Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Why the hell was this allowed to happen. It makes me so angry that these protesters were allowed to be there let alone shout abuse at our troops. http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/i...cons/icon8.gif
I hope they bring each protester down one by one.

BBC NEWS | England | Beds/Bucks/Herts | Two held during parade protests

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

fer me they should have the authority to round em up n chuck em out of the country, nowt against free speech, but downing street or the like is the place fer demonstrations, not parades welcoming working mem back home.:(

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Absolutely 100% Cashy. I cant for the life in me understand why they were allowed there . http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/i...cons/icon8.gif

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and on saturday they are having an irish republican,ira march in kirkintilloch.big counter protest is happening lets see if this reaches the news..

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I think to the lads and lasses of our armed services returning or about to serve abroad and to see this on the streets of the UK must be the ultimate insult.
The PC brigade must watch this and realise there is only so much we can take.
UK citizens or not send them back to their roots.
Put them in a glasshouse and they will soon realise how wrong they were.

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It is absolutely disgusting, can't for the life in me understand how it was allowed to happen. What an insult to the lads and lasses in our forces:mad:

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Heartbreaking to see these bearded religious pratts shout at our troops this way. They are doing their duty defending us all, whatever the politicians have sent them to do.

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If they don't like it here they know what to do. Some would say it was a pity the rest of the crowd didn't get them

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It's not on...there are people including christians that oppose the action in Iraq but some of the placards on display are close to threats...at least some were arrested.

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Well at least the police were taking pics so we can only hope that they all get pulled in one by one.

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They should have all been arrested....from what I saw in the video, most of the protesters supported beards and attire that is a symbol of another religion. Not Christian.
Yes they were threats, and if it had happened welcoming homecoming troops on the streets of Iraq, Pakistan or Iran they would have been shot.
I am not in favour of that but such is life.

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Hundreds of thousands took to the streets to protest against us invading Iraq. I didn't protest, but totally opposed this war, which was sold as a lie about weapons of mass destruction, when really it was about securing a stable base amongst the oil fieds of the Middle East. However I totally support the the troops who are living and dying out there, and wouldn't dream at protesting at the home coming parade of the ones lucky enough to return.

If anyone doesn't like living in this country they are free to move elsewhere. I'm sure quite a few people would glady wave 'em off.

Frankly I'd be more than impressed if they gave up any benefits this country might afford them, child benefit, education, health care etc etc, but sadly I can't see them doing that, for they seem more than happy with that part of living in Britain.

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thats the bottom line here, they damn well know they can.:mad: and the lilly livered politicals will do sod all about it.:mad::mad:

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Yes..but could the same be said about the recent attacks on British personnel in Ulster?...your statement could apply to Irish citizens living here that have supported the Republican cause in the past and some may still support that cause..does your post apply to them and not just Muslims?..to cut it short did you have the same opinion of the immagrant Irish in the 70' 80's?

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Er....show me where in the post I referred to any religious or ethnic group!?!

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In answer to the less inane part of your post, if they were actively supporting terrorists at that time yes.

I also think it was wrong we have/had such a 'special relationship' and didn't cut diplomatic ties with a country, the U.S.A., which allowed open and direct fundraising for terrorist cells, and which resulted in the deaths of British citizens.

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nowhere..but I get the gist...just pointing out that this country has been through these attacks since the 70's from the Irish and now maybe the more dangerous are the Muslim extremists.. but you never got anyone saying the Irish should be sent "home"...

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I know some people even in Accrington who did openly support the IRA in the 70's...maybe they would not have taken murderous action but they did openly support the IRA...now we have a situation were some Muslims support terrorist actions carried out by extremists and all hell breaks loose...I'm being provocative.

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Well as so often, you got the wrong 'gist' yet again, as I made no mention of any one group of people.

As for the Irish question you're wrong yet again. Lots of quite innocent Irish families had their property, and in some cases themselves, attacked, after various terrorist atrocities in the '70's. There are many recorded cases of this happening in London and Birmingham especially.

That was wrong, but if some people were raising money for, or aiding terrorist organisations, then they should have been be stopped by legal means, whatever that may have entailed.

I think I'll change my comment about if people don't like this country they are free to move to another, to also include planet.

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was a family up Fern gore had their property damaged back then, were good friends of mine.

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Ok when was the last time or anytime you saw people raising money for Al Quada?.. but not to long ago there was money raised for the IRA and the Republican cause in pubs in London and even in Accy... I'm saying that people have forgotten the misery of the IRA ..the IRA are Irish..they like to kill the British..should they be sent home?

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And that is what I'm saying..it's out of order...to long on here it has been time to have a dig at Muslims,Polish..or anyone else..if it was as simple to say send "em home " then great.. but the slating of immagrants seems more aggresive if they ain't white!

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it has also been mentioned that the muslim protesters were taking pictures of thet returning troops , even if no actual harm comes to these troops the threat of intimidation was clearly there

what these idiots dont realise is that if the UK had the laws in place that they woudl liek to see they wouldnt have the right to protest they would probably be whipped or executed

perhaps if they disagree with the way we do things they should pi** off to a country that does things teh way they like and leave those that appreciate the freedom we have to live here in peace

as for te IRA i find it ironic that america leads teh way in the fight against terror yet funded the IRA to blow things up , mame and murder on british soil

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I didn't mention any one group, and don't try and label me as racist, as I was publicly fighting that in the late seventies.

It's probably more than a little racist of you to presume that Muslims aren't white, when in fact there are lots, and like most religions it transcends colour, culture, and national borders.;)

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I agree it was disgusting but thousands of our troops have died to allow us to have free speech.

Why do you think their actions in Iraq/Afganistan are defending us?

Because we are a tolerant country we do not arrest all non Christians. Do you think we should do?

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Arrest the ones who where carrying placards whatever race or cread.

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I can't believe this ... what is happening over there? ... today, Trooper Marc Diab, Royal Canadian Dragoons, one of 4 Canadians KIA in Afghanistan in the past week will arrive home ... and I will guarantee that nothing like this will happen in Canada. Many of us oppose the war; but we support our troops 100 per cent.

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I have to say I was sickened by what I saw on TV this morning, but the thing that sickened me more was the fact that the police did nothing about it, if it had been the other way round and the indigenous population had been protesting at a muslim parade, their feet wouldn't have touched, but instead the police were protecting this rabble. But at least two people were arrested, not the placard waving prats but two local people who took exception to this protest, makes you proud to be British:(

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If the protestors feel so strongly then renounce your British citizenship(and all benefits and entitlements)and go and try the Talibans hospitality for a month or two.
We are all lucky to live in this country,that even with it faults still compares favourably to some of the wannabe 4th century dwellers cess pits that exist..
If you don't like it, to paraphrase,"Go East young man".

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I agree with that statement but only for some of the placards. I saw the one in the paper below that said "Muslims Rise Against British Oppression". He should have been arrested.

http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/a...s-parade-1.jpg

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The thing is Neil, its not matter of should have been arrested, but more on the lines why weren't they :( if they feel oppressed then they can sod off back to the cave from whence they came, nobody is asking them to stay, and you can bet your bottom dollar that none of them are in gainful employment and they and there extended families are being kept by those very same people they are calling oppressors:(

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Would these people have the freedom to protest in such a manner in their own country?
I rather think that they wouldn't. As many others have said, there are a lot of us who did not want our troops out there....in a war that was not of our making(in effect a false war).....if these people do not like living in a society that allows them the freedoms that they have here......then leave! And make sure the door doesn't hit you in the bum as you leave.

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Can you just imagine what would happen if a bunch of blokes had to make placards saying Muslims out and stand outside a mosque on a Friday lunch time, their feet wouldn't touch, so whats the difference, isn't this the type of thing that causes resentment amongst the indigenous population, we have to toe the line and these fanatics get away with anything they like. The sorry thing about this is that all Muslims are being tarred with the same brush

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I don't agree with the war in Iraq and I'm not anti-immigrant. However, this really is too much. Our armed forces put their lives on the line for us on a daily basis and they should not be subjected to this sort of abuse when they return home. I watched the arrogant, smug individual who organised this protest being interviewed by John Stapleton this morning and I came as close as I've ever been to putting my foot through the TV screen.

I would be very interested to hear: (a) what this government are going to do to make sure that this doesn't happen again, and (b) the excuses that the chattering classes and Hampstead Heath intellectuals come up with for this hateful rabble.

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whilst greg is getting rightfully praised in the other thread, things like this are the "Big" issues,that affect every british subject! i'm sure the feeling about this is reflected all over england, by the majority of people, WHY was this march/demonstration allowed in that place? WHY is nothing done about these hostile people? these demonstrations can only cause racism, hatred, intolerance, what can he do to help the public in this instance?

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That is a very prejudiced comment as some of the protesters interviewed on TV were obviously born here and lived here all their lives.

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Another prejudiced comment making the asumption that this is not their own country.

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As Bernard Manning once said, just because a dog is born in a stable it does'nt make it a horse.
If they want to follow their own religion, and have their own laws implimented, then they should be in their country of origin.
Retlaw.

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If we make the assumption that this is the case they should comply with the rule of law of the country. Without Fear or Favour.

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Echo every word here. Im still really angry at that protest. and THE FACT That nothing was done to avoid it.
I am so proud of our armed forces but right now very ashamed to belong to a country that allows such behaviour to the ones that have been fighting for these prats to be able to protest in the first place.
:(http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/i...cons/icon8.gif

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Bout time we stood up and let ourselves be counted. It seems that our cowardly government have long treated the muslims like some sort of protected species, much to the detriment of the long suffering public who are seeing their own rights eroded on a daily basis.

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its sod all to do with prejudice, its about people living here abiding by our laws n traditions. like i did happily when i lived abroad. it was my choice, their country, so i respected it.

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Could`nt have put it better myself.

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If they feel like they do....then whether it is the country they were born in or not....it isn't their country.
They aren't showing prejudice are they????????
I do not call it prejudice...I call it patriotism.......I call it support for the lads and lasses who in the line of duty, put their lives on the line in a war that the majority of us seem not to have been in support of.
I call it justified.

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Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Yes and if they carry on Big Ben will be removed, and it will have a big golden dome on it, and speakers yeodeling the faithful, and York Minster will become the biggest mosque in the British Isles.

Retlaw.

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a

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

During the 2nd World War persons with family in, or showing sympathy with, the country we were at war with, were compelled to live in camps.

I see similarities here to the present situation.
The Isle of Man could not be used this time but there are still large expanses of uninhabited land in Scotland and Cornwall

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Exactly, that is why the protesters with placards that could be classed as inciting violence should have been arrested.

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I can think of better places, like some of the more remote uninhabited islands in the Orkneys.
Then they can please theirselves what the do, but no benefits, self suffiencey or perish.

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If they were born and bred in this country then they are arguably guilty of treason, which still carries the death penalty

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Georgia is an uninhabited island around the Falkland Isle Retlaw, and its far enough as well:rolleyes:

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Yep, thats what i was going to say. I must admit my blood was at boiling point watching those Scum. I'm another who was not a supporter of the War in Iraq, or indeed of the ongoing conflict in Afghanistan. This war is never going to be won in the way in which we are choosing to fight it. We are just sending our troops into an unwinable situation, and constantly putting needless lives at risk, as well as throwing billions of pounds down the drain. I'm sure a lot of our Soldiers dont agree with these conflicts either, however they realise this when they sign up and represent our country with great dignity and bravery. Its partly because of them that we can live in a country where we can voice a reasoned opinion without fear of torture or worse. These Muslim extreamists are insulting the heart of the British nation by the obvious venom of their protest. Again the Police chose not to act for fear of being branded racist. This appeasement of Ethnic minority groups at the expense of the majority really needs to be addressed urgently. Maybe there are times when we are just Too tolerant in this country. Others can take great advantage of that at times. Hopefully this proves to be an isolated thing, but unfortunatly it probably wont. I really can feel that there could be civil unrest in this Country the way things are going. Particularily now we are living in more austere times too. If people really think that living in a multicultural environment is desirable/beneficial then theres no place for allowing such a radical element of bigots to pedal their inflamatory thoughts. Surely some of their comments would be classed as incitement to Hate or violence? Our Police and Government need to take strong action against this, and be supported by all sectors of the community in doing so. Otherwise we may as well accept now that Multiculteralism like Communism sounds like a good idea....but it just dont work!

Best Regards - Taggy

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Agree 100% ... support for the troops and support for the war are seperate issues .... In Canada, support for the war is at an all time low; but support for the troops is very strong ... there is no contradiction in this. In Quebec, only about 20% of those polled support the war; yet, when the Royal 22nd (a francophone regiment) was deployed to Afghanistan, Quebecois in their thousands turned out in Quebec City to wish them well ...

And there is nothing wrong with patriotism ....

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I often remind people of that fact

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It doesn't seem to be used thought does it. I would have thought that the people who copied the 7th of July bombers were gulity of Treason.

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Sorry John..got to pick up on that:

The penalty for treason was changed from death to a maximum of imprisonment for life in 1998 under the Crime And Disorder Act. Before 1998, the death penalty was mandatory, subject to the royal prerogative of mercy. Since the abolition of the death penalty for murder in 1965 an execution for treason was unlikely to be carried out.
Treason laws were used against Irish insurgents before Irish independence. However, IRA and other republican guerrillas were not prosecuted or executed for treason for levying war against the British government during the Troubles. They, along with loyalist militants, were jailed for murder, violent crimes or terrorist offences.
William Joyce was the last person to be put to death for treason, in 1946. (On the following day Theodore Schurch was executed for treachery, a similar crime, and was the last man to be executed for a crime other than murder in the UK.)
As to who can commit treason, it depends on the ancient notion of allegiance. As such, all British nationals (but not other Commonwealth citizens) owe allegiance to the Queen in right of the United Kingdom wherever they may be, as do Commonwealth citizens and aliens present in the United Kingdom at the time of the treasonable act (except diplomats and foreign invading forces), those who hold a British passport however obtained, and aliens who - having lived in Britain and gone abroad again - have left behind family and belongings.

This from Wilkpedia.

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The placard bearers should have been removed immediately, and arrested for inciting racial hatred and violence, then locked up for a long spell, I am quite sure that, had I been there, I would have been arrested and locked up for my reaction to these scum.

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The difference there Derek is your ethnic origin.

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Were we at RAF Northolt when "Our Lad" come home:confused:
If any of us had been there with placards we would have been arrested, no doubt about it :mad:

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You've all heard the saying "you couldn't make it up" well listen to this one. One of these protesters, one Jalal Ahmed, has security clearance and works for Easy Jet as baggage handler at Luton Airport:eek::eek::eek: comments please:rolleyes:

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

well if they allow thugs n thieves to be cops, a baggage handler is fine.:rolleyes:

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Just depends what he's going to slip in a bag when no ones watching is the thing that bothers me cashy :(

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Wonder just how long he,ll keep his job now all this has come to light?:confused: Will be interesting to see if action is taken against him.
And yes IMO it damn well should be:(

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Could'nt agree more, but i bet it dont!!:(

Best Regards - Taggy

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I have it on good authority he is an MI5 agent planted to spy on the rest of the Luton baggage handlers:)

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Onlt two people were arrested at this demo.....both of them non muslims.
Bet that surprised you!

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Well that explains it then Tealeaf, and there's me thinking he was a danger to national security, how silly of me:rolleyes:

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I was going to pm you and say that however angry this makes you, remember that the work you do on behalf of the troops serving at the sharp end of things means much more, and more truly represents how the vast majority of feel, than the rantings of a few extremists. But I decided to put it on the open forum instead .... I think it adds a little perspective to this whole deal.

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I agree Eric . If anything positive has come out of those scumbags protesting, It is the Public support strengthening more than ever, and that can only be a good thing for our troops.
IMO all they have done is embarrass themselves and their own culture and joined a few more dots together to enable a clearer picture of what we the british public have to endure in our own country, Now all we need is a decent enough government to sit up and take note. :(

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agree, only problem with it is NO government in this country would have the balls to take the Bull By The Horns n sort it.:mad: whilst its all happening at the moment, aint heard the opposition shouting at Brown n co has anyone?

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There was a news report on TV last night from Pakistan. It was about a long Walk from Karachi to Islamabad. It seems that during the political unrest of the last couple of years, the then President(Pervez Musharraf) sacked all the senior judges.....and they want to be reinstated.

There was a large demonstration and in the crowd were 'plain clothes police'......demonstrators were hit with batons and bundled into vans and taken to Prison.......women too were treated in this manner.
So thje demonstrators in Luton want to realise that they have freedoms here that aren't shared with the people in their own countries......and women demonstrators and polictical activists are not tolerated at all.

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The thing that amuses me about these nut jobs, is they are calling our troops yet more Muslims are being killed by Muslims ever day, and I also ask the question how many Muslims did Sadman slaughter during his tyrannical reign, exactly:(

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Suppose it was all a question of law Margaret. If they weren't throwing objects, hitting out at anyone ... just maybe causing an obstruction or some sort of incitement, then all the police could do was to move them along. Bet they themselves would have loved to have punched the hell out of them !

Can't obviously blame other members of the crowd from having a go at them, can you ? Suppose though in the eyes of the law they were committing an offence.

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I have to disagree kate, if the BNP were stood outside a mosque waving obnoxious posters, their feet would not have touched, you know it I know it, but because they were Muslim fanatics shouting vile insults at our lads marching through their town, the police were scarred to death of being pulled over the calls, there is one law for us and another law for them and lets face it its not the first time this has happened nor will it be the last, sadly:(

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Kate, I think it might have something to do with the interpretation of the law and maybe a little to do with the fact that the police don't want complaints that they are 'racist' levelled at them.
I agree with Jaysay. I also think that the people bearing placards which proclaimed the regiment to be 'the butchers of Basra' is an act of inciting racial hatred and should have been dealt with as such.
One of the protesters also made the allegation that the soldiers raped and killed women and children. Where is his proof of that? Has he got any proof?

The good news is that the chap who worked airside as a baggage handler has had his airside pass revoked and is subject to an investigation by his employers.....who were keen to point out that he was only ever a part-time employee.......five minutes airside is enough to do great damage if he wanted.....isn't it?

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What a sloppy piece of journalism in the Lancashire Telegraph. It used quotes from me that paint the opposite to what I believe.

The British Right to Protest and Loony Extremist Muslims in Luton.

1) Muslims in Luton demonstrating should be charged with incitement to cause hatred. Home Secretary Jackie Smith is right.

2) They should never have been allowed by the Police anywhere near armed forces personnel. This was not protest but hatred and incitement to violence.

People in general have a right to protest. That is what we are defending, freedom. However not there and not the way they did. I don't know why they want to live here if that's their view, and as for the hate preacher on benefits, that needs addressing immediately.

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'He (Anjem Choudary) has previously made no secret of his demands that the country be placed under sharia - Islamic law. This would mean all women would have to wear veils, adulterers would be stoned to death and drunks whipped in public.

Firebrand risks jail in call for jihad cash - Times Online

It disgusts me that people like this 'preacher' make use of this country's democratic right to free speach, and use it to try and take away the rights of those they disagree with.:mad:

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It is interesting to note that this man was pictured in the paper this weekend quaffing beer and Lager(this was when he was a young and foolish student)......he says that the pictures are fabricated.

Was he following the tenets of Islam when he was pictured drinking alcohol?

It seems to me that we are far to soft on these people. I am not talking about all Muslims....just the ones who hate us vehemently, but will hold out their hands to take any benefit that is going....they don't hate us then do they?

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'The jobless Brit-born lawyer, a father of three, lives off £25,000-a-year state handouts.'

Daily Star: Simply The Best 7 Days A Week :: News :: Hate preacher: I've found god

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Reckon the Telegraph owe you an apology on that one Graham :

Armed forces celebration parade for Accrington (From Lancashire Telegraph)

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I've read this report and it doesn't seem that Graham has said anything untoward, unless its been edited that is:confused:

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It's the way the sentence was put together Jaysay. Almost made it look like an invitation to come and protest, which I am sure is not quite what he said.

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Kate take a look at your link again think they must have edited because it doesn't seem to mention Graham saying anything about protest's

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This is the bit I meant :-

Coun Graham Jones, leader of the Labour party, said: “These things are very close to home.
"The death of Private Jason Rawstron from Clayton-le-Moors, for example, but it is important that people have the right to protest if they want to.”

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Well all I can say is good on Accrington.
If Im reading it right it does actually look as though g jones is saying he thinks its ok to protest no matter what although I know he isnt but I can see how it could be interpreted

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It was edited poorly and bits chopped out taking it all out of context of you read it one way.

It's tough balancing people who potentially will stir up violence (The Luton Muslims) and on the other side, someone with a strong one sided opinion that is emotive but doesn't directly pose a threat of violence (Wim Gilders Dutch MP recently).

Lord Haw Haw, a New Yorker, was executed for Nazi propaganda by the Allies. That was treason though but where does treason start and end?

Churchill's view that "I may disagree with what you say but I'll defend you're right to say it" seems a good philosophical starting point however...

It's politicians that make policies, not soldiers. There were soldiers partners and children there. People who had risked their lives (outside of politics) and who deserved personal privacy regardless. These Muslim extremists were callous in what they did when they did.

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BTW has anyone viewed the film Fitna and what do they think?

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Quite right, so why isn't Jacqui Smith doing something about it? Why aren't the government looking at ways of introducing legislation to make abuse of our armed forces a hate crime?

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Yes.

Your quote from Churchill answers what I think.

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Mr. Jones, you've complained about the inaccuracy of the 'Telegraph' report but what have you done to Winston?:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Kate I've clicked on the link again, I know its early for me at 4-55am, but just like when I posted yesterday afternoon the part about "protesting if they want to" is not there, it must have been edited. Not getting a LT and only reading it on line, doesn't give me a look at he original story, but they can't unprint papers. In my dealings with the media I always kept a hard copy of what I wrote, if dealing over the phone I taped my phone calls, helps to iron out mistakes under editorial licence if need be

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I'll hold my hand up, it is there Kate, I just read Grahams first comment about being close to home, I must pay more attention, but I think that Cllr Jones must have used the words edited or not, maybe it could have been better not giving the press a line on the matter that could be edited in a way to make him sound bad, hey but who am I to tell the great orator how to make comments, we all know, as we've been told numerous times, that he's perfect and is Gods gift to the world, maybe in much the same way that Gordon keeps harping on, must be a trait with New Labour, many a slip is made between the cup and lip:rolleyes:

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Could be Jaysay..just like the "slip" that Tory Maggie had when she danced with Mugabe at a lavish dinner held in his honor in Zimbabwe.. no comparison..but you start posting propaganda I will cane you!

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Think it also depends on what you construe as inciting violence. Granted, the things they were shouting and the placeards that were displayed were definitely acts of incitement, but surely their presence at this event was doing that also??? Out of respect for our lads and lasses that have served their country, we shouldnt have allowed these 'people' any where near the homecoming parade. Protests should be aimed at the right people, ie the government, not our troops coming home to their families

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

lets fill it in ..there is a conflict of wether any people should have the right to express and shout out whatever they want.. yes they should have that right.. we do have laws in this country stating that anyone inciting or even threatening any kind of violence can be charged ..convicted and sentenced.

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

So if there was some kind of Islamic procession and you had right-wing extremists holding up placards that were blasphemous towards their religion, that would be OK then? Their feet wouldn't touch and quite rightly so. Exactly, the same situation here...these idiots were deliberately trying to stir up trouble by offending people.

As onlyme says, if they want to protest against the war, they should be protesting against the government, not abusing returning servicemen.

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

eh? I do recall the National Front marching in Blackburn.. massive stuff and even had a rally.. those people did not care where you came from nor religion or politics...they where concerned about colour.. times were hard in the 70's and the same ****e was churned out .. some older people should remember what it was like.. but i't's a shame the people that recall those times have now turned racist.

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Yes, I remember those times, Mancie. I was there to protest when they marched through Accy. And it's a shame that those who think it's quite permissible to see our returning troops abused by those who wish to stir up trouble like to label those who disagree with them "racist".

Re: Protests at returning troops Parade
 

Protests are usually held at where they will get the best media coverage. No point protesting outside No 10 if no one else is there but the PM to see it.

They got massive media coverage for the protest. It did however backfire for them and has done a lot of good for the soldiers. Look at the turn out at the home coming parade after that one.

I can't help wondering who planned the protest and what the real intentions were ;)

It certainly did nothing to change public opinion against our troops being over there.