Budget 2009
 

• Borrowing £175bn THIS year. Some £600bn over 4 years (I think that's the highest in peace time history)
• Economy shrink 3.5% 2009
• Income tax on those earning over £150k up to 50% from April
• Spending growth down to under 1%
• Alcohol and tobacco tax up 2%
• £1bn to help climate change
• Debt will be 80% of GDP
• Millions to get anyone under 25 into work or training.
• Fuel duty up 2p/litre from September
• £500m to kick start housing projects to deliver thousands of new homes.
• £100m to local authorities for energy saving housing
• £50m to modernise Army housing
• Companies can defer tax on profits from last three years
• £9bn efficiency savings
• Broadband investment (think it was £10m)
• Capital allowance for investments doubled to 40%
• Cut carbon emissions by 34%
• £525m financial support for offshore wind power
• £20 extra child tax credit
• £100 disability extra trust fund
• Grandparents get more basic state pension for helping child care
• Real term basic state pension increase
• Maintaining winter fuel allowance
• Tax free ISA's from £7,200 limit to £10,200

Could have missed some things, started writing half way through.

Re: Budget 2009
 

GDP is going to be DOUBLE what it was when Labour came in.
Absolutely abhorrent figures. :eek:

Re: Budget 2009
 

Another gross amount of money poured in to the waste drain of a government agency :rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

There wasn't a global recession then.

Re: Budget 2009
 

obviously not shaker.:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

I think this is £512bn over 4 years. Either way it's bigger than every governments borrowing added together since the Bank of England was set up 300 years ago.

Re: Budget 2009
 

whatever the answer to this recession is i sure don't know, i await yer learned answer.:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

The answer to this recession is confidence. Nobody can have confidence while the government continues to borrow hundreds of billions of pounds, more than 300 years of accumulated government borrowing. It's time we live within our means, and importantly government has to do the same as us.

Re: Budget 2009
 

that shows just like me ya have no idea, confidence is as much use as a fart in a spacesuit, if all the countries in this recession do not follow suit. ya are just using this as another excuse to rubbish yer opponents, it really is very sad.:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

You ask for an answer, I'm telling you I don't think borrowing hundreds of billions is the answer. By telling you that I'm not trying to rubbish the government for the sake of it - I do it because I profoundly disagree with what they're doing. Future generations will have to live with their mistakes.

If you wanted me to expand then what I'm saying is government should be spending less. You cannot borrow your way our of a recession caused by borrowing too much. If it spends less then government can reduce taxes that affect everyone, not just the rich. People will have more money in their pocket, to spend on goods and services. Which means more jobs are created in the productive part of the economy.

Re: Budget 2009
 

my view is simple i don't know, so therefore i leave it to people who should know better than me. i am happy to ride with their solution n see what happens, then if it does fail, i reckon i am then entitled to slag em, its called giving people the benefit of the doubt.:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

You make it all sound very simple Andrew..how about telling us were you would start making your cuts in public spending to pay for your tax breaks and less Government borrowing..NHS? sickness benifits? pensions?..or by cutting jobs in public sector causing even worse unemployment?
Your solution is the same old Tory way that has been tried and tested in the past..in fact it has been the same Tory policy since the war..and has never worked..it just causes more misery!...have you people got any new ideas?

Re: Budget 2009
 

Well the best thing is to get rid of Gormless Gordon and his pet puppet Alistair:dummy:Doddy has just unveiled a statue in Ulverston of two of the finest comedians that ever lived Stan and Olly, think we should have one of our Dynamic Duo in Parliament Square, at least we could get our own back when the pigeons do to them what they've done to use over the last few years, mainly from a great height:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

How many noughts in 600 Billion Mancie?

Re: Budget 2009
 

oh I don't know..are we talking Peso's?..cause I reckon it's about 6 quid :D

Re: Budget 2009
 

I think thats the answer we got today from Mickey Mouse and Flash Gordon...........................:eek:;)

Re: Budget 2009
 

What do you expect Roy they're still using a bloody Abacus the pair of divvies:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

Well I've just been on the BBC's budget calculator and it's worked out that Chris and I will be £592.59 better off! So benefits us.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Same here Gayle, about £550 better off so I am not complaining! And that is due to increases in family tax credits and family allowance plus I will be paying less tax and NI, great!

Re: Budget 2009
 

I hate the thought I will be paying 50% tax soon :mad:

Re: Budget 2009
 

It was suggested that If we all drank five more pints of lager a day and smoked an extra 20 fags we could see a light at the end of the tunnel within 6 months.

In my case it will be the channel tunnel.With a bit of luck.:(:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

True indeed ... esp. the last bit .... but Andrew is right in a sense; what is needed is consumer cofidence ... but the threat of govt. economy which rides on the backs of the poorer elements in society is not the answer. Nor is the simplistic "live within it's means" bs ... we are talking complex economies here, economies that have developed into entities we have never had before (like the EU), and to compare these economies to individual budgeting (now, if we cut back on bacon, we can buy more beer) is pure, unadulterated horse manure. What all countries need are new ways of addressing economic problems; and one thing is obvious: we can't leave the running of business to the businessmen ... they screwed up massively and dumped us into the economic craphouse, proving that they can be trusted only to line their pockets at the expense of the ordinary citizen, and their national economies.

Re: Budget 2009
 

I sympathise Neil, sadly I am quite some way off the high earners bracket so it won't be troubling me for the foreseeable future!:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

I was not being serious. I think the 50% was for those earning £150,000. That just a couple of quid out of my league :D

Re: Budget 2009
 

:D..so say the die hard fans of Norman Lamont and Geoffrey Howe..:rofl38::rofl38:..

Re: Budget 2009
 

How the hell.....on this earth can you support the numpties who have got the country in the mess that every man, woman and child will be paying for decades to pay back the debt.
New Labour has gone 'tits up' big time. :eek:

Re: Budget 2009
 

I thought you meant it! Hahaha.....maybe if you were a barrister, Neil. :D

Re: Budget 2009
 

I don't support numpties.. Labour or any others...you can argue all day about who and what got us into the mess.. but I know that the same old agenda put forward by Andrew has not got us out of recessions in the past and there's no reason to believe it would work this time...I'll be honest and say I was almost afraid the opposition may have had something new to offer the country at this time because I personally don't want them back in power..but if anyone thinks the old tune about tax cuts along with public spending cuts are the answer.. then they are the living in a past that was even worse than it is now.

Re: Budget 2009
 

I remember the country rejected Churchill after the war and the labour government of the day lost control.
I remember the pemiership of Wilson and the labour government lost control
I remember the 'Winter of Discontent' labour lost control.
You can fool the some of the people some of the time...as the saying goes...............Time for a change.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Well, I will be worse off by £ 75.47 approx. due to the tax on my pleasures i.e. tobacco, wine and driving, overtaking the rise in my state pension.

http://planetsmilies.net/sad-smiley-335.gif

Re: Budget 2009
 

yeh n i remember "Thatcher" who made the country what it has become today, full of selfish look after number1 n stuff the rest.:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

But did'nt have to borrow 600 Billion pounds to keep the country afloat.

Re: Budget 2009
 

You got the advantage there Roy I don't remember... but I know that the Tories in the 50's opposed free health care...opposed national pensions..and opposed welfare benefits... of course in these days they would not dare to speak about cuts in funding for essential spending on these services...but these old Tory "values" live on...and the Tory party has proved that you can fool some peolpe some of the time.. but you ain't fooling me.

Re: Budget 2009
 

yeh well the tory way never worked, so i am prepared to see if this does.:rolleyes: the selfish ******* were always there of course, but thatcher dramatically increased the number.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Next time you mount the soapbox on speakers corner ask the assembled crowd "Can we trust Gordon Brown" on a show of hands I think the majority would keep their hands in their pockets...by the same token if you asked the assembled crowd if they support Man Utd....The answer would no doubt be................'Do Yeh':)

Re: Budget 2009
 

Magiie ruffled a few feathers I know but would you give a vote of confidence to the present administration?

Re: Budget 2009
 

"
"ruffled a few feathers" ? :D... when she dies I don't reckon the cranes down the docks in the Thames will be bowed like they did at Churchill's funeral... she got rid of the dockers before the miners..any comparison to this Goverment with Thatcher and her wimps is an insult to any moral thinking person.. but then the Tories do not care how low they stoop to get power.

Re: Budget 2009
 

no i would not, nor do i think cameron or clegg could do a better job though.:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

Ruffled a few feathers:eek: That's like saying that Genghis Khan was a cavalryman:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

Labour is drinking at the last chance saloon in-less theirs a change in direction their will be No Fourth Term.

Re: Budget 2009
 

now then..is there a prize on here for ******* that state the obvious?.. such a brilliant conclusion turkish..you'd have to get up pretty early to catch you out eh! :rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

But in tough times like these who would want to be in power:confused: And remember, it was Republican (that's Tory to the max) policies, dating back to Ronnie Raygun and his bitch, Maggie, that got us into this mess in the first place. And if Labor is drinking at the Last Chance Saloon, I think I'll join them for a brewskie. Remember, the only good tory is a suppository.:eek:

Re: Budget 2009
 

Go shoot your Rare Bits. :)

Re: Budget 2009
 

Darling makes that pair look like financial geniuses and you have to remember that this shower inherited the best financial outlook of any incoming government in history, but as usual it will be left to the Tories to clear up after this shower of total incompitents, like we always do

Re: Budget 2009
 

But for Thatcher this country would have been a Banana republic long ago, the only thing she did was put it of until New Labours 12 years of incompitant bungling, we are now a country with the third biggest debts in the world behind USA and Italy. One thing I have noticed is that not one of our Labour mouth pieces have had a word to say on this issue, mind you they never have any contribution to an thread on their incompetent brothers and sisters in Westminster, they give um a wide birth, but as the old saying goes they all P in the same pot, in good times and bad times

Re: Budget 2009
 

No matter which party is in opposition they all same the same thing, they can do a better job than the resident government. It's been going on since parliament existed, one day somebody may actually prove it :rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

I hear what your saying dave, but this time I'm a hundred per cent sure, mind you the Monster Raving Loony Party could do better that this shower, Wynonie for PM:D

Re: Budget 2009
 

If an election was called tomorrow, whoever won it would be in the unenviable position of trying to sort out these huge problems.

I agree with Andrew though, you cannot borrow your way out of a recession that was caused in the first place by irresponsible uncontrolled borrowing.

But then what can you expect.......the fiasco over expenses for MP's has done untold damage.......they can live off the fat of the land (our taxes), tell us to be more prudent,
and almost smirk while they see us on our uppers.
Now, if they cannot see that this is immoral, how can we trust them to make judgements that affect all of us?

Re: Budget 2009
 

Think what you have said is true, especially about borrowing, but that as always been the Labour way, knowing full well that if it goes belly up it won't be them picking up the pieces, it happened in 1950, 1979 and even more so now, but this time its a mitigated disaster, we are now, as a country in the biggest doubt for over 300 years, things can only get better was the cry in 1997, ya reght:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

I'm not denying that we're in a mess right now but would we honestly have been in any different situation if the Conservatives were in. It's a world wide recession so it would have hit us anyway. In one way, it's probably come at the right time for the Conservatives because they'll take over (and I'm not actually in much doubt that they'll win) and they'll be able to blame everything on the previous administration. :D

The only thing will be if the Conservatives can come up with a way of getting us out of it whilst the rest of the world wallow in it.

Re: Budget 2009
 

My thoughts exactly Gayle.

To jaysay, Royboy et al... it's all well and good slating the government for borrowing so much money, but I hear not one opposition supporter or politician saying what they would do differently.

Re: Budget 2009
 

But in this case it will be true, we left Labour in a rosy position in 97, after cleaning their last effort up 74/79, we were the worst prepared country in the modern world going into this recession because we had a chancellor who spent the brass and didn't look to the future, oh and by the way there still hasn't been a Labour Lackey on here yet, they've gone missing again

Re: Budget 2009
 

Don't be too sure Gayle. It's a long time until the next general election. It's also not what we are finding on the door steps.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Well fair enough Bernard. Perhaps if the election was tomorrow it could be a Tory win, but you're right, it's a long time off.

Perhaps the County Elections will give us a better indication as to how people are voting right now. ;)

Re: Budget 2009
 

What good would that do? The arrogance of this Labour Government as it stands would take no notice anyway.

Re: Budget 2009
 

This situation is a bit like a football club that fires the manager because it isn't getting the wins......the next chap in HAS to make sure there are wins.........and I can't really think of a party that has a crew that is up to the job....in effect whoever wins the next election will pick up a 'poison chalice'.......unenviable.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Do you knock on every door or do you Knit one Pearl one?

Re: Budget 2009
 

They never knock on my door Roy:D

Re: Budget 2009
 

So it's ok for the opposition not to serve their purpose by offering no alternative, all the while slating the government for their decisions?
What a pathetic response.

Re: Budget 2009
 

It might inspire more people to believe them (any party here) if they stopped claiming such ludicrous amounts of money for second homes and such like when they don't need them. It is all good and well saying they aren't breaking any rules but they made the rules theirselves!!!!

Re: Budget 2009
 

I dont think I was soliciting for a lesson in politics.
I understand there is a similar situation in Hyndburn where Labour are in opposition and from what I gather PB takes no notice of them either?

Re: Budget 2009
 

Bernard you've been in politics long enough to know you can take with a pinch of salt what people say on the doorstep, the only vote your sure of are well known party supporters of long standing, I have no doubt that you treat elections exactly the same why as we do, you get your core vote out on the day, any other are a bonus. The fact is a great number of people have already made their mind up about the next election and it ain't looking good for your lot:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

All I want to know is what your beloved opposition would've done with Budget 2009 if they were in power... because slating decisions without giving an alternative is ultimately useless to everyone.

Re: Budget 2009
 

I think you're right. Some of the second home allowances claimed are nothing short of obscene.

The Prime Minister has said that changes will be made. Not before time as well.

Re: Budget 2009
 

If there are to be changes they can't come soon enough IMO, we have got pensioners who after working all there life can barely survive on the pittance that they get paid. Yet MP's are claiming money left, right and centre just because they can. A ridiculous state of affairs in anybodies book:mad:

Re: Budget 2009
 

The figures are released to the leader of the opposition one hour prior to the Budget Statement..............I'll wager even he was gobsmacked like everyone else when the full facts were known.
If you expect off pat ansers to something that has been carefully thought out by robbers and spin doctors for months............I'm afraid that will not be forthcoming...........yet.

Re: Budget 2009
 

A lot of political pundits have made up their mind about the outcome of the next election. The public haven't been asked yet.

Remember what Harold Wilson said A week's along time in politics.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Err... let me know when they come up with something then. :rolleyes:

It just seems to me that there is very little point in the existence of the opposition parties these days, which is really sad. No real alternative is offered... just bickering in the media and even less impressive bickering in the commons.

Re: Budget 2009
 

I couldn't agree more.

Re: Budget 2009
 

as its took months to carefully think out, summat we can both agree on, how come though ya aint got n answer yet, ya got an answer as to its success, this is what i call bullsh1t.:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

How do you start to mend an economy that as all the resemblances of Dresden in 1945, not matter how much notice your given Roy, they could have given a month notice and it wouldn't have made any difference :(

Re: Budget 2009
 

Ya Bernard but even Wilson didn't make a dogs breakfast of the economy did he. I tend not to listen to politicians on any side these days, its the economists that tell it as it is without spin one way or the there, and they are all saying that Darlings figures don't even begin to add up, in fact things are going to get a lot worse before they get better:eek::eek::eek:

Re: Budget 2009
 

I have watched Brown give pathectic reasons why they have plunged the country into massive debts...................Thats Bullsh1t! :)

Re: Budget 2009
 

As usual Roy its everybody else's fault and not his, maybe a place on GMTV would be better as Gordon the Gopher:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

all the civilized world are in debt, suppose thats browns fault as well.:rolleyes: all in debt fer the reason, typical tory rubbish, brown/ cameron, none of em will get us out of the crap,without co-operation of other nations, thats plain to see.............unless yer a tory.:D

Re: Budget 2009
 

I keep my rare bits well covered and protected:D .... and also my wallet ... esp. when there are tories around .... at least when Labour picks at your wallet, the money goes to help the country. With the tories, it often ends up in their pockets, or their already well-heeled friends and backers.

Re: Budget 2009
 

On the subject of 2nd home allowances why on earth should there be a need for this at all, surely either Hotel/Apartment Accomodation could be used at greatly reduced costs, or even better still an accomodation block purposely built to provide each MP with a basic bedroom and office room if needed, would cost an awfull lot less in the long run, and the property itself would also be an asset!

Also George Osbourne mentioned yesterday and today that as a result of the budget everyone earning over £20,000 pa would be paying more tax! How has he quantified this? Am i missing something, because other than last years almighty cockup with the 10p tax situation, i had'nt noticed any detrimental tax policy for the relatively low paid?

Best Regards - Taggy

Re: Budget 2009
 

None of them will get us out of the crap unless we put forward a decent escape plan cashy, the thing is that Darling said yesterday that we need to borrow £175 billion this year alone, but that's where the problem lies, where does this money come from? It comes from the money men (or Toffs as Mancie calls them) these money men ask the advice of the city economists, or number crunchers, these people have already said that the Governments figures don't add up, "We have a problem Huston". If these number crunchers turn round and say, which they are likely to do, that Great Britain PLC is a dodgy investment proposition, then good old Gordon and Alistair are up the Swan without a paddle, big time

Re: Budget 2009
 

National insurance contributions Taggy is one main reason, not a tax as such but a stealth tax

Re: Budget 2009
 

It goes to do what? :hehetable

I think politics on your side of the pond may differ somewhat.?

Re: Budget 2009
 

Having all the Government living in one place would be a massive security risk

Re: Budget 2009
 

Maybe Graham will come along and remind us how he thinks up good ideas for Hyndburn and accuses the Tories of nicking his ideas.

Maybe the Tories don't want to help Labour out of the mess they caused - or maybe they have no idea what to do either :D

Re: Budget 2009
 

or maybe not Neil :D It could be a brain free zone:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

The main problem is that we, as a country have no savings......when Gordon was Chancellor he said there would be no more boom and bust....he believed his own spin so much that he thought he could sell the family silver.....and look where it has got us.

I know the financial situation is of worldwide dimensions, but surely that was because a lot of the money markets were based here........when the banks in the US sneezed, all the financial organisations were affected by the lack of confidence in British money markets.

The media then 'talked down' sterling, finance and british business, any efforts made to rectify the situation were too little and far too late.

Re: Budget 2009
 

This 'world financial crisis' has been engineered as the first stage of a World Bank.
There will follow - World Government and a World Army
You may well say 'why an army'?
....it will be needed to supress any dissidents... and quite a few are expected:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

Margaret...you have hit the nail on the head...It was the pundits and the governer of the bank of England who drove down sterling and the government did nothing to stop it.
Exports are cheaper yes....but there is no money to support it.
Why should I now buy from China, as I have always done when sterling will only buy 75% of what I was paying 1 year ago...why should I buy sterling with euros at equal parity.......no bloody way.
Sterling will have a deep effect on many currencies and many people who would have taken sterling in the past as a reliable currency will no longer take it.
We are and the pound is in a mess.

Re: Budget 2009
 

As an addiition to my last post, I am nearing the age of seventy and my life in the commercial world will end on !!th June.
I owe nothing and no-one owes me anything...a nice position to be in.
Good luck in the future to the ones who aspire to start a business and to the ones who keep their jobs.
Good advise to all...keep your eye on the ball and dont let the barstewards get you down.:D

Re: Budget 2009
 

its because we will be joining the euro soon:)

Re: Budget 2009
 

The gnomes will be pleased....but not for me thankyou. :eek:

Re: Budget 2009
 

Politics over here is way different .... Canadians are natural Liberals .... that translates as a government with fiscal resoponsibility and a social conscience. We have a conservative minority govt. now, but they are held in check by a strong Liberal minority. The majority of Canadians will vote for the party which supports publicaly funded health care and is commited to maintaint our social "safety net".

And in a lighter mood: Why did the Canadian cross the road? Answer: "To get to the middle".

Re: Budget 2009
 

I fell out with Gordon and Tony a long time ago, when Prudence Gordon decided to sell 60% of our gold reserves, 415 Tonnes. In doing so he ignored advice from economists and the governor of the Bank of England and sold the Gold when the market was at the bottom. Costing the country £2 billion pounds. (£2,000,000,000.00). Nice work

Re: Budget 2009
 

Yes Boeing guy that is the action to which I referred in my previous post........he didn't need to do that.........and most people with a modicum of sense will always have a bit of something for a rainy day.........he expected blue skies all the way........now its P'ing down and he's sold the umbrella. Good Man, what?????

Re: Budget 2009
 

They are all together in the Houses of Parliament arnt they? And thats not been blown up yet! May be the Houses of Parliament itself could be extended to provide the accomodation needed, either way a second homes allowance is simply not defensible!!

Ive noticed Ryanair are proposing a "Fat tax" on overweight passengers maybe we should do the same with our MP's, its quite noticeable how many of them seem to "Balloon" in size after a few years in office, it doesn't seem that Gym Membership is an allowable expense though unlike a months supply of Sausage Rolls and booze!!

Best Regards - Taggy

Re: Budget 2009
 

Well we may be in a recession, but not as you'd notice in the annals of power, it appears that minsters have upped their booze budget by more than have. For the 2009/10 the budget for ministers entertaining in the form of wine and champers has gone up from £525,568 last year to £800,000 this coming year, recession, what recession:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

It is obscene amounts of money like this that really get my goat. Why can't they pay for their own booze out of their wages plus their other allowances?:mad:

Re: Budget 2009
 

well, Bernie.....it is because they can.

I think that they should all try to survive for one month on a basic pension.......no allowances, no drink tab at the Houses of Westminster....just a basic pension.
It would give them a little idea of what is happening in the real world.......you know, that one where we live.

Re: Budget 2009
 

Bernie they can pay for mine too if they want, after all they keep bumping up the prices for us mere mortals:(

Re: Budget 2009
 

The budget shows once again how clueless they are, live by the old rule, if ya aint got it, dont spend it! This false economy is why so many people are in debt, the jobs/training for under 25's has been tried before, it doesnt work! If they fast track people through weak training (into supposedly professional jobs) the training isnt sufficient, lack of skill means not good enough at the job, then they go self employed and cant manage, fasttrack training = fasttrack bankrupts, or inept public services.

Re: Budget 2009
 

thats it in a nutshell, n not just the government, the dimwit public as well! much is not worked for n earned, the clowns have to have it NOW , n get it on credit they cannot afford when times are tough, n guess who created that mentality?:rolleyes:

Re: Budget 2009
 

not a guess cos it's a non brainer... the early 80's economy was total borrowing.. encouraged by the Government..but Thatcher and the brilliant minds of Howe,Lawson and Lamont turned borrowing into a craft..I remember Thatch saying you can't buy a house without borrowing .. which is logic for most people .. and then they sold off shares in essential public assets like electric/gas to "the public" who then expecting big returns... this "mob" may not have a clue.. but I know the alternative.. and it is dire!