Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I also read in one of the papers yesterday that there was rioting in Poland over the Warning the Eu has doled out about their constitution...and the way the judicial system works.
They are also infuriated about being told to take more of the refugees/migrants

I can't find the article that i read yesterday, but this link gives the gist of it.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-court-changes.

It really is time that the EU sat up and took notice of the unrest among its' members.

Italy is threatening to give thousands of incomers temporary visas which would mean that these men(they are mostly men) would have the right to travel freely in the Schengen Zone.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

So, maybe we should have a new referendum?

One that includes all the members of the E.U. that are upset with how the main powers ignore their problems, such as legal/illegal immigration, not being allowed to act in ones own interest (unless you are a French or German official), well, you know, the sort of stuff most sane folk have discussed on here over the past 5 years.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Not we- The rest of the E.U. were out the damn thing by vote.;)

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Most things you say make immediate sense, the above I just don't understand????

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

We have no need at all for one in my view out and stopping out as far as i'm concerned, the rest can make their own minds up about a corrupt, bullying organization,

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Well, there is one article in that newspaper that suggests we will soon be having another referendum...I think his name is Bogdanor.
I will look for a link.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...lock-life-raft

There you go!

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

So, from the link do we take it that if brexit is going to be difficult we should meekly look for a reason to stay?

Perhaps have another referendum, capitulate, give in, allow others to walk all over us?

Ye Gods! my Father must be spinning faster than a formula 1's turbo, he and others didn't bring us up to give in just because life get's a little difficult, NOW, is the time for us all to get behind the facts, the vote is in, we are out and let's all make sure that we are allowed by our democratic decision to leave when we decide to leave, If Europe wants to go it alone, without our guidance, why should we have any regrets?

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

C'mon, Margaret!
The Grauniad?
That's just the print version of the Brussels Broadcasting Corporation.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Yes and I know.
It is not something I actually read regularly, but when looking for the link about the EU meddling in Polands affairs...I spotted that gem.(I could not locate the link to the original story i had read in some other paper...I read a very wide variety of online news articles)
I have to say nothing causes my Hackles to rise faster than articles in this apology for a newspaper.
I read articles with my teeth gritted and steam coming out of my ears(not a pretty sight)

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

As it's a Sunday most of my day is spent perusing the tabloids & broadsheets, at some point today I read an article about UK putting forward a sum of £36 Bn to advance "Divorce talks", yet x hours later Brexiteer John Redwood is pretty much saying it' a load of owd cobblers! Personally I'm in agreement with the lad, for my thinking the eu should be paying us especially since we've pretty much funded quite a large chunk to this dictatorial, cronyist corrupt organisation.

Brexit news - 'Completely ridiculous' Tory MP shreds £36bn divorce bill | UK | News | Express.co.uk

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Couldn't agree more, unfortunately, because it is a dictatorial, cronyist corrupt organisation, it is only natural that they would expect us to bankrupt ourselves trying to get away from them.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

as one large US Brewer stated "True"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5v3uCSDiIwE


And if the eu had been anything like this young lady I'm pretty sure we'd not be talking divorce settlements right now! Yeah, yeah I know, I'm pretty shallow really. :D

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Let's not pay them a sous, a red cent, a penny.
What are they going to do about it....Chuck us out?
Well good...it will save all the argy bargy going on right now.
This figure of 36 billion is supposed to be what we would pay over a four year period.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Theresa May should come onto the TV and make a statement, and tell us exactly what is going on. All these rumours have to stop. Hammond and Gove are causing the most problems, not forgetting Labour, Lib Dems, The menacing SNP, and the one Green.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Brexit news - Gina Miller lashes Brexit 'lies' and backs 'punishment' for MP's | UK | News | Express.co.uk

Another of the bitter remoaners...wanting those she feels misrepresented Brexit to be punished.
The ones who should really be punished are the lot that sold us down the river by telling the electorate it was 'a trading arrangement'. No such thing.
It has taken the politicians four decades to listen to the will of the people.

Does Gina Miller think that we swallowed whole, the pap that was fed to us prior to the vote.
These were politicians we are talking about. Their stock in trade is obfuscation, outright lies and on a good day half truths
I think those who actually went and voted were just glad to have the opportunity to do so...and yes, of course the sensible amongst us knew that it was never going to easy.
But, is it right NOT to try something because it might be a bit tough?
Not in my book it isn't.
When you look at the way that the mandarins in the EU have talked/treated us since the vote...you would have to have spit for brains to want to stay.

The sooner we ditch this self serving,corrupt, undemocratic organisation the better.
I have a bottle of vintage Dom Perignon(it was gifted to me) that will be used to toast our exit...if and when that day comes.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Not a problem with the suggestion, just as long as it covers all politicoes whichever side of the fence they were, I seem to recall the cleglet & tim terribly dim denying the eu wanted its own military, or further unified integration for a start, that should give the despicable witch something to chew over.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Yes, and at the end of the article this woman does make the point that lies were told by both sides....but she notes that 'fear' was used as a lever to get votes...well, correct me if I am wrong but it seemed to me those who wanted to remain were the ones who were spreading doom and an Armageddon scenario if we ditched the EU.
That was HER side.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Gina Miller is nowt but an arrogant self serving bitch simple as.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

The sooner we ditch this self serving,corrupt, undemocratic organisation the better.
I have a bottle of vintage Dom Perignon(it was gifted to me) that will be used to toast our exit...if and when that day comes.[/QUOTE]

hope you will be able to drink your bottle margaret but i,ve always had this fear that i,ll believe we,ve left when it actually happens. don,t trust politicians even those who say they want out to deliver us who can,t wait to get out our wishes. think another reforendum will come up after all the talks have finalised and the remoaners will get their way with the extra votes the brain washed younger generation will use.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

The only way we will have to have another Referendum is if the opposition parties in the House of Commons put every obstacle in the way to scupper a deal.
This was a Democratic vote to come out of the EU, It's about time these MP's do as we have asked them to do. After all, we, the tax payers pay there inflated salaries

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

So Do I.

I have just been reading that old Vince Cable has been running off at the mouth about us oldies 'shafting' the young of this country by our vote to leave the EU.
I think he has got it very wrong...we have shafted nobody.
Those younger folk had a vote to use..if they did not use it for whatever reason, then shame on them and they have to live with the consequences.
I really think it was MY generation that was shafted....by those lying politicians who told the folk of this country that the Common Market(as it was then) was just a trading organisation....and all those who came after and COULD have asked the population what they thought, but didn't because it was a very lucrative gravy train to jump onto when a political career was over.

Those remoaners are the ones who will be least affected by the changes that free movement gives(well apart from low paid cleaners, au pairs and nannies for their children).
As things stand we do not know WHO is here so we have little chance of getting them to go home even if that was on the cards(which it isn't).
I wish they would just get on with it...shut the door, tell them they can whistle for their divorce settlement and let's set sail for a future where we can sterr our own course.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

when have politicians actually do what those who elected them want from a local issue to brexit. before the reforendum most MP,s of all parties wanted us to stay in. just another job for failed politicians like the kinnock,s to carry on their trade. the public gave them a thumbs down to the EU. it wasn,t a massive thumbs down but it was one. the problem will be the opposition parties may band together with the stay in tory brigade to scupper a deal. for a politician to vote for brexit was like a turkey voting for christmas.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Not only our own lily livered politicians are getting in the way of what the electorate asked for, but also the Brussels bureaucrats are also throwing up obstacles and then claiming we are being belligerent and uncompromising. Much of it has to do with the civil servants on that side of the channel and those over here too...they don't want to lose lucrative salaries.
The in-fighting in the political parties makes Brussels think that the will is not there to see this through.

I would rather have no deal than a rough deal.

I do not want to be in the position of Norway...being neither in nor out and yet paying for the privilege(what privilege would that be then?) and no voting rights...not that being able to vote on issues has done us any favours, we haven't won a vote yet.
They need our trade far more than we need to trade with the EU.
Only something like 37% of goods and services are sold to the Eu and the Eu prevents us from effectively trading with other countries which are not in this dysfunctional 'club'

The EU is Squit scared that we will leave a gaping hole in their coffers and that Germany and France will be landed with picking up the costs.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

margaret, you know what you wrote makes sense, i know it does but why don,t the politicians of all parties know. for me its a matter of what,s in it for a lot of them now or in the future. democracy, they must be joking.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I really don't know Monkey Hanger.
I rather believe that the politicians think they are better than us...that they can do pretty much as they please when they have got your vote...that it doesn't matter if we don't like what they do they are secure in their position for at least five years and theirs is a very well paid occupation.
Yes, I think money and power matter to them more than doing right by their constituents.
It is 'What can I get out of this job...rather than what can I do to make lives better for those who gave me their vote. I think that may of them see us as ill educated mugs and morons.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Margaret, I'm sure, like me, you realise that the days are gone when someone made their fortune in whatever business, normally by the time they were 50-ish, then decided to put something back into the community by standing for election as the local MP.

These guys were so well respected, and went on to successfully look after their constituency, mostly until they passed away!
Compare that with these so-called career politicians, who seem to enter Parliament at ever so younger ages, (eg, the 21yr old SNP who quit after two years)!

It is now obvious, from recent history, that the likes of Mr A B Liar, & Cameroon, just do not have the 'life' experience to govern this great country of ours.

Unfortunately, like you, Cashman, and many others on here, we are no longer in a position to stand for election.... if we were all 20 years younger, we could form a considerable alliance & defeat all those that would do our country down!

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I would imagine almost anyone of the posters on this site if, they put themselves up be elected to govern this land of ours would have more common sense and work harder for a land of the free than any example we have seen over the last 5 years.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Shame I can't give you a double 'like', Less!

If we all pretended to be in our late forties/early fifties, d'you think we could get anywhere?

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Perhaps we need to change the law on M.P.'s pay?

Yes, I do think they should get a decent living wage, no, I don't think they should make anything from directorships or other such 'gifts'.

They should have one job, make sure the rest of us have the very best representation.

Oh I know, it'll never happen we vote in ambitious folk that really, really are only interested in themselves.

I'd love an M.P. to come on site and prove me wrong...


If they ever do, it would be wonderful.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

C'mon, Less, I think you are a bit old to believe in the tooth fairy & santa claus!!

Not to mention our esteemed MP, who's name escapes me!!

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Yes...you are right.
Career politicians are in it for only one thing...themselves.
I am not sure I would ever go into politics because I find it difficult to promote something I do not believe in...I can not pay lip service to something.
I say what I see...regardless of political correctness.
I don't see how truth should be governed by political correctness.

I have served my local community in doing a job that I loved.
I almost (I DID say 'almost')felt a fraud for taking a wage because I enjoyed it so much...even when it was hard, smelly and dirty work.

Maybe what is wrong with us...is that we know the difference between a good representative and a poor one.
We have seen those men who pulled their tripes out for the local community.
Then we get someone who is more interested in supporting the party line than looking after the interests of Accrington.
Maybe our expectations are too high.

What I really don't get is...if someone like me, with a secondary school education can see flaws in how things are panning out, why is it that these educated fellows(those who have been to Uni and taken degrees) can't see what I can see.
The only conclusion I am forced to draw is...it is not in their interests to see what I see.
They are, like Nelson, putting the telescope to the blind eye.
This is for their own reasons...power, kudos and money.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

if we got rid of the whip business and gave them a bit more say then it could be better for all concerned and certainly give the MP a bit more status. all this sheep herding on votes wether you agree or not really gets my goat.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Here is a few paragraph's from an article printed today in the Newcastle Chronicle
by Jonathan Walker

BRITAIN WOULD HAVE VOTED TO REMAIN HAD IT BEEN BETTER EDUCATED,
ACADEMICS CLAIM

New research suggests the nation would have voted against Brexit if more of us had gone to university

The UK could have voted against Brexit if voters had been better educated,
academics have said

A new paper suggests that a university education was the 'predominant factor' dividing
those who voted Remain and those who voted Leave

It even made more difference than age or income, according to the document

And if just 3% more people had gone to university then the results of last year's EU referendum, when the UK voted to quit the EU, could have been different.


The findings were published by academics from the university of Leicester

They produced data showing the cities such as Sunderland have a low proportion of
people who have been through higher education and voted to leave the EU - while areas
such as Lambeth and camden in London have a high proportion of graduates and voted to remain

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

The Academics can kiss my arse.:rolleyes: cos they are full of its contents,

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I am always, always sceptical of research.
I need to know who commissioned and paid for it(research is never cheap)
I want to know what backgrounds the commissioner had.
I want to know what criteria was used to determine who respondents would be.
I need to know what the questions were...how they were couched(we all know that some questions can be loaded to lead the respondent)
I want to know what commissioners wanted to prove.
I want to how many people were in the samples and what the 'control' was.
There is very little truly independent research.

I agree with Cashy on this one...though I would really rather they didn't kiss my butt...I might catch something.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Here is another one of those Remoaners stories.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/stop-eu-ex...-business.html

Each time one of these articles is printed, those mandarins in the EU must rub their hands with glee.
I would not put it past them to be paying these disillusioned folk to spout these views to unsettle those who voted out.

Article 50 has been activated...it is time for all the politicians to realise this, roll their sleeves up and fulfil the democratic will of the people.
These negative reports are unhelpful and divisive.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

We've had this before, the ill-educated voted brexit, and if it's true, we are ill-educated because Our politicians had and still do ignore the education of the masses, we have been promised smaller classes and more qualified teachers since before I was born.

What happens? M.P.'s and bankers make mistakes and what is one of the first things they cut back on? edification, edukation, edukatshun!

Don't blame the people, don't call the people, get the people on your side M.P.'s by actually giving what you promise before we put an X on the ballot paper.
:mad:

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I really think that the elite(or those who THINK themselves elite) do not want the masses to be educated.
Educated people are much harder to control and subdue because they are capable of analytical/critical thought.
Gullible people believe the promises of these lying politicians.
Look at Jeremy Corbyn...he 'bought' the votes of students by telling them that they could have free tuition and historical student debt cancelled.
Now if these students had asked themselves where he was going to get the money to fund this, they might have considered their options a little differently.

So, maybe experience of life trumps a university education after all!

My education was achieved in the University of life...the one of hard knocks.
I made myself responsible for my continued learning...and I am still taking classes.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

What has university got to with intelligence?
Every half-arsed collection of portacabins calls itself a University and any gormless eejit can get into one these days as long as they bring along their tuition fees.
University Academics are just another self-serving set of twerps living off benefits.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Aye but they can vote twice.;)

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

It teaches folk to be devious, that their needs or desires are paramount...that you have to do what you have to do regardless of how it may impact on others.
Other than that, being a graduate does not signify intelligence.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Universitys don't educate, it's where the easily lead are subjugated with leftist pathetic attitudes, half the courses are worthless anyway & it's the domain for the lazy generally!

Education my arse!

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

[QUOTE=DaveinGermany;1199159, half the courses are worthless anyway & it's the domain for the lazy generally!

Education my arse![/QUOTE]

its back to my mate blair again dave. increased university places and wanted even more to go. more to do with lowering youth unemployment at the time than giving a worthwhile further education. back in what they called the bad old days of grammar schools only the top few in the A stream went to what the call now uni and the rest of us actually got a job, worked and studied for proffesional qualification via night school or correspondance courses. so going to university means us thick buggers who actually got O levels when they ment something no sod all. its them that no sod all.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Being a private school/Oxford educated son of a law LECTURER, Bliar's primary aim in massively expanding tertiary education was to keep left-wing academics in jobs.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I really do hope this does happen, Hammond is a spineless europhile & should never have been let anywhere near Brexit negotiations, Krud .... the less said about her the better & as for the self serving witch Sourby bumping her gums about leaving if it doesn't go her way, for me the sooner the better, in fact to burst her smugness bubble DisMay should kick her out in ignominy rather than have her resign!

Bring in the Moggie & give the Nige an advisory position on the Brexit team, after all he's got an inside line on the eu cesspool dwellers & their antics.

Theresa May told to boot out Remainers and create pro-Brexit cabinet | UK | News | Express.co.uk

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

So who does actually run europe? Once more Mutti speaks & europe gets condemned! For all you idiot remainers, this is what you'll be getting if you insist on staying in the eu, unlimited enforced 3rd world encroachment, authorised from the new Reichs chancellery & Führerbunker.

Merkel: ?EU Can Take 40,000 More Migrants?

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

What are the chances she plans to dump them all here before we can finalise Brexit?

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Please, save us that

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Son...I think that is what you call a 'rhetorical question'.

At least they are calling them what they are...MIGRANTS...not refugees.

I think the EU model of having the whole continent and probably the world 'coffee coloured' with no national specific identity is a realistic possibility...though please Lord...not in my lifetime!
They are mostly young men who come...so it natural that they will want to mate....and the resultant children will be mixed race.
They really do seem to want to wipe out the white European as a race.

This will fulfil the Coudenhove- Kalergi vision of a submissive population...drones to work, with no real nationality.
This is a form of ethnic cleansing...social engineering of the worst order

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

And it scares me as much as the possibility of nuclear war.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I acquiesce unreservedly, not only that, but this insistence that the european nations be deluged by floods of unwanted, uneducated & unemployable 3rd world enrichers, defies all logic, common sense & understanding. Furthermore it goes completely against the un's very own charter 61/295 "Declaration on the rights of the indigenous peoples"

Why are the politicoes, msm & information services not highlighting this blatant discrepancy & total disregard of an agreed upon ruling?

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

becuse it is part of a little known subversive plan.
If you asked anyone in the street about the Coudenhove Kalergi plan...how many folk do you think would have heard of it?
You could go on any university campus and ask these so called educated folk and I bet you would be digging in a dry gulch.

It would not do for the public to know the plans of those who want to pull the strings of the world...those who want to engineer socoety to their own ends...goodness me...NO, you don't want the pigs getting wind of the abbatoir. It could lead to an uprising(let's hope)
That it goes against the UN charter means very little as little is known about the plan.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

you call it gumption, but that is just another word for brains..intelligence...call it what you will...it is all the same.
My experience has taught me that my quote is pretty damn near the mark.
If brains were dynamite most folk wouldn't have enough to blow the wax out of their ears.
If brains were elastic, most folk wouldn't have enough to make a frogs jockstrap.
I have many more.but I won't tire you with them :)

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Read in the newspapers recently, that Theresa May is going to make an apology at the Conservative party conference for the result of the general election, she had the final decision, but she was advised by other members of the Cabinet to have this election, so no apology is needed. only in my opinion.

The person who should be making an apology to the British people is Jeremy Corbyn, for Labour's so called, pack of lies Manifesto.

On a more positive note, the fishermen up in Aberdeen are seeing more jobs in the fishing industry, plus new orders for Trawlers to be built. That has to be good.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Why? It didn't do him any good, he lost. Anyway, all politicians lie, it's what they do.



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Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

You ask why. Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour party lied, it cost the Conservative's a decent majority. This has repercussions for the EU negotiations, eg. Weak Government

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Oh! I should have added that all the opposition parties, are going to make it as difficult as possible to negotiate any deal with the EU, most of all Labour

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I think apologising is a bad move, it makes her look weak...and it achieves nothing positive.

What I would like is for her to kick out the likes of Philip Hammond, Amber Rudd(though I really want to call he Amber Dudd).
I would also like her to tell the EU negotiators on both sides to get their act together.
I would prefer 'no deal' to a 'raw deal'.

We do not need the EU...but they need our cash.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Mrs May made a serious mistake when she succumbed to hubris. She absolutely should not have called the election. The result is the proof of that. I really do not think that anyone can blame other politicians for standing against the Conservative Party in case they defeated them. That's why we have democracy.

I think that Jeremy Corbyn has a longer record of being anti-EU, than has Mrs May. The extreme left in this country have always been opposed to the union. So in that case, I feel it is doubly wrong to blame him for the state we now find ourselves. I mean, to be honest, he hasn't, actually, ever done anything! [emoji23]

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Actually the Conservative party cost the Conservative party a decent majority, a landslide could have been had but they would have had to have put up decent candidates, of course, the same can be said for Labour, because both parties are rubbish these days.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

If Corbyn's Labour party had not lied over student fees, the Conservative party would have had a landslide

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Well, there is one thing Jeremy Corbyn has been an IRA supporter

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

You have already stated that here,

No matter how many times you repeat it does not actually make it true.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I can't see that one single issue changed an entire election. The popular press like to polarise issues, but we should be wary of falling into such simplistic thinking.

It was undeniably an attractive policy, and who are we to call it a 'lie' when they were not given the opportunity to deliver? (Compare with Clegg's lie over student fees - ultimately fatal). All manifesto promises are fair until proven otherwise.

The blame lies with Mrs May, even she accepts that.


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Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Simplistic tabloid stuff again. The reality is much more complicated. But I'm not defending him, other than from your claim his lies are why the country is writhing on the floor in the EU negotiations.

I recommend you read All Out War by Tim Shipman, which is the "full story of Brexit". https://www.waterstones.com/book/all.../9780008215170

It all started to go wrong long before Mrs May or Corbyn were leaders. Britain's relationship with the EU is messy to say the least.


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Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

That has to be the biggest understatement of all time.

The UK has never really been comfortable with the concept of the EU - neither has the EU ever been comfortable with the UK being in the EU...except they like to take the money from us....but not a single politician wanted to listen to the people of the UK.

We were sold this dysfunctional organisation as a trading alliance.
It morphed into something different and still we were not given a voice.

Mrs May was constantly being told that she had no mandate from the people...she had not been elected...she had just been parachuted into the position of leader by the cowardly abdication of responsinility, by David Cameron.
I really think he gave the country the referendum thinking that nothing would change...so when the country voted to get out of the EU...he took fright.

In such circumstances I can see why Mrs May took the advice to go to a general election...it was her chance to seek the mandate from the electorate and silence the critics who said she had no mandate.

The campaign was fought by the tories as if it was already won..big mistake...and Jeremy Corbyn did what all Labour leaders do...promise the electorate the earth and a bag to put it in....also thinking that he would not have to deliver....well, he was right...but only just.


At a time like this, the politicians should be joining ranks and rolling their sleeves up to deliver what the country chose to do....not fighting in a sack like so many snakes.(which, in a nutshell, is what they are!)
The likes of Claude Juncker and Michel Barnier must be rubbing their hands in glee to see the political parties in such disarray.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Haha, I know. Sorry!

I should have clarified I was referring to Brexit, which only started its current rumblings after the 2010 election.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

No.. don't be sorry...you have said what is true.
I can live with people who tell it like it is.
That is how I operate in my corner of the world.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

As D-in-G has said elsewhere in a thread, it's a funny old world.

Brexit according to politicians was brought about by the misplaced voting of, ill-educated older generation, this didn't go down too well with quite a few of us on here or indeed across the nation.

Now it seems according to some, the chances of brexit running smoothly by us having a strong government has been botched thanks to the 'educated' students of the younger generation kicking against the traces and voting for their own survival, (I'd do the same if I was one of them).

No doubt there will be other political catastrophes before we can say goodbye to Europe.

All those of you in betweenies had better expect to be blamed for whatever comes next after all, you must be the silent majority at whose feet the blame must in future be placed just to prove that we are all equal in the politicians eyes.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Politicians are very good at laying the blame at someone else's door.
Whatever happens it is NEVER their fault.
I think this can be said of the referendum too...by giving us a say, they had automatically found someone to blame(whichever way it turned out)
Except those of us who have lived long enough, know that it can all be laid at the door of successive, lily livered governments who were too scared to go to the electorate about the changes in the EU(from the E.E.C).
They allowed us to get in deeper and deeper...for more and more control to be assumed by Brussels (who could not give a flying fig for the thoughts and ideals of the UK public - as long as we cough up the money, they don't care) until we might just as well have lost the second world war...after all they seemed to be ruling us(rather than us ruling ourselves).
How our brave boys who gave up their lives for our freedoms must be spinning in their graves.
British politicians betrayed us just so that they could have a life on the gravy train.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

sigh...now where did I put my anti cynical pills?

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Leave them in the bottle, we don't want you overdosing by accident.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-LgRmsSUBPF..._and_pills.jpg

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

There is certainly a chance of that Less, but they never kill you....they just leave you feeling sort of hung over but worse.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

People have said they are addictive, I don't agree, I've been using them every day for over 50 years and don't find them habit forming.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

This older generation you are talking about left school at 14/15...and yes were were poorly educated...but we were(in the main) numerate and literate.

From leaving school most of us(especially those on here that you refer to Less) enrolled in the University of Life.
No mickey mouse degrees for us...no film and media studies, no political science(What is that? Since when has politics had anything scientific about it. If you can lie and look someone straight in the face you can be in politics).
We worked and went to night school or took up apprenticeships.
Whatever...our education continued driven by our needs to earn a living.
During this self betterment process we gained something known as 'experience'.
It was this experience that made me vote the way I did...in the referendum and in every election where I have made a valid vote.

So although the politicians considered us ill educated(because we did not go to uni) WE ALL KNOW that they couldn't find their bum with two hands and a map..this despite the fact that many of them DID go to Uni.
It was just a case of those 'elite' career politicians letting us know that the' peas had got their heads above the sticks'

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Me too Less...Me too( except I have to admit to at least another ten years of use)

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I don't use 'em, I like to keep my cynicism perfectly honed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Yes...you can tell :)

I start each day telling myself that today will be different.....I will not look beneath what someone is telling me(to see if they are trying to put one over on me)...but each day I fail.
It has now become my nature.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Well after listening to the news tonight as far as i'm concerned the U.K.should just tell em to shove it, and walk away from the E.U. tosspots.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

That's been my view since the day after the referendum, Cashy, and, since then, the prattling and posturing from the politicians and civil servants (not to mention the manipulative mendacity of the Brussels Broadcasting Corporation) has confirmed it's the only sensible option.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Yes...I have been saying that from the outset.
The mandarins in Brussels are doing everything to slow negotiations down and put obstacles in the way of a settlement....and then the politicians here are involved in their own wranglings even within the Tory party.
It's time someone knocked some heads together.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Headline news today...Brexit talks are DEADLOCKED:

It is obvious to me the EU do not want us to leave, so every obstacle will be put in our way. I personally am sick and tired of the whole thing...We should tell the EU what we want, give them a time scale, if that is not met, walk away. If they decide to put tarrifs on our goods we can do exactly the same thing to there's. This is to great a country with lots of potential, we will be fine.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

They do not want to negotiate...they have no intention of negotiating. We should just tell them to stick the EU where a monkey shoves his nuts...and walk away.
As for tariffs...if they want tariffs then we can play that game too...we actually buy more from them than we sell to them.

It just shows the kind of dictatorship the EU is...they want all their own way and a bag to put it in.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

They have little intention of handing us a fair deal, cos those other countries that are considering a referendum will not do so if we get a bad deal. trouble is most M.P.s are too slow to see it.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

said the same cashy from day one. it would possibly start a break up of the EU and they don,t want that. as i,ve said before money talks, unfortunatly those in the EU do also. for all those like me who want out as quickly as possible do not hold your breath.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Blair had a meeting with Barnier yesterday, theres a pic of it in the Daily Express, looked to me like hes giving him one.:eek:obvious what the Chief Remoaner was saying.:(

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Cashy, it was Tony Blair kissing the face cheeks of Jean Claude Drunker(juncker)....he had already kissed his bum cheeks years ago.

The Brexit talks are farcical. You cannot negotiate with someone who clearly has no intention of negotiating anything.
They want to bully us...all I want is for the politicians to tell Michel Barnier to 'sit on it and swivel'...and let the whistle for any money.

The value of U K trade to the 27 EU countries is in the region of £300 billion....goods and services.
Another thing is that the UK are the third biggest contributors...and without our contribution the French and the Germans would be left picking up the tab.
I am sure this is not something they are keen on.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Aye well i got mixed up but was still an E.U. Dinosaur.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

probebly saying to barmier in the words of fu manchu, trust me i will return.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

It was actually junker i ballsed up.:eek:

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

It's OK Cashy...they are all a shower of she-ite (sorry...the EU and anything concerning it just gets my goat) so you can be forgiven because one turd looks very much like another.
Some are just browner and smellier(sorry if you are just having your tea).

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

There is an old saying...The man who maketh no mistakes dosn't maketh anything.
All the posts you do, there is bound to be one or two errors.
Margaret's comments were priceless

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Thank you Bea...I just say it how I see it.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

So Michel Barnier is going to teach the UK (a lesson)about the consequences of leaving the single market...This was said at a gathering of the elite Ambrosetti Forum on the lakes of Lake Como and was not for public consumption but somehow(I think it was The Times)it found its way into the public domain.
How condescendingly arrogant of the man.

For those who voted to stay...i hope you have realised what lengths this corrupt, money gobbling, undemocratic organisation will go to to prevent us having a say.

It is quite clear to me that these negotiators do not want the UK to secure a deal, they want the UK to fail in the negotiations as this will deter other members who maybe thinking of heading for the door, just how hard it is.
I just wish that David Davis and Co would tell them to 'stuff it' and leave.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Its also about time the"Media" told the public the truth about what is going on with these corrupt gets imho, they avoid doing so simply cos they wanted to Remain.:rolleyes:

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

They won't tell them to stuff it probably going to balls up leaving as well, because the only country that ever applied all of the EU'S rules & regs without choosing to ignore the ones they don't like is this one.
So instead of just pulling out for the good of us all they will do the gentlemanly thing and adhere to negotiating terms even to our detriment.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

Less, there is no change there then.
The UK has ALWAYS followed the rules to the letter(some would say slavishly).
Other countries in the EU(notably France) pick and choose which bits of the legislation they will and will not follow.

France has the same ECHR rules, but seem to interpret them in a way which is in line with French culture....our judiciary interpret the rules to the detriment of British culture...but they are the same set of rules.
The French can deport undesirables regardless of whether they have a Persian cat...or a French wife.
Yet here the judges fall over themselves to accommodate the right for a foreign thug to have a family life.
If you doubt this, just ask the Houston family who lost their daughter to a hit and run driver who should not have been here.

It is all getting very tedious.
This wrangling and lack of progress. This obstructive and uncompromising attitude of the EU mandarins...I was going to call them diplomats, but they are to diplomacy what Arthur Scargill is to opera singing.

Re: Referendum is a load of crap.!!
 

I don't doubt it, I often wonder out of the people that live on my street (it's a long street), how many of my neighbours have a legal right to be here?
I can't tell a good un from a bad un because it's very much a closed community of which I seem to be an outsider.