The Peel Monument
 

On the top of the Coppice is the Peel Monument, a symbol of the returning of the Coppice to the people of Accrington. It celebrates its centenary in 2009. Now, I know that it's a long time off but I also know how long it takes for things to happen around here.

We should be making our voices heard now that we want this monument tidying up in time for its centenary.

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Would be quicker to ask for voulanteers and all go up one sunday to do a proper cleaning job on it (My hands up)... I fear with 3 yrs to go you have left it too late for the officials to sort out:)

Start the accyweb friends of the coppice society or summat..... seriously.. I have been waiitng years for accyweb to make a difference.. have a project... lets see if this is it ?

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..surely it is more than a Graffiti-removal job? I thought there was some subsidence under one part of the structure and some serious cracking? Mind you, last time I was up there was 1974, so things may have changed a bit.

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Are you suggesting accyweb isnt up to the job then tealeaf... how much cold water have you got in your taps :)

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Send up the community service mob to clean it up. It would bring it back to its glory and wont cost the town a penny.

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Any chance of someone whipping up with a camera. I know there are recent pictures around but we need damage identification shots as it is currently before anything else is done.

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whipping up the coppice days are long gone for this out of shape snapper :) I can get up there but its more a struggle than a pop up :)

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Maybe it could be a task for Mid Pennine Arts, they seem to like doing things on tops of hills, this could probably be something useful for a change, or in real terms value for money

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It needs new foundations, and the very least the base stone re-laying, they've sunk, becuase the ground around it has been eroded. there's no pointing, on the base stones. It's covered with paint. Now I don't know if you realise it but stone is not smooth, spray paint gets into every tiny crack,so unless it was covered with mould, you've got no chance of just scrubbing the paint off.

You also need some decent paths up there.

As has been said elsewhere, as part of your panoptican, you should maybe make the existing monument your panoptican with it being raised higher, uplit, with lit paths leading to it, and a total revamp of the shelter.


I didn't realise that was a peel monument as well as the one at ramsbottom.

You do realise that tamworth here, has connections with peel don't you? I've just bought some sir robert peel first day stamp covers off ebay, that are franked in tamworth

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Too be honest it is more than likely outside of our ability to do the work ourselves. Some of the facing stones would need to be replaced and the rest would need to be removed and sand or bead blasted. I wouldn’t object to doing some of the donkey work on specific days but it would probably be of more use for us to be involved in fund raising or canvassing local industry to chip in and do the work cost free. The end result would require proofing against kids and vandals.

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We offered to do something but your friend refused our offer.

If you recall we said that we would look for additional funding to sort out the monument and the paths but we took the hint when someone said 'no, no, no'. It made it perfectly clear that our help wasn't wanted.

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Not men from mars Gayle anything but men from mars

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So....... what do you think of making this monument your panoptican, by adding to it, not adding something to the side of it, but adding to this.

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Can anyone give me directions to a site where I can see a picture of this monument or even post a picture on here?

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I thought it was the Tory party election address that showed men from Mars, and your friend Peter and his chums were going to protect us from an alien invasion.

Seroiusly, I think Gayle has good point that now is the time to start fundraising for the monument to be refurbished for 2009. I suppose that place to start would be to get the monument inspected and the to find out the cost of restoration, then see were the funds can be obtained from.

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Click on gallery at the top of the page, the go down to Miscellaneous, and then to coppice.

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Blah, blah, blah.

Yada, yada, yada.

Your negativity/obsession with Gayle is becoming tired.

Surely she can't still be a threat to your beloved Peter?

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Sir Robert Peel was MP for Tamworth from 1830 to until his death in 1850, and in 1834, he issued the first party political manifesto, known as the "Tamworth Manifesto".
His father Robert Peel (who was born at Peel Fold)had been MP for Tamworth from 1790 until his death in 1830. The family lived at Drayton Manor.

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What do you expect?

Three years for the Council to plan something?

No way.

Much more exciting to botch something up at the last minute.

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Drayton manor as such has gone now:( it's just a theme park.

The railway line through here, was originally called the peel line, now the trent valley line.

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lol she is cos next time she will get in :D

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I didn't necessarily mean that it should be the council who should plan something - I agree it would be bothched up at the last meeting.
However there must be other bodies who can be approached to get he ball rolling - I suppose it can be classed as an historical monument (especaily as it commerates the family of an ex prime minister, and one very widely known, if only for the establishment of the ploce force)., so maybe English Heritage could be worth a try as a starting point.
Gayle have you any ideas how the project could get off the ground?

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I agree but isn't that one of the jobs of our local Council to protect the unique heritage of our area?

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yes but be realistic rindy

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(Deep breath.)

I appreciate every wise decision Hyndburn Council has took on my behalf.

I love HBC.

^ I'd buy a sticker of that off the council, as long as it was on Free Trade paper and re-cyclable.;)

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I'll donate a roll of co-op free trade toilet paper to them then on your behalf so that they can be printed up. We wouldn't want then to waste tax payers money on paper would we.

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It is but wouldn't it be kick in the teeth for PB et al if we the people took the inniative.

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Serious question here... may be a bit daft and uninformed and whatever.. but I gotta ask

In Hyndburn or Accrington.. is there not some sort of protection society... a group that looks after important things.. heritage stuff maybe or preservation? Sorry no idea who or what... just wondering if there is something in place... people who would make sure these things are done... people who should have been consulted when they ripped down the arndale clock without consultation... tha knows...

anyone follow my question ? :)

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Yes, english heritage protect some sites buildings and monuments, others are listed. grade 2 usually for something like that.

Other society's help to protect stuff to, i think there's an elizabethan society, victorian society, national trust, then you get the locals, civic societies, your local council. Planning department environmental health for unsafe structures etc.
Not sure that any would or wouldn't cover that monument. Depends on who it belongs to. It's got to belong to someone.

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hmmm thinking?, joking? , hugging?, enjoying?, trying?, ... haaa got it!.... brainstorming?


go on then i give up... what was the secret word doug ?

:):):)

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The thought of that clock gathering dust in that dark damp basement makes me sad :(

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I didn't say that did I? :o ****** I must be more understanding to my fellow web mates......:) :) :)

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I had a great deal to do with finding out about the arndale clock.. i corresponded with the arndale, greg pope.. the observer and even the guy who made it... then when it came time to do soemhting the whole of accyweb seemed to lose interest :( the threads there to see still.

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Is there now’t on the HBC site about special interest groups or heritage projects in the area?

The problem with this Monument is that it’s not attractive or regionally important enough to attract large scale funding. If it going to get done its likely to be a load of fat middle aged men giving up there Sundays and sweating there bollocks off swinging pick and shovel just like the old days.

I know I don’t qualify given the aforementioned description but I wouldn’t mind getting involved. :) :)

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Yes Kippax I follow your question, I don't know whether their is a Civic Society or not. I should think they would be the people to contact. I'll try to find out tomorrow.

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Kipax I know, thats the first thread I ever read on here, and it's the reason I ended up on here, so it's partly your own fault that your stuck with me.
I was talking to the girlfriend at the time who lives in rawtenstall and somehow clocks got mentioned, and she told me about the clock that used to be in accrington. I decided to see if I could find out about it and find Pictures. I ended up on that thread.

That clock should be in the market hall. If you don't want it up there, I'll have AJ buy it and ship it down here, he likes clocks, he'll build it a special home somwhere out of his pocket money :rolleyes:

Re: The Peel Monument
 

From Hyndburn website about Peel Park

Peel Park and Coppice


History
The land that today comprises Peel Park and the Coppice was acquired for recreational use by the Town Council of Accrington from the Peel family who originated from Peel Fold, Oswaldtwistle and who are notable for Sir Robert Peel the Prime Minster and founder of the Police force. Some of the land was purchased at a favourable price and the Peel family donated the remainder. The work of laying out the park was implemented to coincide with periods of depression and so alleviate local unemployment.

Mr William Peel officially opened the park on 29 September, 1909 . The opening ceremony included a procession of 5,000 children from local schools, three bands and civic dignitaries walking from Avenue Parade to the top of the Coppice. The school's represented on the procession; Cambridge Street, St. Anne's, St. Mary Magdalene's, Hargreaves Street, St. Andrew's, St. Mary's Woodnook, Spring Hill, St. John's, Hyndburn Park, Benjamin Hargreaves, St. Peter's, St. Oswald's, St. John's Baxenden, Green Haworth and St. James.

On the Coppice there used to be four guns which were donated by William Peel in 1910. They overlooked Peel Park and Peel's Accrington House

As Peel Park (and the Coppice) are designated Parks on Hyndburn Council website, the Council must be ultimately responsible for the monument.

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hmmm depends on who inherited the park from town council. You obviously had a seperate town council at one time like we've got, but according to what your saying it's part of your borough council now, unless your town council still owns parks.
It confuses me up there, you do like to complicate things.

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Another group who might be interested are the Prospects Foundation they can be contacted c/o Hyndburn Borough Council.

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I realise that our set up is different to yours. But basically the park belonged to Accrington Borough Council, who amalgamated with the urban district councils of Church, Clayton-le-Moors, Rishton, Great Harwood and Oswaldtwistle in 1974 to form Hyndburn Borough Council. We now only have one council in Hyndburn, there aren't any town councils, just the borough council
All the parks are now owned and managed by Hyndburn Borough Council. The park here in Clayton-le-Moors, Mercer Park was owned by Clayton-le-Moors urban district council prior to 1974, but is now owned by Hyndburn Council.
I know its a moot point whether the parks are being managed properly, but they are the responsibilty of Hyndburn Council.

Re: The Peel Monument
 

well according to that it was acquired for recreational use by the Town Council of Accrington from the Peel family .town council/urban district/ parish, then above that is borough, anyway if it's hyndburn that took over the park then they took over the monument.

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Trivia. whats the connection between sir robert peel and aliens?
There is one.

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Sorry if I sound political here, but the connection, although it is very supurious is as follows. Mid Penine Arts (for whom Gayle works) wanted to build a panopticon on top of the Coppice. Peter Britcliffe (the Tory leader), didn't want one, and implied that Gayle was only standing against him in the local elections in May in a fit of pique. The election manifesto that the Tories sent out, had a picture of the Coppice with a alien spaceship on the top, and the Tories promised to protect our hills (possibly it appeared at first glance from aliens), although I think it was ment to be panopticon they were protecting us all against, but that didn't seem to clear

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If you can follow the plot we were until Jaysay/ John Farrer/Peter Britcliffe's chum had another dig at Gayle.

I merely remarked it was becoming boring, plus it is quite a valid point that our council has some responsibility to maintain our historic heritage.

Follow me so far?

Good.:D

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In answer to your question there is a Civic Society in Oswaldtwistle. I don't know if there's one for Accrington. I'd like to think there is.

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I have 2 questions as i have never been up there and dont think i could make it anyway.
1) what is the monument for ?
2) when was it put there?

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Not an expert but-
1/ 1909.
2/ To commemerate the fact Sir Robert Peel's family came from the area. They lived at Peel Fold in Oswaldtwistle.

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/PRpeel.htm

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Quite sad to see that the graffiti isn't the usual Jane luvs Tony, but appears to be political. Anti-war and the CND symbol.

W*nkers.:mad:

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I agree that our council definitely has some resposiblity to maintain our historic heritage.
The comment that you made about hanging baskets, whilst they might sound a good way, in principle, of brightening the borough up. They are an extravagance we can't afford, when you look at how neglected our once proud towns were. It is a case of fiddling whilst Rome burned.
I am going to email Peter Britcliffe and ask what the borough is going to do to restore the monument in time for the 100th anniversary of the opening of Peel Park. I will let you all know his reply, and then we can all think how to put pressure on him to preserve how heritage.

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I think this is what you need as a starting point

http://www.lantern.lancashire.gov.uk...1178/1188.html

Mind you the stonework has been deeply carved into by people leaving their marks and I don`t know how you can rectify that.

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wow this thread has grown over night! - To answer a few questions -

Jaysay brought MPA and the Panopticon into the debate (again, boring boring). My point was that there is no reason for Mid Pennine Arts to be involved because the Panopticon was rejected and that remains the situation. It's not an art project so we have no interest and we haven't been commissioned to do any work on it so again we have no interest. If we were approached then I'm sure we would but the chances of that happening are slim - we've been told to leave the Coppice alone and we're doing what we were told.

As for me personally, I am one person around here. Yes, I know about funding and yes, I am interested in history but I can't do everything and you shouldn't expect me to!

Yes, there is an Accrington civic society and for all I know they might be doing something but it's on HBC land so surely they should be doing something.

The grafitti has been there for many years, it is all CND and war stuff so I'm guessing that it's mid 70s - it's been in that state for years.

So that answers a few of them.

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Before Rindi gets his knickers in a twist, I'm not having a go at Gayle, but maybe she would like to define "Art". One only has to look at the Turner Prize to begin to scratch ones head when it comes to art. I for one was rather annoyed at the fact the the Lottery funded the National Opera to the tune of £50 million quid when the likes of Accrington Blind Society were rufused funding to upgrade their Bank street HQ. To me people who like art should fund it, or at best done try to push it down every ones neck on a basis of like it or lump it.

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I agree with Gayle, she can't be expected to do everything, and as it is on Hyndburn Council's land they should do something about it.
I have just sent an email to Peter Britcliffe (copy of text below) and await his reply. I will post a copy of his reply, when I receive it. I also copied Graham Jones into the email, both to keep him informed as Leader of The Labour Party, and in his role as a ward councillor - I am uncertain whether the Coppice is in Peel ward or Huncoat.
COPY OF TEXT OF EMAIL
Dear Mr Britcliffe
As you are no doubt aware, on 29 September 2009 , it will be the centenary of the official opening of Peel Park by Mr William Peel.
Could you please tell me what plans Hyndburn Borough Council have to celebrate this event. Also what steps are being taken to renovate, and preserve for future generations, the Peel monument on the top of the Coppice. This monument commemorates the family connection of the Prime Minister Sir Robert Peel to our borough, and surely is something which we make every effort to renovate and preserve.
Regards

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I sent my email at 10.55 this morning, and I haven't received an acknowlegement yet.

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Peter britcliff should be ashamed of himself if he blocked the panoptican and then had the cheek to turn it in to an election joke when what is up there, and has been there all through, is a vandalised disgrace. It's a disgrace to the peel family, it's a disgrace to accrington people.

peter britcliffe doesn't class a panoptican as art but he classes this as art. He MUST do, it's been there for years, and all through the panoptican arguments.
http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/a...g?d=1152167115

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Look peter, a nuclear bunker for you and your fellow councillors
http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/a...t-coppice.jpg?

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There is another thing to consider... Its all old graffiti and could also be seen as part of history.... No one is doing anything bad to it at the moment.... but thats not my point...

What do you think will happen as soon as everyone knows its been cleaned up? I think we all know :(

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What right has he got to say that?
It's not HIS coppice is it, and he doesn't make the decisions either. YOU the electorate make those, he's supposed to carry them out.

What were the grounds for the panoptican being refused?
According to whats been written on here the public seemed to like some of the designs.

There's another connection between robert peel and aliens.

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show me.... i got the impression everyone was appaled and was 100% behind getting it stopped.. I am happy to be corrected and cant wait to see who thought it was a good design or a good idea..... so please do... show ? :)

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Let's not go over this again please?

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he started it .....





sorry couldnt resist that :)

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What about forming some sort of "friends of the coppice" type thing ?

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Can I just add a quick word on the Panopticon malarkey? Blackburn's Corporation Park has a Panopticon,it's called "Colourfields".All that happened there was that funding paid for the derelict cannon batteries to be refurbished and made safe for the public to use as a viewing point.The original structure is still intact,it now has some fancy railings and some quite pleasant striped paving.You can see for miles over to the Fylde coast,hence the word Panopticon. I would urge the more broad minded and intelligent members of the site to have a nosey at this given the chance. It hasn't spoiled anything,it has saved a dilapidated and dangerous structure and transformed it into something usable and accessible again. I was originally totally against the whole Panopticon idea,but there is NO reason why the funding cannot be used to improve/refurbish an existing structure......food for thought eh???

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I think that is a great idea Kippax and Lindsay's post about the Blackburn pantoptican certainly points us in a direction of keeping and refurbishing the exsisting memorial and adding features in the vincinity that enhnace it. Often, it isn't until people see what has been acheived somewhere that they can envisage a similar scheme in their own area.

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lol, behave or I'll tell miss.

Kipax, I can understand that people don't want something that doesn't fit, some sort of super modern space alien thing, although I like the space ship one. I do not believe that it's right for a councillor to say that HE doesn't want ANYTHING on the coppice. thats taking your right as an accrington resident away from you.
I believe you could get a nice scheme on there that enhances and adds to whats there already. Something that most will like. I'll design something for you based on whats there and what I feel.

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So it has been done elsewhere then. It can be done, you don't need a fancy new panoptican, you can add to what you've got.

The problem with the existing panoptican is that its got no hight to it. Is there a reason that it shouldn't be higher, or a reason why there shouldn't be something high up there?

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Is there an electricity supply up there ? or was one planned?

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robert peel fonded the police force
The police had police boxes with telephones in, you know the square blue ones
Dr who uses one to go and visit aliens.
who knows, he could even turn up in it on top of the coppice, and people will think the tardis is the new panoptican

So there, thats the connection between robert peel and aliens on the coppice.

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Still need an answer about leccy supply though. You need a camera up there really to stop vandalism.

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PB has been away all week and is not back until late Friday, but he is aware of your Email

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Thank you for that info. But do you monitor his emails for him when he is away?

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No Claytonender, but his secretary does and at 11.30 am there was nothing in his in box. it could be delay on the server, but I have a copy of you post of 10. 58 yesterday.

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I thought that HBC are not putting any money into Mid Penine this year. We can hardly expect something from them if we don't put anything in.

Maybe Gayle would like to remind us how much HBC put into Mid Penine and how much Mid Penine brought into Hyndburn.

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What is Art?

Art is undefinable.

It's conceptual.

Perhaps Immanuel Cricket Club, which was recently awarded tax payer's money from a committee headed by Peter Britcliffe, could claim to be a collective of performance artists and try and secure funding from the Arts Council of Great Britain instead, the next time they need funding?

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Thats true rindy, we've debated that down here for months and got no where, which is why I say what right has one person got to say no, just because he didn't like the schemes that were suggested.

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See you do have your uses.;)

What is it they say about keeping a dog and barking one's self?:D



Someone said the anti-war graffiti has been up there since the seventies. It must be bloody good paint! Where can I buy some?

What war is it refering to, Vietnam?

To me it looks more recent and refers to the war in Iraq.

It wasn't there the last time I was up there about six years ago.

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six years is still a long time for nothing to have been done about it. perhaps something to say what it's for would help to, I'm guessing that they see that as some sort of war memorial to paint that on it.

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If you had taken me up on my offer of giving you a lift to that meeting you would have heard that debate 1st hand. One gentlemen was very opposed to the money going to the cricket club. Peter put it to a vote of all those present at the meeting. The vote was yes ( my a large majority ) and they got the money.

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Thats strange because he is in Bournemouth all week. His Secretary is Linda. How do you know what's in his inbox? I know he can collect his mail online but I am not sure he knows how.

Nice to see you back anyway Mr Farrer. All this anti-art stuff, you'll be burning books outside Scaitclife House next. Whatever happenned to freedom of expression then??

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Please you lot try and keep on topic, it is a good and sensible suggestion that something needs to be done about. If you must have a political debate please take it somewhere else.


Graham, is the coppice not part of your friends group?

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S H U T- U P ! ! !

I was going to go but was having a ****ty day.

Happily my absence still allows me to put forward my point of view, does it not?

It's like saying we can't discuss national politics unless we were present in the public gallery at Westminster.

What time are you picking me up for the next one?

Your lovely lady wife has told me to tell you I have to go straight back home afterwards. Sorry no country runs.:D

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P.S. I was aware that it was put to a public vote and didn't say otherwise.:)

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So you are only telling us half a story. Quite the politition yourself.

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What is Politics?

Politics like Art is undefinable.

Both can be viewed conceptually.

See back on track.:)

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true, but party politics has no place at this level. This is about you and things that will effect your lives. Whether funding is given or a project is given the go ahead shouldn't be affected by people playing party politics at a local level.

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Complete and utter bollocks...........:)

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I've decided that this would make a great panoptican and would link the peel monument and aliens
http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/galle...s01/100/12.jpg
1024 wallpaper

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When are we closing the border between Lancashire and the mad gets from further south?:D

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I've got some fantastic ideas for accy, peter will love them. :D

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Yes I initiated the Friends of Arden Hall and was the chair. They are doing fine now so I am just on the committee now. We don't cover the coppice. However some of cross over to the Regional Park thing which is a bit of a mess with the Council (i.e. dont know what they are doing except repeat Panopticon as often as possible to gain votes)

As I understand opinion in the area, people want to see better facilities like you would find in any counbtry park. Clearly marked information boards, improved paths catering for all. Maybe one or two without steps to allow wheeled access (disabled, police, council cleansing collection if bins etc..). Good access areas (better bike or car parking facilities at several entrance points). A Park Ranger or 2. Some stopping off points (vandal proof if thats possible). An information leaflet. Clearly marked viewing areas. Some promotional stuff to get people to come and see Accy as a great place. Any sensible sugggestions.

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Reply received from Peter Britcliffe.
I have just received a reply to the email I sent to Peter Britcliffe yesterday, below is the text of the email.

Thank you for your e mail.It may well be worth setting up a small committee of interested parties to consider what appropriate actions we can take. I would be happy to arrange a meeting for the early autumn. If you would like to be part of that committee please contact my office on 380165 and I will ensure you receive an invite to attend.If you know others who may be interested please let meknow. Kind Regards
Peter Britcliffe

In Graham Jones last post he explained about the Coppice being treated as a country, which I think is a good idea.
So if there are any of you interested in being part of the committee ring 380165.

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duplicate post

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Given the bad news he received this week, I don't think he'll want me ringing him up :D

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HBC put a big fat zero into MPA last year. As for what they got out of us - I don't know figures but as far as project go there's The Enchanted Woodland at Arden Hall, the Mela and Community Festival, work at Within Grove, a major conference that we held at the Dunkenhalgh for teachers, a conference held at the Hope Centre for pupils, Talking Shop, lots of subsidised workshops in schools plus other stuff.

Some of the projects had outside funding that Mid Pennine Arts applied for so not all of the funding came from Mid Pennine Arts if you want to be pedantic but the projects happened because of MPA.

Talking Shop is an exception because HBC are putting a small proportion into it this year but they are putting the money in solely for that one project and it is funded from one specific department of HBC.

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what news was this

sorry never been in the political loop so to speak but this sounds juicy :)

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I think it might be a few months before Graham can tell all but look forward to it because I think it's going to be juicy.