Who gave this Plank a Gun?

gynn · 04-11-2010, 17:53

Mark Saunders officer 'planted song titles' in evidence | UK news | The Guardian

I have to say my jaw dropped when I heard that the police marksman who was involved in the Mark Saunders shooting had included as many song titles as possible in his evidence to the inquest. To show such insensitivity in what was actually a tragic case of a mentally disturbed person is just unforgiveable.

Lets hope he's now named, shamed, and put up to the public humility he deserves!

jaysay · 04-11-2010, 18:07

But is he good at what he does, aka using a fire arm in the course of his duties

JCB · 04-11-2010, 18:28

Every area of work has its insensitive idiots .

Alan Varrechia · 04-11-2010, 19:45

It won't be just him, bet there were lot's of bets going on as to how many he could get in.

DaveinGermany · 04-11-2010, 19:51

You did ! And everyone else in the UK ! He is an armed response Police officer of the Met, he's been licensed & trained in the use of firearms, which when needed will be used as required in a criminal situation.

Mark Saunders was drunk & intimidating, he was also in possesion of a loaded firearm which he'd discharged on several occasions on the day. Had this been in your street would you have felt the same ? Would you have been quite happy to let him carry on shooting randomly or would you have wanted the Police to react ?

Admittedly his wording of his after action report was in bad taste & not the most sensible thing to do & for that he deserves punishment, but it has nothing to do with the officers ability to use a firearm in the course of his duty.

Tealeaf · 04-11-2010, 20:04

I know some of the guys down here at Leman St (where all the Met's armed units are based); from chatting over a few jars, there is no doubt that this character was a clear and present danger and needed blowing away. What is disgraceful is the subsequent waste of taxpayers money on the inquest and as such I suspect that some of the cops involved treated this farago with the contempt it deserved.

I suggest you lot back in Lancashire should concern yourselves more with how this copper - one of Lancashire's Finest - ended up with a couple of Uzzi's in his house:

Lancashire sergeant helped gangster brother (From Lancashire Telegraph)

cashman · 04-11-2010, 20:40

The fact the officer has been a dickhead after the event is no reason at all why this guy was shot, its that simple.

Gordon Booth · 04-11-2010, 20:44

I went on shooting competitions where policemen from Armed Response Units took part to keep their hands in and see how they compared to skilled amateurs.They were TOTALY professional,TOTALY disciplined and VERY serious about their chosen branch in the Police.
They were also unbelievably good shots, even with pistols. Believe me anyone who takes these men on is drunk, on drugs or has a death wish!
Whatever this man is, he is NOT a plank! He has been VERY highly trained to do a very unpleasant job if required to. He will be very intelligent and motivated.
Why he gave evidence as he did I don't know but NEVER doubt the actions he took on that day were coolly,calmly(even coldly) decided upon. Have confidence in these men, they are prepared to do a job most of us could never face!

Tealeaf · 04-11-2010, 20:54

That inquest cost the best part of 350K; it should have cost no more than a hundred quid. Besides which there is no proof that he deliberately chose lyrics from various songs; he was under cross-examination as were all other witnesses and the terminology he would have used would have been consistent with any death-by-shooting inquest. That terminolgy is also consistent with numerous lyrics from various popular songs over the last 50 years or so, all eulogising some clown shot in a gunfight.

Anyway, would it not be best to await the formal enquiry into this officer's actions rather than make judgements on what you read in some tabloid rag?

Eric · 04-11-2010, 21:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

You did ! And everyone else in the UK ! He is an armed response Police officer of the Met, he's been licensed & trained in the use of firearms, which when needed will be used as required in a criminal situation.

Mark Saunders was drunk & intimidating, he was also in possesion of a loaded firearm which he'd discharged on several occasions on the day. Had this been in your street would you have felt the same ? Would you have been quite happy to let him carry on shooting randomly or would you have wanted the Police to react ?

Admittedly his wording of his after action report was in bad taste & not the most sensible thing to do & for that he deserves punishment, but it has nothing to do with the officers ability to use a firearm in the course of his duty.

I tend to agree ... and I would argue that being drunk, intimidating, and in possession of a loaded firearm is more in bad taste than anything the officer did. I don't think that remorse and sensitivity is a quality necessary for a member of a SWAT team. Being able to shoot straight is. PCism again.

I do find it disturbing when police have to use lethal force; but I also realize that in this less than perfect world such actions are sometimes necessary. I don't agree with all that the police do, but I am convinced that, in most cases, they do act in the public interest. You are all probably aware that in Canada police officers are armed; but this does not mean that trigger happy coppers are blowing away people at random. In Kingston, for example, the only cases of police discharging their firearms in the past year involved the mercy killing of animals hit and severely hurt by motor vehicles. However, I do know that if there were an incident involving an armed stand off, the police here might be called upon to use lethal force. And if this happened, I wouldn't give a flying you-know-what about some perceived insensibility of the officer burdened with the responsibility of firing the lethal round.

Neil · 05-11-2010, 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn

I have to say my jaw dropped when I heard that the police marksman who was involved in the Mark Saunders shooting had included as many song titles as possible in his evidence to the inquest. To show such insensitivity in what was actually a tragic case of a mentally disturbed person is just unforgiveable.

Lets hope he's now named, shamed, and put up to the public humility he deserves!

If it is true I found it amusing. Then again I have a sense of humour. Mark Saunders was a danger and was dealt with appropriately.

I think these officers do a very difficult job, shooting to kill is not a nice thing to do and I am sure they all have different ways of dealing with it.

jaysay · 05-11-2010, 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil

If it is true I found it amusing. Then again I have a sense of humour. Mark Saunders was a danger and was dealt with appropriately.

I think these officers do a very difficult job, shooting to kill is not a nice thing to do and I am sure they all have different ways of dealing with it.

Think your spot on Neil, I know one thing I couldn't or for that matter wouldn't want to do the job

jaysay · 05-11-2010, 10:34

Mark Saunders inquest: Policeman who 'inserted song titles' suspended | Mail Online
Looks like the chaps been suspended

Benipete · 05-11-2010, 11:03

In conclusion the officer said,"You ain't seen nothing yet" "I did it my way" and now "It's over"

gynn · 05-11-2010, 11:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

Mark Saunders inquest: Policeman who 'inserted song titles' suspended | Mail Online
Looks like the chaps been suspended

Quite right too. It might have been the hardest job in the world dealing with the crazed gunman, but to treat the innocent relatives with such complete contempt in the cold light of day is unforgiveable.

Of course there is a time and a place for humour, but this certainly wasn't it!

The Chief Constable of the Met seems to share that view, thank goodness.