Bedroom tax - targeting the poorest.

[accyman]

although it is a tradgedy when someone finds themselves in such despair that ending their life seems like their only option i do think those that inflict suffering on others by their choice are selfish.

there are many ways to kill your self with less fuss and if someone absolutely must make a statement with their death there are ways in doing so without destroying other peoples lives.

i may seem cold and callous i dont know but thats just how i feel about it

[Less]

Originally Posted by accyman

although it is a tradgedy when someone finds themselves in such despair that ending their life seems like their only option i do think those that inflict suffering on others by their choice are selfish.

there are many ways to kill your self with less fuss and if someone absolutely must make a statement with their death there are ways in doing so without destroying other peoples lives.

i may seem cold and callous i dont know but thats just how i feel about it

I wholeheartedly agree, unfortunately lets be honest when driven to such extremes as taking your life, is the method used something that person has control over?

To be so desperate surely overpowers a persons thoughts of consequences to others?

Perhaps what's needed is a government leaflet advising the desperate on the least inconvenient method of gratifying suicidal tendencies to be issued with every document the benefits department issue announcing how they are going to make your life a living hell by reducing the payments you used to receive?

[cashman]

I tend to agree accyman, then i think the heads have gone to make em do it in certain ways?

[accyman]

im just glad we dont have dignitas in the UK

This tory lot would give grants to anyone on benefit of any kind to go get themselves done in because a one off payment would be cheaper than making sure someone who is ill got treatment,care and support

[Sunflower49]

Originally Posted by Less

What a load of tripe!

A large part of the UK suffer from depression and can cope with it until they are pushed beyond their personal tipping point, her family no doubt would rather she had asked them than take this 'final solution'.
She had managed to deal with her 'issues' until hit by this ill thought out attack on the Countries vulnerable.
The Government are to blame, because there aren't enough one bedroom properties to move all that are effected into, so all they are doing is taxing the poor and no doubt this woman will not be the last person driven to this extreme by them.
When are people such as you going to wake up and realise that this isn't an attack on scroungers, but an attack on the poor and the ill, will you only consider it to be wrong if it unfortunately happens to you, or when one of your loved ones gets so desperate that you lose them to this terribly cruel and uncaring shift in our societies moral fibre?

RIP The Victims Of A Cruel Tax, Don't Feel Alone, There Will Be Many More...

You've most certainly put words in my keyboard there Less. I never implied she was scrounging-I don't think she was. I just think there were more factors here than 'The government did something so I killed myself'.

[MargaretR]

The population cull is underway.

The Great Culling has begun: Will your genetic lineage survive?

"The word for this is, of course, eugenics. Adolf Hitler pursued the same philosophy: Improve the human race through genocide. Eliminate the weak, the ugly, the stupid. Fire up the incinerators, disarm the target race to be exterminated, and herd them into gas chambers or open pits.

Today's eugenicists are more subtle. They've learned, through experience, that openly gassing entire populations doesn't win over the hearts and minds of the public. So they've developed covert methods of accomplishing the same thing. These coverts methods include convincing people to eat genetically modified foods -- which promote infertility -- to drink fluoride, take vaccines, use synthetic chemicals, increase abortions and pursue other actions that either kill people outright or drastically reduce rates of reproduction."

There has been a plan for population reduction in force for decades.

It is blatently told to you on the Georgia Guidestones -
Georgia Guidestones - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature."

We are seeing eugenics in action.

History of eugenics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"In the United Kingdom, eugenics never received significant state funding, but it was supported by many prominent figures of different political persuasions before World War I, including: Liberal economists William Beveridge and John Maynard Keynes; Fabian socialists such as Irish author George Bernard Shaw, H. G. Wells and Sidney Webb; and Conservatives such as the future Prime Minister Winston Churchill and Arthur Balfour. The influential economist John Maynard Keynes was a prominent supporter of Eugenics, serving as Director of the British Eugenics Society, and writing that eugenics is "the most important, significant and, I would add, genuine branch of sociology which exists".

Its emphasis was more upon social class, rather than race. Indeed, Francis Galton expressed these views during a lecture in 1901 in which he placed British society into groups. These groupings are shown in the figure and indicate the proportion of society falling into each group and their perceived genetic worth. Galton suggested that negative eugenics (i.e. an attempt to prevent them from bearing offspring) should be applied only to those in the lowest social group (the "Undesirables"), while positive eugenics applied to the higher classes. However, he appreciated the worth of the higher working classes to society and industry.

The 1913 Mental Deficiency Act proposed the mass segregation of the "feeble minded" from the rest of society. Sterilisation programmes were never legalised, although some were carried out in private upon the mentally ill by clinicians who were in favour of a more widespread eugenics plan. Indeed, those in support of eugenics shifted their lobbying of Parliament from enforced to voluntary sterilization, in the hope of achieving more legal recognition. But leave for the Labour Party Member of Parliament Major A. G. Church, to propose a Private Member's Bill in 1931, which would legalise the operation for voluntary sterilization, was rejected by 167 votes to 89. The limited popularity of eugenics in the UK was reflected by the fact that only two universities established courses in this field (University College London and Liverpool University). The Galton Institute, affiliated to UCL, was headed by Galton's protégé, Karl Pearson".

It isn't comfortable to realise that it may well be happening.

[Less]

Originally Posted by sugarmouse0707

You've most certainly put words in my keyboard there Less. I never implied she was scrounging-I don't think she was. I just think there were more factors here than 'The government did something so I killed myself'.

I've put nothing of the kind in, you like many others are happy in you're own comfortable little space and rather than consider how someone could be driven to such extremes salve your conscience by saying there must be more than what is being said.

Allow me to spell it out for you, every time you ignore the plight of someone so desperate as to be driven by hardship caused by this unfair tax, is a cruel act on your behalf, you claim to be an animal lover, would you force any living beast into a corner where cruelty makes them take their own life?
If not why allow it for people?

Do me a favour, don't answer, I can't stand how stupid you are.

[Sunflower49]

Lol I am many things Less but you cannot insult me-I know myself well enough to either admit it, or know full well it isn't true.
You have said some pretty ridiculous things to me in the past as it is, the above is just another one. Put me on ignore if I get that much on your 'tit's '.

[Less]

Originally Posted by sugarmouse0707

Lol I am many things Less but you cannot insult me-I know myself well enough to either admit it, or know full well it isn't true.
You have said some pretty ridiculous things to me in the past as it is, the above is just another one. Put me on ignore if I get that much on your 'tit's '.

No, I will continue to answer you until you begin to think.

I have the rest of my life to train you somehow I think you are like a dog I used to own, everyone said it was to stupid to learn, I taught IT with kindness, you I will treat with what you deserve.

[Alan Varrechia]

[Sunflower49]

Originally Posted by Less

No, I will continue to answer you until you begin to think.

I have the rest of my life to train you somehow I think you are like a dog I used to own, everyone said it was to stupid to learn, I taught IT with kindness, you I will treat with what you deserve.

If you really think that's your duty, and really wish to do that,pm me , don't berate/namecall on an active thread-It's not on topic and is not good for other forum members to see.

Originally Posted by accyman

although it is a tradgedy when someone finds themselves in such despair that ending their life seems like their only option i do think those that inflict suffering on others by their choice are selfish.

there are many ways to kill your self with less fuss and if someone absolutely must make a statement with their death there are ways in doing so without destroying other peoples lives.

i may seem cold and callous i dont know but thats just how i feel about it

I agree-was partly an influence on my opinion.

[GEaston]

Plenty of idiots on here mouse, and Less is one of them. He and others that can't argue quickly resort to personal insults. As a former teacher he should know better. For my part I am pleased I didn't attend his IT class!

I'd like to know why people think the government owes them anything - house, living, just anything at all. Welfare state came in post war to provide for people in harsh circumstances, which was an honourable idea, but its long since morphed into something can take the **** out of as the Phillpot "family" perfectly demonstrated. I get that's an extreme case, but the fact that people can is shameful. Individual greed will always trump need.

What happened in Britain in every century prior to this one? For the previous 10,000 years we did just fine, and were a great nation for much of the latter part. There's plenty of excellent economic systems without a Welfare state, or handout mentality, like the one here in Singapore. Here they spend next to nothing on welfare, and almost no one looks to the govt for help nor is anyone jealous of the UK system, which they find laughable. Here, and in most of Asia, the concept of FAMILY is live and well. FAMILY look after you until such time as you no longer need help. The house next door to me has 4 generations of the same family living in it.

Meanwhile back in Blighty we now have a system where people leave home at 18, feel entitled to be housed by the government (for no reason other than they reached 18), have kids and often can't even stay in an immediate family unit - in fact if you don't your priority in the govt housing queue rises, long with your Govt support payments.

Time to completely reconsider the role of govt in society, instead of just moaning about it. Step back for a minute and read this thread again - people are actually outraged that the government isn't providing enough of the right type of housing !!!! I could add my previous point about our nation also being financially bankrupt and unable to support any such thing, but that's a wider discussion.

[MargaretR]

I am glad we don't have the squalid living conditions of the victorian era, and am glad that several generations don't live together in overcrowded dwellings.

Both were factors causing disease and early deaths.

Wages were low then, and (by the present cost of living) are low now, which puts home ownership beyond the reach of most people. The housing shortage causes high rents - anything rare has a high price.

The system you advocate ie, no state provision, has US citizens living in tent cities.

That couldn't happen here because all land is owned by somebody so there is nowhere to pitch it ! Even cardboard boxes in shop doorways are against the planning regulations and illegal.

You seem to wallow in nostalgia about the 'age of empire type' past - the only people who enjoyed it were the landed gentry.

I recall recently, a reporter decided to live like a homeless person so he could report it. He lasted a few days and died of hypothermia. Do they die of that in sunny Singapore?

[Less]

Originally Posted by GEaston

Plenty of idiots on here mouse, and Less is one of them. He and others that can't argue quickly resort to personal insults. As a former teacher he should know better. For my part I am pleased I didn't attend his IT class!

Inaccurate shots,
but they serve to prove you are prepared to talk without checking facts.

As for personal insults, isn't calling me an idiot just a touch personal? So what does that make you?

I know that so far as I'm concerned it made the propaganda nonsense after the above first paragraph unworthy of any thoughtful reply, but then that's you and you're big, 'I AM!'

[gpick24]

Originally Posted by GEaston

Plenty of idiots on here mouse, and Less is one of them.....

Now don`t be like that. Less is OK so long as you agree with everything he says.