons.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Of course, there is also the possibility that the political and financial elites are planning something to distract us from our woes and also get the economy moving again. I would not want to be in Iran's shoes at the moment. I would not put it past the Americans to engineer a situation involving Israel, Syria and Iran. There is also the possibility of War in Europe.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

OMG! Please take that back at once...:(

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Just popped back from the reincarnation thread -you wouldn't be the second coming of Nostradamus by any chance:rolleyes:;):D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

The possible/likely scenarios -

Bring Out Your Dead - UBS Quantifies Costs Of Euro Break Up, Warns Of Collapse Of Banking System And Civil War | ZeroHedge

...not exactly comfortable to read or contemplate

"the historical parallels are unappealing. Past instances of monetary union break-ups have tended to produce one of two results. Either there was a more authoritarian government response to contain or repress the social disorder (a scenario that tended to require a change from democratic to authoritarian or military government), or alternatively, the social disorder worked with existing fault lines in society to divide the country, spilling over into civil war. These are not inevitable conclusions, but indicate that monetary union break-up is not something that can be treated as a casual issue of exchange rate policy"

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

The other amazing thing that has just ocurred to me is that everything seems to be lining up neatly just in time for the Mayan Prophecy about 2012. Apparently the prophecy was found in only one temple in Mexico... in the paper yesterday it was reported that they had found another temple with the same prophecy.

As regards the spectre of War in Europe. if the economies go down and their aint no cash who are people going to start blaming, when they get over the shock. They will look at those whose economies are still functioning with envious eyes.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Can you not rememember all the power cuts, and the like?

I was eight. It was terrible.

We had a windmill, which powered two lamps and a portable telly. Which was pointless, as there was no tv being broadcast.

Even Blur Peter. I was furious, and still think Biddy Baxter could have fettled together some sort of programme.

I can't get my head round all that's happening now.

I might cash in all my assets, and invest in something tangible.

Perhaps in community art. Something in wool, which will hold it's value.

It sounds frightening enough to give you a headache. Cheers Acidic-babs.

I might just blow everything, and throw caution to the wind, and host one almighty 'We're all doomed, doomed I tell you' party.

http://images.coolchaser.com/themes/...SmileyFace.gif

:rolleyes:

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Remember it all -and you saying you had alternative power and a swimming pool as we were all suffering!

Glad you' re still a party animal - I was about to throw out an SOS! Put me on the list for the party-if the world's about to end -I want to go out with a bang -and you know what kind i mean.;):D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

A 'run on the banks' is possible.
This site indicates which banks(20) are most vulnerable
20 Banks That Will Get Crushed If The PIIGS Go Bust

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Ok, you will be invited. My parties have bangs a plenty.

We are more vunerable as a society, than we were 40 years ago.

Most people didn't even have freezers then. Now we rely on electicity for everything. From getting money from the hole in the wall, to receiving our news.

Who has a battery powered radio nowadays?

Though that would be near useless too, as there'd be very little being broadcast.

I've been squirreling away three years worth of dried food stock, and after that I've discovered I can survive on what I can forage from nearby woodland.

It might not be pretty, but the new Dark Age could be fun.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Sigh Now that I have cheered everyone up here's a little light relief...

(rush ahead to 1m, 20secs)

Fred Astaire & Ginger Rogers: Let's Face The Music And Dance 1936 - YouTube


A wonderfully illogical solution to the problem, perhaps, but I can't think of a better one for now.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Sorry your timing's a bit out - the three day week was Jan to Mar 1974 (I missed it as I was working in the States). So mobertol is right it was the following year.

Also the Winter of Discontent was 1978-9 under Callaghan.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

The advantages of heeding conspiracy forums is now revealing itself.
I am prepared .... right down to the axe by the front door :D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

'It is eerily reminiscent of the 1973 energy crisis when rising oil prices pushed up inflation and sent the world into an economic tailspin. Britain was hit particularly hard at the time, suffering power cuts, rampant inflation and a three-day working week.'
BBC News | UK | Is this 1973 all over again?


1973 was winter of discontent
1973 was real winter of discontent | The Sun |Features


'The Three-Day Week was one of several measures introduced in the United Kingdom by the Conservative Government 1970–1974 to conserve electricity, the production of which was severely limited due to industrial action by coal miners. The effect was that from 1 January until 7 March 1974 commercial users of electricity would be limited to three specified consecutive days' consumption each week and prohibited from working longer hours on those days.'
Three-Day Week - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

International trade will stop - enjoy bananas while you still can :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTTrXAE7OPU

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Your half right.

The term winter of discontent, wasn't used until 1978/79.

Though there were national power cuts in 1973.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Nevermind bananas.


Enjoy getting any shopping, ordered and delivered, whilst you can.

;):D

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Even if you soak it, you'll have to chop it into very small pieces, before it's palatable.

;)

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I already have - the axe by the door ensures I hang onto it:D
Scavengers will raid the allotments first.
There are four edible weeds within a 4 minute walk.
I have 2 (paper) books to identify edibles and water purification drops to clean water from Tinker Brook.

PS you may recall a thread a while back where I asked about local springs ;)

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Party sounds promising -let's have one in any case...to ward off the inevitable! I know it's your gaff -but I'd warn Babs to lighten up or I'll not endorse his invitation...:D

Luckily I am my Gran-mother's protegé - she was a great survivor and I have picked up many of her war-time tips and instincts too!

As to foraging -no probs. do you like rose-hip tea? I can recognise mushrooms too, the poisonous ones could be traded with poisonous folk...:rolleyes: I can also kill and pluck feathered things -the joys of farm living. If you ever fancy a roast heron or such...;)

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Either way, it was not a good time. I also remember, before that time, the idea of locking petrol caps on cars was almost unheard of. During the worst of the petrol shortages the company I worked for was selling them by the hundreds to prevent theives from siphoning the petrol from your car at night.

Margaret's idea of self-sufficiency isn't as half-baked as it sounds. And even in a depression there is always a bob or two to be made.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Have I upset you all. I'm sorry... Oh dear where are The Empire Girls when you need them?

Oh. Here they are...



When You're Smiling (1930) - YouTube

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

I really can't believe how bad that is.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

The Mayan Prophecy, interesting reading but personally, I'll have salt on mine please. :)

2012 Mayan Calendar 'Doomsday' Date Might Be Wrong : Discovery News

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Just about forgiven for that -charming actually -not bad at all!

It's a song my Grand-mother used to sing....it's very optomistic in it's way.

You might make it to the party yet -especially if you do a tip-tap routine dressed as a little sailor-boy!:D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

If Mayan prophecy interests you there are some informative lectures on this site
Mayan Majix - Learning Lab (playlist on the left side)
Ian X Lungold based his lectures on the research by Dr. Carl Johan Calleman, whose book I have also read.

It is not an end of the world doomsday prophecy.:rolleyes:

Incidentally the Mayan prophecy matches those in the Hindu Yugas

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Loath as I am to blow my own trumpet, there's nothing little about this sailor boy.

Max and Paddy...paddy teaches max to dance.(perfect quality) - YouTube

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

But some have taken it to such levels & that is the thing that some people are focusing on.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

There is reason why 'they' do that
....but I ain't gonna say - had enough ridicule for today:D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Well, the news isn't all bad:

Canada?s Strong Banking System: Benefitting Canadians

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Don't think Goldman Sachs' hasn't noticed. Look at the people in charge and then look at the additional positions they hold and the groups they are members of.

If Canada isn't feeling the financial heat right now, that means one of two things: either you are already bought and paid for or you are just being kept in reserve.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

They are worth their weight in wood over there as i'm sure Eric will confirm...:rolleyes:

The Lumberjack Song - YouTube

:D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

So you've joined the ranks of the out to lunch conspiracy theorists? The reasons for our economic strength are simple and open for anyone to see. A regulated banking system, strong financial sector, and the resources of the second largest country in the world ... and that basket case, Russia is the first. As our PM told Obama recently, concerning the US's balking at the building of a pipeline from Western Canada to the Gulf: if the US doesn't want our oil, then China and Japan will be more than willing to buy it.:alright: We will build our pipeline whatever ... if it doesn't go to the Gulf, we'll build it to Vancouver. Fact is, we are already the largest supplier of offshore oil to the US ... they like it that way because of our political and social stability ... we are also their largest supplier of uranium and potash ... and their largest customer for their Lockheed F-35 fighters. We will have some sort of recession ... people will buy less of what we have in abundance; but they can't buy none of it ... they need it. We hardly felt the last global meltdown. Obviously Europe and the US can't fix their economies ... it will hurt us some; but, as with the last mess, we will survive better than most.

Contrary to popular belief in the rest of the world, we do not kiss American ass .... we leave that up to people like Tony Blair ... Remember the joke: "What's 6 inches long and hangs down between GW's legs? Ans. Tony Blair's tie.":rolleyes: WMDs anyone?

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

I advised you to look at the people running your financial services sector and and their associations.

Entirely at random, and courtesy of Wikipedia, I looked at the Bank of Montreal (also known as BMO Financial Group). Apparently this has as it's CEO a chap called Bill Downe.
Nice chap, I'm sure, and just a tad older than me at 59.

Following the impressive tally of positions held within the Bank of Montreal there follows a list of Professional Associations

"Bill Downe is the only Canadian member of the International Business Leaders Advisory Council of the Mayor of Beijing, and he is a member of the International Advisory Council of Guanghua School of Management at Peking University. He is a director of Catalyst, and a member of Catalyst’s Canadian Board of Advisors. Mr. Downe is also a member of the Economic Club of Chicago and Past President of the Federal Reserve Board’s Federal Advisory Council."

It took me less than thirty seconds to find that out.

I would argue that if you looked at the other members of the FED's Advisory Council you would find the grasping fingers of Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan et al.

That was just an example chosen at random. I bet if you went through all the Schedule I banks you would find more than a coincidental relationship to G-Sachs and JP Morgan.

What does it mean? Perhaps, nothing at all. Perhaps they are all just good friends and simply play Golf together. Perhaps. But I wouldn't bet on it.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Oh and another thing I only discovered recently. You spoke of Natural Resources. The sorts of things that make greedy men's eye gleam.

In the 1930's, The USA, with whom as you know we here in the UK share a 'special relationship' had put together a plan for the destruction of the British Empire. They were terribly worried at our strangle hold on international trade. They got so far with the planning that airfields and military bases were set up, in secret, next to the Canadian border in readiness for invasion.

That was in the late thirties, before America became a world power. Don't believe me? Think I'm still a conspiracy theorist/crank/nutjob? Read this...

How America planned to destroy BRITAIN in 1930 with bombing raids and chemical weapons | Mail Online

Then wonder what would happen if, just after Christmas, the brown solids really hit the fan and the US suddenly needed what Canada had.

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You forget to mention that the present govenor of the Bank of Canada, Mark Carney, spent 13 years with Goldman Sachs ... not that it matters a hill of beans when it comes to doing the best for Canada. He has been credited with shielding Canada from the last financial crisis. He is the current chairman of the Finacial Stability Board ... another international link ... a recognition not only of his personal abilities as an economist (got his degrees at a place called Oxford, I believe), but also of the strength of Canada's financial institutions. Whichever way you look at the current international economic picture, we will survive better than most. Still, the biggest threat to the world economy is the mess that the Europeans have got themselves into ... the short term for which is "EU." Which probably means that those of you who belong to the "let's get out now" group are right, and that Cameron, Clegg, Milliband et al. ... and, yes, your own MP ... are dead wrong. In the long term, the best thing for the UK would be the disintegration of the European Union.

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You prove my point, Eric. Now look at the 'technocrats' that have just been imposed on Greece and Italy. You will find the same track record.

Goldman Sachs has it's grubby fingers in more pies than you can imagine.

As I said before, Goldman's have not overlooked Canada and they won't be backward in calling in favours when the time comes.

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Niall Ferguson wrote an interesting essay on a future vision of Europe, in yesterday's Sunday Times.

Handily, because you have to pay for the online version, he's also flogged it to The Wall Street Journal, where it's free.

:D

Niall Ferguson on 2021: The New Europe - WSJ.com

Thanks for the link rindy, I almost read it but 95% of me couldn't be bothered.

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Not a bad read ... quite punny in places;)

If some on here got together, I think that they could come up with something just as good ... probably even better:alright:

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

I only liked his tale, because it had a happy ending.

Britain no longer being part of the United States of Europe.

:D

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Me too....and the link to Article 50 of the Lisbon treaty brightened what would have otherwise been a very grey day......I know, I should get out more! :)

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

well the powers gone out in william st, is this the shape of things to come?

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

"The lamps are going out all over Europe. We shall not see them lit again in our time.";)

Geert Wilders has a more modern version. You can google it. Don't want to put in a link ... this is a family forum:rolleyes::D ... and it is a tad controversial, eh:dancedog:

Re: Be Careful What You Wish For
 

Don't get too cocky.

We're just about to evacuate Gracie Fields, and a whole coach load of minor royals, for safe keeping, until we once again have peace in our time in Europe.

;):D

Will the blokes that clean up the London streets after the Queens horses be cleaning up these evacuations, or will we get some Eastern European pooper scooper's coming over and doing a better job for less money?