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gynn 30-10-2010 20:14

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by walkinman221 (Post 856850)
the council also put him and family up in a top room in the dunk.

Shouldn't he have gone self catering? :confused::confused:

JCB 31-10-2010 11:25

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by walkinman221 (Post 856850)
The cost of aldo zilla just keeps going up as well as the footballers wages he was paid the council also put him and family up in a top room in the dunk.

" The spin off from having Aldo Zilli here was the whole town benefited , " said Peter Britcliffe .

" He brought a lot of people to the market and therefore a lot of money, " said Marlene Haworth .

Both quotes from Accrington Observer , 29/10/10 .

DaveinGermany 31-10-2010 11:27

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JCB (Post 857102)
" The spin off from having Aldo Zilli here was the whole town benefited , " said Peter Britcliffe .

" He brought a lot of people to the market and therefore a lot of money, " said Marlene Haworth .

Both quotes from Accrington Observer , 29/10/10 .

Well it would be wouldn't it ! I'm pretty sure the traders weren't asked for confirmation.

Ken Moss 31-10-2010 11:28

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JCB (Post 857102)
" The spin off from having Aldo Zilli here was the whole town benefited , " said Peter Britcliffe .

" He brought a lot of people to the market and therefore a lot of money, " said Marlene Haworth .

Both quotes from Accrington Observer , 29/10/10 .

Except that he didn't and those quotes are complete balls. Try dealing with actual facts, Peter.

The traders are financially crippled by the sixth day because no extra money is being spent in the market.

garinda 31-10-2010 11:29

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Bring back Fanny.

That would have got the crowds in.

Ken Moss 31-10-2010 11:32

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Sean Wilson cost £2,500 to promote his own business for a day and Kenny Baker was a slightly more reasonable £350, although he might have been a bigger draw on Saturday morning when peple are actually off work and can find time to come see him.

Welcome to the real world, Leader of the Council.

DaveinGermany 31-10-2010 11:32

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 857107)
Bring back Fanny.

That would have got the crowds in.

Is this one of them double intenders G ? Or am I presuming too much ? :s_aim1:

garinda 31-10-2010 11:35

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany (Post 857109)
Is this one of them double intenders G ? Or am I presuming too much ? :s_aim1:

Of course not.

Anyway, after checking, although Fanny comes cheap, her and Johnnie are no longer available.

:D

garinda 31-10-2010 11:37

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 857108)
Kenny Baker was a slightly more reasonable £350,

They could have Cheryl Baker for thirty five quid.

Ripped her skirt off everything, and handed out cheese straws.

Ken Moss 31-10-2010 11:39

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 857113)
They could have Cheryl Baker for thirty five quid.

Ripped her skirt off everything, and handed out cheese straws.

Colin Baker is from Rochdale.

Can't get cheesier than 1980s Doctor Who surely?

garinda 31-10-2010 11:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 857115)
Can't get cheesier than 1980s Doctor Who surely?


Baker's Cyst - NHS Choices

If left to ferment.

Cost?

Price of a bag of flour.

:D

DaveinGermany 31-10-2010 11:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 857112)
Anyway, after checking, although Fanny comes cheap, her and Johnnie are no longer available.:D

That's no good can't have one without the other, it'll only lead to trouble ! ;)

I see Mr Gryle's up & about too ! :D

garinda 31-10-2010 11:46

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany (Post 857120)
That's no good can't have one without the other, it'll only lead to trouble ! ;)

I see Mr Gryle's up & about too ! :D

You are a card.

If Fanny was here she'd be weeping.

Johnnie, would be there to wipe away those tears of joy.

DaveinGermany 31-10-2010 11:51

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 857121)
You are a card.

If Fanny was here she'd be weeping.

Johnnie, would be there to wipe away those tears of joy.

Penicillin, isn't that the answer ? Especially in Blue Stilton Cheese

Ken Moss 08-11-2010 20:50

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
It seems that a reappraisal is in order.

Cllr Haworth was quoted today as having spoken to 12 traders in the Market Hall, all of whom were in favour of Wednesday trading as they had seen their takings double from what they took on Mondays.

If that's true then it seems I must eat my words but for some reason I remain skeptical.

cashman 08-11-2010 21:02

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 859886)
It seems that a reappraisal is in order.

Cllr Haworth was quoted today as having spoken to 12 traders in the Market Hall, all of whom were in favour of Wednesday trading as they had seen their takings double from what they took on Mondays.

If that's true then it seems I must eat my words but for some reason I remain skeptical.

interesting i shall make a point of speaking to a few later this week, cos bet ya aint as skeptical as me.;)

Ken Moss 08-11-2010 21:05

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman (Post 859889)
interesting i shall make a point of speaking to a few later this week, cos bet ya aint as skeptical as me.;)

Won't make much difference Cashy.

If the powers that be manage to convince themselves that Wednesday trading works then it will be the toughest turd in the world for the stallholders that disagree.

Tealeaf 08-11-2010 21:09

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nell (Post 856095)
Hi everyone,

Just thought i'd let people know whats the've actually got on the balcony.

Womens Hairdresser
Bead Shop
Hand-made Jewellery
Womens clothes shop
Gifts/interiors etc.
Hand-made soaps etc
Perfume shop
Community loan service
Home Support (not sure)
Card/craft shop
Artist
Remote control specialist/hobby shop
miniatures i.e hornby etc & hobby shop
Web designer
Beautician

Bloody hell! The only thing that's missing is a sign leading upstairs saying "Lesbians and Loonatics only beyond this point".

cashman 08-11-2010 21:13

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 859891)
Won't make much difference Cashy.

If the powers that be manage to convince themselves that Wednesday trading works then it will be the toughest turd in the world for the stallholders that disagree.

well aware of that ken, but it will either make me hold me hand up, or more likely give me some ammo.:D;)

garinda 08-11-2010 22:41

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 859886)
It seems that a reappraisal is in order.

Cllr Haworth was quoted today as having spoken to 12 traders in the Market Hall, all of whom were in favour of Wednesday trading as they had seen their takings double from what they took on Mondays.

If that's true then it seems I must eat my words but for some reason I remain skeptical.

Yes, ask her for names, as none I've spoken to are in favour, and say it isn't worth their while opening.

Get her to ask one of the Market Hall's busiest stalls, Len's, and see what they say, or any of the butchers, or the biscuit man.

Perhaps her twelve are all from upstairs.

:rolleyes:

garinda 08-11-2010 22:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 859924)
Yes, ask her for names, as none I've spoken to are in favour, and say it isn't worth their while opening.

Get her to ask one of the Market Hall's busiest stalls, Len's, and see what they say, or any of the butchers, or the biscuit man.

Perhaps her twelve are all from upstairs.

:rolleyes:


By the way, tell Cllr. Haworth by 'Len's' I mean it's Len's Cooked Meats stall.

Just in case she hasn't heard of it, and might need to ask someone where to find them.

hyndburn 08-11-2010 23:21

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
yes i will be in the market on thursday to have a talk to them.
Also on thursday come to the town hall and have a 2min silence at 11am with myself and irene then have a cup of tea or coffee in the mayor parlor hope to see you all yours malcolmp

shillelagh 09-11-2010 00:08

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
i forgot about this .. on saturday afternoon i was walking through the market hall .. and there was about 20 people all sat down on the chairs at the bottom of the stairs .. and bloke standing there with boards saying .. Lancashires Criminal Past .. now i didnt see any pics of our longstanding accywebbers there :D:D:D.. so carried on walking .. but is this going to be a longstanding thing .. a talk in the market hall ... on a saturday afternoon .

DaveinGermany 09-11-2010 03:26

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Thought the idea of the market hall was trade not trivia ?

Ken Moss 09-11-2010 04:14

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany (Post 859936)
Thought the idea of the market hall was trade not trivia ?

You blind fool! Have you not heard what Cllrs Haworth and Britcliffe are saying about the people of Hyndburn? It's time for us to move into the 21st century, this is clearly the way forward.

With their tremendous wealth of successful business experience behind them I'm sure they have a lot to teach us all, particularly any market trader harbouring under the archaic idea that the borough should continue the ridiculous charade of closing early on Wednesdays.

Who do we think we are?

Barrie Yates 09-11-2010 09:41

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 859892)
Bloody hell! The only thing that's missing is a sign leading upstairs saying "Lesbians and Loonatics only beyond this point".

Hasn't he missed out "Cafe", or does he have the same impressions that I have from there?

Barrie Yates 09-11-2010 09:48

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 859886)
It seems that a reappraisal is in order.

Cllr Haworth was quoted today as having spoken to 12 traders in the Market Hall, all of whom were in favour of Wednesday trading as they had seen their takings double from what they took on Mondays.

If that's true then it seems I must eat my words but for some reason I remain skeptical.

I may have misunderstood this Ken. Are you comparing like for like i.e. Was Monday a normal opening day in the past? All things are relative anyway.
The only real trade that I have seen on the new opening days has been the ground floor cafes.
I fear that if this present situation carries on then the Market is dead once Tesco open and start to push the price war with Asda:mad:

Ken Moss 09-11-2010 11:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates (Post 859981)
I may have misunderstood this Ken. Are you comparing like for like i.e. Was Monday a normal opening day in the past? All things are relative anyway.
The only real trade that I have seen on the new opening days has been the ground floor cafes.
I fear that if this present situation carries on then the Market is dead once Tesco open and start to push the price war with Asda:mad:

To be honest Barrie I'll let you draw your own conclusions, I was merely quoting the Leader of the Council yesterday.

I share your opinion regarding Tesco and they are all widely regarded as instigating the death of the town market, no one is taken in by this.

Neil 09-11-2010 11:53

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Here is a wild question to throw in the pot

Does it matter if the Market Hall does close?
If yes, why does it?

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 11:58

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
It wouldn't matter if Ossy closed.

gynn 09-11-2010 12:13

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil (Post 860001)
Does it matter if the Market Hall does close?
If yes, why does it?

I would say Yes, it matters.

What are the things about shopping in Accrington that make it different from other towns? The Market hall,............er, I can't think of anything else.

Take away the Market Hall and everyone will be doing their shopping in Asda and Tesco. Just like every other town in England.

Or am I being over nostalgic?

Neil 09-11-2010 12:14

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860003)
It wouldn't matter if Ossy closed.

There is no market in Ossy :confused:

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 12:20

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil (Post 860006)
There is no market in Ossy :confused:

I was referring to the town itself.

Ken Moss 09-11-2010 12:25

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil (Post 860001)
Here is a wild question to throw in the pot

Does it matter if the Market Hall does close?
If yes, why does it?

It's a reasonable question. If something is dying then why fight against the odds to keep it alive?

The only snag with that line of thinking is that it was doing perfectly alright without a lot of interference from councillors. What we have here is less euthaniasia and more murder and the culprits will be right in the public eye.

Of course if we hadn't had 13 years of Labour rule.....works every time, doesn't it?

gynn 09-11-2010 12:53

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 860008)
It's a reasonable question. If something is dying then why fight against the odds to keep it alive?

But aren't there enough examples in other towns, such as Bury and Fleetwood, to show that there IS a demand for a properly run market hall?

Ken Moss 09-11-2010 12:55

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn (Post 860013)
But aren't there enough examples in other towns, such as Bury and Fleetwood, to show that there IS a demand for a properly run market hall?

Yes, I think there is.

I'll fight to the last to keep the Market Hall open in Accrington but with the councillors we have in control offering this kind of help I don't think I'm going to get the chance to be of any use to the traders before May at the earliest.

It's a crying shame and a shining example of the massive egos we're up against.

Wynonie Harris 09-11-2010 13:03

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
It's the oldest market hall in Lancashire and it's been providing an excellent service to the town and its environs since 1869...until those on the council decided to start meddling. As Gynn says, it's one of the things that differentiates us from surrounding towns, who demolished their market halls in the mania of 60's redevelopment and must be bitterly regreting it now.

Despite the encroachment of superstores and other modern retailing concepts, there is still a place for the market in the 21st century, as Bury has undoubtedly proved. However, the idea of transforming the market hall into some sort of multi-media events centre is a waste of time - it's where people go to buy things, not listen to glorified buskers, fawn over Z-list celebrities and gawp at somebody's crochet work. :rolleyes:

cashman 09-11-2010 13:15

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
As they have sacked the Oldham M.P. fer lying, can Marlene Haworth being a councilor, be sacked if she is discovered to be doing the same?:cool:

BERNADETTE 09-11-2010 13:32

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil (Post 860001)
Here is a wild question to throw in the pot

Does it matter if the Market Hall does close?
If yes, why does it?

I think it would be a great shame if the Market Hall were to close. Not everybody wants to shop in supermarkets all the time myself included. I know my shopping needs are a lot less than others on here but even whilst raising a family I used to get most of my shopping in and around the market area. As we do every year we will be going to Leeds on the 20th christmas shopping and like Bury, Fleetwood etc their market is thriving. If other towns can get it right why not ours???? So YES it does matter if the Market Hall were to close:(

Gordon Booth 09-11-2010 13:35

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn (Post 860013)
But aren't there enough examples in other towns, such as Bury and Fleetwood, to show that there IS a demand for a properly run market hall?

We had a run to Bury last week on market day.They have just opened a new shopping complex, The Roc and the Millgate centre is still open.BUT-the market and the indoor market were packed! M&S in the Roc-a large food hall, almost empty, not many walking round the Roc at all.
You may not NEED a market but how boring without one, what's left in the town centre? As gynn said, if Bury can PACK a huge market, why can't Accrington?

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 14:06

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
I suspect that many of those visiting Bury are from Manchester and it's environs - Bury, is afterall, just a quick tram ride away. And lets face it - there are quite a few people from Hyndburn who take the short drive down there or just hop on the bus. I think the problem with Accy is it's relative size and it's inability to expand and reach a critical mass were it can be seen as a viable shopping destination.

It could possibly sell itself as a niche market but that usually involves the sale of higher priced goods and offhand I can't think of 'owt in which Accy could specialise in. We certainly don't want to go down the road of having a 7 day a week flea market.

What is undoubtably the case is that the Market Hall itself needed to change. I remember several years ago going in there with a colonial mate of mine and he thought he's entered a time warp; his comment was - do you need a ration book to shop in here? It really was a mixture of 1950's hardboard tat and digusting coffee shops (one employee of which may have heard my friends comment because the liquid I was subsequently served with appeared to contain rat poison).

What is also the case is that the restoration has been only a partial success while the management regime is now an absolute disaster. It really is time for a radical rethink on the market hall and the outside market and what they should be doing and how it should be done.

Benipete 09-11-2010 14:10

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Well it certainly wouldn't matter to me If It closed but then neither would the Library.Civic Hall,Sports Center and every Fast Food Takeaway shop in Accrington.;)

On the other hand they are important to other people so I'll keep my gob shut.:D:D

garinda 09-11-2010 14:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn (Post 860005)
I would say Yes, it matters.

What are the things about shopping in Accrington that make it different from other towns? The Market hall,............er, I can't think of anything else.

Take away the Market Hall and everyone will be doing their shopping in Asda and Tesco. Just like every other town in England.

Or am I being over nostalgic?


I agree.

It's what makes the town different from anywhere else in the country. Towns and cities with the same old boring generic high street stores.

What Accrington has, is a truly stunning building, still fit for the purpose it was built for, well over a hundred years after it was constructed.

Up until the refurbishment it was packed with busy stalls. I'm not blaming anyone, just commenting, that it seems emptier than it was before, for whatever reason.

The wooly sculptures doesn't compensate for that. Again, just my opinion.

People do shop in there. At the moment you could more or less buy everything you need to sustain a family for a week.

If this remains the case, once the massive new Tesco opens, remains to be seen. Though many of the market traders fear it will be the end of their businesses.

Is it important it remains a Market Hall?

Yes.

It makes Accrington different from other towns, it creates jobs, and it provides a place for people to do their shopping who'd prefer their money not to go into the pockets of the supermarket owners.

In the future, towns will become like the old Victorian mill towns, where the only shop was also owned by the mill owner. Who basically had their workers over a barrel, as they had no choice where to spend their wages, other than paying it back to the already wealthy industrialst's shop till.

The country will be carved up by the big boys. Each town having it's own one stop superstore, and Joe public will once again be over a barrel.

Sadly the numpties who've allowed this to happen, will be long gone.

cashman 09-11-2010 15:13

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
some may say nostalgia, i say a Market Hall gives a town center character, which may sadly be lost, if the numpties don't change views.:rolleyes:

Neil 09-11-2010 15:17

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860007)
I was referring to the town itself.

We would like to close our border with Church to keep those wrong 'uns out :p:D

Alan Varrechia 09-11-2010 16:21

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860044)

In the future, towns will become like the old Victorian mill towns, where the only shop was also owned by the mill owner. Who basically had their workers over a barrel, as they had no choice where to spend their wages, other than paying it back to the already wealthy industrialst's shop till.

The country will be carved up by the big boys. Each town having it's own one stop superstore, and Joe public will once again be over a barrel.

Sadly the numpties who've allowed this to happen, will be long gone.

Well said garinda. It sums up capitalism to a tee. :):)

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 16:29

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860044)
In the future, towns will become like the old Victorian mill towns, where the only shop was also owned by the mill owner.

Err....anyone spot the contradiction in Rindy's logic and observation?

garinda 09-11-2010 17:14

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860072)
Err....anyone spot the contradiction in Rindy's logic and observation?

Er...give us a clue, Miss Liza Goddard.

Accrington was never reliant on just one mill owner, or even just one trade, unlike some other places, so that can't be applicable to the logic or observation.

garinda 09-11-2010 17:20

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860036)
I remember several years ago going in there with a colonial mate of mine and he thought he's entered a time warp; his comment was - do you need a ration book to shop in here? It really was a mixture of 1950's hardboard tat and digusting coffee shops (one employee of which may have heard my friends comment because the liquid I was subsequently served with appeared to contain rat poison).

For goodness sake don't ever take your little chum dahn to south London's very busy Tooting Indoor Market.

Thriving it may be, as was Accrington's until fairly recently, but it'll make him think Accrington's grand Victorian Market Hall is positively space age in comparisson.

Your dear friend might have a queer turn.

;)

Barrie Yates 09-11-2010 17:24

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil (Post 860001)
Here is a wild question to throw in the pot

Does it matter if the Market Hall does close?
If yes, why does it?

May we enquire as to where you stand on this?

garinda 09-11-2010 17:26

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates (Post 860089)
May we enquire as to where you stand on this?

Oh I'm sure he'd miss it.

He's always to be seen in there.

Crochet hook in hand.

:D

Barrie Yates 09-11-2010 17:27

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss (Post 859999)
To be honest Barrie I'll let you draw your own conclusions, I was merely quoting the Leader of the Council yesterday.

I share your opinion regarding Tesco and they are all widely regarded as instigating the death of the town market, no one is taken in by this.

Does your response indicate that you did not challenge the statement but merely accepted it.
If that is the case, why did you not challenge the statement?

garinda 09-11-2010 17:31

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates (Post 860093)
Does your response indicate that you did not challenge the statement but merely accepted it.
If that is the case, why did you not challenge the statement?

In his defence, not that he needs it, but I don't think he's online, he only became elected to the council in May, predating the planning approval Tesco was given, by some time.

Neil 09-11-2010 17:35

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates (Post 860089)
May we enquire as to where you stand on this?

Of course you may.

garinda 09-11-2010 17:37

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates (Post 860093)
Does your response indicate that you did not challenge the statement but merely accepted it.
If that is the case, why did you not challenge the statement?

From 2008...

All systems go for new Tesco - Accrington Observer

Although Tesco failed to come up with the correct number of local jobs promised, they did stump up the million quid bung, whoops, the 'one million pound for regenerating Accrington town centre'.

Was this figure, of a million punds, ever increased?

Perhaps one of our councillors could inform us of the amount Tesco donated?

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 17:56

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860087)
Er...give us a clue, Miss Liza Goddard.

Accrington was never reliant on just one mill owner, or even just one trade, unlike some other places, so that can't be applicable to the logic or observation.

Oh Dear...now you are getting confused.

Your original reference was to that of the 'Truck' system, where factory owners paid their employees in tokens that could only be spent in the the factory shop. The first act partially outlawing this in 1725, followed by the major one in 1831 - that was under the reign of William IV. There were two subsequent acts in the 1880/90's but they were only clearing up odd bits.

So when Victoria began her reign in 1837 there was little left of trucking; growing cotton towns - and other industrial towns throughout the UK - began to develop their market centres. Accy market hall and it's immeadiate market area is a classic example of this; lots of competing stall holders . Practically every other town in England was the same.

I quote from you..'in the future, towns will become like the old Victorian mill towns, where the only shop was also owned by the mill owner. Who basically had their workers over a barrel, as they had no choice where to spend their wages, other than paying it back to the already wealthy industrialst's shop till'

No doubt some mill owners will have owned shops in Accy and places like it but by Victoria's reign most people were paid in hard earned cash and were free to spend it as they wished - and that is why Accy town centre developed as it did.

Garinda, you either need to take a chill pill or alternatively join the thread on floating lead coffins; whatever, please leave the history stuff to the experts.






garinda 09-11-2010 18:20

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Towns like Saltaire, Meltham, Bournville, Poundsbury, Port Sunlight, Copely, Akroydon and Creswell, etc., etc., all flourished at the height of the industrial revolution, under the reign of Victoria.

The workers were employed by the sole factory, paid rent to live in the houses owned by that one company, and shoped in the stores owned by that factory/mill owner.

The result being, there was really very little choice of option.

Anyway, Mr. Picky, we digress.

Soon this country will be carved up, and each area will have it's own superstore.

Result?

No competition, and therefore no choice, and because there is no one else, no real value for money.

Like it or not, most businesses in Accrington fear that by having a town centre superstore, such as Tesco, that it will adversely affect their trade, and could see them cease trading altogether.

There is only so much money to go around.

Superstores are fine, if they are out of town, and if people have so little time that they like doing all their shopping in one place, and all their money into the pockets of just one owner.

garinda 09-11-2010 18:28

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860106)
Garinda, you either need to take a chill pill or alternatively join the thread on floating lead coffins; whatever, please leave the history stuff to the experts.

Being so much younger than yourself, and you having kept company of many an old queen, perhaps even the great Queen Empress Victoria, herself. I feel suitably humbled by your greather historical knowledge.

Good luck in the Accy Web quiz.

God willing, with the right wind behind you, may you one day be lucky enough to win it.

;)

:D

garinda 09-11-2010 18:38

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860106)
chill pill

'Chill pill'?

Who taught you that phrase, Plato, in his Academy?

:rolleyes:

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 18:39

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860117)
Towns like Saltaire, Meltham, Bournville, Poundsbury, Port Sunlight, Copely, Akroydon and Creswell, etc., etc., all flourished at the height of the industrial revolution, under the reign of Victoria.

The workers were employed by the sole factory, paid rent to live in the houses owned by that one company, and shoped in the stores owned by that factory/mill owner.

.

Yep..the likes of Titus Salt and the Quakers certainly looked after their workers. Subsidised superior housing, free education for the kids, healthcare...but no pubs. Still, they were paid in cash and they had the option as to spend their money in the company shops or not. And of course, they were an exception - no wonder there was a waiting list to join them.

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 18:43

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860119)
Being so much younger than yourself, and you having kept company of many an old queen, perhaps even the great Queen Empress Victoria, herself. I feel suitably humbled by your greather historical knowledge.

Good luck in the Accy Web quiz.

God willing, with the right wind behind you, may you one day be lucky enough to win it.

;)

:D

Yeah..I certainly need it in the quiz. Maybe I should get a new mouse to speed up my reaction time in answering questions or maybe I should spend a few hours a day watching Corrie and similar rubbish and listening to earache in order to try and get half the questions right.

Gordon Booth 09-11-2010 19:09

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860106)
Garinda, you either need to take a chill pill or alternatively join the thread on floating lead coffins

Tealeaf, I hope you're not suggesting the 'floating lead coffins' thread is inhabited by some lunatic fringe? Unkind! Maybe true, but unkind.

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 19:19

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth (Post 860138)
Tealeaf, I hope you're not suggesting the 'floating lead coffins' thread is inhabited by some lunatic fringe? Unkind!

Certainly not, Gordon. But Garinda is a difficult man to put down. He's a bit like one of these characters in an Xbox computer game - you know the one I mean - the Cannibal Zombies. However much you blow them away and think they've gone for good then suddenly up they pop and wallop! They're trying to take a bite out yer leg. That's why I thought it would be better for him to go elsewhere just for a bit and see how he goes on with a few mathematical conindrums, instead of trying to talk about history - of which he knows nowt.

Alan Varrechia 09-11-2010 19:25

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
If you’ve never had the pleasure of reading “The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists” by Robert Tressell, here’s a succinct excerpt that explained more to me about how the world works than school ever did.
http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...k.html&h=fe5b9

Think you will find this explains what garinda is saying.:)

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 19:32

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
I've just read it; can't see 'owt about Accy Market Hall. Is it in another chapter; if so, what page?

Alan Varrechia 09-11-2010 19:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Maybe the point flew straight over your head.

Gordon Booth 09-11-2010 19:57

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860142)
That's why I thought it would be better for him to go elsewhere just for a bit and see how he goes on with a few mathematical conindrums, instead of trying to talk about history - of which he knows nowt.

So you try and divert him onto my pet thread? But I suspect he knows nothing about maths either! Crocheting-yes but maths?

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 19:58

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Then again, maybe it didn't....but I'm perplexed. What has pseudo-scientific, neo-Marxist claptrap got to do with the splendour of Accy's Victorian Hall, its history and its future?

garinda 09-11-2010 20:11

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860127)
Yep..the likes of Titus Salt and the Quakers certainly looked after their workers. Subsidised superior housing, free education for the kids, healthcare...but no pubs. Still, they were paid in cash and they had the option as to spend their money in the company shops or not. And of course, they were an exception - no wonder there was a waiting list to join them.

Again, digressing.

The workers in the places I named were paid in cash, and therefore did have some option of choice, as to where to spend that money.

Though in reality, if you lived in Saltaire, working six days a week, you could always journey into Bradford to do your shoping, on your solitary day off.

There wouldn't have been many places to spend that money. The Sabbath being a day when trading was forbidden.

They say history always repeats itself.

With the opening of the massive new Tesco store, it probablty will.

;)

No councillors willing to share yet, just how much Tesco donated to council coffers?

:rolleyes:

How about how much the new road works and roundabout's cost? I know that falls under L.C.C., but any ideas?

Can't be much change out of a million quid, considering the tiddly little roundabout on Haslingden Old Road cost £800,00.00.

:rolleyes:

garinda 09-11-2010 20:16

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth (Post 860151)
So you try and divert him onto my pet thread? But I suspect he knows nothing about maths either! Crocheting-yes but maths?


I know one nutter, plus another nutter, equals two fools having a party.

;)

Many strings to my bow.

A blessing; Being bestowed with so many gifts.

Now toodle off back to plumbing the depths, in your Look and Learn of 1964 thread, this one's about the refurbishment of the Market Hall.

;)

Less 09-11-2010 20:24

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860154)
£800,00.00.

:rolleyes:

Decimal Point/comma misplacement/missing/extra zero warning!

If this had been Star Trek bulbs would have been exploding everywhere, How come even in the future Americans never fit fuses to anything?
:)

garinda 09-11-2010 20:25

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth (Post 860151)
So you try and divert him onto my pet thread? But I suspect he knows nothing about maths either! Crocheting-yes but maths?

Underestimation equals one of many, whose card is now marked.

Too many cards to count.

Not having the time myself to waste on something so straightforward as mathematics. Boringly simple formulas, that an even simpler machine can do, or even a monkey.

I'll leave that to you, Chee-Chee.

;)

Alan Varrechia 09-11-2010 20:26

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quite possibly soon to be empty market, an ex market where people used to shop till the traders were driven away.
Maybe a certain councillor has it earmarked for a place to display his medal and plaque collection.
I think rindys point was the market was a metaphor for the downtrodden masses and tesco is the upper class mill, shop, house,everything you need to survive provider.
Thats what i thought anyway.


I could always take Jays view and just blame the last 13 years of labour rule.
:hidewall::hidewall::hidewall::)

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 20:27

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860154)
Again, digressing.

The workers in the places I named were paid in cash, and therefore did have some option of choice, as to where to spend that money.

:rolleyes:

You are the one who digressed and brought up this nonsense about the truck system. I've stuck to my guns all the time about the Victorian market hall and right from when I first joined this website in 2003 I have continuously opposed the public laterine called ASDA and I shall continue to do so about Tesco.

cashman 09-11-2010 20:33

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860162)
You are the one who digressed and brought up this nonsense about the truck system. I've stuck to my guns all the time about the Victorian market hall and right from when I first joined this website in 2003 I have continuously opposed the public laterine called ASDA and I shall continue to do so about Tesco.

Whilst opposing what ya rightfully call the public latrine, ive seen ya yon.:D:D:D:D:D

garinda 09-11-2010 20:34

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Less (Post 860158)
Decimal Point/comma misplacement/missing/extra zero warning!

If this had been Star Trek bulbs would have been exploding everywhere, How come even in the future Americans never fit fuses to anything?
:)

:rofl38::rofl38::rofl38:

Happily for you I'm not the leader of the council!

My mistake doesn't change millions into thousands though, it's just gibberish.

Suprisingly it still reads illustratively, and conveys my point as to costs.

It also serves as a reminder of not posting on Accy Web, whilst also attempting to scramble an egg.

:D

garinda 09-11-2010 20:40

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860162)
You are the one who digressed and brought up this nonsense about the truck system. I've stuck to my guns all the time about the Victorian market hall and right from when I first joined this website in 2003 I have continuously opposed the public laterine called ASDA and I shall continue to do so about Tesco.

Asda, and Tesco will slug it out.

With Tesco's wonga in the council's coffers, Tesco will emerge as victor.

The losers will be the townsfolk of Accrington, who then have little choice as to where to shop.

Short-sightedness is common to many politicans.

The nature of having elections every few years, mean they very rarely look at the long term effects of their policy decisions.

Especially when they can get their hands on a 'donation', in the here and now.

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 20:41

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman (Post 860164)
Whilst opposing what ya rightfully call the public latrine, ive seen ya yon.:D:D:D:D:D

Aye..to use the nearest cash machine to Church, if I recall. I may have piked up a bottle of milk while I was there, though.

garinda 09-11-2010 20:44

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman (Post 860164)
Whilst opposing what ya rightfully call the public latrine, ive seen ya yon.:D:D:D:D:D

A Tealeaf in Asda?

Surely not.

:rofl38:

I have been in.

Twice in six years, and bought nowt, each time.

:D

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 20:49

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860166)
Asda, and Tesco will slug it out.

With Tesco's wonga in the council's coffers, Tesco will emerge as victor.

The losers will be the townsfolk of Accrington, who then have little choice as to where to shop.

Short-sightedness is common to many politicans.

The nature of having elections every few years, mean they very rarely look at the long term effects of their policy decisions.

Especially when they can get their hands on a 'donation', in the here and now.


There's no doubt Tesco do bribes; forgetting the brown envelope stuff, I think I put a posting a few months ago on the Stanley section about Tesco's football summer schools in Lancashire in 2010; 4 of 'em in total, all located in areas where Tesco had previously got planning permission for store developments. One of 'em, of course, was the Sports Centre in Church.

garinda 09-11-2010 21:02

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860171)
There's no doubt Tesco do bribes; forgetting the brown envelope stuff, I think I put a posting a few months ago on the Stanley section about Tesco's football summer schools in Lancashire in 2010; 4 of 'em in total, all located in areas where Tesco had previously got planning permission for store developments. One of 'em, of course, was the Sports Centre in Church.

As I said.

It's easier to see as far as the next election, rather than thinking about the long term future.

gynn 09-11-2010 21:03

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860171)
There's no doubt Tesco do bribes; forgetting the brown envelope stuff, I think I put a posting a few months ago on the Stanley section about Tesco's football summer schools in Lancashire in 2010; 4 of 'em in total, all located in areas where Tesco had previously got planning permission for store developments. One of 'em, of course, was the Sports Centre in Church.

That doesn't wash, Tealeaf. If I was a member of the Planning Committee open to bribery and corruption, I think my price would be higher than the prospect of some future summer soccer school!

Could it be that Tesco selected the sites for their soccer schools in areas where they were about to develop new stores, as a Google Page Ranking Exercise to get themselves popular with future customers?

garinda 09-11-2010 21:06

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn (Post 860181)
That doesn't wash, Tealeaf. If I was a member of the Planning Committee open to bribery and corruption, I think my price would be higher than the prospect of some future summer soccer school!

Could it be that Tesco selected the sites for their soccer schools in areas where they were about to develop new stores, as a means of getting themselves poplular with future customers?

I'll ask again.

Accy Webbers who are also councillors, just how much did Tesco donate to the coffer's for regenerating the town centre, as part of their planning application offer?

Was it just the one million pounds?

:rolleyes:

garinda 09-11-2010 21:23

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf (Post 860142)
history - of which he knows nowt.

I know your history.

Ergo.

I know you're history.

You are the Missing Link.

Goodbye.

:ello:

Tealeaf 09-11-2010 21:41

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn (Post 860181)
That doesn't wash, Tealeaf. If I was a member of the Planning Committee open to bribery and corruption, I think my price would be higher than the prospect of some future summer soccer school!

Could it be that Tesco selected the sites for their soccer schools in areas where they were about to develop new stores, as a Google Page Ranking Exercise to get themselves popular with future customers?

I didn't say that was the only bribe, did I? Stop and think...if you were a major corporation looking at a controversial development which was likely to face major oppostion, what would you do? Think of Sun Tzu, think of Machiavelli....put a little deception plan in place. Offer something like a footy school..many can see that is a bribe, so the opposition concentrates on that. But because it's not big enough to be a substancial bribe then the assumption is made by a mayority then they may have good intentions after all. But the real stuff is going on behind the scenes - and that's were the brown envelopes are passed.

Ken Moss 10-11-2010 06:46

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates (Post 860093)
Does your response indicate that you did not challenge the statement but merely accepted it.
If that is the case, why did you not challenge the statement?

The way council meetings work is a rather rigid format that doesn't allow the freedom of speech you might expect, particularly during 'Correspondence' which is an opportunity for The Leader of the Council to tell us how well he's doing without interruption.

Apart from that, a newspaper article is a far more public way of challenging the statement....

cashman 10-11-2010 13:26

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Have just been in market hall n visited 3 stalls, asked em all what do ya think about this weds opening? none were complimentary, the best thing to a positive comment were one said, its a real pain in the arse, after 2-00 i won't get any customers at all, but i have to stay open until 4-30, its a poor do when yer can't decide how yer own business operates, but yer can't win wi the council.:( so marlene haworth musta spoke to 12 of the others, or did she?:rolleyes:

Tealeaf 10-11-2010 13:29

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
She probably rigged the question and the votes. She should be on X factor.

Margaret Pilkington 10-11-2010 14:05

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
come on now...politicians(national or local) have been known to use poetic license......or as I would say...fiblets.
I don't believe what MH says, after all it is in her interests for the Market hall to be seen to be increasing Wednesday trade...she has a vested interest, as she is the cabinet minister(what a ridiculous title) for the place.

cashman 10-11-2010 14:08

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington (Post 860381)
come on now...politicians(national or local) have been known to use poetic license......or as I would say...fiblets.
I don't believe what MH says, after all it is in her interests for the Market hall to be seen to be increasing Wednesday trade...she has a vested interest, as she is the cabinet minister(what a ridiculous title) for the place.

as i asked before, can she be sacked if its lies? or are cabinet ministers exempt, unlike ordinary M.P.s.:D;)

gynn 10-11-2010 14:11

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Three have put their head above the parapet in the Telegraph

"A number of traders backed the comments.

Steve Hayman, of Slacks Butchers said, “Wednesday trade is definitely picking up and the trade is building nicely.”

Lynn Hind of Matthews Cards and Hardware said: “We are glad we are giving it a try as we have been busy”.

Andrew Lund of the Sweet Stall said: “We were in favour of the trial and we are finding trading decent, so far so good.”"

cashman 10-11-2010 15:07

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gynn (Post 860384)
Three have put their head above the parapet in the Telegraph

"A number of traders backed the comments.

Steve Hayman, of Slacks Butchers said, “Wednesday trade is definitely picking up and the trade is building nicely.”

Lynn Hind of Matthews Cards and Hardware said: “We are glad we are giving it a try as we have been busy”.

Andrew Lund of the Sweet Stall said: “We were in favour of the trial and we are finding trading decent, so far so good.”"

would hope thats the case, also would hope they aint related or friendly wi certain councilors. i was in fer approx 30 mins at dinner time n never saw 1 customer at slacks, cos i use em sometimes, but as there were no chickens on display i gave em a miss today.

jaysay 10-11-2010 18:07

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
I have made very little comment on the Market Hall refurbishment because I hadn't seen it, but I have now, its a hell of a site better than it was the last time I went in and was quite busy really, but still think it should be up to the traders to say whether they want to open, on Wednesday, end of story

heth 10-11-2010 19:06

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Me and my Mum refuse to go in on a Wednesday as we feel that the traders should be able to decide not the councillors. Do they work 6 days a week and only have Sunday off is the question?? ;)

Neil 10-11-2010 19:43

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heth (Post 860441)
Me and my Mum refuse to go in on a Wednesday as we feel that the traders should be able to decide not the councillors. Do they work 6 days a week and only have Sunday off is the question?? ;)

Some work Sundays as well, the good ones that is

heth 10-11-2010 19:51

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Not many then...............heeheehee!!! :D
Still wont go in on a Wednesday though, many people wont Wednesday is prob thier washing and cleaning day!!! ;)

garinda 11-11-2010 07:16

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heth (Post 860457)
Not many then...............heeheehee!!! :D
Still wont go in on a Wednesday though, many people wont Wednesday is prob thier washing and cleaning day!!! ;)


Wednesday's should be kept special.

Sacred day, of the god Woden.

Woden's day should be a day of rest, and worship.

:D

heth 11-11-2010 20:53

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda (Post 860528)
Wednesday's should be kept special.

Sacred day, of the god Woden.

Woden's day should be a day of rest, and worship.

:D


I have to say that I had to google that to see what it meant!!!! :rofl38:

Also dont forget that Jeremy Kyle is on in the morning................:p

Less 11-11-2010 21:32

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by heth (Post 860744)
I have to say that I had to google that to see what it meant!!!! :rofl38:

Also dont forget that Jeremy Kyle is on in the morning................:p

I was very impressed that you can Google, (I've spent years trying to teach Jaysay), but THEN, you go and ruin it, by proving yourself to be a member of the masses,
Jeremy Kyle?

Who is he,?

garinda 11-11-2010 21:36

Re: Market Hall Refurbishment
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Less (Post 860765)
Jeremy Kyle?

Who is he,?

He's the man who's being fingered as the next Prime Minister of the United Kingdom.


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