Did Graham Jones do the right thing?

[Ken Moss]

Originally Posted by Less

Please, don't point me to link's, I asked you for simple terms that convinced YOU and other Councillors, not the official (amendment?). I myself am a simple soul, if it convinced you, why won't it convince me?

I know you and I haven't been eye to eye for a while, that can be rectified by honesty, not by hiding behind the Party/Council interpretation of what happened.

The honest answer is that I can't remember, it was over six months ago now and was of very little interest to me even then since it had almost no relevance to my council work whatsoever. At the time I just wanted an overview of the situation because I was being asked to vote on something which I had no prior knowledge of. My overriding thought was to get a basic grasp of why I was voting in favour of the amendment as opposed to the original motion. I think the Labour amendment is less biased although I would still rather the Conservatives had not brought it to the table in the first place since it would only stir up emotions somewhere and not really solve anything.

Can we please drop this now? I feel as if I've said everything I have to say on this subject at least twice.

[Less]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

The honest answer is that I can't remember, it was over six months ago now and was of very little interest to me even then since it had almost no relevance to my council work whatsoever. At the time I just wanted an overview of the situation because I was being asked to vote on something which I had no prior knowledge of. My overriding thought was to get a basic grasp of why I was voting in favour of the amendment as opposed to the original motion. I think the Labour amendment is less biased although I would still rather the Conservatives had not brought it to the table in the first place since it would only stir up emotions somewhere and not really solve anything.

Can we please drop this now? I feel as if I've said everything I have to say on this subject at least twice.

Oh dear me, yes, let's drop it, that is certainly an honest answer.
To vote in such a throw away fashion,

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

and was of very little interest to me even then since it had almost no relevance to my council work whatsoever

I make everyday decisions along similar lines, "does it affect Me?"

Answer, "no", well in that case, 'stuff it', follow the crowd. Let me get on with my life.

[garinda]

Graham Jones publicly said on here, in reference to a referendum on our European Union membership, that it would, quote, 'settle the matter democratically'.

Yet two short weeks later he voted for his puppet masters, rather than his constituents, and denied the people of Hyndburn the democratic right to have their views counted.

The overwhelming majority of people thought he was wrong to do so.

He's now also known to be someone capable of the grossest hypocrisy.

Only a fool, or someone similarly as keen to arse lick their way to the top of the putrid political pole, can see this very clearly.

[Less]

Originally Posted by garinda

Only a fool, or someone similarly as keen to arse lick their way to the top of the putrid political pole, can see this very clearly.

Should that have read:-

Originally Posted by garinda

Only a fool, or someone similarly as keen to arse lick their way to the top of the putrid political pole, can fail to see this very clearly.

Is Jay giving private lessons? Where do I sign?

[Ken Moss]

Originally Posted by garinda

He's now also known to be someone capable of the grossest hypocrisy.

Only a fool, or someone similarly as keen to arse lick their way to the top of the putrid political pole, can see this very clearly.

Interesting.

Change of heart?

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Less

Should that have read:-





Is Jay giving private lessons? Where do I sign?

I dictated it correctly.

Jaysay typed it incorrectly.

He's not going to last long, on this work experience placement.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

Interesting.

Change of heart?

Nah.

You have to have one.

In order to change it.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

Interesting.

Change of heart?

Jones put his party before the people of Hyndburn.

The vast majority of people thought he was wrong to do so.

As galling, was the sheer hypocrisy. After saying what he did on here, about a referendum settling the matter 'democratically'.

He's nearly up there with you.

When it comes to saying the wrong thing, and digging himself into a deeper hole.

At least Britcliffe knew his limitations.

Hence only two posts of his are on here.

From hero to zero.

Some can achieve that in only a few, foolish words.

Still, I suppose that's evidence of at least some talent.

[Ken Moss]

Originally Posted by garinda

The vast majority of people thought he was wrong to do so.

Did they?

Is this based on the 46 votes cast in your poll?

Out of over 80,000 residents in Hyndburn?

Possibly not quantifiable as a representative cross-section of the borough's views, I fear.

[Margaret Pilkington]

I think, for me, what caused me the greatest concern was that Graham Jones felt that 95% of the electorate couldn't give a toss about the EU....now what I would like to know is, where did he get that figure from? Had he done a straw poll...or did he just pluck the figure from thin air.
While the vote on here may not be representative of how the borough as a whole would vote(it is, after all, only a straw poll) we aren't ever going to find out how many people care about whether we are in or out of the EU, unless someone gives us a say in the matter.
As far as I am concerned Graham showed an amazing lack of concern with the people who voted for him......and more than a little hypocrisy and a self serving attitude.

It really does make voting less and less attractive, when those who are elected do not live up to our first initial impressions and hope. Maybe that is our fault for believing that voting changes anything.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

Did they?

Is this based on the 46 votes cast in your poll?

Out of over 80,000 residents in Hyndburn?

Possibly not quantifiable as a representative cross-section of the borough's views, I fear.

It's certainly unquestionable evidence, as to what the vast majority of people on here thought, of his actions.

Unlike the '95% of people who don't give a toss about Europe', according to Graham Jones, and to which Margaret P. refers to.

Do you happen to know the actual source, where that figure came from?

Or was it plucked from the air, in utter desperation?

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

I think, for me, what caused me the greatest concern was that Graham Jones felt that 95% of the electorate couldn't give a toss about the EU....now what I would like to know is, where did he get that figure from? Had he done a straw poll...or did he just pluck the figure from thin air.
While the vote on here may not be representative of how the borough as a whole would vote(it is, after all, only a straw poll) we aren't ever going to find out how many people care about whether we are in or out of the EU, unless someone gives us a say in the matter.
As far as I am concerned Graham showed an amazing lack of concern with the people who voted for him......and more than a little hypocrisy and a self serving attitude.

It really does make voting less and less attractive, when those who are elected do not live up to our first initial impressions and hope. Maybe that is our fault for believing that voting changes anything.

I've already said I think Jones arrived at that figure, after taking a poll in his office.

With only Merkel the office cat, being responsible for the unloyal, dissenting 5%.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

Interesting.

Change of heart?

Thought about bank balance more like it, is chance of getting a JOB would have gone straight out the window if he'd have disobeyed Mr Ed

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by garinda

I've already said I think Jones arrived at that figure, after taking a poll in his office.

With only Merkel the office cat, being responsible for the unloyal, dissenting 5%.

Ya and he must have roped Bernard in the swell the vote

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

I would never undermine Graham Jones and so the straight answer is yes.

I don't know enough about Europe to discuss it properly so until that changes I will leave decisions to those who do.

So basically you just agree with whatever Graham Jones does through blind loyalty? I also don't see why disagreeing with him is "undermining" him. Surely the hallmark of a mature political relationship is being able to disagree about things at times?

As for leaving decisions to those who "know enough" about issues, why bother having a democracy at all? If the politicians know so much more than us, we may as well not bother with elections and just let them get on with it!