Re: The Tories
 

No matter what technological change have occured, you still need men to operate the equipment, and machines to transport it to the scene of incidents, and buldings haven't had all that much done for the so called technological age, they still collapse, they still catch fire, people still get trapped in them. I regularly call in at the Fire Stn and I've seen nothing new that I couldn't instantly operate. They also have an eletronic system, type in a post code and it will display a route to the incident, so I tried it against my local knowledge and beat it 7 out of 10. Not every place has a post code, especially farms and smallholdings.

By the way one of my daughters serves as a Sub Officer in the London Fire Brigade.

Re: The Tories
 

i know the facts, i know there is a campaign discrediting of fire fighters with the government stealing their pensions, closing fire stations etc. i wouldnt trust boris johnson one little bit. he is a dangerous amateur which has been proved with cyclists fiasco .

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Agreed, but modern crew numbers are less than in earlier times due to tech & advances.

As to your Daughter, utmost respect to her & her colleagues for doing a difficult & dangerous job.

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lives are saved by the speed the emergency services get there. it takes just seconds later for lives to be lost. the fire stations that are closing will make it longer for emergency services to reach their destination which will cost lives as the traffic in london is horrendous . i usually reside in west kensington while im in london where the population is rising quick like the rest of london but they decide to cut the emergency services doesnt make sense

Re: The Tories
 

the tories are borrowing more than labour ever did. the only difference labour spent it on the public these tories are giving it away to a bunch of spivs. Britain?s deficit soars to its highest for 24 years - Business News - Business - The Independent

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You wouldn't know true facts if they jumped up a bit you on the bum, all your government bashing comes from is ignorance of real facts being replaced with those that fit your twisted ideology

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Because they are having to pay of the crippling interest on a £1.5 Trillion left by the last useless Labour Shower and those are the facts you scotch divvy

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Although I'm no lover of Blair/Brown, the actual figure left by the last government was £700 billion...which was mainly caused by spending on Education, Health and Welfare (for the sick and disabled despite Daily Mail headlines focusing on the 0.001% of con artists, most of whom were brought to book, hence the headlines)...

The current shower have managed to raise that to the figure you quoted of £1.5 Trillion (i.e. they doubled it in 3 years), they managed to do this despite reducing funding to health, welfare and education, despite reducing funding to just about everything and allowing the growth of parasitic companies like ATOS and OneConnect, both of whom have a mandate to screw people over (allegedly :mad:)...

AND they have increased the cost of everything they could think of and allowed foreign power companies to rob its electorate blind in the name of Mammon.

They take money in bedroom tax from pensioners and the disabled whilst allowing companies like Amazon to avoid paying tax by lack of modern thinking and poor legislation.

We have tory MP's laughing and joking about foodbanks and a minister for education who thinks schools should be run by Mr Chips and Joyce Grenfell. They have stifled the economy despite advice from almost every single economist on the planet. We give foreign aid to countries with space programs, (something we can't afford ourselves), whilst removing aid from our own by reducing the number of firemen, policemen and hospitals.

And before you use the stock 13 years argument..yes Blair/Brown were screw ups, liars, warmongers, wasters, pension thieves, muppets and generally made a right mess of things..but this incumbent lot are systematically destroying every single good thing that was ever created in this country and increasing the debt of every single man, woman and child with their insane policies.

If you seriously believe that the current crop of Conservatives are working for the good of the many, you have a real problem with your logic.

Re: The Tories
 

I'd sooner have the current crop than socialism born of envy, you have it why can't I, the only trouble with born again socialist is they become worse than natural born Tories, remember good old Arthur went into the miners strike with a big union and a little house and came out the other side with a big house and a little union, hypocrisy personified, even Mrs Blair had the hard faced cheek to say she still considered herself a socialist, when they gain power socialism flies out the window;)

Re: The Tories
 

telling you again these arent the true tories you harp on about . they dont care about the population or the future of britain, they are a bunch of opportunists ,spivs the tory party was never the same after thatcher this is one of the reasons we are skint . britain spent £2 billion giving money to private rail firms who then passed it on to their shareholders . the tories sold the utilities to foreign governments who now control our economy. we have no control over our destination, while the country rolls down the river they always yes always bring up immigration,attack the nhs for a smoke screen and people take it in. this country is so politically inept. you cant go on blaming the last government for ever.

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i want people to suceed in business ,i want people to own their own homes, i want people to have pride in their own country but these spivs have created an environment where it is virtually impossible for young people to get on the property ladder or a full time job.. if i was in charge i would be laying down laws that would drag down the shares of all the utilities and buy them all back.with the revenue created by owning the utilities , job creation, control of our destination it would single handedly bring us out of recession. everything i would do would be directed to the future for our country and children. i would keep the east line nationalised ,nationalise the rest of the railways with revenue raised i would put it towards taking back the transport infrastructure . i wouldnt rule out all private inclusion but would make sure all rolling stock was made in britain by british companies who were given conditions by taking on apprentices and local populations.. remember vote for me vote for cmonstanley for prime minister... lo

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dont let the spivs take it away from you

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This is where your thinking is blinkered my friend...

Socialism is not born of envy, its about having a fair crack of the whip to better yourself from the fruits of your labour, and using some of those fruits to help those less fortunate.

As a socialist, I couldn't care less if you have more wealth than me, a nicer house, a better car and holiday for six months in Antigua providing you are doing this from the fruits of your own labour. You can own a factory and make a huge profit from the workforce, providing you treat your workforce with respect and pay them a fair days wage, I wouldn't care how huge a profit you made as long as you used a proportionate amount to help the less fortunate.

By proportionate I mean I earn 50p and give 5p, you earn £50 and give £5...what the tories want is the guy who has £50 to only give 5p....thats got nothing to do with envy....its about fairness.

Graham Jones retweeted something from Shelter Uk earlier.... 80,000 kids without a home in Great Britain this christmas morning

Shelter England- Home

So as a 'hypothetical' factory owner, what you putting in the pot to help?...... a socialist £5 or a tory 5p?

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More than blinkered ... it's blind ... and stupid and illogical. It appears to be founded on the "idea" ... if one can call something so dumb, an idea ... of the trickle down effect. You all know the one: Give breaks and tax reductions to big business and they will generate wealth for the rich which will then pass down to the plebs. This works only as far as "generate wealth for the rich" ... this they will use to hire a bunch of high priced tax lawyers who will find all the available loopholes, and, maybe, find tax shelters. The rich are the greedy ones.

Re: The Tories
 

even the torygraph hates this government and wants to tell the truth.Ministers accused of energy bill cut 'con' as £5-per-household saving will be paid back with interest - Telegraph ive just watched boris on the parliament channel on mayor question time . he didnt answer one question he dilly dallied mumbling a load of crap.

Re: The Tories
 

I've heard it all now, somebody sitting around all day watching the Parliamentary channel, what a sad pathetic little man you really are get a life and for christs, sake stop boring the tits of me

Re: The Tories
 

I think if I was working for them and facing large cuts to manpower I would be turning it into a major incident with every man and his dog called out trying to prove that number of people were required.

All those people may have been needed but the response has certainly given people an excuse to say they need all the people they have

Re: The Tories
 

Oh yeah...can't you just hear the operator.....

Ring..Ring..

'which emergency do you require'

'erm.. all of them i guess, a roof has collapsed in a theatre with over 700 people inside'

'oh and how many are still inside'

'erm.. dunno, there's a bit of screaming and scrambling and some guy just went past me covered in blood holding his unconscious son in his arms'

'well could you go back inside and count how many are trapped, see if they need digging out, while you are there could you check if there is any damage to the myriad of electrical systems within the theatre that may cause a fire. Could you also count the number of people injured and needing medical attention? When you've done all that call me back and I'll be able to send the correct number of fire engines and ambulances.' :rolleyes:

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And therein lies the problem, all these people require paying, regardless of participation, on duty, laid off sick etc, etc. Added to this there's all the support staff who sit in an office but don't provide physical hands on action, eating up resources that could be better employed.

The Germans have a regular fire service but for a Country about three times the size of UK their "Paid" manpower isn't anywhere near comparable to UK. The practicality behind this is due to the Germans maintaining, training & investing in an exceptionally good volunteer force of fire fighters functioning on the same principal as the UKs RNLI. "Freiwilligen Feuerwher" can be found in virtually ever town & village & are supported, sponsored & integrated into the major framework of the German fire service with regular training & advancement of their volunteers.

Re: The Tories
 

Interesting ... same over here too. This unit fighting the big fire in my neighbourhood was manned by volunteers from Kingston's west end:

Re: The Tories
 

Now now Jaysay ... that should be "man boobs" ... ;)

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There is a different mind set amongst the English about volunteering.
Volunteers have bearly always been shat on or their services abused.
Its not even easy to keep a retained fire service, and they get paid a retaining fee, and pay for drill nights and for turnouts.

Re: The Tories
 

Too many people here expect someone else to do it all for them while they sit in front of the TV or in the pub.

They days of scrubbing your doorstep and sweeping the footpath outside your house are gone. We have become a lazy society.

Re: The Tories
 

Some of society is lazy.....some isn't.
It may be a generational thing. Those of us who were born in the 'baby boomer' years are more likely to volunteer services and time.....but who wants an arthritic sixty something with a dicky ticker as a firefighter?

Re: The Tories
 

There is also an element of 'I pay part of my council tax to fund these services' in the equation too.

Re: The Tories
 

I'm totally confused by that comment :confused:

Are you saying its lazy NOT to volunteer to take someones livelihood away or are you saying its lazy to expect someone to do something they are paid to do?

We all know how you give your free time, doing something that you are passionate about voluntarily, do you know many people that are passionate about volunteering to man the tills at Tesco or cleaning the sewers. How about people volunteering to do the job that feeds your family?

In the case of emergency services, what I want are trained professionals to be paid accordingly from a central fund raised by fair taxation to save my life if needed, and I'd rather have too many than too few, and if that means cutting aid to spacefaring nations so be it.

And what you seem to have missed here is that despite the 'alleged' outrageous number of emergency services that turned up, (for what was originally thought to be a major disaster), they still had to commandeer 3 London buses to transport the injured to hospital.

Re: The Tories
 

Sorry to double post but I feel very strongly about our emergency services...

On this particular night, the emergency services got it perfect. They had enough firemen to ensure that everyone got out and the building was secured from further structural damage and fire, the ambulances ensured that the critical and severe were treated without loss of life, the police ensured that the area was secured.

A potential catastrophe was averted because of skilled, trained, dedicated people.

What absolute fools they were for doing their job..the gutter press and associated bufoons were so quick to jump on the fact that so many resources attended..it didn't matter that nobody had died... that they had done their job so damn well...that they had all the bases covered...

Nobody reports good news so lets find the negatives...so the tory press barons once again use 'numbers'....and the gullible amongst us fall hook, line and sinker yet again!

Re: The Tories
 

the thing is the german companies work in cohesion with their employees. british employers wouldnt let their workers volunteer. you would be classed as a liability. thats the difference with British and German society.

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Typical right-wing claptrap ... the implied argument, if you can call it that, is so spurious and illogical that it is hardly worth addressing. Blame the poor for their poverty; blame the unemployed for the lack of decent, well-paid work.

According to tories there is a "level playing field" out there, and anyone with enough gumption can succeed:rolleyes: What a crock of horse manure. Let the privileged few export good jobs to places where labor is cheap and unprotected. Let them hide their profits in tax shelters. And then blame the plebs for not being able to make a go of it flipping burgers. Tories load the dice in favour of the already rich. They create a diillusioned underclass, and then blame them for continually crapping out. If you chant "the poor and unemployed are lazy" long enough, even many of the poor and umemployed come to believe it.

Re: The Tories
 

You're slipping into "Wicked Tories" mode again, by inferring all t'mill owners (British employers?) wouldn't let their people volunteer. One word for you my friend "Territorials" or as Dave & his mates are now titling them, "The Army reserve" not forgetting the RAF & Navy reserve.

While containing, as the title states eligible ex-service personnel (reservists), there are also quite a few volunteers who have a day job & are willing participants in deployments with the blessings of their employers so that statement doesn't cut it.

And if the Military can train & deploy "Civvie Volunteers", surely the emergency services are capable of following a similar line?

Re: The Tories
 

And if by some chance there hadn't been such a turnout by the emergency services and their had been a loss of lives, what a field day the press would have had with that story.

Re: The Tories
 

My reply was about this bit of Retlaws quote
I agree with you on that.


I have said to several politicians that I don't agree with Council Tax freezes. I believe they do it to makes voters happy and not for the good of the Borough. Costs are increasing all the time in wages, insurance, vehicles etc etc and the incoming money is staying the same. in effect a frezze is the same as a cut. The services we receive are being cut to keep Council Tax the same which is not good. Many on here moan about the state of the town centre, lack of toilets and whatever, with less money to spend the service we get will be worse.

HBC are already outsourcing and joining with other councils to provide reduced services for things like planning and others.

Re: The Tories
 

Why would you be a liability?

How many charity shops do we have in town that have a mix of paid and voluntary staff?

I am sure between us we could name several other companies in Hyndburn that use volunteers on a regular basis.

I am heavily encouraged to volunteer at work, we have a few charities I can do volunteer days for and my company will give me up to 4 days off in return for doing 4 volunteer days.

The Tories
 

Is that 4 days a week? A fortnight? A month? A year?
If it's a week you're working for a charity and your employer has you part time!

Re: The Tories
 

Four days off isn't all that tempting to those who are out of work. Maybe if they volunteered, they could be rewarded with four days of paid employment.:rolleyes:

Re: The Tories
 

That is what my company offer its employees if they want to volunteer. So if I spent 4 days volunteering I would get 4 days off work.

Re: The Tories
 

with pay:confused::eek:

Re: The Tories
 

showing their true colours again;) UK weather: Conservative energy minister goes to fox hunt while thousands are hit by power cuts - Mirror Online out of touch and soon to be out of government.

Re: The Tories
 

Of course with pay

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Do you read the story?
It says he didn't go hunting at the bottom and only tweeted support for the hunt

Re: The Tories
 

Oh the tedium! Is that the time already? http://yoursmiles.org/tsmile/sleep/t2218.gif

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Ok I'll bite, you've obviously got something up your sleeve..volunteers give their time for free..how does that make you a volunteer if you are paid to do it?

Re: The Tories
 

Think he means his days off are paid by his company Guinness.

Re: The Tories
 

Good point. All I know is that I can attend volunteer charity days - last one was working in a green space in Manchester clearing out a pond and planting trees. If I attend one in my own time they give me a day off, upto 4 days a year.

I suppose the company is giving me to the charity for the day because I still get paid my normal rate so its my company that loose out because I am not working for them

Re: The Tories
 

And no doubt they can write that off for tax purposes.....not really the true spirit of volunteering ;)

Re: The Tories
 

Ah! See your point now, but as he's doing volunteer work for another concern & they're not paying him, he's a "Volunteer" to them. And his company, well they're just doing their little bit of philanthropic niceness, can't harm their image any can it? :)

Thereby putting C'mons somewhat skewed & dogmatic view of "Wicked Tory grasping chiefs of industry" being all about profit ahead of humanity. ;)

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I suppose it depends who he works for. Lets say he`s a fireman and does 4 days a year "voluntary" work but then gets 4 extra days off with pay. Who pays for that?

Re: The Tories
 

Nope you're missing the point completely..there is zero volunteering occurring here...one man is being paid, one company is offsetting this pay against tax.

The charity has an extra body for a day, the company is profiting from the tax break and Neil is providing the humanity...he is being paid, albeit indirectly, by the taxpayer.

You still sure that Cmon is wrong? Who has the profit here, who has the humanity and who is paying?

Re: The Tories
 

Damned if they do, damned if they dont

I work for a private company so no need to worry about that

Re: The Tories
 

You are making a lot of assumptions there.

Cmon is always wrong so no need answering that one :rolleyes:

Re: The Tories
 

Yup..I'm assuming you are human :p

Re: The Tories
 

It will still be offset somewhere, lets say you work for currys then, and every employee did 4 days a year volunteer work, don`t you think that would mean either as has been said, company pays less tax, or, the price of electricals go up. One things for sure Currys won`t be losing out.

Re: The Tories
 

I think my firm do it because it makes them look good working with charities.
Only a small percentage of employees do it anyway.

Re: The Tories
 

to be replaced by what, two Mr. Eds now that's really something two Eds certainly better that one:eek: ones a real balls up for a start with:rolleyes:

Re: The Tories
 

Wrong, misguided, predictable, tedious, obsessive .......... so many adjectives & only one C'mon! ;)

The Tories
 

Unless of course you are doing something that requires sponsorship such as a marathon, charity work should be like secret Santa, you do it because you can to make a difference to the project, not for publicity for you or some company.

The joy is making a difference, not in praise by blowing your own trumpet or using an employee to make it seem like you are worthy of some false praise.

Re: The Tories
 

Most companies blow their own trumpet as a way of saying how good they are when trying to get more business

Re: The Tories
 

yes of course they do and in the world where business is almost seen as 'dirty' it seems that they have to prove themselves to be honourable...and if charities benefit it is no bad thing.
It would be a better thing if the bosses of the big charities took less money out of the pot so that those who really need the help can get it.....and please don't anyone tell me that if you pay peanuts you get monkeys.

Re: The Tories
 

I also 'get' the distrust Guinness has for volunteer work.
Especially where this means that the work isn't there for someone to be paid for doing it.....to put bread on the table for a family.
It would be hard for some jobs to be done by volunteers...but then there are some things that volunteers are good at.

Feeding folk in hospital........what would you choose....that your elderly infirm mother is fed by a caring volunteer or is left to starve because the nurses, HCA's are too busy doing other things?.....it is easy to say employ more of them, but if the budget isn't there, then it isn't going to happen.

The Australin Fire and rescue service rely heavily on volunteers......people from the local community who want to make their community safe in times of need(bush fires, and floods).
Volunteer services have to be balanced so that the trained people can supervise the volunteers...make sure that what they are doing is no risk to their health or to the health of those they are trying to help.
Volunteering is good for personal esteem as well as the esteem of business.

Re: The Tories
 

It would also be a better thing if the bosses of big business and big business itself paid their fair share of taxes so that the need for charity would not be as pressing.;)

Re: The Tories
 

It would be better if the tax rules weren't so poor that companies can legally pay little tax.

You can't blame a business for legally reducing it's outgoings. They are in business to make money.

Re: The Tories
 

All political parties have had opportunites to close loop holes in the tax system....none of them have acted.
They know that these loopholes exist...and as Neil rightly says, the businesses are in it to make money...and anyway they can reduce their outgoings will maximise their profits.
There is no philanthropy in business.

Re: The Tories
 

And it would also be a good thing if one asked the question, "Why are the tax rules so poor?" It's no accident.

If you have any spare time, William L. Shirer's "Collapse of the Third Republic: An Inquiry into the Fall of France in 1940" has some interesting chapters on how big business and it's leaders, and their unwillingness to pay their fair share, contributed mightily to the defeat of France in WW ll.

By the by, as you are no doubt aware, "caritas" is one of the three theological virtues, along with some faith, and some of what was left in Pandora's box ... it should come from the heart and the soul ... it should not be a public relations exercise.

Re: The Tories
 

Like everything else in this world(or so it seems to my cynical self)'caritas' has been hijacked for commercial purposes.
Need to get my pills changed again, they don't seem to be working that well.

The Tories
 

So, I have a reasonable size company with several employers.
I have a pet project, it could be anything that seems worthwhile.
I use part of what should go in taxes to set up and register a charity.
I can now use up to 95% of any cash paid into that charity as administration fees. I can also offer my employees the chance of working a couple of days for the charity and reward them with their wages for the time involved. Which I no doubt can write off against my company taxes. Why do I bother producing anything? Why don't I just liquidate my main companies assets then run the charity full time?
Lovely tax free dosh with volunteer workers doing unpaid work to keep me smelling of roses.

After all, I no longer have to worry about paying a workforce, ensuring they are attracted to working for me by offering good pension and company perks, no doubt no VAT, if I also make it a religious charity perhaps no business rates on my place of worship/head office.
I could use part of my administration costs to pay for excellent accountants that will filter what's left to some offshore bank say perhaps Iceland then, although I haven't actually paid out one penny to the needy of my charity my accounts show the money to be intact and earning me a nice bit of tax free interest that will be used to 'improve' my administration.

Re: The Tories
 

Less...this time next year you could be a millionaire.

The Tories
 

Not really Margaret my plan stands no chance, look at the first sentence I obviously don't know the difference between an employee and an employer! Predictable text got me again.
:)

Re: The Tories
 

Then, to the tune of the Red Flag: The working class can kiss my ass;):D:alright:

Re: The Tories
 

Predictive text or not...I got the gist of it.
Anyway when you are, I do hope you remember your friends :D

Re: The Tories
 

Horny Escorts prostitute job advert posted on government website 'in error' | Metro News ian duncan smith fails again.. lol

Re: The Tories
 

Why, did he not get the job?

Re: The Tories
 

Have to admit that I don't get the point of this post.:confused: What's the problem? I presume that escort agencies are legal in the UK, and that it legal to advertise the services. So, what is the thing about the govt. website? Is it that this particular service was taking advantage of free advertising? Or is it that govt. should not associate itself with such a "sinful" service, one that many members of parliament use or have used?;)

Re: The Tories
 

C'mon sees it as a sleaze thing.....in much the way that the red tops do.
It is an inflammatory headline. Something which he hopes will offend.
I am much more offended by politicians who lie, cheat and steal from the public purse......and unfortunately for us, they come in all political shades......for similar reasons that large companies avoid paying taxes - because they can!

Re: The Tories
 

you do miss the point. if somebody who refuses to go to a job interview that is on universal jobmatch gets sanctioned no questions asked. anybody can pose as an employer and put a job and organize a venue for interview . does that make you safe going sending a 16 girl year old for a job interview. if this was on for 2 days before being properly checked out what else is on there. here is another fake one Universal Jobmatch: Fake ads seeking MI6 hitmen and mafia couriers posted on Government's new website | Mail Online

Re: The Tories
 

you can' blame anyone for missing the point when all you post is a link and a half arsed cryptic comment.
I would guess that a lot of people do not bother to read the links you put up as they no longer trust them to be anything other than a sensationalist headline.

Just as I am sure that if jobs like MI6 hitman and Mafia couriers were advertised, most of us would realise that they are not actual jobs.

Re: The Tories
 

your still missing the point:eek: man/woman pretends to be employer , man/woman pretending to be employer puts on legitimate looking job on universal job match job centre sends 16 /17 /18 year old girl or boy to interview man/women could be human trafficker ,pervert serial killer or anybody. why? because private company who run the website cant be arsed to check them out or dont to save money.:alright:

Re: The Tories
 

If your point is that there should be stricter public control over work which is outsourced to private companies, or that certain things should not be outsourced, then I agree with you. But this sensationalist horse manure about escort services ... gimme a break.;) I'm presuming, though I'm not going to google to make sure, that prostitution is legal in the UK ... rather than picking on this tittillating tidbit, address the issue. Some things belong in the public sector so that the profit motive doesn't enter into the equation. NHS comes immediately to mind of course ... jails, search and rescue, power generation and supply, infrastructure and its maintainance, and, yes, even railways come to mind. Also there are, no doubt, laws against sixteen-year-olds working in the sex trade. So there is protection for the vulnerable who, I believe, are more at risk from criminal organizations than they are from someone playing around with a government website just for a goof.

Re: The Tories
 

No, I'm not missing the point. It is you who misses the point.
But it isn't much use explaining it to you because you do not want to see any point other than your own.

Re: The Tories
 

Are you getting desperate now? That one is more than a year old

Re: The Tories
 

getting desperate Neil, he's always been bloody desperate;)

Re: The Tories
 

yep and its still not changed;) this is happening in 10 days:confused:

Re: The Tories
 

why should this worry you...none of them are in Scotland?
How do you know that your beloved Labour would not have done the same thing?
The real answer is - you don't!

Re: The Tories
 

here we go again, because you live in scotland :confused: as ive explained before, i spend a lot of time in Fulham Kensington and hammersmith i am not tunneled vision and spend all my life in one place . the last labour government done cuts with the fire service as we all know about ie ossy but not in the dangerous scale the tories are. the last labour government spent money on services where is osborne spending his Osborne increases debt more than Labour did over 13 years » Spectator Blogs

Re: The Tories
 

Fulham Kensington and Hammersmith bit out of your depth there I would think, not too many keep the red flag flying in that neck of the woods:D

Re: The Tories
 

Of course Labour made cuts....they also spent way beyond their means which is why we are in the position we are in.
If labour had got back into government they may have been forced to make more cuts than you would find comfortable with.
The political parties are not in the game to make life easier for the common man......some day you may just see that.

Re: The Tories
 

you cannot be serious, every government spends beyond our means ever since the 1690s this government arent even spending it they are giving it away to their banker and hedge fund mates:eek:

Re: The Tories
 

Sorry Margaret I have to disagree with that...

We are not in the position we are in because of the last government. It's a myth perpetuated by the tory media based on what was meant to be a stupid in-joke by the outgoing treasury minister (there's nothing left, we spent it all), which was pounced on by the tory spin doctors. That's the kind of crap joke I might leave in the empty coffee jar at work before I have a few days off.

The last government left us with one third of the debt we are now in, they did this by spending on health, welfare and education, and they had to deal with a worldwide recession. Yes they were numpties..but..

This lot have killed people with their policies, just like Thatcher did and just like every tory government before them. And we are worse off than we have ever been with no sign of the light at the end of the tunnel, despite endless promises of tough love and all in it together.

You are right that political parties don't care..but what is your alternative?

Russell Brand says don't bother voting? Maybe you could pointlessly spoil your paper? Vote for a guy who has ignored his promises and the wishes of his electorate? Post endless links on forums without explanation? Bitch and whine on a local forum and do zilch about it? (thats me by the way as if you hadn't guessed ;)).

How do you make a guy who used to work in a printers but became your representative listen, and more importantly ACT on your view instead of his own or his party leaders?

Re: The Tories
 

i will also be keeping a very close eye on who buys and how much these properties go for;)

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Whilst I fully agree with this section of your post, you do raise a question in my mind - If Thatcher and her successors did so many things wrong why didn't Blair/Brown revoke all the contentious issues?

The Tories
 

For the exact same reasons this co-ed lot of idiots haven't revoked any of labours so called misguided policies.

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Guinness, it would not be good if we agreed on everything.
It is your prerogative to hold differing views - I respect that, because they always seem balanced and considered.
As for the story about there being no money left...it was reported in more than just the Tory biased newspapers......and whether it is true or not we - the plebs, have no real way of knowing.
If it was a joke, it was in very bad taste.
Suffice it to say, that the last incumbents presided over a banking crisis, which they knew about and failed to act on....OK at the same time there was a toxic banking situation over the pond which compounded this crisis.
There were other serious failings of the last government...that isn't to say that the current incumbents are getting it right either.
They were left with a poisoned chalice - and had the Labour government be re-elected who knows whether things would be different - we can never know.

As to the alternative - well, if I knew that I wouldn't be sat here tapping away on a computer - I would be proclaiming my solution from the housetops.
Similarly I do not know how we get our elected representatives to comply with the wishes of those who elected them....Einstein, I am not!

Some interesting points have been brought up by a couple of posters.
When a party is in opposition they snipe at the government, but yet when they get into power they do nothing about the things that they sniped at the previous government for...and this is true of ALL parties.

In my considered and humble opinion thay are all a shower of Fisons.

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So where is he then? I'd of thought C'mon would've been wetting himself to get on here after the latest revelations about the Thatcher files. :idunno:

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thats history i knew most of this anyway.. what about now. there are tidal surges, river banks bursting their banks what did Owen Paterson say ,when asked about the cuts to the enviroment agency ? Floods: Row Over Environment Agency Job Cuts he is a mucky idiot what ive heard a nasty piece of work.

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BBC News - Young people 'feel they have nothing to live for' its alright dont worry according to the tory party and their fascist press mates these peoples lives dont matter....

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And there it is!

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im really scared ive just seen an army of Romanians going past my window:D

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it could be worse it could be my window;)

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Ha Ha. :D:D:D

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this is so funny Nick Clegg Is David Cameron's Condom, Says Boris Johnson

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help to buy scheme you couldn't make it up own estate agents £35,000 car lol David Cameron?s Help-to-Buy poster girl attacked for buying own £145,000 home through her estate agency firm - News - People - The Independent