Council get something right!!
 

www.accringtonobserver.co.uk/news/index/articles/article_id=12071.html and rejoice!!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Hmm,thinking a lot about this one;my Uncle isn't usually one to play the wrong hand in these things and he voted for,from what I gather he reckons we should go with the least offensive and unobtrusive suggestion that will then give the funding to repair all the pathways,put picnic benches in etc.He reckons that by saying no to it all the town will lose all the potential funding and the bill to just restore the Coppice paths is way beyond council means now;let alone restore the Coppice to it's former glory.

Looking at it from that point of view,maybe he is right;how else is the funding going to be found? I still think it's a ludicrous idea but if it helps restore something to the Coppice maybe we should consider it and try and "down size " the plans!
Feel free to have a go at me,but the bloke has lived here all his life and isn't generally given to flights of fancy!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Well, at long last sense has prevailed. A similar story to this was on the front of the L.E.T tonight.....it went something like 'HILLOCKS'.....or at least I think that's what it said.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Well there is a light on somewhere HBC. Maybe to use of commonsense well catch on.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Do you think that barmy britcliffe has been reading threads in here as UNREGISTERED and thought ''oh ****** better not do it''??;)

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I think he might have been reading what we have posted Slinky, but I think a few of the members on here have e-mailed him as well.
Lindsay, there still might be a chance that something will be done on the Coppice....it just won't be telly tubby land. According to the L.E.T this guy Nick Hunt is still hopeful that some kind of artwork might find favour.
I just think that the present plan was poorly thought out, and there is already erosion to the pathways up there, and as you say there is no money in the borough for the paths to be repaired......and in any case the repair to the pathways and access to the site would have still been the boroughs responsibility.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Still laughing at ISSAC as his first name hehehehe.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

oooooooh slinky, you are naughty!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

i KNOW I can't help it.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Must have been :rofl38: :rofl38: :rofl38: :rofl38: Coupled with PB saying no, no, no, got
to be the best news of the day.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

What's all this about "former glory"? It's a hill for goodness sakes. It's not a theme park!

When I saw the "Hillocks!" headline and read that PB was against the idea my first thought too was that he must have been reading the AccyWeb! OOOer. Do you think he's seen my poster?

I honestly think that renewing the paths and putting some picnic tables and doing up the shelter and the monument are really what the Coppice needs and not some daft panopticon scheme which is only going to cost money to maintain. How it can be thought to bring money into the town I still haven't fathomed out.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

i think the line about it looking like something from teletubbies is quality

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

If they are going to put anything up there it should reflect the towns past heritage. A monument to the East Lancs or something to remember the towns mining heritage. Now’t tacky, just something small and meaningful.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I'd put some money in to that willow. Good idea.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I`ve been delving into this and could find no mention of funds to upgrade the paths and monuments or build car parking spaces. Even Gayle Knight said in last weeks Observer that they hoped to find additional funding for this, as has happened in Rossendale. However, Rossendales site is an old quarry and attracts funding due to it being derelict and having previous industrial use. As our site is open moorland gifted to the borough there would be no way we could get extra funding, so the carrot they were dangling was more of a bribe. And of course Hyndburn can`t afford to maintain it`s existing parks ( as anyone has been through Milnshaw park recently will know). Oh and according to the local plan there would have to be disabled access, that Mid Pennine Arts seem to have overlooked.
Victory for Accyweb I say!!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

why do we need footpaths up the coppice

i thought the idea of walking up there was to get away from streets, tarmac and paths etc

simply wear appropiate footware lol i used to play up there every day and managed to get to the top wearing trainers with no problems at all

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

do they mean repair the current path that winds up the front of the coppice and keep them in keeping with the surroundings

ime all for the council filling in those ruts with soil and chippings etc but a tarmac path just wouldnt look right

ime sure if evened out propperly the current paths would be easily scaled by an electric scooter or somone pushing a wheelchair infact ive seen an old man going up the side path near the bowling green in an electric scooter with his dog tied to the scooter lol

pretty brave fella because its very bumpy but he must have negotiated a way through lol

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I'm not going to cheer just yet as they may still do something daft. It was said in one of the papers that the earthworks would not be very prominent when seen from the town, so how are they going to attract tourists......and how would this extra money be generated???? I would really like to see the diasbled access......are they going to get Stannah in?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

When I said "former glory" I merely meant that it wouldn't be the vandalised,rubbish strewn mess that it is now.I do know a hill when I see one!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

As I sat on the monument last Sunday in the beautiful sunshine, I twice witnessed an age old tradition which proved to me why I would detest a panopticon up there
Mum and Dad with small child on its first visit to the top of the Coppice. Excitedly the child dashes ahead, clambers as far as possible up the monument, then the parent places the child on top of the monument so the child is on the highest point in town. My dad did it with me and I`ve asked around and it seems to be most peoples first memory at the top of the Coppice. Mid Pennine Arts.... they havn`t got the imagination of a three year old child.

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i dont want to thread wander but i feel the need to point out that at easter on a few occasions the cross that gets errected has been burnt to ashes

what makes these art people think that their so called art would be appreciated and not set fire to or vandalised

my first memories of the coppice are of running up it every day when i used to be a runner but my fondest memories are of the shelters on the top of the coppice and a certain lady friend and a bottle of slalom D beer :D

edit:

i must appologise for the use of slalom D beer i was young and didnt know any better

it was also cheap

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I used to run on the top of the Coppice.....methinks that's why my knees are knackered now......but the views from up there are spectacular.
I think my first trip up there was with peel park school......on a nature/local history ramble......that is many years ago.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

He He, don't we all wish :)
sorry Margaret !

Re: Council get something right!!
 

There are the confirmed funding sources and the likely funding sources. REMADE [LCC] have advanced large funding based on the Panopticon to fund two access sites, one in Peel and one in Huncoat. Thats a 6 figure buget and will start 2006 [or be cancelled if the panoption doesn't go ahead] Froends of AH have £120,000 commitment from The Forrestry Commision and the Council through the Regional Park has an application in for £100,000 to start. Those are just starting figure without looking further. I'd like to think we could set a target of £1m over 5 years.

We not [not the shabby Tory burghers who perport to run the town!] have been looking with a lot of agencies at the potential, and its massive. There are three access points to upgrade. The Hodder Street entrance is currently in process of being regenerated helped by the Panopticon scheme.

Paths. Different ideas are being floated. Cycle access, disabled access, some non disabled access in steep areas with drainage probs. Different surfaces.

There are 3 main points to this project
1 strategic network - coppice links into everything else
2 facility upgrade and management - the coppice
3.Access and information points - outside of the coppice signs car parking leaflets promotions etc...

Hope that helps
Cllr Graham Jones - Peel ward
http://www.peelward.ic24.net

Re: Council get something right!!
 

From the REMADE business plan, the areas identified for remade1 seem to be
Aspen colliery&coke ovens oswaldtwistle
Within grove huncoat
Star delph quarry Gt harwood
You can view that plan here http://www.lancashire.gov.uk/environ...ber%202003.pdf
Check the salary levels for running the scheme :eek: and the on costs in maintaining after.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Remade last week said that should the Panopticons go ahead then the Coppice access areas would become urgent and the Budget would be advanced to start 2006/2007 & 2007/2008. That came from the horses mouth. The meeting featured FoAH, HBC planning, HBC Parks & Open Spaces, Remade [LCC], Wildlife Trust.

I think these two sites had been scheduled some years away from what was said. There were a lot of maps on the table but the two sites are Peel Park and Huncoat, though I think there is a case for Hodder St, the 3rd site.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I have had a look at this stunningly repetetive document and note that Aspen Colliery Coke Ovens is a project selected for inclusion in Year 1. How odd that we are almost at the end of Year 1 and no improvement work has been done. I also note that the plan states that the Within Grove project might be considered a waste of time, effort and money.

It is all very well Councillor Jones suggesting that we might be turning down shedloads of improvement investment. But on the evidence he presents I see nothing more than a lot of well meaning suggestions which may be very glossy and "worthy" but actually do nothing to improve the lot of people living in the borough. In fact, as I see it, it is only beurocrats who will benefit in any way from this plan.

There is no getting away from the facts that the majority of people in the borough want the Coppice to stay as it is, and the Panopticon project selected for the Coppice is ill thought out, says nothing about the area it will occupy, says nothing about the aspirations and history of the area, defeats the point of having a landmark and is about as meaningless as the councillor's description of Conservative Councillors as "Burghers". Which, according to the OED, describes a citizen of a German Town. (Unless he knows something we do not!)

One is led to wonder why Councillor Jones, alone of his collegues, has chosen to wait until now to make his opinions known to the members of this board. After all, it is not as though the debate has not been raging here for some time. One also wonders whether, now that he is a member, he will be joining any of the other debates concerning HBC and it's percieved failings. I do hope so.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I have checked the document and the major line for East Lancashire it is "Assisting delivery of the Regional Park will be a REMADE priority."

The document dates for 2003 as well. The [ELP] Regional Park initiative is setting the agenda now which the REMADE document refers to. That inititiative is only beginning to find roots however. ELP & NWDA are strategic organisations pushing this wider agenda including the Panopticons project. For good or bad it is all happening above The Councils head.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

So are you saying that if the Panopticans don't go ahead the remade funds will not be forthcoming, to regenerate the areas identified?
Another question, from the remade business plan, the on costs for maintaining these projects on completion are a little high. What happens to them if grants, funds were withdrawn, as you know they can be, is HBC to be faced with the maintenance cost, hence the people of hyndburn?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Excuse me Councillor, but I think it might be a good idea for me to point out that most of the members of this site speak and use plain English (Some of us, very plain English.) not Quango Newspeak. Would you care to translate?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Remade are working towards the Regional Park. Its a great idea.

And in answer to the contributions - I just want the best for where I live and I am sick and fed up of crap decisions and nothing getting any better. I have posted 3 or 4 posts last year and read regularly. I am interetsted in what other people genuinely think.

- The Coppice is a significant part of the Regional Park and may be the centrepiece? -

Regional Park.

The development of East Lancashire's Regional Park - the first in the North West - means a major boost for the area. A cash injection of £23 million to develop the Park opens up a brighter future for both visitors and residents alike.


The Park is a key element of our twenty-year strategy and encompasses both rural and urban areas in East Lancashire. It will provide an environment in which our communities will be encouraged to take part in various initiatives designed to improve their immediate surroundings and enhance their quality of life.


The Regional Park will provide an overarching focus for other projects such as transport, housing, economic development, education and health. It will bring in new investment and create additional development opportunities. Attractive new housing developments and business relocations will result from the pleasant environment created by the Regional Park. The East Lancashire Rapid Transit system will facilitate the movement of people to and around the Regional Park.


The Park will improve the image and upgrade the environment of East Lancashire by promoting it as a place to live and work and helping to attract private sector investment. It will also stimulate urban regeneration, providing an interface for communities with recreational, cultural and sporting facilities in a countryside environment.


The Park will also raise the profile and image of East Lancashire as a great place to visit. The new woodland and gateway facilities that will be developed as part of the Park will provide a considerable boost to the tourism industry. The Park will allow the development and expansion of local recreational, sporting and leisure facilities.


Disadvantaged communities will benefit directly from the Park. The initial focus will concentrate on a broad band of urban fringe land adjoining a number of disadvantaged areas. The re-use of derelict sites, reclamation of brownfield land and diversification of agricultural land will all be priority activities.


Funding of £5m from the Single Regeneration Budget (SRB) towards the Park's establishment is matched by a further £18m from the public and private sector.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Sorry. I dont mind taking stick. The reason for butting in is the debate so far in the media has been poor. In plain english.

ELP is the East lancs Partnership, a quango funded by the 7 district authorities and LCC in east Lancs to develop common solutions.The other high profile thing it has been involved with is rapid transit

NWDA is the North West Regional Development Agency. Another quango. Last years proposed referendum on regional gov't was an attempt to make it more democratic. It has funded the Panopticons project.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

>> The Coppice is a significant part of the Regional Park and may be the centrepiece? <<

Thanks for that explanation. If, as you say, the Coppice may become the centrepiece of the Regional Park, then surely it is in everyones interest to make any sculptural Landmark placed there as visually dramatic and as artistically valuable as possible. How do you think a handful of grassed over heaps, which according to Midpennine Arts, will only be properly visible from the air, achieve this end?

You also mention The East lancashire Rapid Transit System. Perhaps you could enlighten us what will happen to this proposal, if as is expected the government's review of Railways in the north west concludes that the Blackpool/Colne Line is inefficient and should be closed?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Yes I take your point on the regional park and would welcome any move to create it.That would be of benefit to all east lancashire,and has been on the cards for a long time, but it did not answer the questions I asked.
You intimated in your first post, that if the panoptican did not go ahead, the funds for the regeneration of the areas indicated would not be forthcoming, is that correct.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Kind of the above answer. We need to be in at the sharp end of the Regional Park and fighting for as much centrepiece funding as possible. We are not and also we are in danger of being left out somewhat. I know Nick Hunt from Mid Pennine sees the coppice as a centrepiece.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

A lot of this is kind of up the air or up for grabs I feel. East Lancs Partnership, i reserve comments on tax payers money being spent by them. The trasit thingy has gone from a full on metro accompanied by front page headlines and glossy print to guided bus paths, to upgrading the current bus timetable. I kid not. At most transport meetings, including the new passengers group set up, ELP were absent to my knowledge. Not good.

The regional park is the only one I have any faith in. Thats because the likes of Remade, the other district councils and the NWDA are backing it. So its got plenty of umph right now.

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Thank you Graham, interesting to read a different perspective. Although as you can see the majority of people here prefer the natural beauty of the Coppice unadourned.
Walking along Broadway yesterday however, this is a place crying out for public art/ benches/ flowerbeds and shops that aren't waiting for tennants.
Sadly Accy town centre now reminds me of the worst satellite towns around Glasgow.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I just noted how much it has proved to be pie in the sky [Transit plans]. [How much council Tax do we pay?]

The Colne line is hort of just 300 yards of track near Todmordon to make it a circular to Manchester through Blackburn, East Lancs valley, Tod, Manchester. To me that makes more sense. I cant see it being cut though a new operator has just taken over I understand.

However Clitheroe Manchester is under threat. Another Beeching hatchet job you might argue. Although Prescott has just backed down and help fund the Manchester Metro 2 - the extension I understand? We will have to see what govenment recomends but.. the EL railway is important.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Ahh, so it's all up in the air is it? Pie in the Skie sort of thing. It might happen and it might not happen, the funding might be there, but then again, it might not be there?

And in the meantime the people of Accrington will be lumbered with another expensive white elephant to maintain while the local regeneration circus moves on and develops even wilder and more expensive ways of spending public money. Still, the vandals will enjoy trashing it, so I suppose that it won't be entirely wasted.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

instead of fancy art monuments why dont we just simply restore the spread eagle that has been visable for as long as i can remember

it seems to be loosing its shape a little and is no where near as big as i remember it been and i bet would cost a hell of a lot less than any monument you could stick up there

it would also be visable by everyone and i cant see anyone objecting as its already there and only needs a bit of tidying up around the edges

if you like you can fund me i will trim around it with a shovel for a few hunderd quid

town center is a disgrace to look at and those pathetic cobbles now scattered in patches throughout the town centre are dangerous in my opinion and a waste of money , all they seem to be good for is making people slip on their ass

bring back the benches , bring back the flower beds and it wouldnt hurt to clean up our back alleys and streets as we have a reputation for been a dirty town and unfortunatly people are right our town is filthy so even if tourists did come they would be wiping their feet on the way back out

just a few simple ideas from a simple man

no not simple as in idiot b4 any one says it lol

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Messages are getting a bit out of step, sorry..

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Turning Accy round is going to a monumental task and the Councils current debts dont allow it to do anything but lip service. One 30 year old independent says his trade is 30% from 10 years ago. Market traders are making 40-60% from 3-4 years ago. Obviously thats why shops are shutting up or selling stuff off tight margins. There are no plans for improvement cept £250,000 makeover of Broadway. Shame.

Any suggestions?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

An Elected Mayor. Requiring charity shops to pay full business rates. Lowering the rent on Market Stalls. Sort the pavements out. "Free Parking" should mean just that, anywhere in the borough. Concentrate inward investment on the town centre not on Whitebirk.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

On anything other than the regional park I think I would be cautious. The Regional Park thingy tho, you have to weight up just whose prepared to run with it and put some brass in and clued up they are to it lasting.

Sadly quango short term-itus is a 20 year British disease and unfortunately nowadays its about weighting it up and taking your chances. I know from the funding I have been involved with the Reg Park seems a green light go-er. An example is REMADE funding.

Even Lord Britcliffe doesn't know all this stuff..

Re: Council get something right!!
 

If Accrington town centre is going to turn itself around it has to be as a centre for small independent retailers which is how it used to be before the supermarkets and chain stores came along and forced long established family businesses out. High quality is not delivered by the likes of ASDA, Next and Debenhams. All they are interested in is milking the area dry.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

As far as the Idiot in Chief is concerned, it surprises me that he manages to find his way home, let alone anything else.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

sorry about the typos

Elected Mayor - wot Lord Britcliffe... He actually covets HBC having one and it being him.

I spent half a day with the Markets Manager Mrs Hall studying the books. If the council cuts rents it will have less income to do other things.

You mean one of those parking tickets I got on week one on Dutton St!! Deep in current Tory thinking is actually car parking charges - devioulsy mind you. HBC holds a covenant on the Arndale Car Park setting parking charges. It is considering selling it back to the Arnddale so they can possibly charge for parking and the Council gets a receipt for the covenant and the Arndale the flack for charging. I am not sure whether David Jones, the manager down at the Arndale would want to chgarge though. Still its not stopping the politcal thinkers thinking it.

Whitebirk will get sunk [Peel Holdings application that is]. Its funny that Blackburn covet Whitebirk and have always been frustrated thats HBC owned because it always could have a severe impact on Blackburn TC but was out of their hands. Now with the regernation partnership deal of course they have a way to have an input for Blackburn, through HBC.

As for concentrating investement. Hyndburn is skint, hasn't a pot to **** in, pardon the french. Its current debts cant be paid off in my lifetime. I'll be dead if they ever get near to paying them off and Im 39!

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Absolutely. Could not agree more. This line of conversation on TC balls ups could go on for ever. The one thing Accy still has luckily is all its old qualint buildings. And that [concept] should be the backbone of all TC thinking.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

On the transport thing,
have just been reading a document on the LCC website dated Jan 2000, where "they plan for cycling as a principal means of transport within the proposed regional park for east lancashire"

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Having hired contractors, who aren't responsible for the state of the recently laid paving, is a mistake someone should own up too. Especially as l know as fact that every claim for injury is settled without contest. Hardly good business sense considering the state of the budget.
Hard up? Attend one of the next Britcliffe strolls around the 'improved' town centre.

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"It will provide an enviroment in which our communities will be encouraged to take part in various initiatives designed to improve their immediate surroundings and enhance their quality of life"
Who comes up with crap like this. I don`t want an unelected bunch of cretins to encourage me to take part in an initiative, they can all sod off. If the goverment wants to fleece us of our taxes to pay for this sort of beaurocratic bull****, they they can give us the money to repair the existing paths and monument and make everyone happy.
It`s my Coppice and you can`t have it!!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

sound about right. The glossy literature came out about 2002/2003

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>>Especially as l know as fact that every claim for injury is settled without contest.<<

How much does that cost us?

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There's to many quangos I agree.

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No offence to anyone, but should we have people in charge of such a vast budget, who aren't professional? Should councillers be paid a more attractive salary, rather than expenses? Would it attract people who wouldn't let these mistakes happen?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Actually I think it would attract Career Politicians who would hold themselves even less accountable.

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Funnily enough one of Lord Britcliffes efficeiency savings last year was to reduce insurance costs by simply agreeing a greater excess on the policy. Trips and bumps had an excess of £1000 but that is now £5000. So every lost claim is £5000. I dont think they have lost to many as yet but the legal department [with the cuts and the ELEVATE housing programme] is overstretched.

The lastest shoddy section is the top of Broadway past the shops up for sale near scope. Like a water bed.

The Market Square Development has just had final hadn over about three week ago so up to that point all claims were the responsibilities of the developers [of which I think we are a third - not clear on what liability we had then for trips]

The issue was the sand based flagging could not survive the suction of the 4 wheel street sweepers and so they became washed out and unstable. The contractors blamed the Council but evidently you cant get one of those machines down by the bus stops along the market pavillions so it was poor workmanship. The Council coughed up [I think] £10,000?? for its share of the repairs which delayed final signing of contracts.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Everyone thinks they are right, politicians especially, after all someone voted them in so they must be.

The reality is very few actually question if they are right and recently in Hyndburn people have proven they are taken in by what is said by Lord Haw Haw Britcliffe and printed by his papers, the Observer and LET. Ok I am being cyncial but Hyndburn BC is morally corrupt in my view.

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>> Ok I am being cyncial but Hyndburn BC is morally corrupt in my view <<

How refreshing! but as a one of the people of Hyndburn i think I can safely say that I am not in the least taken in by the Idiot in Chief, nor are many members of this site.

I think part of the problem is that people recognise the faults and failings of the council but do not know how to make their voices heard or how to affect change other than by the ballot box, and an awful lot of damage can be done between one election and the next.

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Re: Council get something right!!
 

I theory the officers are professional and the politicians take their advice. In practice they bully one another. Cllr Britcliffes problem is he has no idea and is easily influenced on 80% of things, and there have been some empire builders. The other 20% is the newspaper stuff where he knows how to say the right thing to get the most votes - as opposed to doing the right thing.

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Yes it having an effect. All teh ambulance chasers with glossy TV ads are being funded by claims against companies and councils. The Councils insurers are Zurich Interbnational and all claims are assessed and dealt with by them in conjunction. I believe there have not been many winning claims against the Council. last time the debate came up I argued for a tough it out policy.

Then there was 9/11 and civic buildings don't come chaep. I think insurances have doubled in 3 years. I would have to check that.

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>> Then there was 9/11 and civic buildings don't come chaep.<<

Oh come on Graham, How much kudos is Al Quaida going to generate for itself by bombing Accrington? And if they did, I am sure that the larger part of the country would regard it as doing the nation a favour. The only people to benefit out of that sort of thing is the insurance companies.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Quite right. HBC now has that much debt it would be an argument in itself for merging with Burnley and Pendle and Blackburn. The last 5 years have been disastrous for the ratepayer. Debts are now at £27million pounds [excluding Council House debts] and will cripple the Council for at least the next 10 years. Unless external monies are brought in I cant see how any improvements can take place over this time.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

funny!!!!!!!!!!

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Re: Council get something right!!
 

your perfectly entitled to ask what councillors got what expenses last year under the new Freedom of Information Act. could be quite revealing. previously they printed them i the paper as a legal obligation but excluded travel and other special allowances and away day jaunts and junckets like the one recently to Peebles.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Is bankruptcy an option?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

curioslu no. Councils cant go bancrupt. What happens is the Governemtn comes in and its auditors take over the council, bit like a football club going into administration. They then flog everything and cut everything till they get a balance that will continue. So for instance the Coppice could be sold and the ratepayers wouldn't have say. It wouldn't get planning permission of course and I believe it may be protected by gift of covenant.

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Re: Council get something right!!
 

Gift of Covenant. This is something that has been hinted at before in relation to the Coppice. Did the Peel family place restrictions on the use of the land?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Having lived in the most expensive and cheapest boroughs in the country re: council tax, l find the total mismanagement of finances a hard pill to swallow now l'm back in Hyndburn.

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Just thought it would be a lead to the people of hyndburn, headlines in the "Observer"
Local Cllr's take cut in expenses to help out the shortfall in budgets:D

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Gosh, Rovers should 1 up...

I dont know the figure properly but it was down to blame, contractors blame council, council blames contractors, so it was settlement.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

So do I. I dont know if being at the coalface is more or less depressing.

I made this sarcastic blog on last weeks Tory budget, you can pick your favourite cut, not all are included:

Conservatives have 19 seats, Labour 15

......coming in over the wires..... Ruling Conservatives propose 5% increase Council Tax increase.. 2% above inflation... and £350,000 of cuts.... Dial a Ride to be cut... lights on viaduct to switched off at 10pm???! .... 50% cut in grass cutting.... bins emptied less frequent in 4 wards.... cuts in fly tip collection... fridge collection £10 per fridge... more to follow...reduce hanging baskets and floral budgets...

... sports centre to shut earlier... Annual Audit and Inspection 2005... auditors highlight embarrasing mismanagement...

...Bus Station Inspectors to be sacked... no replacements/withdrawel of service... above inflation increased charges for drain clearance... reduce forrestry maintanence [funny, thought the Conservatives were committed to the Coppice]...

... 5% increase in council charges for public halls.. oh and a tax on death.. crematorium and burial charges up 8% [again!]... Cllr Britcliffe announces 8% cuts inall services across the board..

...waiting for beaurcracy savings... waiting for beaurcracy savings... waiting for beaurcracy savings... waiting for beaurcracy savings ... no beaurcracy savings...

...Conservatives plan to borrow another £2m taking Councils debt up to £27m [It was £10.9 million when they took over!]...

...Peter Britcliffe claims Labours budget is fantasy and the Conservatives prudent...

...Accuses Labour of false £40,000 saving... DeLoitte Touch paper produced showing the Council could/should make £148,000 saving... Cllr Britcliffe claims to not to have read the report...

...Cllr Britcliffe says bringing in Blackburn with Darwen Council is a profitable move [a Labour Council] and partnerships with LCC will bring savings [another Labour Council]...

[note. The Councils own regeneration services are being split up after poor performance]

... Cllr Britcliffe says only Conservatives can be trusted to run the Council properly !! ...

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Should be :)
And now HBC plan to spend £250,000 on the area?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Just a simple and quick question... why is money for renovation of the Coppice tied into the Panopticon project? Is it a case of kick one they all limp?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I have to say I feel better informed since Graham has been enlightening us about what goes on at HBC.......better informed but worried!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

In that case he should be ashamed of himself and read it forthwith.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Difficult to answer that one. The idea of of one regional park which isn't continous but is brought together through line of site eg Pan Opticon. Each one can see at least one other. Its tarted with a concept and that concept underpins it all. There are those who believe the Angle of North effect as well. That something unusual, quirky and as part of a bigger concept would attract visitors from much further afield to see the Regional Park, part of it, rather than a local patch of land known as the Coppice. Thats what is driving the programme. Inward investment and a wholistic view to some of East Lancashires amazing landscape. That the sum is greater than the parts and with a bit of flash [ie the various Panopticons linkage] it will add a bit of chutzpah.

This is a hard sell, just an honest look at how people are organisations are running with an agenda that seems alien to people. As it stands we aren't going to participate and we're out of the money circle unless something resolves itself.

However when the literature and big sell gets pushed out around Britain, with no Panopticon we wont be featured, obviously, and the likelyhood of wanting to invest as much money in something that isn't going to attract anyone is much reduced.

Its now a different ball game and we wil see whether Cllr Britcliffe can swing the investment in without a Panopticon.

My point is this. Its a 19 Hectare site and this is a hundred square feet development, some of the designs are as placid as my 92 year gran!! So it the middle way seems the sensible way. So like Cllr Britcliffe I too would say No No No; no humps, no halo, no hollywood.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

This is a hard sell, just an honest look at how people are organisations are running with an agenda that seems alien to people. As it stands we aren't going to participate and we're out of the money circle unless something resolves itself.


THIS ISNT A HARD SELL IT SHOULD SAY!!!

Re: Council get something right!!
 

In another thread on this subject I proposed three different locations for this project all of which would benefit from reclamation, all with excellent views and all visible from more than just a passing aircraft. Why are Nwda and midpennine so set on the Coppice?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

And why are they so Fixated on such bland and meaningless works? As far as I am aware Chris Beard, the designer, has never carried a project through to completion yet. And yet they seem to regard him as the only person to deal with. It makes no sense.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Now its getting into the realms of I dont know. It also touches on another major issue. The reponsibilities of quangos. It has been adn still is vogue to have these non political bodies. The thinking being politicians make a balls of things. The reality is quangos make a bigger balls. As churchill once said Democracy may be crap but theres no better alternative. The biggest quango builder was Nigel Rix who then IMHO [better put that in for legal reasons, he has threatened to use me once before] who then didn't have to answer to no-one and could do as he liked. East Lancs Partnership are not an organisation I or we the Council ever see.

I have never met anyone from there and they are housed in the Globe Centre with a lot of staff. The Councils troubles are never ending and ELP seems to be 'fogotten about' as far as scrutiny. Anyhow the ruling Tories set the Scrutiny programme so its up to them to pull these organiastions in. I cant understand why ELP have not been pulled in before. Well I can. Conservative = useless in Hyndburn.

The Panopticons decison in before cabinet [April meeting] and the Tory chair of scutiny can decide within the next 6 days whether to scruitize the process. Typical corrupt Hyndburn politics. Only the ruling Conservatives are allowed to decide what Conservative decisions can be scrutinized. Its all bent if you ask me. Your not allowed to ask thorny questions. The press dont bother turning up these days either.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

another typo should read..

better put that in for legal reasons, he has threatened to SUE me once before]

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

The Panopticons is a Cabinet decision but Britcliffe knew he might be able to pull a double political scoop. Or treble.

He forced the issue on the agenda for 'open debate' and intended to request a show of hands 'to gage the feeling for cabinet' he said. When has ever asked Labour councillors what they thought other than for his own political gain?

He summed up the debate and and said No No No and asked for show of hands. We decided not to vote on the issue because there was no proper debate, just an anti panopticon lynch mob. Some of our members came late to Council and unaware voted how they felt and several others decided to commit themselves to yes. 17 Tories voted against [2 abstained one was Tony Dobson] and 12 Labour voted for, 1 against [Malcolm Pritchard] 2 abstained [Me & Pam Barton].

It was a win win for Britcliffe. If the show of hands went against him he had his cabinet excuse ready made, whilst playing the popular card of No No No and looking strong. But not of course when you have to rely on passing the decision making buck as he did.

His 2nd win of course was to draw a party political divide. Labour wastes money, Tories don't. Bit rich coming from 'Mr HBC Debt' himself.

Thirdly he anticipated Labours budget that night would get big press headlines so he altered the Council agenda moving the Panopticons from last item to first, before the budget. Now whats more important I ask?

What that boiled down to is Labour was going to highlight that Area Councils cost £150 per person per person who attends and that we would scrap them and have 24 wardens instead. Britcliffe is frighttened stiff about this idea but knows he is on a sticky wicket. Last week leaders column talked up how good Area Councils are as part of his defence.

So he cleverly let the press feed early on the Panopticons issues, blowing out the press coverage on the budget, or Labours alternate budget proposals and leaving no time to talk about them at the end of a busy meeting.

Press print Panopticon story front page, Councils finances are ignored, the opposition is effectively silenced and bingo - how many Joe public know what the alternative budget is when they come to voting next time.

What they do know is that big bad nasty Labour Party wants to waste [if he successfully makes that connection he will stop saying it is external monies] monies putting silly artwork on rural land and thats a vote winner. Sadly the Panopticons should be low on HBC priorities but hey, thats good politics if thats your thing.

Britcliffe moves Joe public around the board with clever simplicity. You have to admire how he can cover up more and more bad decisions. And to be honest, the trouble with the current Hyndburn Labour Party is it is to plain honest. [Though I wouldn't wish that to change - just the public to be more informed]

Re: Council get something right!!
 

It will go to planning if one is submitted, but the cabinet may turn the scheme down in April first. Britcliffe has made his bed and as a political monster I would be surprised if he changed tack. However because of external funding a lot of officers think it is a stupid decision so I suspect the advice from within 'dont look a gift horse in the mouth'. Thats where a change of decision will come now if one occurs.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Quote:

What that boiled down to is Labour was going to highlight that Area Councils cost £150 per person per person who attends and that we would scrap them and have 24 wardens instead. Britcliffe is frighttened stiff about this idea but knows he is on a sticky wicket. Last week leaders column talked up how good Area Councils are as part of his defence.

Would that be in Cllr's expenses, or in payment to HBC employees attending the meetings. cause from the one's I have attended, there seems to be a few HBC employees present.

Re: Council get something right!!
 

I knew that HBC was a shambolic mess and I often characterise Britcliffe as a bumbling fool who can barely sting a coherent sentence together. but I had no idea that the situation was as out of control as you seem to suggest. It seems clear to me that the public should be made more aware of the situation. Would the Observer be likley to print some of your observations via their letters page or do you think that you would be censored or censured?

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Re: Council get something right!!
 

Probably more to the point, what can board members do to help improve the situation?